• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 06:24
CEST 12:24
KST 19:24
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt2: All Star5Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists14[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Fresh Flow9[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash10[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0
Community News
2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers11Maestros of the Game 2 announced32026 GSL Tour plans announced13Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail1MaNa leaves Team Liquid22
StarCraft 2
General
Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool 2026 GSL Tour plans announced MaNa leaves Team Liquid Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament GSL CK: More events planned pending crowdfunding 2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) SEL Doubles (SC Evo Bimonthly)
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 522 Flip My Base The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 521 Memorable Boss Mutation # 520 Moving Fees
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Data needed [ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt2: All Star RepMastered™: replay sharing and analyzer site Gypsy to Korea
Tourneys
[ASL21] Ro16 Group C [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [ASL21] Ro16 Group A
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Any training maps people recommend? Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Starcraft Tabletop Miniature Game
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Movie Discussion!
Sports
McBoner: A hockey love story 2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
[G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Reappraising The Situation T…
TrAiDoS
lurker extra damage testi…
StaticNine
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1843 users

[Patch 1.0.0.129: Fizz] General Discussion - Page 129

Forum Index > LoL General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 127 128 129 130 131 158 Next
Want to rage about your latest loss?
Use the QQ thread.
If you whine in GD, you'll get warned.
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17281 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-11-26 17:08:02
November 26 2011 17:06 GMT
#2561
On November 27 2011 01:31 Unentschieden wrote:
The problem with different laning and jungling requirements is the collision when you take one to the other. Wriggles is intended as jungling item but plenty laners use it for infinite sustain. And in turn without in depht research your first try to jungle will most likely result in you dying to creeps - that is quite a bit different than a suboptimal runepage when laning.

BREAKING NEWS: Noobs are bad! Who cares. Never make your decision based on what an inexperienced player will do their first time trying something. There are plenty more people who do full retard things in lane in early levels than there are junglers dying to minions. There's a reason there's a gradual leveling system so that people can learn how to play against equally bad opponents. Moreover, the new masteries make jungling much less reliant on rune pages.

Wriggles offers very little over just a plain vampiric sceptor for sustain, by the way.

Pot nerfs are even dumber than the jungler nerfs. What do people do when they get low hp? Hug towers or back. What do people do when they have high hp? Skirmish and poke. Pot nerf is yet another change that goes explicitly against their stated goal of decreasing passivity.
twitch.tv/cratonz
turdburgler
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
England6749 Posts
November 26 2011 17:14 GMT
#2562
isnt the value of wriggles in lane the free ward? meaning the item pays for itself over time. not that the item itself is something thats actually that good?
Cixah
Profile Joined July 2010
United States11285 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-11-26 17:21:19
November 26 2011 17:18 GMT
#2563
On November 27 2011 02:14 turdburgler wrote:
isnt the value of wriggles in lane the free ward? meaning the item pays for itself over time. not that the item itself is something thats actually that good?


In top and bot lane in particular, many of the AD champions will try to pick up wriggles because it's cheap lifesteal and the proc is pretty damn good for farming. Not to mention the dragon control it creates in situations where 3 of them are beating on the dragon or baron, and the wards from them all.

It's the Swiss Army Knife of League, and until wriggles loses the ward ability. Will always be too good. Either that or limit it to 1 per team.
Hug The Goat! Hug the Goat! Hug the Goat!
unichan
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States4223 Posts
November 26 2011 17:30 GMT
#2564
On November 27 2011 02:18 Cixah wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 27 2011 02:14 turdburgler wrote:
isnt the value of wriggles in lane the free ward? meaning the item pays for itself over time. not that the item itself is something thats actually that good?


In top and bot lane in particular, many of the AD champions will try to pick up wriggles because it's cheap lifesteal and the proc is pretty damn good for farming. Not to mention the dragon control it creates in situations where 3 of them are beating on the dragon or baron, and the wards from them all.

It's the Swiss Army Knife of League, and until wriggles loses the ward ability. Will always be too good. Either that or limit it to 1 per team.

that would be funny, lol, your ap carry gets mad at your jungle for not ganking and then buys a wriggles with his superior farm so he can't get one
:)
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-11-26 17:42:25
November 26 2011 17:38 GMT
#2565
On November 27 2011 02:14 turdburgler wrote:
isnt the value of wriggles in lane the free ward? meaning the item pays for itself over time. not that the item itself is something thats actually that good?

The ward (and the fact that you never have to go back to keep 100% uptime) is pretty much what makes or breaks Wriggle's as an item. Without it, Wriggle's is not in any way out of line, particularly when you're comparing it to 2-3 DBlade.

I'm curious why Riot never decided to hit the ward when they were trying to deal with the "Wriggle's in lane" issue--seeing as that's the 1 component of Wriggle's that's way more useful for laners than for junglers (since junglers get to bluepill more often to buy wards when they need them). Keep the ward ability, sure, but at least hit the cooldown. Letting someone have 100% uptime on their river ward without ever having to go back to get more wards is a bit silly.
Moderator
BlackPaladin
Profile Joined May 2010
United States9316 Posts
November 26 2011 17:38 GMT
#2566
On November 27 2011 02:18 Cixah wrote:
It's the Swiss Army Knife of League, and until wriggles loses the ward ability. Will always be too good. Either that or limit it to 1 per team.


Then how could we possibly play follow the leader if someone builds wriggles??!!
"Your full potential does not matter if you do not use all 100% of it."
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17281 Posts
November 26 2011 17:53 GMT
#2567
Anything that limits a certain item to X amount per team is bad design. It actively encourages griefers to abuse it.
twitch.tv/cratonz
Shiv.
Profile Joined January 2011
3534 Posts
November 26 2011 18:12 GMT
#2568
Doublelift has 15k viewers at this very moment. What the fuck.
currently rooting for myself.
Hynda
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Sweden2226 Posts
November 26 2011 18:15 GMT
#2569
On November 27 2011 02:53 Craton wrote:
Anything that limits a certain item to X amount per team is bad design. It actively encourages griefers to abuse it.
worked fine in dota, people trolled at first got banned and then it went to the right hero.
Hynda
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Sweden2226 Posts
November 26 2011 18:15 GMT
#2570
On November 27 2011 03:12 Shiv. wrote:
Doublelift has 15k viewers at this very moment. What the fuck.

that is what happens when you join clg from 300 to 15k
MoonBear
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
November 26 2011 18:19 GMT
#2571
On November 27 2011 03:12 Shiv. wrote:
Doublelift has 15k viewers at this very moment. What the fuck.

To be fair, that Blitzcrank game was real sexy.
ModeratorA dream. Do you have one that has cursed you like that? Or maybe... a wish?
DrKlingmann
Profile Joined December 2010
Poland356 Posts
November 26 2011 18:35 GMT
#2572
Acer playing vs GBT in 4PL right now..
Both teams are in Group A for WCG so it is kinda interesting.
But I don't know if they have same line-ups for WCG.

http://www.own3d.tv/live/69066/TeamAcer_CitizenWayne
--- EUNE Jarpen ---
Alay
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States660 Posts
November 26 2011 18:36 GMT
#2573
As a full time jungler for my team, I have to say I'm both saddened, and scared shitless about the direction riot is taking the game.
sob3k
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States7572 Posts
November 26 2011 18:37 GMT
#2574
On November 27 2011 03:12 Shiv. wrote:
Doublelift has 15k viewers at this very moment. What the fuck.


He's a good player playing @like 1600 ELO which makes him look like a fucking god, so its very entertaining to watch.
In Hungry Hungry Hippos there are no such constraints—one can constantly attempt to collect marbles with one’s hippo, limited only by one’s hippo-levering capabilities.
DrKlingmann
Profile Joined December 2010
Poland356 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-11-26 18:45:33
November 26 2011 18:38 GMT
#2575
I'm full time jungler too.. But I'm not going to comment on those changes until I play with them.
--- EUNE Jarpen ---
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
November 26 2011 18:47 GMT
#2576
On November 27 2011 03:38 DrKlingmann wrote:
I'm full time jungler too.. But I'm not going to comment on those changes unless I play with them.

My problem with the changes at this stage isn't necessarily the effect, but their ostensible rationale behind them as outlined by Morello and Guinsoo. I don't like what they want to do with the jungle--and whether or not these changes accomplish them, the fact that they're explicit design goals make me worried about future changes.
Moderator
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17281 Posts
November 26 2011 18:49 GMT
#2577
On November 27 2011 03:37 sob3k wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 27 2011 03:12 Shiv. wrote:
Doublelift has 15k viewers at this very moment. What the fuck.


He's a good player playing @like 1600 ELO which makes him look like a fucking god, so its very entertaining to watch.

Pretty sure he switched to a low level smurf at some point. I turned it off after half a game because the level of play was so low it wasn't worth watching.
twitch.tv/cratonz
Hynda
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Sweden2226 Posts
November 26 2011 18:55 GMT
#2578
On November 27 2011 03:37 sob3k wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 27 2011 03:12 Shiv. wrote:
Doublelift has 15k viewers at this very moment. What the fuck.


He's a good player playing @like 1600 ELO which makes him look like a fucking god, so its very entertaining to watch.

1600? Pentalift is 1250
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17281 Posts
November 26 2011 18:57 GMT
#2579
[image loading]
twitch.tv/cratonz
seppolevne
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Canada1681 Posts
November 26 2011 18:58 GMT
#2580
On November 27 2011 02:06 Craton wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 27 2011 01:31 Unentschieden wrote:
The problem with different laning and jungling requirements is the collision when you take one to the other. Wriggles is intended as jungling item but plenty laners use it for infinite sustain. And in turn without in depht research your first try to jungle will most likely result in you dying to creeps - that is quite a bit different than a suboptimal runepage when laning.

BREAKING NEWS: Noobs are bad! Who cares. Never make your decision based on what an inexperienced player will do their first time trying something. There are plenty more people who do full retard things in lane in early levels than there are junglers dying to minions. There's a reason there's a gradual leveling system so that people can learn how to play against equally bad opponents. Moreover, the new masteries make jungling much less reliant on rune pages.

Wriggles offers very little over just a plain vampiric sceptor for sustain, by the way.

Pot nerfs are even dumber than the jungler nerfs. What do people do when they get low hp? Hug towers or back. What do people do when they have high hp? Skirmish and poke. Pot nerf is yet another change that goes explicitly against their stated goal of decreasing passivity.

So people get to low hp, they tower hug. Free lane for the other team to farm all day. Or they back - free tower. Or maybe they stay around because shit, we need to defend this -> other team gets aggressive -> jungler ganks them. Or maybe the aggressive lanes trades 2 for 1. Or maybe everyone b's every 3 minutes because....? Less health means more deaths - backing isn't instant and not always an option.
J- Pirate Udyr WW T- Pirate Riven Galio M- Galio Annie S- Sona Lux -- Always farm, never carry.
Prev 1 127 128 129 130 131 158 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Afreeca Starleague
10:00
Ro16 Group C
Bisu vs Ample
Jaedong vs Flash
Afreeca ASL 17126
StarCastTV_EN520
Liquipedia
Replay Cast
09:00
SEL Doubles #1
CranKy Ducklings69
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
SortOf 139
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 8426
Sea 6934
BeSt 1813
firebathero 979
EffOrt 626
Stork 394
Pusan 310
Larva 270
actioN 267
ZerO 267
[ Show more ]
Soulkey 170
Rush 141
Mini 140
Hyun 125
hero 122
ToSsGirL 106
Killer 93
Sharp 35
Backho 27
sSak 27
Barracks 26
Sexy 25
JulyZerg 24
NaDa 23
yabsab 18
Shine 18
SilentControl 17
Hm[arnc] 12
Terrorterran 11
Bale 11
GoRush 11
Noble 8
Dota 2
XaKoH 501
NeuroSwarm120
XcaliburYe68
ODPixel58
League of Legends
Reynor52
Counter-Strike
edward238
x6flipin59
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King68
Other Games
singsing1415
crisheroes262
Pyrionflax168
Livibee50
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream7916
PGL Dota 2 - Secondary Stream6899
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 294
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 50
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP4
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• TFBlade979
Other Games
• WagamamaTV130
Upcoming Events
Wardi Open
36m
Monday Night Weeklies
5h 36m
RSL Revival
15h 36m
GSL
21h 36m
Afreeca Starleague
23h 36m
Barracks vs Leta
Royal vs Light
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
1d
RSL Revival
1d 23h
Replay Cast
2 days
The PondCast
2 days
KCM Race Survival
2 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
3 days
CranKy Ducklings
3 days
Escore
3 days
RSL Revival
4 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
5 days
Universe Titan Cup
5 days
Rogue vs Percival
Ladder Legends
5 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
5 days
BSL
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
6 days
Ladder Legends
6 days
BSL
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Wardi Open
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: W3
RSL Revival: Season 4
NationLESS Cup

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
StarCraft2 Community Team League 2026 Spring
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: W4
Acropolis #4
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.