EPT[Patch 1.0.0.124: Talon] General Discussion - Page 133
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-Kato-
Spain1146 Posts
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Craton
United States17294 Posts
~ It's a modifier that basically says 'ignore minions.' | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
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Craton
United States17294 Posts
129 from fake plat, so close but so far :S | ||
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spinesheath
Germany8679 Posts
What would really help imo is some kind of reward for playing arranged 5s. Strictly better than all you could get from solo Q. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
On September 05 2011 17:24 UniversalSnip wrote: jesus god I've never carried a game as hard as this one ![[image loading]](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v410/UniversalSnip/wowthatgame.jpg) nexus towers down? np. Ashe that hit ONE arrow in the first 45ish minutes? ok. Brand that feeds annie five kills mid and then feeds nid when he swaps top? Eh whatever. Full items tristana? Do not make me laugh. Morgana. Also, janna. I'm EXHAUSTED after that game. I want to press on to gold tonight but I just can't. And by carry you mean played somewhat well getting a postive KDA (expected on carries) while the jungler carried all the bad players? Honestly if a melee jungler has a score like that he is just carrying you all on his back :O | ||
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Craton
United States17294 Posts
On September 05 2011 20:49 spinesheath wrote: I don't think it would be too bad if they simply removed the rating on ranked Solo Q. It's not necessary either though. What would really help imo is some kind of reward for playing arranged 5s. Strictly better than all you could get from solo Q. Why should Solo Q ranked be removed? Normals have no meaningful skill divisions -- they are, and will forever be, a practice ground for people to learn the game and learn the champs. You play ranked because you want to play a game with and against good players, not with someone who is clueless of how to play the game or their champ. Requiring people to queue with 5 others will kill the interest in this game for many people. It would be the biggest blunder Riot could ever do. | ||
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phyvo
United States5635 Posts
I'm not cool enough to duo queue with anyone with above 1500 elo, let alone someone from TL that other TLers actually know about. And he doesn't stream so idk how I'm supposed to witness such a thing. On September 05 2011 21:02 Craton wrote: Why should Solo Q ranked be removed? Normals have no meaningful skill divisions -- they are, and will forever be, a practice ground for people to learn the game and learn the champs. You play ranked because you want to play a game with and against good players, not with someone who is clueless of how to play the game or their champ. Requiring people to queue with 5 others will kill the interest in this game for many people. It would be the biggest blunder Riot could ever do. I don't think that solo queue should be removed but to be honest there needs to be more attraction for arranged 5s. There should be *some* bonus for rounding up 5 people to play with, even if it's a terrible pub group. To do an arranged 5s you need to coordinate with 4 other people and for many people that's simply way too much work (har har coordination too much work in a team game). Their system for scoring arranged 5s isn't too great either, it's not even half as good as what WoW had for PvP teams and WoW PvP is a joke in many ways. Even a decent clan system might help people form better 5 man premades but Riot just literally has nothing to encourage 5s so no one plays them. Moreover pretty much all the streams on CLG stream solo queue nearly all the time so it's not like high elo streamers set much of an example for the rest of us or get us excited to try and beat them in arranged 5s. | ||
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Craton
United States17294 Posts
The problem is you're trying to make 5v5 ranked the superior form of ranked, rather than an alternative form. If you want to play with 5 people you know -- great. More people prefer solo Q than full premade, so it's just stupid to try and stick your [Riot's] nose in the air and saying "nah fuck you guys, we're going to make all the good rewards only available to the mode barely anyone plays." It'd be like making TT have the top rewards. The "bonus" of rounding up 5 people is having better communication and the choice of playing with people you like. Riot just literally has nothing to encourage 5s so no one plays them. This is not a problem. People should play what they like, not what Riot has artificially inflated or deflated. | ||
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spinesheath
Germany8679 Posts
Add incentives to play arranged 5s -> more people play. That's not taking away things from solo Q players. It's giving arranged 5s players something extra. | ||
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HyperionDreamer
Canada1528 Posts
On September 05 2011 21:54 Craton wrote: 5v5 arenas in WoW had very long queues at top ratings, just like LoL does. People had just as many complaints about WoW's +/- scheme as they do with Riot's. The fact of the matter is people will always complain, especially when they feel slighted. The problem is you're trying to make 5v5 ranked the superior form of ranked, rather than an alternative form. If you want to play with 5 people you know -- great. More people prefer solo Q than full premade, so it's just stupid to try and stick your [Riot's] nose in the air and saying "nah fuck you guys, we're going to make all the good rewards only available to the mode barely anyone plays." It'd be like making TT have the top rewards. The "bonus" of rounding up 5 people is having better communication and the choice of playing with people you like. This is not a problem. People should play what they like, not what Riot has artificially inflated or deflated. I think their addition of "teams" to ranked 5's will help quite a bit, since instead of playing as a team but getting individual rating points, your team will profit as a whole from winning games. Plus, they can use the ladder as a method for ranking/seeding teams into tournaments. Solo queue is more prevalent right now, IMO, because of convenience. Instead of rounding up 5 people from a chat channel or liquidparty, just press Start... | ||
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Craton
United States17294 Posts
On September 05 2011 22:03 spinesheath wrote: If this game is supposed to develop a real competitive scene, there must be a way to practice competitively. Solo Q is not good for that. Arranged 5s are not played enough. Add incentives to play arranged 5s -> more people play. That's not taking away things from solo Q players. It's giving arranged 5s players something extra. If you're giving a lesser played mode the higher rewards, then you're absolutely taking something away. The game doesn't exist for the "tournament scene" -- it exists for the everyday player. That's how a business works. If you try and marginalize the majority of your players, then you're going to fail. The fact that a tournament scene evolved out of the game is icing on the cake and something that will help LoL grow, but it is absolutely not the core of the game. Solo queue is more prevalent right now, IMO, because of convenience. Instead of rounding up 5 people from a chat channel or liquidparty, just press Start... I refer back to WoW -- there were three modes: 2v2, 3v3, and 5v5. Very, very few people played 5v5, even though you got the most bang for your buck out of the mode. Why? Because actually finding 5 people that match your skill level, mesh with every single person on the team, and are able to play regularly is exceedingly difficult. You can get 5 randoms from liquidparty for a normal (occasionally), but almost every time you're going to have a tremendous difference in skill across the 5 players. Arranged ranked is exceptionally more difficult than that. --- A thing Chaox talked about is how they're making "team ratings" instead of individual ratings for 5v5 arranged. Depending on how they implement this, it could be incredibly crippling for the average player. A MAJOR issue in WoW was that adding a new player to a team would completely fuck up your rating (your team had a rating and the individual had a rating, so if someone joined the team they'd default to a low individual rating, which would screw up the average rating of the team and really destroy the +/- gains of points). Why did WoW do this? Because the rewards, of course. Things like shoulder armor needed a high rating (like 2200+), which corresponds to the end-of-season awards for LoL. If someone can just join the team and play 0 games then it undermines the whole reward system. However, if you need a % of the games played, then you basically have to disband a team and start from scratch if you want to add a player after having a lot of games played, as otherwise you'll have someone ineligible for the rewards. Only the very top teams can have a core group of 5 people that can play. The average team would need 10+ just to have enough on to play games (and that's not even counting the differences in skill between players), which further compounds that problem. | ||
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tyCe
Australia2542 Posts
edit: as for incentives to play ranked 5s; well they can have automated/integrated tournaments every week or day open to ranked 5s, or even simply a daily chance for teams to join a best of 1 match for the chance to win some RP. Whatever they choose, I agree with chaox in that LoL is ultimately a team game and therefore the premiere ranking system should be team-based. | ||
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Attakijing
United States693 Posts
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Craton
United States17294 Posts
On September 05 2011 23:05 Attakijing wrote: once someone comes up with a way to encourage people to play ranked 5's everyone will wonder how anyone could ever play this game without it. admit it, almost every solo q game you lose makes you wonder why you even bother putting faith in your teammates. hopefully valve will do it with dota 2 and then riot or some third party will make a similar social networking application for LoL, because i don't feel like learning another 100 champions Your choice then becomes dealing with strangers once in awhile (the lower your Elo the less likely you are to play with someone again) and dealing with the drama of cutting someone you know (aka a friend) from your team because they're a dick to play with or just bad, which is imo worse. | ||
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tyCe
Australia2542 Posts
On September 05 2011 23:06 Craton wrote: You could just have a chat room for your team set to auto-join. I'm not really sure how a team system is going to do much more than that for communication. Your choice then becomes dealing with strangers once in awhile (the lower your Elo the less likely you are to play with someone again) and dealing with the drama of cutting someone you know (aka a friend) from your team because they're a dick to play with or just bad, which is imo worse. You misunderstand me. I'm suggesting a clan/guild type system with the necessary interface for the clan to organize itself. E.g. It could be like LiquidParty with a visible roster, player ratings, ability to set announcements and schedules and with clan titles etc etc. Its much harder to convince someone to join a channel you set up everytime they log in cos you know, maybe there would be some ranked 5s going on, than actually have clans or teams be the norm and have them automatically sign into the clan page interface when they log in. Convenience and accessibility shouldn't be underrated as after all, solo queue is played because of it's accessibility rather than it's unbeatable fun factor. | ||
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Attakijing
United States693 Posts
On September 05 2011 23:06 Craton wrote: You could just have a chat room for your team set to auto-join. I'm not really sure how a team system is going to do much more than that for communication. people "could" just email each other all the information they publish on facebook. why didn't people do that? because facebook makes it really easy. if teams are built into the game people will understand that even if they only play solo queue there is a whole other part of the game based on coordination and teamwork that they are ignoring. Your choice then becomes dealing with strangers once in awhile (the lower your Elo the less likely you are to play with someone again) and dealing with the drama of cutting someone you know (aka a friend) from your team because they're a dick to play with or just bad, which is imo worse. welcome to real life, lol. i had a roommate who turned into a real dick as soon as he started losing and i'm not living with him this year, not just because of that, but it is kind of revealing of his personality. god forbid a video game promotes being a nice person. IMO the future is probably going to be things similar to the TL LoL community. certain websites like reddit or TL, or other interest groups, will have subcommunities that people feel at home in. Maybe you think someone in that group is a dick but as long as you can find 4 people you like that are online you can have a game with them. edit: wow, idea KS | ||
739
Bearded Elder29905 Posts
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Aurdon
United States2007 Posts
On September 05 2011 22:03 spinesheath wrote: If this game is supposed to develop a real competitive scene, there must be a way to practice competitively. Solo Q is not good for that. Arranged 5s are not played enough. Add incentives to play arranged 5s -> more people play. That's not taking away things from solo Q players. It's giving arranged 5s players something extra. The problem is having no real way for the average player to put on tournaments. Without replays or observer mode, you have to contact riot to get a hold of the tournament realm to do anything. So weekly cups and community run tournaments just don't happen. Right now you just have the big riot sponsored lans and the ESL/NESL cups. Hopefully when Riot gets their shit together you will start to see more people running small little tournies and stuff and the regular player will have chances to either compete on a more regular basis or have something worth setting up scrims and five queing. | ||
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STS17
United States1817 Posts
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