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On October 10 2019 05:33 chuchuchu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2019 05:01 StasisField wrote:On October 10 2019 04:45 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 04:24 StasisField wrote:On October 10 2019 04:22 whitehat511 wrote:On October 10 2019 03:26 Meta wrote:On October 10 2019 02:04 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 01:44 Wombat_NI wrote:On October 10 2019 01:28 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 01:21 Wombat_NI wrote:
[quote]
They’re not a political platform, but they do have a clear political position here which is tow whatever line the Chinese authorities want them to tow.
Seems to me it was a pretty good platform for the guy to use really, although the attention it gained was more from Blizzard’s reaction than his actions specifically. Gained a fuckload of traction even US Senators are wading in, doubt he’d have been able to elicit such a response with a tweet.
China and especially the Gulf States use sport as an extension of their soft power, they’ve made it political already, likewise the Cold War saw sporting events like the Olympics as an ideological battleground. if it is not an political extension of soft power,why some officials of the organization are talking about politics？if not,STOP talking.As an official, you can't blatantly confront the Chinese public opinion while thinking that discrimination against Chinese people, Chinese culture and support separatism and violence. Why not? National self-determination is a key principle of geopolitics in the modern era. Considering a bomb blew in the windows of my house when I was but a babe, I’m quite happy that the United States interceded and helped facilitate a peace here that respected both of the national identities in our wee country. I would personally like to see more of China and its culture emerge onto the world stage, an old and venerable culture indeed, whose people have accomplished remarkable things in the last few decades especially. If it’s by trampling on everyone and expecting Westerners to bend to their whims and where criticism is construed as a grievous insult then, no thanks. When you think so, have you ever asked about the thoughts of ordinary Chinese? It's like I'm here to express the thoughts of an ordinary Chinese. Indeed, I feel sad that I didn't learn English well, because what I lost is not a good paper, but an opportunity to communicate with others. Not only Americans can define the world. The pioneers of socialism and communism are Germans and French. Formerly President Roosevelt of the United States was also criticized for socialism or communism. But think about Chinese history, the current development of China, and the past workers of Britain. Some ideological conflicts are unavoidable, especially under the propaganda of some western media, they usually distort the report in order to satisfy their own interests. China does not do very well in many places, but it does not want to do so. No Chinese wants his country to be like India with the same population. (I do not mean to discriminate. Most Chinese want to live a good life first and guarantee everyone the same rights, wealth, rights and status.) In China, it is still possible to elect people who have been upgraded from the grassroots level through examinations and votes, while officials at the grassroots level are also elected. In China, former leaders were even born to poor peasants rather than a billion-dollar owner or equally wealthy political family. Both father and son are presidents. Western media believe that China is undemocratic and not free, and the Chinese believe that they are free and democratic. This seems to be a disgusting tactic. I was disappointed with many of the statements, especially those of the distorted Sixth Fourth Movement (my father was one of the participants, but later they built China into the second largest country in the world), and those who believed that the Hong Kong police should not react to any of the protestors'actions. When commenting, consider that China has 1.4 billion people. This country can not change because of the ideas of more than a dozen people, thousands of people and tens of thousands of people. The most important thing is to ensure that more than a billion people, like other Westerners, can live with wealth and dignity on this planet. I wonder what this guy thinks about the hundreds of students that were murdered at Tienanmen Square in 1989. And I wonder what you think about the Trail of Tears? The Trail of Tears is universally taught as an abhorrent action by the United States government here in the US. It is not celebrated. Its brutal events are condemned by the people and by society. So now tell us what you think about Tienanmen Square in 1989. The Chinese often regard 1989 as the same event as the Cultural Revolution. If you preach him, for the Chinese, as if to promote k.k.k, my father used to be one of them, but he told me a lot. The reason why the Chinese do not want to talk about the 1989 and the Cultural Revolution, because this is a disaster and an unspeakable thing. More importantly, they are related to political struggles. It’s as if Americans don’t talk about Lincoln actually not liberating all black slaves. The African Americans actually struggled for human rights until the 1960s-1970s, but today it is no longer a simple assassination of Martin Luther King. In fact, you can see when I see you talking to you here. China is not what you think. I will still talk to you about this, because Blizzard is often more tolerant, just like StarCraft, or World of Warcraft shows. I will not be arrested. Similarly, if I know you in reality, maybe I will pretend not to know and be surprised as you mentioned above. In fact, I started to understand 1989, or from China's website (dark network, the Chinese network is very complicated, in fact, you can find what you want, including everything that violates all human laws) Because we don't want to talk about it, this is not a simple thing. Just like we don't talk about conspiracy theories on the moon or aliens in the 51st district. We talked about Kennedy flying more to the moon and today's nasa, not to him and Marilyn Monroe, as well as Cuba, and the conspiracy theories he was killed. (Actually, these conspiracy theories in the United States were very popular in China. People refused to believe that landing on the moon was true. People also believed that Kennedy died of Marilyn Monroe and family curses, and there were really aliens in District 51.) People in the US talk about our historical figures' short-comings all the time. They are taught in schools. They are not something we have to go seek out on our own on a website. My US History teacher brought up the hypocrisy of Thomas Jefferson writing "The right to Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness" while still owning slaves many times. We were taught about Lincoln's actual beliefs and how what he did did not truly liberate everyone and bring us on an even playing field. The struggles of the Civil Rights movement are talked about in-depth in schools. The atrocities of our government are openly taught and condemned. You just grouped Tienanmen Square in with conspiracy theories and that's all that I think really needs to be said on that, but I will say more. Your own government murdered its own people. It drove students over with tanks without issue. Students that were peacefully protesting. Your government murdered people. It happened. It is not a conspiracy and it does not deserve to be treated like some outlandish concept. The fact you are so afraid to talk about awful things your government has done speaks volumes. I guess the problem with Google Translate. I just said that I or other Chinese people are trying to refuse to talk about these issues, not that we don't understand, or that we don't know, afraid of some kind of revenge. The only reason is that, as the problem we are facing now is the same, a group of Westerners are trying to convince a Chinese to have a view about China. They have a premise that they are correct. And reject all Chinese views, even if this is a Chinese issue. We don't want to lie, so often we pretend not to know and refuse to talk. Because we know that we can't convince a group of people who only live in the West. Just like my useless work now. Just as you don't believe in all the Chinese who have expressed their views on this, but when you try to find information, you can find that in all official documents, the United States, the European Union, and the United Nations, except for the media that is full of conspiracy theories. Even Wikipedia has debates about whether there is a massacre in Tiananmen (1989). Of course, you choose to believe in online media. And a Chinese (my family) who has had a real experience is brainwashed. I don't think that we are talking about these things based on conspiracy theories. I just want to explain that sometimes when we look at American things, or when events, the Chinese will deviate from the truth of the matter, and prefer to think that conspiracy theories are correct. You said, you are a troll. I don't believe that the Chinese government is evil and has committed various crimes. So why did someone just talk about it, and he met someone in Shanghai who told him that Falun Gong is evil? (Maybe I understand it wrong.) We are in the classroom, if you are talking about any character in the classroom, from small to large, we are listening to political or historical teachers who constantly criticize the government or historical leaders. Because of George's relationship (Fiction 1994), we often joked that there will be a big brother who arrests you. It is a mockery of the ignorance of Westerners, not fear. This happened in history, but it was in the era of Martin Luther King’s struggle. If you are telling the truth, think about it, will we communicate here?
"Because of George's relationship (Fiction 1994), we often joked that there will be a big brother who arrests you. It is a mockery of the ignorance of Westerners, not fear."
If we don't already know that you're from mainland China, we will have to ask you "are you high?" Because this is so confusing, and even google translate can't be blamed.
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On October 10 2019 05:33 chuchuchu wrote:
Even Wikipedia has debates about whether there is a massacre in Tiananmen (1989).
There are no debates on Wikipedia about whether the massacre happened. People are allowed to debate on the wiki debate page, and on there anyone and whomever can say whatever the heck they please. That never makes it onto the actual article itself, which requires sources for everything you post.
And there are plenty of sources for Tiananmen square. There's fucking photos of it! And they have existed since before Photoshop was a thing.
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On October 10 2019 05:21 jy_9876543210 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2019 05:14 BaneRiders wrote:On October 10 2019 05:01 Geo.Rion wrote:On October 10 2019 04:19 whitehat511 wrote:
You've got to love all the irony of all these Americans and Europeans throwing around accusations that the Chinese government has committed atrocities. You know what they say about people in glass houses. I dont understand people like you, why would u make an account just to argue about chinese atrocities on TL.net of all places? Maybe it is his/her job to do so. It is not the only account created only for arguing in this thread. OK maybe I was wrong, maybe the big machine does care about TL forum... It feels like the comments under CCTV channel on youtube. You click on any of the accounts, and you will see that it's created in 1 day and just to post the only comment.
In fact, I have already talked about it. If you are a manager, you will find that I registered in the GvW competition in Korea.
Because I want to vote for people.
As for why I don't post, it is because of English problems. We are more accustomed to being active in China's own Chinese forum. Is there anything wrong with it?
As for why I will post this time because of the website https://www.rankedftw.com/.
Some people have changed the China region (China mainland server) in the StarCraft area to the Hong Kong regional flag, and the Hong Kong name.
I don't know Western culture and values.
But this matter has already been debated in the Chinese forum in China. And this thing itself does not respect others
We don't want to see Blizzard or StarCraft become the victim of the next political struggle.
We love the NBA and love StarCraft, but we really can't accept such an offense.
If I support K.K.K today, will you support my freedom of speech? I am afraid that the United States will refuse entry.
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Brian Kibler has opted out of Hearthstone:
[source https://www.polygon.com/2019/10/9/20906844/hearthstone-brian-kibler-quits-grandmasters-blizzard-blitzchung-hong-kong］
Popular Hearthstone professional, streamer, and tournament caster Brian Kibler today issued a statement that he “will have no involvement in Grandmasters,” unless “something changes” following Blizzard’s decision to ban Hearthstone player Chung “blitzchung” Ng Wai from the tournament circuit.
Kibler, a regular presence on the Hearthstone competitive commentariat posted a blog today, expressing concern at the “incredibly harsh” punishment meted out by Blizzard to Chung. Earlier this week, the company banned Chung for a year, and confiscated his Asia-Pacific Grandmasters earnings after he shouted “liberate Hong Kong, revolution of our time,” a slogan associated with the current pro-democracy protests.
Blizzard’s actions, which are closely tied to the company’s commercial ambitions in China, have been met with outrage. Some have called for a boycott on the company’s products. Protests have followed from Blizzard employees and Hearthstone competitors.
Kibler’s blog acknowledged that Chung had broken tournament rules, but said that the context of the political situation in Hong Kong, and Activision Blizzard’s Asian ambitions, could not be ignored.
“I won’t pretend to understand either the intricacies of the geopolitical situation in China and Hong Kong or the full extent of Blizzard’s business interests there,” he wrote. “But to me this penalty feels like it is deeply rooted in both. The heavy-handedness of it feels like someone insisted that Blizzard make an example of Blitzchung, not only to discourage others from similar acts in the future but also to appease those upset by the outburst itself.”
Kibler, 39, has been professional card game player for more than two decades, with multiple Hearthstone and Magic: The Gathering tournament trophies. He’s also a regular caster and commentator.
“That kind of appeasement is simply not something I can in good conscience be associated with,” he added in his blog. “When I learned about the ruling, I reached out to Blizzard and informed them that I no longer feel comfortable casting the Grandmasters finals at BlizzCon. I will not be a smiling face on camera that tacitly endorses this decision. Unless something changes, I will have no involvement in Grandmasters moving forward.”
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On October 10 2019 05:43 Excludos wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2019 05:33 chuchuchu wrote:
Even Wikipedia has debates about whether there is a massacre in Tiananmen (1989). There are no debates on Wikipedia about whether the massacre happened. People are allowed to debate on the wiki debate page, and on there anyone and whomever can say whatever the heck they please. That never makes it onto the actual article itself, which requires sources for everything you post. And there are plenty of sources for Tiananmen square. There's fucking photos of it! And they have existed since before Photoshop was a thing.
The so-called photo is a screenshot of the famous tank man.
Photo of the massacre? The blood flows into the river, the bodies of thousands of people. Are you questioning my ability to use the network?
The tanker's video doesn't know if you have seen it. I mean the complete video of the tank stopping and then a group of people pulling him away.
The Japanese also had photos of Chinese people in World War II. Why, do you want to refute the Second World War and support fascism?
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On October 10 2019 05:37 chuchuchu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2019 05:27 jy_9876543210 wrote:On October 10 2019 05:18 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 04:57 jy_9876543210 wrote:On October 10 2019 04:48 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 04:41 jy_9876543210 wrote:On October 10 2019 04:35 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 03:57 phodacbiet wrote:On October 10 2019 02:46 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 02:13 Excludos wrote:
[quote]
I hope you understand that while this is an interesting conversation, your views are inherently skewed by the propaganda you've been fed every day. We know how the Chinese media works (and it's not just China btw. America has much of the same problems, and most of us here do recognise it as such). You have already made made several false statements and made comparisons that does not make sense (Comparing China to England because England has a mock Queen for instance). As such everything you say will be taken with the biggest grain of salt imaginable
I do think it's interesting what the ordinary Chinese thinks, but it truthfully doesn't matter. You don't get to commit human rights violations and consider it ok because "The ordinary Chinese thinks so". Guess who doesn't think it's ok? Hong Kong and its citizens. Very interesting, wrong comparison I just want to show that some forms of democracy and freedom will change, just as discrimination against blacks is definitely not one of freedom of speech in the United States. Although Martin Luther King was killed. Similarly, China's democracy and freedom are not so much the same as the United States, because the so-called autocracy and dictator seem to be like the Queen of England and the Emperor of Japan. And when you talk about it, we should think about Hong Kong and its citizens. I am very eager to ask, do you know how many Hong Kong people participated in this Chinese National Day celebration? Including young people, college students, government officials, police, famous stars, and ordinary people. Do you think we should think about Hong Kong people, then do you know how many people in Hong Kong support the police parade? The police in Hong Kong, the government in Hong Kong, Hong Kong, so many condemns the violent protesters, and the ordinary people, shouting at the bbc reporters, this is Hong Kong, China, the taxi driver who supports the law revision, isn't it Hong Kong? What you see seems to be the collective public opinion of Hong Kong, actually because those people have amplified this reaction through radical methods. Think about it, if it is really a problem of the society and the Chinese government, the Hong Kong government, the ordinary people of Hong Kong (Is it not ordinary people and the grassroots officials?) Are these attitudes still not showing anything? Think about how good the credibility of the Hong Kong government is, and the same group of people are not trusted now. The vast majority of protesters on the streets of Hong Kong are college students, young people, and young unemployed people. Is this a normal antibody or a collective carnival of young people, like an American youth who likes to take drugs? China has experienced two very painful students, and the young people have dominated the political violent protests, almost smashing the entire country. However, these protests did not make more than a billion people ignorant, and the ordinary Chinese who were at a loss knew how to live well. The Chinese have supported all the legal acts of Hong Kong and have wanted to split China and Hong Kong for many years. There is nothing too fierce. We support Hong Kong, support democracy, support freedom, and even to some extent, support universal suffrage in Hong Kong. However, what you have to understand is what is the slogan of Hong Kong's independence and violence? This is what the Hong Kong player and the NBA rocket manager said. This is also why the Chinese currently call it a terrorist, because terrorists in the Middle East often call themselves freedom fighters. If Hong Kong, China, is not dominated by the majority of Chinese people and by the majority of Hong Kong people, then who will decide? Can Texas and California declare independence today and expel all blacks and people from other states？ So，why China give up HK？and Violent protestors demanding the expulsion of mainlanders？ In mainland China, Hong Kong people's bad reputation, sense of geographical superiority and discrimination against mainlanders are the main reasons。 (you can find it in many Hong Kong movies，In mainland China, Hong Kong people's bad reputation, sense of geographical superiority and discrimination against mainlanders are the main reasons (you can find out from many Hong Kong movies, including asking mainlanders if they have seen Apple phones made in China, and mocking the mainland for lack of high-rise power and modern technology, the same thing is still happening to Chinese people in Europe, the United States, etc.)It used to be Korea and Japan.). You bring up valid points, but what you seem to miss out on is how this all started in the first place. There is currently a Sino-British joint declaration agreement between China and the UK dated back in 1984 and went into effect in 1997 stating that HK will have its own government, is able to pass its own laws, and that their way of life would not change for 50 years. You can read a bit on that agreement here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-British_Joint_Declaration. This means that in this agreement, China agreed that its PRC principles would not be practiced in HK until 2047. Despite this agreement, in 2014, China proposed a reform to HK's electoral system, a clear infringement of the agreement. Since China agreed that HK could remain autonomous and have authority over their own government, then why is China screening candidates for HK's Chief Executive? This started around 2014 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Hong_Kong_protests), and afterwards the British Foreign Office announced that Chinese officials now treat this declaration as void. You say China support HK's democracy, then why not let the HK'ers elect who they want, instead of screening who they want the HK people to elect? The HK'ers are upset because they were promised 50 years, but China is trying to impose only 22 years into the treaty. Does this mean China's words aren't even worth 50% of what they put on papers? So flash forward to the current protest, how did it start? Well, China wanted to pass an extradite bill in HK, another infringement of the current agreement. HK'ers did not want this law, which they are within their own rights to deny since China agreed it will not impose, yet China still adamantly demand that this law be passed. If you look over at the 5 demands HK is currently protesting for, they are extremely reasonable given that China started this by breaking their words. 1. Full withdrawal of the extradition bill - Very valid demand, considering China signed an agreement that they will not be imposing their laws in HK until 2047. Last I checked, it's only 2019. 2. Inquiry into police brutality - Also valid, the people would like to investigate police's conduct. The police are meant to protect the people, not beat them up when they are protesting. 3. Retracting the classification of protesters as rioters - This started because China broke its words, so the people were upset and protested. Had China not broke its words, this wouldn't have happened. The people marched because China lied, not because they randomly rioted out of no where. This point can be a case by case basis with some standards since I understand not all protesters are good, some can be destructive, and we should judge them fairly. 4. Amnesty for arrested protesters - Same as point 3. 5. Dual universal suffrage, for both their Legislative and Chief Executive - Again, China signed an agreement that allows the HK'ers to manage their own government. If they are true to their words, let the HK'ers decide how they want their government to be ran. My main point is that HK originally didn't protest for independence. This was NOT how the protest started. They started because China lied and backed out of their own words only 22 years into a 50 years signed agreement. It is only escalating because instead of admitting they were in the wrong, China cracked down on the HK citizens. HK citizens now are entertaining independence because they realized Mainland China does not keep its word. To use a Starcraft analogy, this is similar to Mengsk, Reynor, and Kerrigan working together, yet Mengsk abandoned Kerrigan on that one planet (forgot the name). When Reynor became rightfully pissed for what Mengsk did and turned on him, Mengsk called Reynor a terrorist. China is pulling a Mengsk right now. If China is true to its words. Come back in 28 years and let the HK'ers do what they want to do with their government for now. 1. China hopes to sign extradition regulations with Hong Kong (extending criminal offenders because there have been criminals who have committed murder and rape in mainland China and have been cast into Hong Kong. The Chinese government and other countries such as the United States also have extradition regulations, and the Hong Kong government has other regions. The state has extradition regulations). Why is it rejected? This is not because mainland China requires the implementation of laws in Hong Kong, but hopes to sign regulations with Hong Kong. This is actually very strange. It is actually an agreement between a country and a country within a country. 2. I hope that you can read the Sino-British Joint Declaration carefully. He has not given the British any rights after this. You can blame the Chinese government, but because of this, I think other countries are involved. This is still the Beijing government of China and the Hong Kong region. problem. In addition, the Chinese government's commitment is to keep Hong Kong unchanged for 50 years. I don't know how you understand it. I have two thoughts. One is to continue Hong Kong before the colony in 1997, and the second is to follow the basic law after 1997. Hong Kong. Before 1997, Hong Kong was a colony. Hong Kong people did not even have British nationality. The leaders of Hong Kong were all British whites. They were also British nationals, both the first and the second, including the Hong Kong Constitution, the Sino-British Joint Declaration. During the British colonial period, there was no universal suffrage. I don't know where Hong Kong's universal suffrage comes from. This violates the Constitution of Hong Kong - the Basic Law. In addition, without universal suffrage, it cannot mean that they have no democracy. Hong Kong's politics is closer to the Swiss political system, and each leader does not adopt the Swiss rotation system. Keeping it for 50 years, isn't it just that there is no universal suffrage? Once the universal suffrage is not a violation of the China Commitment and the Sino-British Joint Declaration, and the Hong Kong Basic Law? Although I think that Hong Kong has been harming itself for 50 years, the development of first-tier cities in China is much better than that of Hong Kong. For me, I have lived in Shanghai for a long time, and Hong Kong is like a rural area. Of course, I am not actually, most of them. This is also true in Europe, and I have a stark contrast to the views of Japanese cities. 3. The Chinese government of Beijing and all Chinese have never opposed liberal democracy and legal protests. However, after the Cultural Revolution, the Chinese were sensitive to the protests because we realized that such collective behavior would often evolve into violence. For example, China’s previous protests, the US bombing of the Yugoslav embassy, and Japan’s activities to commemorate the death of soldiers in World War II. This kind of parade in China has produced extreme violence, as happened in Hong Kong. If you don't trust the Chinese and don't trust the Chinese government, don't you believe that the Hong Kong government and the Hong Kong police, which have always been highly praised, don't believe it? Don't you believe in Western media? Go look for their evaluation of the Hong Kong police and the Hong Kong government in history. 4. Special criminals are not advisable. Think about the United States, but the country with the highest proportion of prison population. Of course, I don't want China to become the United States. But think about it. There are many British nationals in the Hong Kong police, white people (maybe I think you still don't believe in the yellow race, but I don't think it is racist). Hong Kong's judicial system, so the judges are British nationality, Australian nationality, 90% of judges are white. You should trust them, not a group of unemployed people, a group of young people who have taken a poison and drink alcohol and have sex on the roadside (although you call it freedom, but often these are blocked by neutral media). Opposite to these violent protesters are peaceful protesters who have long since left the protest, and supporters who support the police, support the Hong Kong government, and support the Chinese government. They are more numerous, but unfortunately they need to work and they do not use violence. So it seems to be weak, and because many of them are older people (you should have heard of Hong Kong's aging), they are not very familiar with the Internet, and the Internet is now a Z-age person (in fact, 1995-2000) Born person). 5. Why did they protest? Quite simply, young people can't find a job without a way out, and they are poor. The long-term segregation policy with mainland China discriminates against mainland Chinese people and believes that they are all poor people, as whites discriminate against black people. Hong Kong knows that Hong Kong is bought by Li Ka-shing, and that the Chinese government cannot interfere and support socialism. Everyone has food and housing. Later, the economic decline of Western society, if you are a European, there should be experience, the US economy has recently grown, but it is also uncomfortable. After the 2008 financial turmoil, it has been declining for a long time. China is getting better and better. When China gets better, when they find that the Chinese who once earned 200 yuan a month have the same income and even more money, they find that they can’t be like the colonial era. Next, when it came to China, it became a millionaire, went to bed with more girls, and bought more luxurious cosmetics. So I hope to return to the colonial era and pass violence. (Their slogan is what you saw in this Hong Kong player and the NBA), by robbing mobile phone stores, selling them online, by raising the flags of the United States and the United Kingdom. I saw Swedes, and I think I should understand why, academically, the Sedgmo syndrome. Perhaps Westerners believe that the colonial era is very glorious. "don't you believe that the Hong Kong government and the Hong Kong police, which have always been highly praised" "Why did they protest? Quite simply, young people can't find a job without a way out, and they are poor. The long-term segregation policy with mainland China discriminates against mainland Chinese people and believes that they are all poor people, as whites discriminate against black people." This is trolling for sure... I can hardly find any other explanations. Oh, poor man. In fact, it is very simple. You only need to use Google to search for the gap between the rich and the poor in Hong Kong. Have you been to Hong Kong and China? I am very familiar with it. Yeah yeah I can find Gini index for every country in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_income_equalityBut why do you think that's the reason of the protest? Where did you find that? Who told you that? You are very familiar with it but you don't know the reason? After removing the tax and welfare transfers, Hong Kong’s Gini index was as high as 0.54. If you have been to Chicago and New York, think about where the tramp is, social security (Hong Kong people want to thank the Hong Kong police for their efforts) In addition, you should check that the top ten billionaires in Hong Kong account for Hong Kong's GDP (more than 35%). The disparity between the rich and the poor in Hong Kong has been criticized by the United Nations. If you can visit Hong Kong's own website You will find that Hong Kong officially announced that there are 1.3 million poor people in 7.6 million people in Hong Kong. Perhaps you should use Google to search for the poor in Hong Kong directly, or go to Hong Kong in person. Take a look at the slums in the bustling city. (The slums in mainland China have long since disappeared) Hong Kong is an area without a universal retirement protection system. It is well developed, but his university enrollment rate is only 20%. This is the famous ten universities in Hong Kong. Hong Kong is a developed region and an unbalanced region. You should probably look at the encyclopedia about Li Ka-shing and see his property. We call him Lee half HK (Lee half HK) Why are you repeating the same thing over and over again? Yes HongKong has poor people and rich people, but that's not the cause of the protest. You don't even know when it began. I certainly know how to get started, what is the reason, and the so-called five major demands. What I told you is the real reason. Because the reason you think is actually happening in Hong Kong within 100 years, not in such a time period. The reasons they opposed were consistent with the violent protests in France. Perhaps you think that the French violent protest is not because the rights of the poor are not guaranteed. But they like it, and the yearning for freedom.
Yeah yeah of course you know the reason of the protest better than the protester themselves, everyone's lying and only you know the truth, based on your research on Chinese social media posts.
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On October 10 2019 05:47 chuchuchu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2019 05:43 Excludos wrote:On October 10 2019 05:33 chuchuchu wrote:
Even Wikipedia has debates about whether there is a massacre in Tiananmen (1989). There are no debates on Wikipedia about whether the massacre happened. People are allowed to debate on the wiki debate page, and on there anyone and whomever can say whatever the heck they please. That never makes it onto the actual article itself, which requires sources for everything you post. And there are plenty of sources for Tiananmen square. There's fucking photos of it! And they have existed since before Photoshop was a thing. Are you questioning my ability to use the network?
Yes. Quite profoundly:
https://observers.france24.com/en/20120604-new-photos-emerge-showing-tiananmen-square-just-after-1989-massacre-china-student-protest-commemoration
And thanks for making me google these for you. They make me sick to my stomach.
There are more, btw. Any google search will do. They are not censored over here (yet)
The "tank man" is from the day after the massacre, not from the massacre itself.
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On October 10 2019 05:29 Penev wrote:
Imagine instead of the player from Hong Kong supporting the protests it was, let's say a Russian guy wearing a kappa pride mask asking attention for how gay people are treated in his country. Would Blizzard have reacted in the same way? I highly doubt it.
Blizzard dealt with this ridiculously harshly and has even removed the video as if it never happened. It's absurd.
@chuchuchu: This matter isn't really that much about China's influence it's more about Blizzard casting aside morals for money. The only reason they did this is because they want a piece of the Chinese mobile gaming market. This is what people are pissed about.
It’s just too stupid.
Some people still think that Blizzard is for greed.
The entire Asia-Pacific region earns only 10% of Blizzard. The Chinese do not buy COD.
Do Chinese people play mobile games? Maybe they prefer to play pubg on steam.
That's why I am always amazed.
You can try to learn Chinese. You can immediately find out how the Chinese hate Blizzard's mobile games and think about the Chinese people's enthusiasm for Diablo.
No one believes that the game can actually sell so much in China. No one has ever reached half the height before.
The entire Chinese network is a ridicule for Blizzard and a carnival for Blizzard's stock price crash.
It is ridiculous to say that mobile games to earn Chinese money.
To tell you the truth, because the investment companies behind Blizzard have Chinese companies.
Like Riot Games
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On October 10 2019 05:44 chuchuchu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2019 05:21 jy_9876543210 wrote:On October 10 2019 05:14 BaneRiders wrote:On October 10 2019 05:01 Geo.Rion wrote:On October 10 2019 04:19 whitehat511 wrote:
You've got to love all the irony of all these Americans and Europeans throwing around accusations that the Chinese government has committed atrocities. You know what they say about people in glass houses. I dont understand people like you, why would u make an account just to argue about chinese atrocities on TL.net of all places? Maybe it is his/her job to do so. It is not the only account created only for arguing in this thread. OK maybe I was wrong, maybe the big machine does care about TL forum... It feels like the comments under CCTV channel on youtube. You click on any of the accounts, and you will see that it's created in 1 day and just to post the only comment. In fact, I have already talked about it. If you are a manager, you will find that I registered in the GvW competition in Korea. Because I want to vote for people. As for why I don't post, it is because of English problems. We are more accustomed to being active in China's own Chinese forum. Is there anything wrong with it? As for why I will post this time because of the website https://www.rankedftw.com/. Some people have changed the China region (China mainland server) in the StarCraft area to the Hong Kong regional flag, and the Hong Kong name. I don't know Western culture and values. But this matter has already been debated in the Chinese forum in China. And this thing itself does not respect others We don't want to see Blizzard or StarCraft become the victim of the next political struggle. We love the NBA and love StarCraft, but we really can't accept such an offense. If I support K.K.K today, will you support my freedom of speech? I am afraid that the United States will refuse entry.
"We don't want to see Blizzard or StarCraft become the victim of the next political struggle."
Then this is the wrong place to go. If people go against Blizzard because of Hearthstone, you can't save it by arguing on a Starcraft forum. There's not much of attention here. The only helpful thing is that you may have a chance to improve your English. Nothing about people's decision.
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On October 10 2019 05:45 Integra wrote:Brian Kibler has opted out of Hearthstone: [source https://www.polygon.com/2019/10/9/20906844/hearthstone-brian-kibler-quits-grandmasters-blizzard-blitzchung-hong-kong］Show nested quote +Popular Hearthstone professional, streamer, and tournament caster Brian Kibler today issued a statement that he “will have no involvement in Grandmasters,” unless “something changes” following Blizzard’s decision to ban Hearthstone player Chung “blitzchung” Ng Wai from the tournament circuit.
Kibler, a regular presence on the Hearthstone competitive commentariat posted a blog today, expressing concern at the “incredibly harsh” punishment meted out by Blizzard to Chung. Earlier this week, the company banned Chung for a year, and confiscated his Asia-Pacific Grandmasters earnings after he shouted “liberate Hong Kong, revolution of our time,” a slogan associated with the current pro-democracy protests.
Blizzard’s actions, which are closely tied to the company’s commercial ambitions in China, have been met with outrage. Some have called for a boycott on the company’s products. Protests have followed from Blizzard employees and Hearthstone competitors.
Kibler’s blog acknowledged that Chung had broken tournament rules, but said that the context of the political situation in Hong Kong, and Activision Blizzard’s Asian ambitions, could not be ignored.
“I won’t pretend to understand either the intricacies of the geopolitical situation in China and Hong Kong or the full extent of Blizzard’s business interests there,” he wrote. “But to me this penalty feels like it is deeply rooted in both. The heavy-handedness of it feels like someone insisted that Blizzard make an example of Blitzchung, not only to discourage others from similar acts in the future but also to appease those upset by the outburst itself.”
Kibler, 39, has been professional card game player for more than two decades, with multiple Hearthstone and Magic: The Gathering tournament trophies. He’s also a regular caster and commentator.
“That kind of appeasement is simply not something I can in good conscience be associated with,” he added in his blog. “When I learned about the ruling, I reached out to Blizzard and informed them that I no longer feel comfortable casting the Grandmasters finals at BlizzCon. I will not be a smiling face on camera that tacitly endorses this decision. Unless something changes, I will have no involvement in Grandmasters moving forward.”
Oh, a man with principles, that's cool. I hope more will follow.
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On October 10 2019 05:53 Excludos wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2019 05:47 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 05:43 Excludos wrote:On October 10 2019 05:33 chuchuchu wrote:
Even Wikipedia has debates about whether there is a massacre in Tiananmen (1989). There are no debates on Wikipedia about whether the massacre happened. People are allowed to debate on the wiki debate page, and on there anyone and whomever can say whatever the heck they please. That never makes it onto the actual article itself, which requires sources for everything you post. And there are plenty of sources for Tiananmen square. There's fucking photos of it! And they have existed since before Photoshop was a thing. Are you questioning my ability to use the network? Yes. Quite profoundly: https://observers.france24.com/en/20120604-new-photos-emerge-showing-tiananmen-square-just-after-1989-massacre-china-student-protest-commemorationAnd thanks for making me google these for you. They make me sick to my stomach. There are more, btw. Any google search will do. They are not censored over here (yet) The "tank man" is from the day after the massacre, not from the massacre itself.
Yes.
A mess after a large-scale rally.
What is the photo of the slaughter, I tell you, just like the US military in Iraq and Afghanistan. Blood and corpses are everywhere.
It is not the mess left by those who eat and drink Lazar in the square.
I tell you what is the slaughter. This is a photo of the US military in Vietnam. Take a good look.
Of course you can also think that this is a fake.
But it's much more convincing than the photos of your ordinary soldiers smiling.
Http://www.myzaker.com/article/5becdc8d32ce407b9600000f
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I can just imagine what the mods are discussing what to do about this atm. Good luck guys! 
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On October 10 2019 05:53 Excludos wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2019 05:47 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 05:43 Excludos wrote:On October 10 2019 05:33 chuchuchu wrote:
Even Wikipedia has debates about whether there is a massacre in Tiananmen (1989). There are no debates on Wikipedia about whether the massacre happened. People are allowed to debate on the wiki debate page, and on there anyone and whomever can say whatever the heck they please. That never makes it onto the actual article itself, which requires sources for everything you post. And there are plenty of sources for Tiananmen square. There's fucking photos of it! And they have existed since before Photoshop was a thing. Are you questioning my ability to use the network? Yes. Quite profoundly: https://observers.france24.com/en/20120604-new-photos-emerge-showing-tiananmen-square-just-after-1989-massacre-china-student-protest-commemorationAnd thanks for making me google these for you. They make me sick to my stomach. There are more, btw. Any google search will do. They are not censored over here (yet) The "tank man" is from the day after the massacre, not from the massacre itself.
https://baijiahao.baidu.com/s?id=1561088272745847&wfr=spider&for=pc
I really hope that you can look at these.
What is the photo of the slaughter?
What is evidence?
What is the real slaughter
However, it seems that it is hard to say clearly with Westerners and whites.
After all, it is a country that relies on the slave trade and the ethnic groups of Africa and the Americas are extinct.
I would like to know that Americans are afraid when they are lying on the land where Indians and blacks are buried.
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This is going to come up at Blizzcon, I guarantee it. Oh boy is THAT going to be interesting.
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On October 10 2019 05:18 chuchuchu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2019 04:57 jy_9876543210 wrote:On October 10 2019 04:48 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 04:41 jy_9876543210 wrote:On October 10 2019 04:35 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 03:57 phodacbiet wrote:On October 10 2019 02:46 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 02:13 Excludos wrote:On October 10 2019 02:04 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 01:44 Wombat_NI wrote:
[quote]
Why not?
National self-determination is a key principle of geopolitics in the modern era.
Considering a bomb blew in the windows of my house when I was but a babe, I’m quite happy that the United States interceded and helped facilitate a peace here that respected both of the national identities in our wee country.
I would personally like to see more of China and its culture emerge onto the world stage, an old and venerable culture indeed, whose people have accomplished remarkable things in the last few decades especially.
If it’s by trampling on everyone and expecting Westerners to bend to their whims and where criticism is construed as a grievous insult then, no thanks. When you think so, have you ever asked about the thoughts of ordinary Chinese?. I hope you understand that while this is an interesting conversation, your views are inherently skewed by the propaganda you've been fed every day. We know how the Chinese media works (and it's not just China btw. America has much of the same problems, and most of us here do recognise it as such). You have already made made several false statements and made comparisons that does not make sense (Comparing China to England because England has a mock Queen for instance). As such everything you say will be taken with the biggest grain of salt imaginable I do think it's interesting what the ordinary Chinese thinks, but it truthfully doesn't matter. You don't get to commit human rights violations and consider it ok because "The ordinary Chinese thinks so". Guess who doesn't think it's ok? Hong Kong and its citizens. Very interesting, wrong comparison I just want to show that some forms of democracy and freedom will change, just as discrimination against blacks is definitely not one of freedom of speech in the United States. Although Martin Luther King was killed. Similarly, China's democracy and freedom are not so much the same as the United States, because the so-called autocracy and dictator seem to be like the Queen of England and the Emperor of Japan. And when you talk about it, we should think about Hong Kong and its citizens. I am very eager to ask, do you know how many Hong Kong people participated in this Chinese National Day celebration? Including young people, college students, government officials, police, famous stars, and ordinary people. Do you think we should think about Hong Kong people, then do you know how many people in Hong Kong support the police parade? The police in Hong Kong, the government in Hong Kong, Hong Kong, so many condemns the violent protesters, and the ordinary people, shouting at the bbc reporters, this is Hong Kong, China, the taxi driver who supports the law revision, isn't it Hong Kong? What you see seems to be the collective public opinion of Hong Kong, actually because those people have amplified this reaction through radical methods. Think about it, if it is really a problem of the society and the Chinese government, the Hong Kong government, the ordinary people of Hong Kong (Is it not ordinary people and the grassroots officials?) Are these attitudes still not showing anything? Think about how good the credibility of the Hong Kong government is, and the same group of people are not trusted now. The vast majority of protesters on the streets of Hong Kong are college students, young people, and young unemployed people. Is this a normal antibody or a collective carnival of young people, like an American youth who likes to take drugs? China has experienced two very painful students, and the young people have dominated the political violent protests, almost smashing the entire country. However, these protests did not make more than a billion people ignorant, and the ordinary Chinese who were at a loss knew how to live well. The Chinese have supported all the legal acts of Hong Kong and have wanted to split China and Hong Kong for many years. There is nothing too fierce. We support Hong Kong, support democracy, support freedom, and even to some extent, support universal suffrage in Hong Kong. However, what you have to understand is what is the slogan of Hong Kong's independence and violence? This is what the Hong Kong player and the NBA rocket manager said. This is also why the Chinese currently call it a terrorist, because terrorists in the Middle East often call themselves freedom fighters. If Hong Kong, China, is not dominated by the majority of Chinese people and by the majority of Hong Kong people, then who will decide? Can Texas and California declare independence today and expel all blacks and people from other states？ So，why China give up HK？and Violent protestors demanding the expulsion of mainlanders？ In mainland China, Hong Kong people's bad reputation, sense of geographical superiority and discrimination against mainlanders are the main reasons。 (you can find it in many Hong Kong movies，In mainland China, Hong Kong people's bad reputation, sense of geographical superiority and discrimination against mainlanders are the main reasons (you can find out from many Hong Kong movies, including asking mainlanders if they have seen Apple phones made in China, and mocking the mainland for lack of high-rise power and modern technology, the same thing is still happening to Chinese people in Europe, the United States, etc.)It used to be Korea and Japan.). You bring up valid points, but what you seem to miss out on is how this all started in the first place. There is currently a Sino-British joint declaration agreement between China and the UK dated back in 1984 and went into effect in 1997 stating that HK will have its own government, is able to pass its own laws, and that their way of life would not change for 50 years. You can read a bit on that agreement here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-British_Joint_Declaration. This means that in this agreement, China agreed that its PRC principles would not be practiced in HK until 2047. Despite this agreement, in 2014, China proposed a reform to HK's electoral system, a clear infringement of the agreement. Since China agreed that HK could remain autonomous and have authority over their own government, then why is China screening candidates for HK's Chief Executive? This started around 2014 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Hong_Kong_protests), and afterwards the British Foreign Office announced that Chinese officials now treat this declaration as void. You say China support HK's democracy, then why not let the HK'ers elect who they want, instead of screening who they want the HK people to elect? The HK'ers are upset because they were promised 50 years, but China is trying to impose only 22 years into the treaty. Does this mean China's words aren't even worth 50% of what they put on papers? So flash forward to the current protest, how did it start? Well, China wanted to pass an extradite bill in HK, another infringement of the current agreement. HK'ers did not want this law, which they are within their own rights to deny since China agreed it will not impose, yet China still adamantly demand that this law be passed. If you look over at the 5 demands HK is currently protesting for, they are extremely reasonable given that China started this by breaking their words. 1. Full withdrawal of the extradition bill - Very valid demand, considering China signed an agreement that they will not be imposing their laws in HK until 2047. Last I checked, it's only 2019. 2. Inquiry into police brutality - Also valid, the people would like to investigate police's conduct. The police are meant to protect the people, not beat them up when they are protesting. 3. Retracting the classification of protesters as rioters - This started because China broke its words, so the people were upset and protested. Had China not broke its words, this wouldn't have happened. The people marched because China lied, not because they randomly rioted out of no where. This point can be a case by case basis with some standards since I understand not all protesters are good, some can be destructive, and we should judge them fairly. 4. Amnesty for arrested protesters - Same as point 3. 5. Dual universal suffrage, for both their Legislative and Chief Executive - Again, China signed an agreement that allows the HK'ers to manage their own government. If they are true to their words, let the HK'ers decide how they want their government to be ran. My main point is that HK originally didn't protest for independence. This was NOT how the protest started. They started because China lied and backed out of their own words only 22 years into a 50 years signed agreement. It is only escalating because instead of admitting they were in the wrong, China cracked down on the HK citizens. HK citizens now are entertaining independence because they realized Mainland China does not keep its word. To use a Starcraft analogy, this is similar to Mengsk, Reynor, and Kerrigan working together, yet Mengsk abandoned Kerrigan on that one planet (forgot the name). When Reynor became rightfully pissed for what Mengsk did and turned on him, Mengsk called Reynor a terrorist. China is pulling a Mengsk right now. If China is true to its words. Come back in 28 years and let the HK'ers do what they want to do with their government for now. 1. China hopes to sign extradition regulations with Hong Kong (extending criminal offenders because there have been criminals who have committed murder and rape in mainland China and have been cast into Hong Kong. The Chinese government and other countries such as the United States also have extradition regulations, and the Hong Kong government has other regions. The state has extradition regulations). Why is it rejected? This is not because mainland China requires the implementation of laws in Hong Kong, but hopes to sign regulations with Hong Kong. This is actually very strange. It is actually an agreement between a country and a country within a country. 2. I hope that you can read the Sino-British Joint Declaration carefully. He has not given the British any rights after this. You can blame the Chinese government, but because of this, I think other countries are involved. This is still the Beijing government of China and the Hong Kong region. problem. In addition, the Chinese government's commitment is to keep Hong Kong unchanged for 50 years. I don't know how you understand it. I have two thoughts. One is to continue Hong Kong before the colony in 1997, and the second is to follow the basic law after 1997. Hong Kong. Before 1997, Hong Kong was a colony. Hong Kong people did not even have British nationality. The leaders of Hong Kong were all British whites. They were also British nationals, both the first and the second, including the Hong Kong Constitution, the Sino-British Joint Declaration. During the British colonial period, there was no universal suffrage. I don't know where Hong Kong's universal suffrage comes from. This violates the Constitution of Hong Kong - the Basic Law. In addition, without universal suffrage, it cannot mean that they have no democracy. Hong Kong's politics is closer to the Swiss political system, and each leader does not adopt the Swiss rotation system. Keeping it for 50 years, isn't it just that there is no universal suffrage? Once the universal suffrage is not a violation of the China Commitment and the Sino-British Joint Declaration, and the Hong Kong Basic Law? Although I think that Hong Kong has been harming itself for 50 years, the development of first-tier cities in China is much better than that of Hong Kong. For me, I have lived in Shanghai for a long time, and Hong Kong is like a rural area. Of course, I am not actually, most of them. This is also true in Europe, and I have a stark contrast to the views of Japanese cities. 3. The Chinese government of Beijing and all Chinese have never opposed liberal democracy and legal protests. However, after the Cultural Revolution, the Chinese were sensitive to the protests because we realized that such collective behavior would often evolve into violence. For example, China’s previous protests, the US bombing of the Yugoslav embassy, and Japan’s activities to commemorate the death of soldiers in World War II. This kind of parade in China has produced extreme violence, as happened in Hong Kong. If you don't trust the Chinese and don't trust the Chinese government, don't you believe that the Hong Kong government and the Hong Kong police, which have always been highly praised, don't believe it? Don't you believe in Western media? Go look for their evaluation of the Hong Kong police and the Hong Kong government in history. 4. Special criminals are not advisable. Think about the United States, but the country with the highest proportion of prison population. Of course, I don't want China to become the United States. But think about it. There are many British nationals in the Hong Kong police, white people (maybe I think you still don't believe in the yellow race, but I don't think it is racist). Hong Kong's judicial system, so the judges are British nationality, Australian nationality, 90% of judges are white. You should trust them, not a group of unemployed people, a group of young people who have taken a poison and drink alcohol and have sex on the roadside (although you call it freedom, but often these are blocked by neutral media). Opposite to these violent protesters are peaceful protesters who have long since left the protest, and supporters who support the police, support the Hong Kong government, and support the Chinese government. They are more numerous, but unfortunately they need to work and they do not use violence. So it seems to be weak, and because many of them are older people (you should have heard of Hong Kong's aging), they are not very familiar with the Internet, and the Internet is now a Z-age person (in fact, 1995-2000) Born person). 5. Why did they protest? Quite simply, young people can't find a job without a way out, and they are poor. The long-term segregation policy with mainland China discriminates against mainland Chinese people and believes that they are all poor people, as whites discriminate against black people. Hong Kong knows that Hong Kong is bought by Li Ka-shing, and that the Chinese government cannot interfere and support socialism. Everyone has food and housing. Later, the economic decline of Western society, if you are a European, there should be experience, the US economy has recently grown, but it is also uncomfortable. After the 2008 financial turmoil, it has been declining for a long time. China is getting better and better. When China gets better, when they find that the Chinese who once earned 200 yuan a month have the same income and even more money, they find that they can’t be like the colonial era. Next, when it came to China, it became a millionaire, went to bed with more girls, and bought more luxurious cosmetics. So I hope to return to the colonial era and pass violence. (Their slogan is what you saw in this Hong Kong player and the NBA), by robbing mobile phone stores, selling them online, by raising the flags of the United States and the United Kingdom. I saw Swedes, and I think I should understand why, academically, the Sedgmo syndrome. Perhaps Westerners believe that the colonial era is very glorious. "don't you believe that the Hong Kong government and the Hong Kong police, which have always been highly praised" "Why did they protest? Quite simply, young people can't find a job without a way out, and they are poor. The long-term segregation policy with mainland China discriminates against mainland Chinese people and believes that they are all poor people, as whites discriminate against black people." This is trolling for sure... I can hardly find any other explanations. Oh, poor man. In fact, it is very simple. You only need to use Google to search for the gap between the rich and the poor in Hong Kong. Have you been to Hong Kong and China? I am very familiar with it. Yeah yeah I can find Gini index for every country in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_income_equalityBut why do you think that's the reason of the protest? Where did you find that? Who told you that? You are very familiar with it but you don't know the reason? After removing the tax and welfare transfers, Hong Kong’s Gini index was as high as 0.54. If you have been to Chicago and New York, think about where the tramp is, social security (Hong Kong people want to thank the Hong Kong police for their efforts) In addition, you should check that the top ten billionaires in Hong Kong account for Hong Kong's GDP (more than 35%). The disparity between the rich and the poor in Hong Kong has been criticized by the United Nations. If you can visit Hong Kong's own website You will find that Hong Kong officially announced that there are 1.3 million poor people in 7.6 million people in Hong Kong. Perhaps you should use Google to search for the poor in Hong Kong directly, or go to Hong Kong in person. Take a look at the slums in the bustling city. (The slums in mainland China have long since disappeared) Hong Kong is an area without a universal retirement protection system. It is well developed, but his university enrollment rate is only 20%. This is the famous ten universities in Hong Kong. Hong Kong is a developed region and an unbalanced region. You should probably look at the encyclopedia about Li Ka-shing and see his property. We call him Lee half HK (Lee half HK)
Chuchuchu's posts are so hard to understand - can see him trying really hard with google translate.
One thing is quite clear - the majority HK people definitely do not support the police. The support for the government/leader/police in HK has reached an all time low. And yes it's done by a reputable organisation and has traditionally been neutral in these matters.
A lot of of the so called "police supporters/govenrnment supporters" get paid to go on these demonstrations...
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Have someone stated that the same happened with the NBA? The coach of the Rockets made almost the same comment but the NBA stated that they supported the coach free of speach. China canceled the games that where going to be held in its country.
Of course this has an impact in future NBA endevours in China but remains a reliable company for its workers.
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On October 10 2019 05:56 jy_9876543210 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2019 05:44 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 05:21 jy_9876543210 wrote:On October 10 2019 05:14 BaneRiders wrote:On October 10 2019 05:01 Geo.Rion wrote:On October 10 2019 04:19 whitehat511 wrote:
You've got to love all the irony of all these Americans and Europeans throwing around accusations that the Chinese government has committed atrocities. You know what they say about people in glass houses. I dont understand people like you, why would u make an account just to argue about chinese atrocities on TL.net of all places? Maybe it is his/her job to do so. It is not the only account created only for arguing in this thread. OK maybe I was wrong, maybe the big machine does care about TL forum... It feels like the comments under CCTV channel on youtube. You click on any of the accounts, and you will see that it's created in 1 day and just to post the only comment. In fact, I have already talked about it. If you are a manager, you will find that I registered in the GvW competition in Korea. Because I want to vote for people. As for why I don't post, it is because of English problems. We are more accustomed to being active in China's own Chinese forum. Is there anything wrong with it? As for why I will post this time because of the website https://www.rankedftw.com/. Some people have changed the China region (China mainland server) in the StarCraft area to the Hong Kong regional flag, and the Hong Kong name. I don't know Western culture and values. But this matter has already been debated in the Chinese forum in China. And this thing itself does not respect others We don't want to see Blizzard or StarCraft become the victim of the next political struggle. We love the NBA and love StarCraft, but we really can't accept such an offense. If I support K.K.K today, will you support my freedom of speech? I am afraid that the United States will refuse entry. "We don't want to see Blizzard or StarCraft become the victim of the next political struggle." Then this is the wrong place to go. If people go against Blizzard because of Hearthstone, you can't save it by arguing on a Starcraft forum. There's not much of attention here. The only helpful thing is that you may have a chance to improve your English. Nothing about people's decision.
Shì ma?
Nín rènwéi bùshì zhèngzhì dòuzhēng?
Díquè, hěnduō xīfāng rén dào xiànzài hái rènwéi nàxiē kǒuhào, nàxiē dàizhe miànjù mófǎng K.K.K de rén shì wèile zìyóu.
Xuānchēng zìyóu de rén hěnduō, bǐrú zhōngdōng de zìyóu zhànshì, nín zhīchí zhèxiē kǒngbù fèn zi ma?
Zhèxiē rén nándào bùshì měiguó zhèngfǔ gǔchuī de? Nín tiānzhēn de rènwéi bùshì yīn wéi zhōng měi màoyì zhàn? Zhè jiùshì zhōng měi zhēngduān dì yīgè suōyǐng bàle.
Yīn wéi shì xiǎng yào pòshǐ zhōngguó qūfú, měiguó yíngdé màoyì zhàn. Zhōngguó rén běnshēn fùchū gèng duō ér dédào de dōngxī, yě méiyǒule.
Hěn kěxiào, zhōngguó bùshì nàxiē ruòxiǎo de guójiā, suǒyǐ bùnéng shǐyòng jūnduì.
Měiguó rén xiànzài kěnéng duì tā de jūnduì fēicháng shīwàng ba. Jíbiàn shì jūnfèi kāizhī děngyú qítā guójiā zhī hé
展开
238/5000
is it?
Do you think it is not a political struggle?
Indeed, many Westerners still think of those slogans, those who mask K.K.K with a mask for freedom.
There are many people who claim freedom, such as the freedom fighters in the Middle East. Do you support these terrorists?
Are these people not advocated by the US government? Do you really think that it is not because of the Sino-US trade war? This is a microcosm of the Sino-US dispute.
Because it wants to force China to yield, the United States wins a trade war. The Chinese themselves have paid more and they have nothing to gain.
It is ridiculous that China is not a weak country, so it is impossible to use the army.
The Americans may now be very disappointed with his army. Even military spending is equal to the sum of other countries.
User was warned for this post
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On October 10 2019 06:08 chuchuchu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2019 05:53 Excludos wrote:On October 10 2019 05:47 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 05:43 Excludos wrote:On October 10 2019 05:33 chuchuchu wrote:
Even Wikipedia has debates about whether there is a massacre in Tiananmen (1989). There are no debates on Wikipedia about whether the massacre happened. People are allowed to debate on the wiki debate page, and on there anyone and whomever can say whatever the heck they please. That never makes it onto the actual article itself, which requires sources for everything you post. And there are plenty of sources for Tiananmen square. There's fucking photos of it! And they have existed since before Photoshop was a thing. Are you questioning my ability to use the network? Yes. Quite profoundly: https://observers.france24.com/en/20120604-new-photos-emerge-showing-tiananmen-square-just-after-1989-massacre-china-student-protest-commemorationAnd thanks for making me google these for you. They make me sick to my stomach. There are more, btw. Any google search will do. They are not censored over here (yet) The "tank man" is from the day after the massacre, not from the massacre itself. https://baijiahao.baidu.com/s?id=1561088272745847&wfr=spider&for=pcI really hope that you can look at these. What is the photo of the slaughter? What is evidence? What is the real slaughter However, it seems that it is hard to say clearly with Westerners and whites. After all, it is a country that relies on the slave trade and the ethnic groups of Africa and the Americas are extinct. I would like to know that Americans are afraid when they are lying on the land where Indians and blacks are buried.
So far you have compared the Hong Kong protesters with the KKK, I think you called me stupid, it's hard to know for sure with your English, you are denying the tiananmen square massacre happened and now you start to get racist about "whites". I wonder where you'll go next!
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On October 10 2019 06:04 chuchuchu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2019 05:53 Excludos wrote:On October 10 2019 05:47 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 05:43 Excludos wrote:On October 10 2019 05:33 chuchuchu wrote:
Even Wikipedia has debates about whether there is a massacre in Tiananmen (1989). There are no debates on Wikipedia about whether the massacre happened. People are allowed to debate on the wiki debate page, and on there anyone and whomever can say whatever the heck they please. That never makes it onto the actual article itself, which requires sources for everything you post. And there are plenty of sources for Tiananmen square. There's fucking photos of it! And they have existed since before Photoshop was a thing. Are you questioning my ability to use the network? Yes. Quite profoundly: https://observers.france24.com/en/20120604-new-photos-emerge-showing-tiananmen-square-just-after-1989-massacre-china-student-protest-commemorationAnd thanks for making me google these for you. They make me sick to my stomach. There are more, btw. Any google search will do. They are not censored over here (yet) The "tank man" is from the day after the massacre, not from the massacre itself. Yes. A mess after a large-scale rally. What is the photo of the slaughter, I tell you, just like the US military in Iraq and Afghanistan. Blood and corpses are everywhere. It is not the mess left by those who eat and drink Lazar in the square. I tell you what is the slaughter. This is a photo of the US military in Vietnam. Take a good look. Of course you can also think that this is a fake. But it's much more convincing than the photos of your ordinary soldiers smiling. Http://www.myzaker.com/article/5becdc8d32ce407b9600000f
LOLOL
Is this guy seriously comparing Tiananmen square massacre (Government targetting their own students/civil activists) to Iraq/Afghanistan (warzone)??
The communist part is well known for killing their own citizens... Going back a bit we can look at the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural revolution..
Anyway this guys is clearly a troll who's closely following the chinese state media's positions so yeh won't reply anymore....
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On October 10 2019 06:10 HaFnium wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2019 05:18 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 04:57 jy_9876543210 wrote:On October 10 2019 04:48 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 04:41 jy_9876543210 wrote:On October 10 2019 04:35 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 03:57 phodacbiet wrote:On October 10 2019 02:46 chuchuchu wrote:On October 10 2019 02:13 Excludos wrote:On October 10 2019 02:04 chuchuchu wrote:
[quote]
When you think so, have you ever asked about the thoughts of ordinary Chinese?. I hope you understand that while this is an interesting conversation, your views are inherently skewed by the propaganda you've been fed every day. We know how the Chinese media works (and it's not just China btw. America has much of the same problems, and most of us here do recognise it as such). You have already made made several false statements and made comparisons that does not make sense (Comparing China to England because England has a mock Queen for instance). As such everything you say will be taken with the biggest grain of salt imaginable I do think it's interesting what the ordinary Chinese thinks, but it truthfully doesn't matter. You don't get to commit human rights violations and consider it ok because "The ordinary Chinese thinks so". Guess who doesn't think it's ok? Hong Kong and its citizens. Very interesting, wrong comparison I just want to show that some forms of democracy and freedom will change, just as discrimination against blacks is definitely not one of freedom of speech in the United States. Although Martin Luther King was killed. Similarly, China's democracy and freedom are not so much the same as the United States, because the so-called autocracy and dictator seem to be like the Queen of England and the Emperor of Japan. And when you talk about it, we should think about Hong Kong and its citizens. I am very eager to ask, do you know how many Hong Kong people participated in this Chinese National Day celebration? Including young people, college students, government officials, police, famous stars, and ordinary people. Do you think we should think about Hong Kong people, then do you know how many people in Hong Kong support the police parade? The police in Hong Kong, the government in Hong Kong, Hong Kong, so many condemns the violent protesters, and the ordinary people, shouting at the bbc reporters, this is Hong Kong, China, the taxi driver who supports the law revision, isn't it Hong Kong? What you see seems to be the collective public opinion of Hong Kong, actually because those people have amplified this reaction through radical methods. Think about it, if it is really a problem of the society and the Chinese government, the Hong Kong government, the ordinary people of Hong Kong (Is it not ordinary people and the grassroots officials?) Are these attitudes still not showing anything? Think about how good the credibility of the Hong Kong government is, and the same group of people are not trusted now. The vast majority of protesters on the streets of Hong Kong are college students, young people, and young unemployed people. Is this a normal antibody or a collective carnival of young people, like an American youth who likes to take drugs? China has experienced two very painful students, and the young people have dominated the political violent protests, almost smashing the entire country. However, these protests did not make more than a billion people ignorant, and the ordinary Chinese who were at a loss knew how to live well. The Chinese have supported all the legal acts of Hong Kong and have wanted to split China and Hong Kong for many years. There is nothing too fierce. We support Hong Kong, support democracy, support freedom, and even to some extent, support universal suffrage in Hong Kong. However, what you have to understand is what is the slogan of Hong Kong's independence and violence? This is what the Hong Kong player and the NBA rocket manager said. This is also why the Chinese currently call it a terrorist, because terrorists in the Middle East often call themselves freedom fighters. If Hong Kong, China, is not dominated by the majority of Chinese people and by the majority of Hong Kong people, then who will decide? Can Texas and California declare independence today and expel all blacks and people from other states？ So，why China give up HK？and Violent protestors demanding the expulsion of mainlanders？ In mainland China, Hong Kong people's bad reputation, sense of geographical superiority and discrimination against mainlanders are the main reasons。 (you can find it in many Hong Kong movies，In mainland China, Hong Kong people's bad reputation, sense of geographical superiority and discrimination against mainlanders are the main reasons (you can find out from many Hong Kong movies, including asking mainlanders if they have seen Apple phones made in China, and mocking the mainland for lack of high-rise power and modern technology, the same thing is still happening to Chinese people in Europe, the United States, etc.)It used to be Korea and Japan.). You bring up valid points, but what you seem to miss out on is how this all started in the first place. There is currently a Sino-British joint declaration agreement between China and the UK dated back in 1984 and went into effect in 1997 stating that HK will have its own government, is able to pass its own laws, and that their way of life would not change for 50 years. You can read a bit on that agreement here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-British_Joint_Declaration. This means that in this agreement, China agreed that its PRC principles would not be practiced in HK until 2047. Despite this agreement, in 2014, China proposed a reform to HK's electoral system, a clear infringement of the agreement. Since China agreed that HK could remain autonomous and have authority over their own government, then why is China screening candidates for HK's Chief Executive? This started around 2014 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Hong_Kong_protests), and afterwards the British Foreign Office announced that Chinese officials now treat this declaration as void. You say China support HK's democracy, then why not let the HK'ers elect who they want, instead of screening who they want the HK people to elect? The HK'ers are upset because they were promised 50 years, but China is trying to impose only 22 years into the treaty. Does this mean China's words aren't even worth 50% of what they put on papers? So flash forward to the current protest, how did it start? Well, China wanted to pass an extradite bill in HK, another infringement of the current agreement. HK'ers did not want this law, which they are within their own rights to deny since China agreed it will not impose, yet China still adamantly demand that this law be passed. If you look over at the 5 demands HK is currently protesting for, they are extremely reasonable given that China started this by breaking their words. 1. Full withdrawal of the extradition bill - Very valid demand, considering China signed an agreement that they will not be imposing their laws in HK until 2047. Last I checked, it's only 2019. 2. Inquiry into police brutality - Also valid, the people would like to investigate police's conduct. The police are meant to protect the people, not beat them up when they are protesting. 3. Retracting the classification of protesters as rioters - This started because China broke its words, so the people were upset and protested. Had China not broke its words, this wouldn't have happened. The people marched because China lied, not because they randomly rioted out of no where. This point can be a case by case basis with some standards since I understand not all protesters are good, some can be destructive, and we should judge them fairly. 4. Amnesty for arrested protesters - Same as point 3. 5. Dual universal suffrage, for both their Legislative and Chief Executive - Again, China signed an agreement that allows the HK'ers to manage their own government. If they are true to their words, let the HK'ers decide how they want their government to be ran. My main point is that HK originally didn't protest for independence. This was NOT how the protest started. They started because China lied and backed out of their own words only 22 years into a 50 years signed agreement. It is only escalating because instead of admitting they were in the wrong, China cracked down on the HK citizens. HK citizens now are entertaining independence because they realized Mainland China does not keep its word. To use a Starcraft analogy, this is similar to Mengsk, Reynor, and Kerrigan working together, yet Mengsk abandoned Kerrigan on that one planet (forgot the name). When Reynor became rightfully pissed for what Mengsk did and turned on him, Mengsk called Reynor a terrorist. China is pulling a Mengsk right now. If China is true to its words. Come back in 28 years and let the HK'ers do what they want to do with their government for now. 1. China hopes to sign extradition regulations with Hong Kong (extending criminal offenders because there have been criminals who have committed murder and rape in mainland China and have been cast into Hong Kong. The Chinese government and other countries such as the United States also have extradition regulations, and the Hong Kong government has other regions. The state has extradition regulations). Why is it rejected? This is not because mainland China requires the implementation of laws in Hong Kong, but hopes to sign regulations with Hong Kong. This is actually very strange. It is actually an agreement between a country and a country within a country. 2. I hope that you can read the Sino-British Joint Declaration carefully. He has not given the British any rights after this. You can blame the Chinese government, but because of this, I think other countries are involved. This is still the Beijing government of China and the Hong Kong region. problem. In addition, the Chinese government's commitment is to keep Hong Kong unchanged for 50 years. I don't know how you understand it. I have two thoughts. One is to continue Hong Kong before the colony in 1997, and the second is to follow the basic law after 1997. Hong Kong. Before 1997, Hong Kong was a colony. Hong Kong people did not even have British nationality. The leaders of Hong Kong were all British whites. They were also British nationals, both the first and the second, including the Hong Kong Constitution, the Sino-British Joint Declaration. During the British colonial period, there was no universal suffrage. I don't know where Hong Kong's universal suffrage comes from. This violates the Constitution of Hong Kong - the Basic Law. In addition, without universal suffrage, it cannot mean that they have no democracy. Hong Kong's politics is closer to the Swiss political system, and each leader does not adopt the Swiss rotation system. Keeping it for 50 years, isn't it just that there is no universal suffrage? Once the universal suffrage is not a violation of the China Commitment and the Sino-British Joint Declaration, and the Hong Kong Basic Law? Although I think that Hong Kong has been harming itself for 50 years, the development of first-tier cities in China is much better than that of Hong Kong. For me, I have lived in Shanghai for a long time, and Hong Kong is like a rural area. Of course, I am not actually, most of them. This is also true in Europe, and I have a stark contrast to the views of Japanese cities. 3. The Chinese government of Beijing and all Chinese have never opposed liberal democracy and legal protests. However, after the Cultural Revolution, the Chinese were sensitive to the protests because we realized that such collective behavior would often evolve into violence. For example, China’s previous protests, the US bombing of the Yugoslav embassy, and Japan’s activities to commemorate the death of soldiers in World War II. This kind of parade in China has produced extreme violence, as happened in Hong Kong. If you don't trust the Chinese and don't trust the Chinese government, don't you believe that the Hong Kong government and the Hong Kong police, which have always been highly praised, don't believe it? Don't you believe in Western media? Go look for their evaluation of the Hong Kong police and the Hong Kong government in history. 4. Special criminals are not advisable. Think about the United States, but the country with the highest proportion of prison population. Of course, I don't want China to become the United States. But think about it. There are many British nationals in the Hong Kong police, white people (maybe I think you still don't believe in the yellow race, but I don't think it is racist). Hong Kong's judicial system, so the judges are British nationality, Australian nationality, 90% of judges are white. You should trust them, not a group of unemployed people, a group of young people who have taken a poison and drink alcohol and have sex on the roadside (although you call it freedom, but often these are blocked by neutral media). Opposite to these violent protesters are peaceful protesters who have long since left the protest, and supporters who support the police, support the Hong Kong government, and support the Chinese government. They are more numerous, but unfortunately they need to work and they do not use violence. So it seems to be weak, and because many of them are older people (you should have heard of Hong Kong's aging), they are not very familiar with the Internet, and the Internet is now a Z-age person (in fact, 1995-2000) Born person). 5. Why did they protest? Quite simply, young people can't find a job without a way out, and they are poor. The long-term segregation policy with mainland China discriminates against mainland Chinese people and believes that they are all poor people, as whites discriminate against black people. Hong Kong knows that Hong Kong is bought by Li Ka-shing, and that the Chinese government cannot interfere and support socialism. Everyone has food and housing. Later, the economic decline of Western society, if you are a European, there should be experience, the US economy has recently grown, but it is also uncomfortable. After the 2008 financial turmoil, it has been declining for a long time. China is getting better and better. When China gets better, when they find that the Chinese who once earned 200 yuan a month have the same income and even more money, they find that they can’t be like the colonial era. Next, when it came to China, it became a millionaire, went to bed with more girls, and bought more luxurious cosmetics. So I hope to return to the colonial era and pass violence. (Their slogan is what you saw in this Hong Kong player and the NBA), by robbing mobile phone stores, selling them online, by raising the flags of the United States and the United Kingdom. I saw Swedes, and I think I should understand why, academically, the Sedgmo syndrome. Perhaps Westerners believe that the colonial era is very glorious. "don't you believe that the Hong Kong government and the Hong Kong police, which have always been highly praised" "Why did they protest? Quite simply, young people can't find a job without a way out, and they are poor. The long-term segregation policy with mainland China discriminates against mainland Chinese people and believes that they are all poor people, as whites discriminate against black people." This is trolling for sure... I can hardly find any other explanations. Oh, poor man. In fact, it is very simple. You only need to use Google to search for the gap between the rich and the poor in Hong Kong. Have you been to Hong Kong and China? I am very familiar with it. Yeah yeah I can find Gini index for every country in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_income_equalityBut why do you think that's the reason of the protest? Where did you find that? Who told you that? You are very familiar with it but you don't know the reason? After removing the tax and welfare transfers, Hong Kong’s Gini index was as high as 0.54. If you have been to Chicago and New York, think about where the tramp is, social security (Hong Kong people want to thank the Hong Kong police for their efforts) In addition, you should check that the top ten billionaires in Hong Kong account for Hong Kong's GDP (more than 35%). The disparity between the rich and the poor in Hong Kong has been criticized by the United Nations. If you can visit Hong Kong's own website You will find that Hong Kong officially announced that there are 1.3 million poor people in 7.6 million people in Hong Kong. Perhaps you should use Google to search for the poor in Hong Kong directly, or go to Hong Kong in person. Take a look at the slums in the bustling city. (The slums in mainland China have long since disappeared) Hong Kong is an area without a universal retirement protection system. It is well developed, but his university enrollment rate is only 20%. This is the famous ten universities in Hong Kong. Hong Kong is a developed region and an unbalanced region. You should probably look at the encyclopedia about Li Ka-shing and see his property. We call him Lee half HK (Lee half HK) Chuchuchu's posts are so hard to understand - can see him trying really hard with google translate. One thing is quite clear - the majority HK people definitely do not support the police. The support for the government/leader/police in HK has reached an all time low. And yes it's done by a reputable organisation and has traditionally been neutral in these matters. A lot of of the so called "police supporters/govenrnment supporters" get paid to go on these demonstrations...
Yes, this is why I said that the Western media is very interesting.
Look at this site, of course, although you claim that you are only there, there is no review, but the content of these sites will never appear in front of you.
See how many people are paying to tens of thousands of people to participate in such a rally?
And it is clear that the support of the government is a certain age, most people are 30-60 years old.
They need work to support themselves, people eat every day, and many of them still support the students who participated in the protest.
You can look for photos or evidence at will. You will find that the vast majority of protesters are young people in their 20s. Can't you explain the problem?
These people represent Hong Kong? Unemployed people can also represent Hong Kong?
Http://news.cri.cn/20190701/80d56a44-5fb6-9b0d-52d5-9d4e461ea353.html
Http://www.xinhuanet.com//gangao/2019-07/29/c_1124813323.htm
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EPT
