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On September 22 2014 06:24 Crushinator wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2014 06:17 Millitron wrote:On September 22 2014 05:40 hfglgg wrote:On September 22 2014 05:20 FiWiFaKi wrote:On September 22 2014 05:11 Nyxisto wrote:
"I find it very hard to believe that if homophobia was so bad, that society survived the millennia where it was common".
As the guy above pointed out you can literally say this about thousands of stupid practises that, in some parts of the world, just won't die off. It's actually ridiculous how many nonsense is still going around, one of them is thinking you can educate your children by causing them pain or humiliation.
Your home is supposed to be a save haven. You're not supposed to be scared of your parents, and if you think you need to scare your kids to teach them discipline you're doing it wrong. You're offering an opinion and stating it as a fact. It's fine if you think that's the right way, but people are allowed to have differing opinions. we did it boys! we have the first guy actually saying that children should be scared of their parents! what the fuck... Respect always has an element of fear to it. That clearly isn't true. I could send you a huge list of people I respect but do not fear in the slightest, but I won't.
I agree that it doesn't always. But very often it is the case... Just like when people talk to police, there's often some fear there. You respect the principal of a school since you don't know exactly what they could do to you. Often respect has a fear aspect.
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On September 22 2014 06:17 Millitron wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2014 05:40 hfglgg wrote:On September 22 2014 05:20 FiWiFaKi wrote:On September 22 2014 05:11 Nyxisto wrote:
"I find it very hard to believe that if homophobia was so bad, that society survived the millennia where it was common".
As the guy above pointed out you can literally say this about thousands of stupid practises that, in some parts of the world, just won't die off. It's actually ridiculous how many nonsense is still going around, one of them is thinking you can educate your children by causing them pain or humiliation.
Your home is supposed to be a save haven. You're not supposed to be scared of your parents, and if you think you need to scare your kids to teach them discipline you're doing it wrong. You're offering an opinion and stating it as a fact. It's fine if you think that's the right way, but people are allowed to have differing opinions. we did it boys! we have the first guy actually saying that children should be scared of their parents! what the fuck... Respect always has an element of fear to it.
Yes, asserting physical dominance over kids that still have their milk-teeth really shows strength of character.
I agree that it doesn't always. But very often it is the case... Just like when people talk to police, there's often some fear there. You respect the principal of a school since you don't know exactly what they could do to you. Often respect has a fear aspect.
parents are not supposed to be police officers, especially not American ones.
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On September 22 2014 06:28 FiWiFaKi wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2014 05:48 Crushinator wrote:On September 22 2014 05:40 hfglgg wrote:On September 22 2014 05:20 FiWiFaKi wrote:On September 22 2014 05:11 Nyxisto wrote:
"I find it very hard to believe that if homophobia was so bad, that society survived the millennia where it was common".
As the guy above pointed out you can literally say this about thousands of stupid practises that, in some parts of the world, just won't die off. It's actually ridiculous how many nonsense is still going around, one of them is thinking you can educate your children by causing them pain or humiliation.
Your home is supposed to be a save haven. You're not supposed to be scared of your parents, and if you think you need to scare your kids to teach them discipline you're doing it wrong. You're offering an opinion and stating it as a fact. It's fine if you think that's the right way, but people are allowed to have differing opinions. we did it boys! we have the first guy actually saying that children should be scared of their parents! what the fuck... This might not be as unpopular an opinion as you think. Its pretty shocking from a European perspective. I was born in europe, and spanked in europe. You are generalizing europe way too much imo, but anyway.
I meant civilized, sorry for the confusion.
On September 22 2014 06:30 FiWiFaKi wrote:
I agree that it doesn't always. But very often it is the case... Just like when people talk to police, there's often some fear there. You respect the principal of a school since you don't know exactly what they could do to you. Often respect has a fear aspect.
There is some fear there when I talk to a police officer, because he/she might hurt me if he/she feels like I crossed some line. But I don't know if I have much respect for the police. My default mode for them is one of suspicion and apprehension, because I know they are not my friends and could possibly hurt me no good reason. I had no respect at all for my old school principal, but that is a personal thing. I don't know if repsect and fear are all that related to be honest.
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On September 22 2014 06:35 Crushinator wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2014 06:28 FiWiFaKi wrote:On September 22 2014 05:48 Crushinator wrote:On September 22 2014 05:40 hfglgg wrote:On September 22 2014 05:20 FiWiFaKi wrote:On September 22 2014 05:11 Nyxisto wrote:
"I find it very hard to believe that if homophobia was so bad, that society survived the millennia where it was common".
As the guy above pointed out you can literally say this about thousands of stupid practises that, in some parts of the world, just won't die off. It's actually ridiculous how many nonsense is still going around, one of them is thinking you can educate your children by causing them pain or humiliation.
Your home is supposed to be a save haven. You're not supposed to be scared of your parents, and if you think you need to scare your kids to teach them discipline you're doing it wrong. You're offering an opinion and stating it as a fact. It's fine if you think that's the right way, but people are allowed to have differing opinions. we did it boys! we have the first guy actually saying that children should be scared of their parents! what the fuck... This might not be as unpopular an opinion as you think. Its pretty shocking from a European perspective. I was born in europe, and spanked in europe. You are generalizing europe way too much imo, but anyway. I meant civilized, sorry for the confusion.
That's quite rude. Plenty of places in europe where people get spanked and are civilized. Slovakia for example.
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On September 22 2014 06:41 FiWiFaKi wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2014 06:35 Crushinator wrote:On September 22 2014 06:28 FiWiFaKi wrote:On September 22 2014 05:48 Crushinator wrote:On September 22 2014 05:40 hfglgg wrote:On September 22 2014 05:20 FiWiFaKi wrote:On September 22 2014 05:11 Nyxisto wrote:
"I find it very hard to believe that if homophobia was so bad, that society survived the millennia where it was common".
As the guy above pointed out you can literally say this about thousands of stupid practises that, in some parts of the world, just won't die off. It's actually ridiculous how many nonsense is still going around, one of them is thinking you can educate your children by causing them pain or humiliation.
Your home is supposed to be a save haven. You're not supposed to be scared of your parents, and if you think you need to scare your kids to teach them discipline you're doing it wrong. You're offering an opinion and stating it as a fact. It's fine if you think that's the right way, but people are allowed to have differing opinions. we did it boys! we have the first guy actually saying that children should be scared of their parents! what the fuck... This might not be as unpopular an opinion as you think. Its pretty shocking from a European perspective. I was born in europe, and spanked in europe. You are generalizing europe way too much imo, but anyway. I meant civilized, sorry for the confusion. That's quite rude. Plenty of places in europe where people get spanked and are civilized. Slovakia for example.
I apologize to the barbarians of Slovakia.
jk
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As someone without children, I actually don't think I can post here. I actually think having a child is a prerequisite to this discussion because while I've tried to fathom every possible scenario I'm not sure how I would react in 100 different scenarios or what might push me to snap. The one thing you have to remember is children aren't reasonable or rational. So it's extremely difficult to judge.
I would just say most parents should have a lot of patience and understanding and think all of their actions through. I think I could always think of some other action to change the situation.
My naive side says I could always reason or outsmart the child to make it grow up into a respectable person eventually. But, I actually don't know. I don't think light spanking is a big deal though. Enough to hurt but not enough to bruise or bleed. Plus, yelling is more effective. The voice is a great resource. I scare the shit out of my team mates, I'm sure I could terrify my child! (I wouldn't actually do that though). ;p
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On September 22 2014 06:35 Nyxisto wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2014 06:17 Millitron wrote:On September 22 2014 05:40 hfglgg wrote:On September 22 2014 05:20 FiWiFaKi wrote:On September 22 2014 05:11 Nyxisto wrote:
"I find it very hard to believe that if homophobia was so bad, that society survived the millennia where it was common".
As the guy above pointed out you can literally say this about thousands of stupid practises that, in some parts of the world, just won't die off. It's actually ridiculous how many nonsense is still going around, one of them is thinking you can educate your children by causing them pain or humiliation.
Your home is supposed to be a save haven. You're not supposed to be scared of your parents, and if you think you need to scare your kids to teach them discipline you're doing it wrong. You're offering an opinion and stating it as a fact. It's fine if you think that's the right way, but people are allowed to have differing opinions. we did it boys! we have the first guy actually saying that children should be scared of their parents! what the fuck... Respect always has an element of fear to it. Yes, asserting physical dominance over kids that still have their milk-teeth really shows strength of character. Show nested quote +I agree that it doesn't always. But very often it is the case... Just like when people talk to police, there's often some fear there. You respect the principal of a school since you don't know exactly what they could do to you. Often respect has a fear aspect. parents are not supposed to be police officers, especially not American ones.
Physical dominance is often the only thing a child will understand in the heat of the moment.
What do you do when your 5 year old is in the process of stuffing the contents of your wallet down the garbage disposal? Do you try to explain why that is not a wise course of action, or do you physically stop him?
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On September 22 2014 07:04 Millitron wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2014 06:35 Nyxisto wrote:On September 22 2014 06:17 Millitron wrote:On September 22 2014 05:40 hfglgg wrote:On September 22 2014 05:20 FiWiFaKi wrote:On September 22 2014 05:11 Nyxisto wrote:
"I find it very hard to believe that if homophobia was so bad, that society survived the millennia where it was common".
As the guy above pointed out you can literally say this about thousands of stupid practises that, in some parts of the world, just won't die off. It's actually ridiculous how many nonsense is still going around, one of them is thinking you can educate your children by causing them pain or humiliation.
Your home is supposed to be a save haven. You're not supposed to be scared of your parents, and if you think you need to scare your kids to teach them discipline you're doing it wrong. You're offering an opinion and stating it as a fact. It's fine if you think that's the right way, but people are allowed to have differing opinions. we did it boys! we have the first guy actually saying that children should be scared of their parents! what the fuck... Respect always has an element of fear to it. Yes, asserting physical dominance over kids that still have their milk-teeth really shows strength of character. I agree that it doesn't always. But very often it is the case... Just like when people talk to police, there's often some fear there. You respect the principal of a school since you don't know exactly what they could do to you. Often respect has a fear aspect. parents are not supposed to be police officers, especially not American ones. Physical dominance is often the only thing a child will understand in the heat of the moment. What do you do when your 5 year old is in the process of stuffing the contents of your wallet down the garbage disposal? Do you try to explain why that is not a wise course of action, or do you physically stop him?
Never thought I'd see the ticking time bomb scenario applied to spanking of all things. *Jack Bauer voice* "If you don't spank your child RIGHT NOW millions of people WILL DIE!"
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On September 22 2014 07:04 Millitron wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2014 06:35 Nyxisto wrote:On September 22 2014 06:17 Millitron wrote:On September 22 2014 05:40 hfglgg wrote:On September 22 2014 05:20 FiWiFaKi wrote:On September 22 2014 05:11 Nyxisto wrote:
"I find it very hard to believe that if homophobia was so bad, that society survived the millennia where it was common".
As the guy above pointed out you can literally say this about thousands of stupid practises that, in some parts of the world, just won't die off. It's actually ridiculous how many nonsense is still going around, one of them is thinking you can educate your children by causing them pain or humiliation.
Your home is supposed to be a save haven. You're not supposed to be scared of your parents, and if you think you need to scare your kids to teach them discipline you're doing it wrong. You're offering an opinion and stating it as a fact. It's fine if you think that's the right way, but people are allowed to have differing opinions. we did it boys! we have the first guy actually saying that children should be scared of their parents! what the fuck... Respect always has an element of fear to it. Yes, asserting physical dominance over kids that still have their milk-teeth really shows strength of character. I agree that it doesn't always. But very often it is the case... Just like when people talk to police, there's often some fear there. You respect the principal of a school since you don't know exactly what they could do to you. Often respect has a fear aspect. parents are not supposed to be police officers, especially not American ones. Physical dominance is often the only thing a child will understand in the heat of the moment. What do you do when your 5 year old is in the process of stuffing the contents of your wallet down the garbage disposal? Do you try to explain why that is not a wise course of action, or do you physically stop him?
Well of course you physically stop them but that is not equivalent to hitting the child!
In the case where there was malicious intent, and it wasn't brought on by the parent in a number of obvious ways (say the child is just a sociopath in the making), at least in my mind I can't see how hitting the child makes him/her a better person. Typically abuse fosters more abuse; they start to think that hitting people who do the wrong thing is a good way to solve a problem.
In those cases there are more reasonable punishments that would work; depriving the child of certain rights or meals; there are gentler punishments that should do the job.
I think its just like how we don't use corporeal punishment in modern day justice. We simply separate people from society, try to reform them, but still make an effort to treat them humanely. Why should the opposite logic be followed in the rearing of children, when it isn't applied to adults? Also caning kids in school must be a thing of the past for a good reason, I think people realized that it was an unnecessarily brutal way of dealing with a problem; psychologists and educators have likely come to the conclusion that it causes more problems than it solves.
Either that or they just felt it was too brutal and had no place in modern society; which I'd agree with. I feel like this could be seen as a human rights issue, in that people have the right to be free from physical violence unless someone is acting in self-defense.
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On September 22 2014 06:50 SK.Testie wrote:The one thing you have to remember is children aren't reasonable or rational.
Precisely the reason why spanking is an irrational punishment. If children aren't reasonable, nor rational, why should they be expected to be able to reason the causality of their punishments?
Physical abuse in any form is immoral and irrational, with the sole possible exception of killing things that spread disease such as mosquitos and rats.
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Physically injuring your child is fine, but physically injuring your girlfriend is wrong because......................
On September 22 2014 05:20 FiWiFaKi wrote:
Often respect has a fear aspect.
Lmao what the fuck is this shit?? Plenty of people respect me, but I'm sure not a single one of them fears me. We' aren't talking about Stalinesque figures here, we''re talking about average people.
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There's a difference between spanking and causing injury. Properly done, it won't hurt more than a little sting.
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On September 22 2014 08:36 Millitron wrote:
There's a difference between spanking and causing injury. Properly done, it won't hurt more than a little sting.
Yes you're hurting your child when you spank them, thanks for clearing that up. I'm just gonna slap my GF now, but don't worry, I just wanna sting her a bit to let her know who the alpha male is.
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On September 22 2014 07:04 Millitron wrote:
What do you do when your 5 year old is in the process of stuffing the contents of your wallet down the garbage disposal? Do you try to explain why that is not a wise course of action, or do you physically stop him?
I'd take the wallet out of his hands and tell him to not do that again. Sweden, where corporal punishment of all forms has been banned have successfully protected their wallets since '79.
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http://www.dogfoodinsider.com/negative-reinforcement-dog-training.html
If it was so effective then why isn't it always used in dog training?
"...since all negative reinforcement, by definition, includes a punisher, making a practice of using negative reinforcement puts you at risk for all the unpredictable fallout of punishment: avoidance, secrecy, fear, confusion, resistance, passivity, and reduced initiative, as well as spillover associations, in which anything that happens to be around, including the training environment and the trainer, becomes distasteful or disliked, something to be avoided or even fled from. "
Talking about dogs again. It makes spanking seem pretty risky, right?
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On September 22 2014 07:04 Millitron wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2014 06:35 Nyxisto wrote:On September 22 2014 06:17 Millitron wrote:On September 22 2014 05:40 hfglgg wrote:On September 22 2014 05:20 FiWiFaKi wrote:On September 22 2014 05:11 Nyxisto wrote:
"I find it very hard to believe that if homophobia was so bad, that society survived the millennia where it was common".
As the guy above pointed out you can literally say this about thousands of stupid practises that, in some parts of the world, just won't die off. It's actually ridiculous how many nonsense is still going around, one of them is thinking you can educate your children by causing them pain or humiliation.
Your home is supposed to be a save haven. You're not supposed to be scared of your parents, and if you think you need to scare your kids to teach them discipline you're doing it wrong. You're offering an opinion and stating it as a fact. It's fine if you think that's the right way, but people are allowed to have differing opinions. we did it boys! we have the first guy actually saying that children should be scared of their parents! what the fuck... Respect always has an element of fear to it. Yes, asserting physical dominance over kids that still have their milk-teeth really shows strength of character. I agree that it doesn't always. But very often it is the case... Just like when people talk to police, there's often some fear there. You respect the principal of a school since you don't know exactly what they could do to you. Often respect has a fear aspect. parents are not supposed to be police officers, especially not American ones. Physical dominance is often the only thing a child will understand in the heat of the moment. What do you do when your 5 year old is in the process of stuffing the contents of your wallet down the garbage disposal? Do you try to explain why that is not a wise course of action, or do you physically stop him?
What the actual fuck? Going to ignore the "Respect always has an element of fear to it" bit and instead concentrate on how youthink preventing a 5 year old from throwing away a wallet is apparently now a deliberate act to cause fear for your crazy notion of respect. Do you even read what you wrote?
Actually scrap that. "Respect always has an element of fear to it" is plenty of crazy all by itself.
Btw Carwash, you need to make sure who you are quoting when editting lol.
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Yes I was spanked not often, but enough born and raised in Ohio. I have a 3 year old and I spank him as does his Thai mother, but only after a verbal warning, followed by small punishment like standing in the corner or his favorite toy being locked up, if he still persist in his action or doesn't stay in the corner after being warned he will be spanked then he is spanked, with a bare hand by me, his mother uses a comb when he is really bad but never hard enough to make whelps or markings.
I also always keep my word, if I tell him he will be spanked if he doesn't stop, once I say this if he continues I keep my word and spank him. His mother not so much, she will threaten, then call me.
Most discipline comes when he is mean to his disabled twin brother. An example Jacob my disabled son will have a toy, his brother sees it and comes take it from him. I tell Junior to give it back, he doesn't he runs instead. I will follow him take it from him, tell him to stand in the other room. He then comes back in the room grabs the toy again, he is then spanked. After this he will cry, run to his brother and hug him. I never have to spank him more than once.
I could never use a switch to spank my son even though I was switched, I had to choose my own and then take the leaves off myself.
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On September 22 2014 07:27 radscorpion9 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2014 07:04 Millitron wrote:On September 22 2014 06:35 Nyxisto wrote:On September 22 2014 06:17 Millitron wrote:On September 22 2014 05:40 hfglgg wrote:On September 22 2014 05:20 FiWiFaKi wrote:On September 22 2014 05:11 Nyxisto wrote:
"I find it very hard to believe that if homophobia was so bad, that society survived the millennia where it was common".
As the guy above pointed out you can literally say this about thousands of stupid practises that, in some parts of the world, just won't die off. It's actually ridiculous how many nonsense is still going around, one of them is thinking you can educate your children by causing them pain or humiliation.
Your home is supposed to be a save haven. You're not supposed to be scared of your parents, and if you think you need to scare your kids to teach them discipline you're doing it wrong. You're offering an opinion and stating it as a fact. It's fine if you think that's the right way, but people are allowed to have differing opinions. we did it boys! we have the first guy actually saying that children should be scared of their parents! what the fuck... Respect always has an element of fear to it. Yes, asserting physical dominance over kids that still have their milk-teeth really shows strength of character. I agree that it doesn't always. But very often it is the case... Just like when people talk to police, there's often some fear there. You respect the principal of a school since you don't know exactly what they could do to you. Often respect has a fear aspect. parents are not supposed to be police officers, especially not American ones. Physical dominance is often the only thing a child will understand in the heat of the moment. What do you do when your 5 year old is in the process of stuffing the contents of your wallet down the garbage disposal? Do you try to explain why that is not a wise course of action, or do you physically stop him? Well of course you physically stop them but that is not equivalent to hitting the child! In the case where there was malicious intent, and it wasn't brought on by the parent in a number of obvious ways (say the child is just a sociopath in the making), at least in my mind I can't see how hitting the child makes him/her a better person. Typically abuse fosters more abuse; they start to think that hitting people who do the wrong thing is a good way to solve a problem. In those cases there are more reasonable punishments that would work; depriving the child of certain rights or meals; there are gentler punishments that should do the job. I think its just like how we don't use corporeal punishment in modern day justice. We simply separate people from society, try to reform them, but still make an effort to treat them humanely. Why should the opposite logic be followed in the rearing of children, when it isn't applied to adults? Also caning kids in school must be a thing of the past for a good reason, I think people realized that it was an unnecessarily brutal way of dealing with a problem; psychologists and educators have likely come to the conclusion that it causes more problems than it solves. Either that or they just felt it was too brutal and had no place in modern society; which I'd agree with. I feel like this could be seen as a human rights issue, in that people have the right to be free from physical violence unless someone is acting in self-defense.
Really you would rather deprive your child of a meal than spank them?
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Main punishment as a child, and got whipped with a thick leather belt.
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EPT
