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Any and all updates regarding the COVID-19 will need a source provided. Please do your part in helping us to keep this thread maintainable and under control. It is YOUR responsibility to fully read through the sources that you link, and you MUST provide a brief summary explaining what the source is about. Do not expect other people to do the work for you. Conspiracy theories and fear mongering will absolutely not be tolerated in this thread. Expect harsh mod actions if you try to incite fear needlessly. This is not a politics thread! You are allowed to post information regarding politics if it's related to the coronavirus, but do NOT discuss politics in here. Added a disclaimer on page 662. Many need to post better. | ||
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Geisterkarle
Germany3257 Posts
So "Asia got through this so good, because they wear masks" is a little bit of the mark... Wearing masks outside is still one of the stupidest things, that is backed up by basically nothing and states are "forcing" it anyway... But I think we had this mask-discussion here in this thread at least 37 times, so... start again  | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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HolydaKing
21254 Posts
China obviously has more advantages because they don't care much about human rights and stuff. | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
I suspect that much of the driving factor for widespread mask discussion is just a desire to establish a "status quo but with masks" to do something that looks meaningful without having to pay the price of a lockdown. Local regulations such as "masks everywhere all the time" seem to be leading to that, especially given that such rules are poorly followed and rarely enforced. | ||
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Lmui
Canada6220 Posts
Look at the inset for Greater Vancouver. Richmond is predominantly asian, and more than half chinese immigrant. There are no regional restrictions, movement is free between all areas on the map inset. Its per-capita stats are generally 1/3 to 1/4 of all other regions, if not better. It's a far better, population-wide acceptance of: 1. Mask up in busy areas 2. Do not go out if sick, or symptomatic 3. Better adherence to general health guidelines around social distancing etc. The virus isn't magic. If Richmond was a proper island, isolated from the rest of greater vancouver, they'd probably have a similar rate to Taiwan/Japan. They have a dramatically lower rate of covid cases is despite reservoirs of covid in all surrounding municipalities. ![[image loading]](https://images.glaciermedia.ca/polopoly_fs/1.24230209.1604015592!/fileImage/httpImage/image.png_gen/derivatives/landscape_804/bccdc-northest-oct29.png) | ||
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xM(Z
Romania5298 Posts
i'm about here: Use of surgical face masks has been advocated to protect clinicians from inhalation of aerosols containing organic and inorganic particulates. This study examined the ability of a 22 micron tracer particle to bypass the filtering capability of face mask material by peripheral marginal leakage of inspired air. For two popularly used face masks taped to a facial moulage, recovery of the tracer particle by an in vitro system was very low. When the masks were placed in the manner in which the product is commonly worn, however, significantly higher numbers of particles were recovered. Passage of inspired air around the periphery of two types of face masks appears to circumvent the masks' ability to screen airborne contaminants. the fucker goes around it; it helps with the initial infectious load delivered, but if you talk to a covid infected dude, both with masks, you'll just get it. ...The respirator provided an efficiency of 94 to 96 percent, compared with 90 to 92 percent and 85 to 86 percent for the molded and tie-on surgical masks, respectively. he exhales 15% of covid and you suck in 85% of it and that's when masks are used correctly. 10% - 15% immunization rate in heavily infected areas from the first wave and another at least 15% from the second wave(since it's way higher/stronger), and one might start seeing the light at the end of the covid tunnel. | ||
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Artisreal
Germany9235 Posts
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Nevuk
United States16280 Posts
On November 12 2020 03:20 xM(Z wrote: lets ... i'm about here: the fucker goes around it; it helps with the initial infectious load delivered, but if you talk to a covid infected dude, both with masks, you'll just get it. he exhales 15% of covid and you suck in 85% of it and that's when masks are used correctly. 10% - 15% immunization rate in heavily infected areas from the first wave and another at least 15% from the second wave(since it's way higher/stronger), and one might start seeing the light at the end of the covid tunnel. That first one isn't about masks being worn correctly, it's about how they are "commonly" worn. (Which is very vague). It's common in the states to see people with their nose out of their mask, which makes them entirely pointless, but would fit that. I also think you're reading the second one backwards - 94% are blocked by respirators, and 85% by tie on surgical masks (which fits with n95 criteria - 94% blocked is the manufacturing minimum standard for them). 15% of the viral load is STILL a significantly likely to be better outcome, even if you get it, btw, from what we know if it. Otherwise, those results fly in the face of every previous study on the subject and common sense in general. There are some filtered masks that are rather expensive and can block a somewhat higher amount, besides the n95. I bought some for my wife since she works in a high risk environment for spreading illnesses (daycare). | ||
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xM(Z
Romania5298 Posts
what people are wearing now are common surgical masks, tied on or rubber band anchored, so it's pretty much the same stuff(in a best case scenario). for the rest of them, the n95+ ones, sure; but as you said, those are used mainly in high risk environments. i believe infectious load is less relevant and how ones genetics react to the virus is critical. (mainly, even with a minimal load received, ones immune system can go overboard very fast and it does more damage than the virus itself) many unknowns sure, but i'm more worried about the need to vaccinate twice a year(like against flue) to prevent covid; i don't know dude ... and, how people would need to have proof of vaccination to engage in any public gathering thinggies. fuck | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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xM(Z
Romania5298 Posts
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WombaT
Northern Ireland26225 Posts
On November 12 2020 03:19 Lmui wrote: I've posted this before, but it's well worth reiterating: Look at the inset for Greater Vancouver. Richmond is predominantly asian, and more than half chinese immigrant. There are no regional restricitons, movement is free between all areas on the map inset. It's per-capita stats are generally 1/3 to 1/4 of all other regions, if not better. It's a far better, population-wide acceptance of: 1. Mask up in busy areas 2. Do not go out if sick, or symptomatic 3. Better adherence to general health guidelines around social distancing etc. The virus isn't magic. If Richmond was a proper island, isolated from the rest of greater vancouver, they'd probably have a similar rate to Taiwan/Japan. Their dramatically lower rate of covid cases is despite reservoirs of covid in all surrounding municipalities. Interesting, cheers for the share. I’d love to see similar breakdowns for other Western countries that have Asian-majority areas and see how those compare. | ||
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Nevuk
United States16280 Posts
We hit our daily record two days ago - New daily COVID-19 cases in the United States hit a record 128,000 on Saturday as multiple states reported the highest number of positive infections since the pandemic began, according to the Johns Hopkins University Coronavirus Resource Center. CDC is also now saying that masks provide protection for the individual wearing them, on top of protecting others. The number of Americans hospitalized due to COVID-19 has risen almost 50% in the last two weeks. On Wednesday, the U.S. surpassed 240,000 deaths caused by the coronavirus, by far the largest number in the world. The U.S. has 4.3% of the global population but 18.8% of the reported coronavirus deaths. Almost 62,000 Americans were hospitalized because of COVID-19 on Tuesday. The previous record for hospitalizations was 59,780 on April 12, after which the number began a gradual decline that reached 28,608 on Sept. 20. Since then, however, the number has been rising steadily. Texas, the nation’s second-most populous state, is the first to surpass 1 million coronavirus cases, according to data from Johns Hopkins University. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention issued new guidance on face masks: They not only protect others, but they protected the wearer, too. The World Health Organization is allowing an independent panel to review its management of the pandemic response. In ICE detention centers, the coronavirus case rate is more than 13 times the rate of the U.S. population and more than double the rate in prisons, according to the report published in JAMA Open Network. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/health/2020/11/11/covid-news-cdc-mask-guidance-maryland-texas-disney/6242757002/ My state (Ohio) is one of the better ones and it's still increased by 25% in the last 8 days. This spike is going to be drastic. | ||
BigFan
TLADT24920 Posts
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Lmui
Canada6220 Posts
On November 12 2020 04:25 WombaT wrote: Interesting, cheers for the share. I’d love to see similar breakdowns for other Western countries that have Asian-majority areas and see how those compare. Not in NA - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richmond,_British_Columbia#Demographics It's the highest proportion in NA, and I'm guessing worldwide as well. I guess maybe Markham, Ontario which would have similar differences: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Markham,_Ontario#Demographics Edit: https://www.publichealthontario.ca/en/data-and-analysis/infectious-disease/covid-19-data-surveillance/covid-19-data-tool Can't see much from here unfortunately - It's lower than downtown toronto, but higher than a couple other areas nearby. Unfortunately, it's close to isolating a chunk of Los Angeles for study, unless more granular data is released, it's hard to see if the demographics help that much. There's also massive density differences between various areas - obviously less dense areas have lower incidence. | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
Also interesting is this Twitter post, showing how the US is trending on cases - uncontrolled spread everywhere: | ||
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Magic Powers
Austria4478 Posts
Hundreds of various video clips of Chinese citizens getting sealed into their homes during the outbreak can be looked up on YT. Here's an example: https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/1703503427818 That is a human rights violation. Look up various search terms including 'China' and 'sealed homes' or something along those lines and you'll find a large amount of videos proving that this has indeed happened. The Chinese government also did not warn the world of the viral threat in time: https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/apr/12/anthony-fauci-china-misled-world-coronavirus-erupt/ This also means that the CCP only took action after it could've been too late, which means they've neglected their own citizens for months, as they had enough information to coordinate a response much sooner, ideally prior to millions of people travelling abroad during holidays. And finally the Chinese government being secretive about their coronavirus data: https://www.foxnews.com/world/chinas-low-covid-19-body-count-secrecy-adds-to-credibility-concerns Meanwhile it is well known that Taiwan responded commendably (I hope no one will ask me to provide evidence for that, because I'd really like to retain my faith in humanity). Thus it is safe to say that the approach from China's and Taiwan's government were complete opposites. Alright. Stay safe, stay healthy. | ||
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Lmui
Canada6220 Posts
On November 12 2020 09:35 LegalLord wrote: Another day, another record - we're over 10k dead globally today. Welcome to the second wave, which deems a damn sight worst than the first one-and-a-half. Also interesting is this Twitter post, showing how the US is trending on cases - uncontrolled spread everywhere: https://twitter.com/bnodesk/status/1326566347556446208 If you look at Wisconsin, they're in deep shit, worse than New york at its peak. 7k cases a day with 5.8m population. In excess of .1% new infections per day across the state, which means probably 1-2% of the state's population being infected on a weekly basis. https://www.nbc15.com/2020/11/12/covid-19-is-so-bad-in-wisconsin-dhs-needed-a-whole-new-category/ They added a new category for rating the extremity of cases, and it's a pretty pointless metric. Thanksgiving is coming up too, and if Canada is anything to go by, there'll be an explosion of cases. Daily case rates are literally going to double. | ||
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Yurie
12004 Posts
On November 12 2020 12:54 Magic Powers wrote: Since my previous post received a warning, saying I'm making grand accusations, here are some links to back up the things I said: Hundreds of various video clips of Chinese citizens getting sealed into their homes during the outbreak can be looked up on YT. Here's an example: https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/1703503427818 That is a human rights violation. Look up various search terms including 'China' and 'sealed homes' or something along those lines and you'll find a large amount of videos proving that this has indeed happened. I will only address the first point. If a new airborn virus occurs that is showing signs of very high lethality and spread the correct thing to do is to shut down the area. I will agree that China didn't implement that perfectly, the idea is correct though. If it started here I would hope they would at a minimum stop travel to and from the city. Having people deliver food to the door so I don't have to go out would be very nice compared to the alternative of being infected as well. I would strongly support permanent curfew until it is shut down. Anything else would be acting without empathy to my fellow humans. | ||
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Slydie
1929 Posts
https://covid19.healthdata.org/spain?view=infections-testing&tab=trend&test=infections The country just reached the "universa masksl" target, but the estimated use was fairly high already in the summer. The numbers did not fit well with the story they wanted to tell, though, so I suspect they distorted the curve on purpose, hiding the the absolutely massive increase in weekly cases from July until now by playing with the values. Social distancing, on the other hand, seems to go very well hand-in-hand with the increase. There are some very good reasons to believe that mask use is barely relevant, and unlike with social distancing, the point of diminishing returns is reached very quickly. I do not think millions of hours of mask wearing to prevent a single case of covid is worth it. | ||
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