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On October 07 2025 01:23 Manit0u wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2025 19:43 0x64 wrote:On October 06 2025 17:50 EEk1TwEEk wrote:On October 06 2025 10:27 Manit0u wrote: Apparently this brings down their oil refinement capabilities down by 50% pre-war. Where do you get these numbers?)) From multiple sources, you know things are getting bad when propagandists are switching their subject. The thing about this number is that it is not something symmetric and linear. You can produce more than you need until you don't. It is a hard wall and the collapse is very fast after that. The only thing more serious than oil shortage, is food shortage. It's weird how things went from a 3 days conquest of ukraine to "well, it's not technically 50% of our oil refinery capacity that has been destroyed, it is 47.5% fact check your numbers, you are victim of western propaganda." Do dumb stuff, have dumb consequences. Last week it was reported they lost around 40% of their refining capacity. And now they've lost 3 more refineries in 3 days. 2 of them close to Moscow. 40% was total outages in petrol refining. The system was never 100% up even before the war.
The loss from attacks was estimated at around 25%.
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Not in Poland's interest to give Germany Nord Stream suspect, Tusk saysWARSAW, Oct 7 (Reuters) - It is not in Poland's interest to hand over a Ukrainian man wanted by Germany for suspected involvement in explosions which damaged the Nord Stream gas pipelines, the Polish prime minister said on Tuesday. Donald Tusk said that ultimately it was for the court to decide whether Volodymyr Z., who was detained near Warsaw in late September, is handed over. But he reiterated Poland's long-standing opposition to the pipelines, which Warsaw says were key to making Europe too dependent on Russian energy. "The problem of Europe, the problem of Ukraine, the problem of Lithuania and Poland is not that Nord Stream 2 was blown up, but that it was built," Tusk told a news conference. "It is certainly not in the interest of Poland... to hand over this citizen to a foreign country," he added. German authorities did not immediately respond to a request for comment. A Polish court ruled on Monday that Volodymyr Z. must remain in custody for another 40 days while a decision is made on whether to transfer him to Germany based on a European arrest warrant. Described by both Moscow and the West as an act of sabotage, the explosions in 2022 marked an escalation in the Ukraine conflict and squeezed energy supplies. No one has taken responsibility for the blasts and Ukraine has denied any role. Another Ukrainian man suspected of coordinating the attacks was arrested in Italy in August and plans to fight extradition to Germany. Volodymyr Z's Polish lawyer has said his client has done nothing wrong and that he will plead not guilty. Germany's top prosecutors' office said in an earlier statement that the diver was one of a group of people who were suspected of renting a sailing yacht and planting explosives on the pipelines, which run from Russia to Germany, near the Danish island of Bornholm in September 2022. He faces accusations of conspiring to commit an explosives attack and of "anti-constitutional sabotage", the German prosecutors added. https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/not-polands-interest-give-germany-nord-stream-suspect-tusk-says-2025-10-07/
Wouldn't it make things much easier if that guy and the other guy that was arrested in Italy resided in a country where European arrest warrants can't be an issue? Daring Polish or Italian law enforcement to ignore the German warrants is kind of a dick move, if they're really guilty.
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On October 08 2025 03:41 Sent. wrote:Show nested quote +Not in Poland's interest to give Germany Nord Stream suspect, Tusk saysWARSAW, Oct 7 (Reuters) - It is not in Poland's interest to hand over a Ukrainian man wanted by Germany for suspected involvement in explosions which damaged the Nord Stream gas pipelines, the Polish prime minister said on Tuesday. Donald Tusk said that ultimately it was for the court to decide whether Volodymyr Z., who was detained near Warsaw in late September, is handed over. But he reiterated Poland's long-standing opposition to the pipelines, which Warsaw says were key to making Europe too dependent on Russian energy. "The problem of Europe, the problem of Ukraine, the problem of Lithuania and Poland is not that Nord Stream 2 was blown up, but that it was built," Tusk told a news conference. "It is certainly not in the interest of Poland... to hand over this citizen to a foreign country," he added. German authorities did not immediately respond to a request for comment. A Polish court ruled on Monday that Volodymyr Z. must remain in custody for another 40 days while a decision is made on whether to transfer him to Germany based on a European arrest warrant. Described by both Moscow and the West as an act of sabotage, the explosions in 2022 marked an escalation in the Ukraine conflict and squeezed energy supplies. No one has taken responsibility for the blasts and Ukraine has denied any role. Another Ukrainian man suspected of coordinating the attacks was arrested in Italy in August and plans to fight extradition to Germany. Volodymyr Z's Polish lawyer has said his client has done nothing wrong and that he will plead not guilty. Germany's top prosecutors' office said in an earlier statement that the diver was one of a group of people who were suspected of renting a sailing yacht and planting explosives on the pipelines, which run from Russia to Germany, near the Danish island of Bornholm in September 2022. He faces accusations of conspiring to commit an explosives attack and of "anti-constitutional sabotage", the German prosecutors added. https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/not-polands-interest-give-germany-nord-stream-suspect-tusk-says-2025-10-07/ Wouldn't it make things much easier if that guy and the other guy that was arrested in Italy resided in a country where European arrest warrants can't be an issue? Daring Polish or Italian law enforcement to ignore the German warrants is kind of a dick move, if they're really guilty.
Its also not really in german interests to find out who blew up the pipeline because its gonna be a problem either way, but saying something like that openly feels like peak polish politics to me. If the EU wasn't such an obvious benefit to poland I swear they would have brexited themselves before the brits did...You smile, wave for the camera, say that you have to review the legal process and then just come up with some BS about legal procedings or whatever afterwards in some random press release that doesn't get much attention instead of playing tough.
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Yes, I think it would be better if Tusk chose to dodge the question somehow. Diplomacy was never our greatest strength.
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United States43111 Posts
If Poland could have moved out of Europe it would have. Poland exudes “I have to live with you (Germany) but I don’t have to like you” energy. But what are they going to do, be friends with the Russians instead?
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On October 08 2025 04:48 KwarK wrote: If Poland could have moved out of Europe it would have. Poland exudes “I have to live with you (Germany) but I don’t have to like you” energy. But what are they going to do, be friends with the Russians instead?
I don't really see a big problem with Poland. They are a large, conservative eastern European country. They are now ascending into becoming a regional power and are starting to take their place in Europe. That's going to chafe a bit for both sides.Eventually they are going to have to moderate their general anti-EU stance (or leave). I don't see it happening soon and I don't see the younger generation of Poles wanting to leave EU so the boomers have time do die off
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Russia being so clearly the bad guy and expansionist should bring everyone together for at least the short term, perhaps the weakest silver lining I've found in a while.
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United States43111 Posts
On October 08 2025 05:12 CuddlyCuteKitten wrote:Show nested quote +On October 08 2025 04:48 KwarK wrote: If Poland could have moved out of Europe it would have. Poland exudes “I have to live with you (Germany) but I don’t have to like you” energy. But what are they going to do, be friends with the Russians instead? I don't really see a big problem with Poland. They are a large, conservative eastern European country. They are now ascending into becoming a regional power and are starting to take their place in Europe. That's going to chafe a bit for both sides.Eventually they are going to have to moderate their general anti-EU stance (or leave). I don't see it happening soon and I don't see the younger generation of Poles wanting to leave EU so the boomers have time do die off No problem with Poland for sure. I like them better than the Brexiteers of the UK. And it’s not like the Poles don’t have legitimate historical grievances. The contradictions are just funny to me. The way the populists snipe at Germany unprovoked, I imagine Germany wanting to complain and then sighing because Poland has a perfect comeback lined up for that.
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On October 08 2025 09:09 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On October 08 2025 05:12 CuddlyCuteKitten wrote:On October 08 2025 04:48 KwarK wrote: If Poland could have moved out of Europe it would have. Poland exudes “I have to live with you (Germany) but I don’t have to like you” energy. But what are they going to do, be friends with the Russians instead? I don't really see a big problem with Poland. They are a large, conservative eastern European country. They are now ascending into becoming a regional power and are starting to take their place in Europe. That's going to chafe a bit for both sides.Eventually they are going to have to moderate their general anti-EU stance (or leave). I don't see it happening soon and I don't see the younger generation of Poles wanting to leave EU so the boomers have time do die off No problem with Poland for sure. I like them better than the Brexiteers of the UK. And it’s not like the Poles don’t have legitimate historical grievances. The contradictions are just funny to me. The way the populists snipe at Germany unprovoked, I imagine Germany wanting to complain and then sighing because Poland has a perfect comeback lined up for that.
Germany doesn't complain. Germany endures. I do get the feeling that Poland's stance is more of a bark don't match the bite kinda deal. And like you said, where are they supposed to go? Back to mother?
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On October 08 2025 04:17 Sent. wrote: Yes, I think it would be better if Tusk chose to dodge the question somehow. Diplomacy was never our greatest strength.
It double annoys me, because as I said, germany doesn't really want to know who did it either, at least not right now and publicly. I personally atm lean more towards thinking ukraine had the pipeline blown up, which if it came out would hurt at least public support, which is why I rather not have it come out right now.
If germany wanted to just silently let this slide and the suspects released from custody so they vanish, then having tusk openly proclaim that poland is reluctant to hand them over makes that harder. Luckily I haven't seen a big media resonance here in germany to this, or otherwise public reception.
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