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Grettin
42381 Posts
On November 13 2012 00:24 Masq wrote: When threads like this pop up I sometimes read a few threads on Stormfront, and I always end up wondering why people think the way they do. I thought i was alone, but i do this also. | ||
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coma
Germany86 Posts
Most of the people sympathizing with these ideas have a low standard of education (no "Abitur", which is the degree you need to be accepted at universities). People older than 60 are much more likely to be in Agreement. Also, they generally live in areas where they have no contact to migrants. Alternative Source(German):Tagesschau.de The actual news here is that the agreement with right-extremist positions has risen from 8.2% to 9% in the course of 2 years. According to my source, the percentage in Eastern Germany was actually 10.2% not 6.6% two years ago 2415 Germans and 95 Non-Germans were questioned. I really hope this trend doesn't continue. | ||
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oneofthem
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
see e.g. “Do you realize,” German Chancellor Helmut Kohl asked Ash after reunification, explaining his commitment to united Europe, “that you are sitting opposite the direct successor to Adolf Hitler?”* http://eastofcenter.tol.org/2012/09/europe-too-afraid-to-fail/ the same can be said for education and politics for the direct successors of the ww2 generation. historical memory needs to be upheld. in this regard germany is far superior to whatever japan has done, outside of making anti-war cartoons. | ||
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kafkaesque
Germany2006 Posts
On November 13 2012 00:27 Gretchen wrote: It's the economy, stupid. Germany may look economically strong compared to the rest of Europe, maybe even the world, but we still have high unemployment rates in exactly the parts of Germany where the Neo-Nazis grow stronger. Economic hardships always breed extremist movements, look at Greece, Eastern Europe or even Russia. They FOUGHT against Nazis in WW2 and now they fly the swastika and march in the streets. I live in Munich and pretty much never meet any Neo-Nazis, because Munich is one of the richest cities in Germany and Europe. We even have one of the highest percentages of foreign population of big german cities, but there aren't any problems, because there are also enough jobs. I never understood the part about the economy, since even if you're relatively poor in Germany, you'll still be absolutely prosperous. Being unemployed in Germany makes you wealthier than average wage in many other countries. As a student, I earn just a little less than a long-term unemployed person on Hartz 4 and I can live very comfortably. What kind of logic is there supposed to be? "Fuck, I can't afford the new iPhone, let's gas some gypsies!" | ||
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Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
On November 13 2012 00:38 coma wrote: I'd like to add some parts of the statistics, ht OP left out, just to give a better picture. Most of the people sympathizing with these ideas have a low standard of education (no "Abitur", which is the degree you need to be accepted at universities). People older than 60 are much more likely to be in Agreement. Also, they generally live in areas where they have no contact to migrants. Alternative Source(German):Tagesschau.de The actual news here is that the agreement with right-extremist positions has risen from 8.2% to 9% in the course of 2 years. According to my source, the Number in East Germany was actually 10.2% not 6.6% I really hope this trend doesn't continue. Those figures are still quite alarming regardless. I can't think of anything to do to solve the problem... On November 13 2012 00:38 Grettin wrote: I thought i was alone, but i do this also. I've trolled Stormfront a little, but those people are just insane. ;P | ||
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kafkaesque
Germany2006 Posts
On November 13 2012 00:40 oneofthem wrote: don't complain about that 'biased' education of history. it's for your own good. see e.g. I hope you're not referring to the OP; I thoroughly embrace the historical education we are exposed to. | ||
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HeeroFX
United States2704 Posts
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oneofthem
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On November 13 2012 00:44 kafkaesque wrote: I hope you're not referring to the OP; I thoroughly embrace the historical education we are exposed to. sorry was replying to + Show Spoiler + On November 13 2012 00:36 Morfildur wrote: Yes, at school we went through the whole WW2 thing 3 times at great length, including visiting some concentration camp (forgot which one). It was about 95% of the history education and the rest of history got mostly skipped over. It's ridiculous actually. After going through it once, maybe spending half a year of history lessons on that all understood that it was a bad time and noone wants that to happen again, so learning something about the other few thousand years of history would have been nice. | ||
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MWY
Germany284 Posts
On November 13 2012 00:32 Osmoses wrote: I believe you are misreading the data. I very much doubt 15% of east-germans think of themselves as "neo-nazis" or even "far-right". If it's anything, it's less about being a jew-hater and more about discontent regarding the current policies on immigration. There is currently this terribly popular idea in the media that the muslims, or islamists, are taking over Europe, and that eventually the whole world will be come Iran. While the media coverage may be somewhat exaggerated, I do feel much like alot of other people, in my country and yours, that my own country is becoming less and less mine every time there is a mosque built or a compromise made in parliament for "sensitivity towards immigrants". I don't hate immigrants, I don't hate muslims, but I can't help but feel angry when they come into my country and demand more and more "rights" while at the same time refusing to assimilate. At the same time, I recognize that this is a somewhat demonized image of immigrants. Of course they are not all a collective group of dicks that come into another man's house and make demands. The vocal minority always give the majority a bad rap. And as long as I do not have to give up freedoms of my own, what's the harm in anything anyone else does? Either way, if I want to hear people shouting praise of Allah from the rooftops, I'd sooner go to Afghanistan than have to hear it in my own country, where I have my own culture and traditions. I may have rambled a bit but TL:DR => people are not nazis just because they feel unease at the growing amount of foreign influences in their countries. So what party did you vote for? Just curious. Because if you feel that way, and it's an important political aspect for you, you basically have no other choice but to vote for the NPD. (Thing is, you basically can't vote for them because they can't be taken serious by anyone.) And i feel like that's a big problem. | ||
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Scorch
Austria3371 Posts
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helvete
Sweden276 Posts
On November 13 2012 00:36 BluePanther wrote: For all the comments about how America is too far right politically, Europe always has this problem and we never really do. In Europe, the GOP (or parts of it) would fit that slot nicely. | ||
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Deleted User 101379
4849 Posts
On November 13 2012 00:41 kafkaesque wrote: I never understood the part about the economy, since even if you're relatively poor in Germany, you'll still be absolutely prosperous. Being unemployed in Germany makes you wealthier than average wage in many other countries. As a student, I earn just a little less than a long-term unemployed person on Hartz 4 and I can live very comfortably. What kind of logic is there supposed to be? "Fuck, I can't afford the new iPhone, let's gas some gypsies!" You are a student. Then there are people with a family to support, debts and such. For them, life isn't as comfortable, they often barely get by. If they can't find work for some time, many of them start looking for someone to blame for their bad situation and people that are "different" are always easy to blame. | ||
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EtherealBlade
660 Posts
I don't think this is much news to be honest, just the usual scaremongering - even if this was real, the (main) problem would not only be the Neonazi kids, but the issues that are being swept under the rug by the EU and Western governments. But what can we expect when the mainstream can be allowed to praise the Weimar Republic as some kind of golden era? Germany, like many other countries had a rough 19th and 20th century, and got a lot to reflect on, but it's been overdone for a long time now and turned into some sick brainwashing. It's inevitable that sooner or later educated people will demand an end to it, but the hypocrites will scream Nazi until the end. | ||
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Probe1
United States17920 Posts
I mean holy shit. I clicked thinking there was a rebellion. | ||
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Rezudox
207 Posts
On November 13 2012 00:41 kafkaesque wrote: "Fuck, I can't afford the new iPhone, let's gas some gypsies!" This made me burst out laughing. I think the thread title is over-stating the case here tbh. | ||
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Ucs
264 Posts
If you look at the european nations that have been effected by the economic crysis you will see the same thing happen everywhere(Hungary and Greece being the best examples when it comes to nationalist parties gaining popularity). In the end, neonazis are not nazis. NPD are just a nationalist party filled with incompetent people(rational,competent,smart people wouldn't join that kind of party). Its just a fad that always shows up in society when a crisis emerges. It comes and goes just as fast. | ||
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MWY
Germany284 Posts
On November 13 2012 00:36 Morfildur wrote: Yes, at school we went through the whole WW2 thing 3 times at great length, including visiting some concentration camp (forgot which one). It was about 95% of the history education and the rest of history got mostly skipped over. It's ridiculous actually. After going through it once, maybe spending half a year of history lessons on that all understood that it was a bad time and noone wants that to happen again, so learning something about the other few thousand years of history would have been nice. Thats so true actually^^. Especially since you not only cover it in your history class, but also in religion, german, english, and even art. xd | ||
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BluePanther
United States2776 Posts
On November 13 2012 00:48 helvete wrote: In Europe, the GOP (or parts of it) would fit that slot nicely. Not really. It may be "far right", but it's not really a "nationalist" party. Even the GOP embraces legal immigration. I think it's because the idea of being anti-immigration isn't really a feasible concept here due to our history. I think that cuts off a lot of these feelings of someone being an "other" before they become to problematic. | ||
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Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
On November 13 2012 00:48 helvete wrote: In Europe, the GOP (or parts of it) would fit that slot nicely. The Tea party has a lot of far right extremists who censor themselves on the public because you can't get elected if you let your racism show. There are a few nazi movements too, but they're not as scary because well, they're not in Germany? That sounds bad but I'm guessing that plays a role. American nazis are viewed as dumb hicks and German nazis are, well, nazis. | ||
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ppshchik
United States862 Posts
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