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Russian Federation4235 Posts
Riot has a very interesting approach to late-game items that DotA never had.
Dota strictly follows one rule in item pricing: space costs money. The more stats an item gives in one slot, the more each point of those stats cost. So it's really most cost-effective to fill your inventory with cheap items you can afford at the moment than get one large item that will only take one slot. It makes sense as it gives the player an additional layer of choice: "should I itemize for the maximum gain now knowing that later I will have to sell some of this stuff or should I get less stats but effectively get more gold later since I won't be selling anything?". Note that you would still rush high-end items in DotA (on carries, other archetypes simply could not allow to hoard much gold), however, it would be not for their stats, but for their unique bonuses like that of Radiance etc.
LoL is the exact opposite of that. The larger the item is, the LESS each point of a stat on it costs. I can't really understand where is that coming from because you always want to rush the big guns, especially since you cant lose gold in LoL. Riot specifically made imbalanced items (Doran's items) to overcome their own pricing policy balancing them with the fact that they simply dont grade into anything and therefore are taking up valuable space in inventory later on.
Which of the policies is better? I don't know. But it may have something to do with the fact that almost every carry is rushing BF sword based items and ignores all "midgame" stuff.
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anyone been having issues with chat lately? I can see people in the channel, but none of the chatcrafting :<
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Mhhhh, am I the only one that finds blitzcranks hook hitbox too big? In comparison to pudges hooks, I find it really easy to land them. It feels as if they took a little speed and range but increased the size of the hitbox way too much.
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On June 04 2011 07:54 Iplaythings wrote:
Denying would make me quit the game. period.
its funny gutiar, cus many of the changes you want is the reason why i play LoL and not HoN. It sounds like you wanna turn LoL to a exact copy of HoN lol, weird. Many of these changes would make me go "fuck no!" and quit the game.
well HoN is awful but yeah i wouldn't mind the gameplay making a shift to more dota-based stuff, it's true.
and bluzman you said exactly what i meant about items. cost efficiency should go DOWN with late-game items, not UP. this would make early game items more powerful (making early game less passive) and make more item branches for champs instead of the classic "every ranged hero rush IE + LW" and "every tanky dps get atmogs + triforce" imo imo
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On June 04 2011 06:47 gtrsrs wrote:
>itemize flash AND/OR make it work like dota's blink dagger
- blink dagger is a beautiful item because it only works offensively. if you've taken damage you can't use it, so you can't be like "OH SHIT 5-MAN GANK COMING I'M GONNA JUST HUG THIS WALL, EAT A ROUND OF CC AND GET TO 1% HEALTH, THEN FLASH OVER LOLOL MY TEAM TAKES BARON AND I GET AWAY RISK FREE."
- in doing this, jungle ganks will be MUCH stronger because there won't be that bullshit flash right at the end of a gank that saves someone. if the laner initiates, the flash won't be able to activate, then the jungler can run in and finish.
Im not the biggest fan of making Flash into an item, it's incredibly hard to balance, I mean it took Icefrog a really long to get the dagger right and it was blatently overpowered for a long time (10 people with dagger lol). The 3-second rule on Flash might work, but not shure on that. I mean, a lot of heroes depend on flash as their only escape so it will propably change the metagame a lot (and might make tankydps overpowered or something)
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I continue to maintain that the best change that can be made to this game is the return of the old LW= an item with aspeed and %arpen.
As for early game, only real way to have battles is to drastically increase health so that players feel good about poking each other without dying. At the same time, lower regen so that getting hit means something. And change it so that exp gain is increased across the board, so that if someone has to back, then the other player gets a level advantage they can play off. Solves the problem of worrying about dying since it is unlikely to happen, and makes the penalty for losing less severe: a level instead of 300 gold and that level. Players engage more, riot gets their less lane passivity bullshit.
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They nerfed health quints and masteries though, looks like the totally wrong way to do it.
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On June 04 2011 09:56 Slayer91 wrote:
They nerfed health quints and masteries though, looks like the totally wrong way to do it.
Thats because the live balance team is largely incompetent.
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Sometimes I wonder why I play this game.
I was going to write out my last game, but really what's the point it would be like 5 A4s worth of mindblowingly bad stuff.
I just wonder why I keep punishing myself like this.
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On June 04 2011 10:06 Hynda wrote:
Sometimes I wonder why I play this game.
I was going to write out my last game, but really what's the point it would be like 5 A4s worth of mindblowingly bad stuff.
I just wonder why I keep punishing myself like this.
The harder the struggle, the more sweet the end result.
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On June 04 2011 10:15 0123456789 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2011 10:06 Hynda wrote:
Sometimes I wonder why I play this game.
I was going to write out my last game, but really what's the point it would be like 5 A4s worth of mindblowingly bad stuff.
I just wonder why I keep punishing myself like this. The harder the struggle, the more sweet the end result.
That is true, I need to stop playing at wonky times aswell I do well during the "prime time" but whenever I play during the night I get the weirdest people ever.
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wow TL premades too imba
made Peach Hime ragequit
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Anyone know how to fix the chatroom bug?
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Imo rebalancing hp/items/summoners is not the way to encourage fights. the risk/reward for any early/midgame objectives is just fucked up.
there are pretty much no good objectives to go for early/mid.
- promote/rally were removed/castrated, so no way to early push well
- respawn timers are so short you barely gain an advantage off a kill
- dragon's only worth is gold for the lategame, gunning for it is essentially trying to farm harder
- buffs are alright, but if there's no fight, buffs don't actually have much power.
so you can't kill towers, people, or dragon/buffs for any sizable advantage. so you just farm until the one big fight for the one objective (baron) worth anything.
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On June 04 2011 08:37 Woony wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2011 06:47 gtrsrs wrote:
>itemize flash AND/OR make it work like dota's blink dagger
- blink dagger is a beautiful item because it only works offensively. if you've taken damage you can't use it, so you can't be like "OH SHIT 5-MAN GANK COMING I'M GONNA JUST HUG THIS WALL, EAT A ROUND OF CC AND GET TO 1% HEALTH, THEN FLASH OVER LOLOL MY TEAM TAKES BARON AND I GET AWAY RISK FREE."
- in doing this, jungle ganks will be MUCH stronger because there won't be that bullshit flash right at the end of a gank that saves someone. if the laner initiates, the flash won't be able to activate, then the jungler can run in and finish.
Im not the biggest fan of making Flash into an item, it's incredibly hard to balance, I mean it took Icefrog a really long to get the dagger right and it was blatently overpowered for a long time (10 people with dagger lol). The 3-second rule on Flash might work, but not shure on that. I mean, a lot of heroes depend on flash as their only escape so it will propably change the metagame a lot (and might make tankydps overpowered or something)
Same here. I thought about it for a while and thought itemizing Flash would be good, but then I decided it's more harmful than not.
I mean, the CD on blink dagger is what? 15-30 seconds? Can you imagine a roaming Alistar with blink dagger with the ability to roflwtfpwn your face every time his cds are down? That'd be straight up retarded imo.
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It would obviously not have a 30 sec CD.
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12 sec cd, 75 mana, 3 sec cd on damage taken.
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On June 04 2011 13:32 Kaneh wrote:
Imo rebalancing hp/items/summoners is not the way to encourage fights. the risk/reward for any early/midgame objectives is just fucked up.
there are pretty much no good objectives to go for early/mid.
- promote/rally were removed/castrated, so no way to early push well
- respawn timers are so short you barely gain an advantage off a kill
- dragon's only worth is gold for the lategame, gunning for it is essentially trying to farm harder
- buffs are alright, but if there's no fight, buffs don't actually have much power.
so you can't kill towers, people, or dragon/buffs for any sizable advantage. so you just farm until the one big fight for the one objective (baron) worth anything.
I think that's also a good point. Dragon should probably be buffed to give some EXP additionally to the gold.
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On June 04 2011 20:32 Woony wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2011 13:32 Kaneh wrote:
Imo rebalancing hp/items/summoners is not the way to encourage fights. the risk/reward for any early/midgame objectives is just fucked up.
there are pretty much no good objectives to go for early/mid.
- promote/rally were removed/castrated, so no way to early push well
- respawn timers are so short you barely gain an advantage off a kill
- dragon's only worth is gold for the lategame, gunning for it is essentially trying to farm harder
- buffs are alright, but if there's no fight, buffs don't actually have much power.
so you can't kill towers, people, or dragon/buffs for any sizable advantage. so you just farm until the one big fight for the one objective (baron) worth anything. I think that's also a good point. Dragon should probably be buffed to give some EXP additionally to the gold.
it does but only for those around it
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On June 04 2011 07:58 HazMat wrote:
Westrice streaming Eg vs TSM scrim.
apparently they are planning on scrimming like 7 days every day until dreamhack. Should make CLG and the Europeans run for their money :D
7 days every day? I see. SO THATS THE SECRET! ;P Clg is probably going to be working hard as well... or at least they have to if they don't want a repeat of what happened in the qualifiers.
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EPT
