EPTRusso-Ukrainian War Thread - Page 190
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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SC-Shield
Bulgaria832 Posts
On August 15 2022 04:00 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: Reports coming in of a Ukrainian strike at the location of a facility that supposedly, stressed supposedly, where the leader of the Wagner Group Yevgeny Prigozhin was seen. Was the HQ of Wagner forces in Donbas. https://twitter.com/L_Team10/status/1558865447541510151 You mean Luhansk county not Donbas. Or so tells me Google. I think Russia cannot continue this war for another 6-12 months at this pace assuming they don't start some referendum or nuclear shenanigans. I hope Ukrainians inflict maximum damage on Russian soldiers to demotivate them further and I think Ukrainian army does it well, Russian soldiers don't feel safe anywhere with HIMARS and recent attacks. | ||
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Magic Powers
Austria4478 Posts
https://www.voanews.com/a/un-movement-of-grain-ships-from-ukraine-encouraging-/6696347.html | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
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Ardias
Russian Federation612 Posts
On August 15 2022 00:09 SC-Shield wrote: My country is still bitterly split in whether to provide Ukraine with weapons even though our Russian 'brothers' attacked my home city in 1916. "Bulgaria, recuperating from the Balkan Wars, sat out the first year of World War I, but when Germany promised to restore the boundaries of the Treaty of San Stefano, Bulgaria, which had the largest army in the Balkans, declared war on Serbia in October 1915. Britain, France and Italy then declared war on Bulgaria." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Bulgaria_(1878–1946)#World_War_I Sorry for standing up for our ally. Also please remind me, who were signing the said Treaty of San-Stefano which Germans appealed to (and who then blocked it from coming to life). On August 14 2022 23:26 SC-Shield wrote: Yeah, it's been known for at least few days that Wagner came out of shadows and openly recruits to join invasion in Ukraine. Also it's reported that some Russian soldiers are from ethnic regions, so it's speculated that Putin does it because he is afraid to cause civil unrest or a threat to his regime if he announces mass mobilisation or if he sends young men from Moscow and Saint Petersburg to die. I've heard that recruitment is from $2000 to $5000 in a 'desperate' attempt to attract volunteers, which is also a salary higher than average. That's why I say desperate attempt. Sources: 1. https://edition.cnn.com/2022/07/29/europe/russia-recruits-volunteer-battalions-ukraine-war-cmd-intl/index.html 2. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/aug/07/russias-private-military-contractor-wagner-comes-out-of-the-shadows-in-ukraine-war We all need to endure current economic difficulties and keep supporting Ukraine for free world to go on.  Wagner openly recruits people from the start of the war, you can easily find contacts in Russian Telegram channels covering the war. Payment in Wagner is similar to the payment to contract Russian soldier in combat zone, it's just Wagner specialists were always deployed regularly (Africa and Middle East), while before Ukraine, most contract troops (not counting Syria task force) were getting peace time payments, which are around 5 times lower than combat ones (600$ vs 3000$ a month for enlisted personnel, not sure about officers). Example (translate with Google): https://www.fontanka.ru/2022/06/09/71399819/ Wagner handles the payments better though, and has less army idiocy, so people proficient in military specializations, or having previous combat experience often go there. How can Putin force anyone from specific region to enlist, if all who go to Ukraine, join the army at their own volition? As I've told before, ethnic regions (not counting those on the north with oil and gas, plus Tatarstan) are among the most economically depressed in Russia, but they have plenty of young men, due to local peoples having more kids, than in Russian regions, plus they have generally lower education and more traditional upbringing, where being strong and brave is considered manly, and a lot of the boys are raised that way. All that (poverty, low education, being strong and respected for being a warrior) makes it convinient for the young people there to seek their career opportunities through the army. Kids from Moscow/St. Petersburg have much more opportunities to earn their living, than enlistment. On August 15 2022 04:00 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: Reports coming in of a Ukrainian strike at the location of a facility that supposedly, stressed supposedly, where the leader of the Wagner Group Yevgeny Prigozhin was seen. Was the HQ of Wagner forces in Donbas. https://twitter.com/L_Team10/status/1558865447541510151 He was there, but he is unharmed, there are photos of him at the site of the strike in RU tg channels. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Wesso
Netherlands1245 Posts
On August 16 2022 04:17 Ardias wrote: "Bulgaria, recuperating from the Balkan Wars, sat out the first year of World War I, but when Germany promised to restore the boundaries of the Treaty of San Stefano, Bulgaria, which had the largest army in the Balkans, declared war on Serbia in October 1915. Britain, France and Italy then declared war on Bulgaria." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Bulgaria_(1878–1946)#World_War_I Sorry for standing up for our ally. Also please remind me, who were signing the said Treaty of San-Stefano which Germans appealed to (and who then blocked it from coming to life). So funny that every country has their own selective memory. Respect for your attitude in these discussions Ardias. | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
NEW YORK, Aug 15 (Reuters) - The United Nations has the logistics and security capacity to support a visit by International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) inspectors to Ukraine's Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Power Plant, a spokesman said, but a Russia diplomat imposed conditions, saying routing any mission through Ukraine's capital was too dangerous. U.N. spokesman Stephane Dujarric, speaking on Monday, also said: "The U.N. Secretariat has no authority to block or cancel any IAEA activities." Dujarric was responding to an accusation by Russia that U.N. security had blocked a visit by IAEA inspectors to Europe's largest nuclear power plant, which Russia seized in March following its invasion of Ukraine on Feb. 24. He said that "in close contact with the IAEA, the U.N. Secretariat has assessed that it has in Ukraine the logistics and security capacity to be able to support any IAEA mission to the Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Power Plant from Kyiv." But he said both Russia and Ukraine have to agree. Both countries have said they want IAEA inspectors to visit. IAEA chief Rafael Grossi has said he was ready to lead a mission and called on Russia and Ukraine to cooperate. In Moscow, Russian news agencies quoted a senior diplomat as saying that no such mission could pass through Kyiv, the Ukrainian capital, as proposed by the United Nations. "Imagine what it means to pass through Kyiv -- it means they get to the nuclear plant through the front line," RIA news agency quoted Igor Vishnevetsky, deputy head of the foreign ministry's nuclear proliferation and arms control department, as telling journalists. "This is a huge risk, given that Ukraine's armed forces are not all made up in the same way," he was quoted as saying. Russia describes its actions in Ukraine as a "special military operation" and accuses Kyiv's military -- and much of its political structures -- as being beholden to nationalists and "Nazis." Tass news agency quoted Vishnevetsky as saying that any such mission had no mandate to address the "demilitarization" of the plant as demanded by Kyiv as it could only deal with "fulfillment of IAEA guarantees." U.N. Secretary-General Antonio Guterres on Thursday called for an end to military activity around the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power complex as Moscow and Kyiv blamed each other for shelling of the area. read more Guterres spoke with Russian Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu on Monday about the conditions for the safe operations of the Zaporizhzhia, the United Nations and Russia said. Source | ||
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Manit0u
Poland17432 Posts
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Ardias
Russian Federation612 Posts
https://ria.ru/20220804/tsar-1807130269.html CAR apparently requested another 3000 military personnel from Russia. On August 16 2022 10:57 Manit0u wrote: So, the Russian state media got Steven Seagal to show up in the studio and dump on the West. I mean, he did apparently join the pro-Kremlin party (Just Russia) about a year ago... He got Russian citizenship and got banned from Ukraine about 5 years ago. He and Jeff Monson both apparently do their own documentaries about Donbass war, both being shot from Russian perspective. On August 16 2022 06:02 Wesso wrote: So funny that every country has their own selective memory. Respect for your attitude in these discussions Ardias. Thanks, I'm a firm believer that even on-line people may maintain reasonable, accurate and rational discussion, hence I'm always checking sources on info I'm arguing about (if it's not coming from my personal experience or from experience of people I know and trust). | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
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SC-Shield
Bulgaria832 Posts
On August 16 2022 04:17 Ardias wrote: "Bulgaria, recuperating from the Balkan Wars, sat out the first year of World War I, but when Germany promised to restore the boundaries of the Treaty of San Stefano, Bulgaria, which had the largest army in the Balkans, declared war on Serbia in October 1915. Britain, France and Italy then declared war on Bulgaria." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Bulgaria_(1878–1946)#World_War_I Sorry for standing up for our ally. Also please remind me, who were signing the said Treaty of San-Stefano which Germans appealed to (and who then blocked it from coming to life). Why didn't you quote a few sentences back as well? In the aftermath of the Balkan Wars Bulgarian opinion turned against Russia and the western powers, whom the Bulgarians felt had done nothing to help them. The government of Vasil Radoslavov aligned Bulgaria with Germany and Austria-Hungary, even though this meant also becoming an ally of the Ottomans, Bulgaria's traditional enemy. But Bulgaria now had no claims against the Ottomans, whereas Serbia, Greece and Romania (allies of Britain and France) were all in possession of lands perceived in Bulgaria as Bulgarian. Bulgaria was content to sit on the fence and observe the fortunes of war before deciding whether to declare their sympathies Bulgaria didn't join Russia presumably because Russia didn't promise us our lands back. So it's only natural what happened in 1915. If Russia was such an ally, they would have helped either by negotiation or by better deal. Now, tell me how is Russia friend when it occupied so many countries in 1944 and killed opposition and intelligent people in the name of communism? It's not just Bulgaria, you invaded and occupied many countries even though they denounced nazism. E.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1944_Bulgarian_coup_d'état So when is Russia going to apologise for this to Bulgaria and all Eastern European countries? Also, when is Russia going to apologise for massacring innocent Ukrainian people in this year alone to be on topic? Once Russia takes full responsibility for their action and stops with anti-NATO scaremongering, there could be a long lasting peace. What happened in Ukraine is entirely Russia's doing. | ||
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r00ty
Germany1057 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + | ||
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Manit0u
Poland17432 Posts
On August 16 2022 19:42 r00ty wrote: Explosions and huge fires on a Russian base in northern crimea this morning. + Show Spoiler + https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDG8vWQf_ek Another accidental fire at an ammunitions depot according to Russian sources... Isn't most of this footage from the airport attack last week? | ||
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r00ty
Germany1057 Posts
On August 16 2022 20:02 Manit0u wrote: Isn't most of this footage from the airport attack last week? You're right sorry. I edited the post it's just a fire. I watched two sources and both of them start off with the airforce base pictures. -,- | ||
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Ardias
Russian Federation612 Posts
On August 16 2022 19:42 r00ty wrote: Another accidental fire at an ammunitions depot according to Russian sources... No, our Ministry of Defence admitted that this was a sabotage/diversion. On August 16 2022 20:02 Manit0u wrote: Isn't most of this footage from the airport attack last week? Only the last part, other videos are new. On August 16 2022 19:23 SC-Shield wrote: Why didn't you quote a few sentences back as well? Bulgaria didn't join Russia presumably because Russia didn't promise us our lands back. So it's only natural what happened in 1915. If Russia was such an ally, they would have helped either by negotiation or by better deal. Now, tell me how is Russia friend when it occupied so many countries in 1944 and killed opposition and intelligent people in the name of communism? It's not just Bulgaria, you invaded and occupied many countries even though they denounced nazism. E.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1944_Bulgarian_coup_d'état So when is Russia going to apologise for this to Bulgaria and all Eastern European countries? Also, when is Russia going to apologise for massacring innocent Ukrainian people in this year alone to be on topic? Once Russia takes full responsibility for their action and stops with anti-NATO scaremongering, there could be a long lasting peace. What happened in Ukraine is entirely Russia's doing. You mean the lands you lost, because you attacked your former allies (who were also tightly aligned to Russia, especially Serbia) because you felt that you didn't get enough from the First Balkan War? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Balkan_War "The Second Balkan War was a conflict which broke out when Bulgaria, dissatisfied with its share of the spoils of the First Balkan War, attacked its former allies, Serbia and Greece, on 16 (O.S.) / 29 (N.S.) June 1913." Also Russia tried to mediate, but Bulgaria didn't like the result of that, forcing Russia to withdraw from arbitration. + Show Spoiler + "Another point of friction arose: Bulgaria's refusal to cede the fortress of Silistra to Romania. When Romania demanded its cession after the First Balkan War, Bulgaria's foreign minister offered instead some minor border changes, which excluded Silistra, and assurances for the rights of the Kutzovlachs in Macedonia. Romania threatened to occupy Bulgarian territory by force, but a Russian proposal for arbitration prevented hostilities. In the resulting Protocol of St. Petersburg of 9 May 1913, Bulgaria agreed to give up Silistra. The resulting agreement was a compromise between the Romanian demands for the city, two triangles at the Bulgaria–Romania border and the city of Balchik and the land between it and Romania and the Bulgarian refusal to accept any cession of its territory. However the fact that Russia failed to protect the territorial integrity of Bulgaria made the Bulgarians uncertain of the reliability of the expected Russian arbitration of the dispute with Serbia.[14] The Bulgarian behavior had also a long-term impact on the Russo-Bulgarian relations. The uncompromising Bulgarian position tο review the pre-war agreement with Serbia during a second Russian initiative for arbitration between them finally led Russia to cancel its alliance with Bulgaria." Then nobody touched you during WW1, but you entered on your own volition, to take, as you said, "your lands back" (I think that's what people blame Putin for, isn't it?). But of course it's the Russian Empire who is the bad guy here. Also you didn't answer my question about San Stefano treaty. Then, I'm not sure why are you shifting attention from the topic I started to discuss, regarding the events of 1916, but if you want to talk about 1944 and later, weren't there a ton of communists in Europe beside those in Soviet Union? So much, in fact, that US and UK had to force them out from France and Italy via Marshall's plan (the demand to withdraw communists from governments)? Even in the link you provided among the chief perpetrators of the coup I see only Bulgarians. Also, if you want to point at nationalities, it's a bit funny to read that "Russia occupied and killed people", when Soviet Union was lead by this Georgian https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin and the stuff about occupation and killings was overseen by this Georgian https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavrentiy_Beria but every bad stuff Soviet Union made in public perception is shifted on Russia and Russians for some reason, and other former Soviet nationalities are clean of everything. Answering your latter questions - probably as soon as US apologizes to the Vietnamese people. Or Chinese to Tibetians. Hell, even Netherlands apologized for war crimes in Indonesia like 70 years later, despite inflicting tens of thousands civilian casualties there. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/feb/17/dutch-state-condoned-extreme-violence-in-indonesian-war-inquiry-concludes Governments don't like to apologize to somebody, unless forced to. Even democratic ones, authoritarian - even less so. WP article on the matter: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/05/26/the-things-america-hasnt-apologized-for/ And regarding "lasting peace" - this is only possible when there is one world hegemon, that may enforce this peace, since law is impossible without law enforcement. Such hegemon was the US for the last three decades, but now it's power is being challenged. And unless US will return to it's alone supreme power status from the 90's, I think we won't see that much peace in the world in future. | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
A Russian ammunition storage unit in northern Crimea has exploded, the Defense Ministry said, injuring at least two people and prompting the evacuation of thousands of nearby residents. The ministry blamed the blast on sabotage. Local news organizations, meanwhile, reported a second explosion on August 16 at a nearby electrical substation in the Dzhankoy district of the Russian-occupied Black Sea peninsula. It was unclear if the two incidents, which occurred around the same time, were related. Video and photographs posted on Telegram and other social media showed a series of blasts and explosions in the district, which is not far from the administrative border with the mainland Ukrainian region of Kherson, now occupied by Russian forces. Russia’s Defense Ministry said in a statement that the explosion occurred at a temporary storage facility for ammunition. The ministry later blamed the blast on unidentified saboteurs. “On the morning of August 16, as a result of sabotage, a military warehouse near the village of Dzhankoy was damaged. A number of civilian facilities, including power lines, a power plant, a railway track, as well as a number of residential buildings, were damaged,” the ministry said in a statement. “There are no serious casualties. Necessary measures are being taken to eliminate the consequences of sabotage,” it added. Sergei Aksyonov, the Russia-appointed governor for the peninsula, said two people had been injured and that railway traffic had been disrupted. About 3,000 people were also evacuated from a nearby village, he said. Refat Chubarov, a prominent leader of the Crimean Tatar community, also said in a post on Facebook that the explosion occurred at an ammunition depot. Two local Crimea news organizations, Kryminform and Crimean Wind, reported that a transformer at an electrical substation had also exploded or caught fire. Russia’s Energy Ministry was quoted by news agencies as confirming a fire at the Crimea substation, but said it had been contained. No cause was given. The incidents came roughly a week after a series of explosion tore through a Russia’s Saky air base, in a western district of Crimea, destroying a number of Russian warplanes. There's been no confirmation as to what caused those explosions, though satellite imagery showed extensive destruction at the base. Most observers suggest Ukrainian forces were responsible but Kyiv has not claimed any responsibility. Mykhaylo Podolyak, a top aide to Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy, said in a post to Twitter that the latest blasts were a reminder that the "Crimea occupied by Russians is about warehouses, explosions and a high risk of death for invaders and thieves." "What is stolen does not bring prosperity," Podolyak later told Ukrainian television. The Dzhankoy district is about 50 kilometers from the Russian-occupied region of Kherson in southern Ukraine. Source | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Manit0u
Poland17432 Posts
On August 17 2022 02:25 JimmiC wrote: Considering how the war has turned with each additional piece of Western hardware they have received. Do the Russian people even believe the claims that their weapons are years or even decades ahead? I would think some might but I can not imagine other countries would, will this effect their arm sales? Russian would be bottom of my list at this point. If you couldn't buy western for political reasons I would be thinking you would be looking Chinese or Turkish. https://ca.yahoo.com/news/putin-brags-russian-weapons-years-135617807.html Depends on your countries' needs. Sometimes you don't need HIMARS and just simple rocket launcher that blankets an area 20km away is enough. Also, say what you will but various AK variants are still some of the most widely used and most reliable assault rifles out there (which also means easy access to ammo etc.). | ||
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