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On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end.
Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech.
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On August 31 2012 13:16 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end. Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech.
Its kind of weird when you qutoation mark facts as though facts are evil and you shoudl be able to accuse someone of whatever you want.
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On August 31 2012 13:16 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end. Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech.
Noooo way dude. Ryan's assertions were weak and are easily contestable, that's why the media is taking shots at it. And frankly, Ryan's speaking style is ... robotic.
Rubio was one of the few speakers that spent time building up Romney, and the legacy of his family, in a convincing and uncontestable way.
Yes, Romney was born with a lot of his advantages, but he is an extension of his father's American Dream, and that should be respected, not diminished.
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On August 31 2012 13:18 Adreme wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 13:16 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end. Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech. Its kind of weird when you qutoation mark facts as though facts are evil and you shoudl be able to accuse someone of whatever you want.
Fact checking implies truth seeking. That is not what the liberals are doing, so I put it in quotes.
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On August 31 2012 13:20 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 13:18 Adreme wrote:On August 31 2012 13:16 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end. Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech. Its kind of weird when you qutoation mark facts as though facts are evil and you shoudl be able to accuse someone of whatever you want. Fact checking implies truth seeking. That is not what the liberals are doing, so I put it in quotes.
Tell me more.
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On August 31 2012 13:20 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 13:18 Adreme wrote:On August 31 2012 13:16 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end. Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech. Its kind of weird when you qutoation mark facts as though facts are evil and you shoudl be able to accuse someone of whatever you want. Fact checking implies truth seeking. That is not what the liberals are doing, so I put it in quotes.
Truthiness!
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On August 31 2012 13:25 Roe wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 13:20 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:18 Adreme wrote:On August 31 2012 13:16 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end. Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech. Its kind of weird when you qutoation mark facts as though facts are evil and you shoudl be able to accuse someone of whatever you want. Fact checking implies truth seeking. That is not what the liberals are doing, so I put it in quotes. Tell me more.
I'm too tired to go through it all again. There's been plenty of discussion about it in this thread already.
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On August 31 2012 13:31 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 13:25 Roe wrote:On August 31 2012 13:20 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:18 Adreme wrote:On August 31 2012 13:16 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end. Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech. Its kind of weird when you qutoation mark facts as though facts are evil and you shoudl be able to accuse someone of whatever you want. Fact checking implies truth seeking. That is not what the liberals are doing, so I put it in quotes. Tell me more. I'm too tired to go through it all again. There's been plenty of discussion about it in this thread already.
No I mean tell me how you know what goes through the minds of "the liberals", and how they all think the same. You seem to think facts are merely propaganda when they go against your "team".
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On August 31 2012 13:34 Roe wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 13:31 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:25 Roe wrote:On August 31 2012 13:20 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:18 Adreme wrote:On August 31 2012 13:16 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end. Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech. Its kind of weird when you qutoation mark facts as though facts are evil and you shoudl be able to accuse someone of whatever you want. Fact checking implies truth seeking. That is not what the liberals are doing, so I put it in quotes. Tell me more. I'm too tired to go through it all again. There's been plenty of discussion about it in this thread already. No I mean tell me how you know what goes through the minds of "the liberals", and how they all think the same. You seem to think facts are merely propaganda when they go against your "team".
If you say so.
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On August 31 2012 13:41 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 13:34 Roe wrote:On August 31 2012 13:31 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:25 Roe wrote:On August 31 2012 13:20 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:18 Adreme wrote:On August 31 2012 13:16 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end. Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech. Its kind of weird when you qutoation mark facts as though facts are evil and you shoudl be able to accuse someone of whatever you want. Fact checking implies truth seeking. That is not what the liberals are doing, so I put it in quotes. Tell me more. I'm too tired to go through it all again. There's been plenty of discussion about it in this thread already. No I mean tell me how you know what goes through the minds of "the liberals", and how they all think the same. You seem to think facts are merely propaganda when they go against your "team". If you say so.
Just for clarification, you truly believe this? If you "Fact Check" speeches from the DNC, I am going to call you out for "conservative bias" and say that you are not "truth seeking" but being biased since the speeches put the hurt on the Romney/Ryan ticket.
It's great that all this liberal and conservative bias keeps us from ever actually getting down to the "facts" and actual policies.
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On August 31 2012 13:50 BlueBird. wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 13:41 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:34 Roe wrote:On August 31 2012 13:31 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:25 Roe wrote:On August 31 2012 13:20 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:18 Adreme wrote:On August 31 2012 13:16 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end. Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech. Its kind of weird when you qutoation mark facts as though facts are evil and you shoudl be able to accuse someone of whatever you want. Fact checking implies truth seeking. That is not what the liberals are doing, so I put it in quotes. Tell me more. I'm too tired to go through it all again. There's been plenty of discussion about it in this thread already. No I mean tell me how you know what goes through the minds of "the liberals", and how they all think the same. You seem to think facts are merely propaganda when they go against your "team". If you say so. Just for clarification, you truly believe this? If you "Fact Check" speeches from the DNC, I am going to call you out for "conservative bias" and say that you are not "truth seeking" but being biased since the speeches put the hurt on the Romney/Ryan ticket. It's great that all this liberal and conservative bias keeps us from ever actually getting down to the "facts" and actual policies.
'fact check' implies an unbiased look at whether or not what he said was actually truthful. While Ryan's speach was definitely misleading, the fact checkers are also misleading which is the main complaint.
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United States13896 Posts
Poor Rubio killed all the momentum he built up leading into Romney's speech when he said "more government over more freedom." I couldn't believe my ears. Seemed like he gave a pretty decent speech, but that left everything on a flat note. Romney came out to a crowd that seemed confused (and understandably so) and not quite as enthusiastic as would have been expected. Not until Romney got on the stage did the the life come back into the building.
Romney's speech was definitely most effective when talking about his family, which made his promise that he would strive to make things better for American families more poignant than anything else I thought. Most of the rest was just the same re-hashed stuff wrapped up in a different package, the feel good stuff, etc. Policy talk was almost an afterthought, but that was never what this speech was about. Because of that there was a lot to be desired for me as I would have preferred policy to the normal spiel. But this is politics and most importantly people need to like the person before they even think about policy so oh well.
I'm looking forward to the debates. Oddly it seemed like Ryan shined more last night than Romney did today, but like I said I think a lot of that had to do with the catastrophe that occurred before Romney even hit the floor. So it goes.
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![[image loading]](http://media.economist.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/full-width/images/print-edition/20120901_FBC878.png)
Source
I'd be a bit more negative on the GM / Chrysler bailouts, but overall a pretty fair report card IMO.
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On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down.
I do agree that the Republicans didn't do too badly, they managed to keep the Ron Paul quasi-fiasco down to a dull roar and a few opinion columns' worth of coverage, and there weren't any speeches which just sort of seemed off key except poor Clint. What I do see coming is probably a refutation of Paul Ryan's speech, which I think has sort of been tossed up for the Democrats to try and slam dunk by the national media, many of whom have raised questions about. As a political speech, it was great - the base doesn't care about how the other side is going to try to pick apart your argument, and I'd argue that conventions are mainly for the base now.
What makes me curious, however, is your mention of "presenting something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing Republicans down." Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't an enormous theme of this convention attacks on Obama? They devoted virtually an entire day to "You didn't build that" and spent massive amounts of time attacking Obama. Even Romney, whose strength is definitely not personally launching attacks (his 'anger' felt pretty... insincere during his speech) felt compelled to try a few out.
As a whole, however, Republicans have succeeded in poisoning virtually all of the Democrats' major achievements, made mostly possible by how liberalism as a whole has failed to defend their governing philosophy for almost a generation. I think Obamacare is a major achievement, having a stimulus was much better than no stimulus, and there should be a focus on closing the wealth inequality gap and higher marginal tax rates on earnings over $250,000 is not class warfare and we've done just fine in the past when rates were double that. Rather, I suspect that Obama will lean on the (very true) willful Republican obstructionism in Congress. High-ranking Republicans and conservative personalities are pretty much on the record in saying they want Obama to fail more than they actually want to pass anything of their own. Congress, for that matter, is less popular as an institution than the Communist Party.
I'm also pretty sure that people who were denied health coverage under the old system and who now have it thanks to Obamacare will feature prominently, as will some more Bain sob stories.
I'd be a bit more negative on the GM / Chrysler bailouts, but overall a pretty fair report card IMO.
I'm curious why conservatives have such hate for mass transit, as evinced in the 'F' grade due to the high-speed rail proposals. The Shinkansen (Japan's famous bullet train) is absolutely amazing and I have no idea why it's a political anathema to conservatives. Granted, my personal view is shaped by where I live and how vital train travel is to me, but it saddens me that there's nothing even remotely close back at home - coming from one of the few people who actually rode AMTRAK on a regular basis.
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On August 31 2012 13:31 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 13:25 Roe wrote:On August 31 2012 13:20 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:18 Adreme wrote:On August 31 2012 13:16 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end. Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech. Its kind of weird when you qutoation mark facts as though facts are evil and you shoudl be able to accuse someone of whatever you want. Fact checking implies truth seeking. That is not what the liberals are doing, so I put it in quotes. Tell me more. I'm too tired to go through it all again. There's been plenty of discussion about it in this thread already.
Paul Ryan knowingly lied, even about things which he had personal experience with. It's been proven numerous times in this thread, through very legitimate sources. Deal with it.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-08-30/paul-ryan-s-hypocritical-attack-on-barack-obama.html
Ryan criticized Obama for ignoring his own debt commission. “They came back with an urgent report. He thanked them, sent them on their way, and then did exactly nothing.” That urgent report? Technically, it wasn’t a report from the debt commission. Too many of its members dissented from the report for it to be adopted as the commission’s official report. One of those dissenters was Paul Ryan.
I swear, this is the face of modern conservatism that's evolved over the past few elections: misrepresenting anything and everything for the sake of winning, with the expectation that we should all just see it as good fun, like you do. And when someone acknowledges what you're doing, just accuse them of the very thing which you're guilty of, so as to make everything one dichotomy of accusations. Nothing is correct or incorrect, just Democrat and Republican. A battle of feigned certitude. "Fact checkers" is another term of derision now, I suppose. Brilliant.
We see how much Republicans sincerely enjoy this. Taking an Obama quote out of context and parading it as your number-one slogan as the centerpiece of your convention. How many Republicans cheered at that quote, "I built that", knowing it's just a mockery of something that's been twisted and taken completely out of context? I will honestly thank god when all this fails to impress the majority of U.S. voters. It will reaffirm my faith in humanity.
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On August 31 2012 14:29 Leporello wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 13:31 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:25 Roe wrote:On August 31 2012 13:20 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:18 Adreme wrote:On August 31 2012 13:16 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end. Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech. Its kind of weird when you qutoation mark facts as though facts are evil and you shoudl be able to accuse someone of whatever you want. Fact checking implies truth seeking. That is not what the liberals are doing, so I put it in quotes. Tell me more. I'm too tired to go through it all again. There's been plenty of discussion about it in this thread already. Paul Ryan knowingly lied, even about things which he had personal experience with. It's been proven numerous times in this thread, through very legitimate sources. Deal with it. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-08-30/paul-ryan-s-hypocritical-attack-on-barack-obama.htmlShow nested quote +Ryan criticized Obama for ignoring his own debt commission. “They came back with an urgent report. He thanked them, sent them on their way, and then did exactly nothing.” That urgent report? Technically, it wasn’t a report from the debt commission. Too many of its members dissented from the report for it to be adopted as the commission’s official report. One of those dissenters was Paul Ryan. I swear, this is the face of modern conservatism that's evolved over the past few elections: misrepresenting anything and everything for the sake of winning, with the expectation that we should all just see it as good fun, like you do. And when someone acknowledges what you're doing, just accuse them of the very thing which you're guilty of, so as to make everything one dichotomy of accusations. Nothing is correct or incorrect, just Democrat and Republican. We see how much Republicans sincerely enjoy this. Taking an Obama quote out of context and parading it as your number-one slogan as the centerpiece of your convention. How many Republicans cheered at that quote, "I built that", knowing it's just a mockery of something that's been twisted and taken completely out of context? I will honestly thank god when all this fails to impress the majority of U.S. voters. It will reaffirm my faith in humanity.
Reading through that article, he didn't really lie about anything. Just left out key details about his involvement with the plans mentioned, hence the title being 'Paul Ryan's hypocritical Attacks' and not 'Paul Ryan's False Attacks'. Calling him a liar and calling him a hypocrit is a huge difference.
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On August 31 2012 13:20 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 13:18 Adreme wrote:On August 31 2012 13:16 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end. Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech. Its kind of weird when you qutoation mark facts as though facts are evil and you shoudl be able to accuse someone of whatever you want. Fact checking implies truth seeking. That is not what the liberals are doing, so I put it in quotes.
There's plenty of liberal-haters like me who recognize that Paul Ryan made a bunch of objectively false claims even aside from general prevarication.
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On August 31 2012 14:36 Phant wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 14:29 Leporello wrote:On August 31 2012 13:31 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:25 Roe wrote:On August 31 2012 13:20 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:18 Adreme wrote:On August 31 2012 13:16 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end. Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech. Its kind of weird when you qutoation mark facts as though facts are evil and you shoudl be able to accuse someone of whatever you want. Fact checking implies truth seeking. That is not what the liberals are doing, so I put it in quotes. Tell me more. I'm too tired to go through it all again. There's been plenty of discussion about it in this thread already. Paul Ryan knowingly lied, even about things which he had personal experience with. It's been proven numerous times in this thread, through very legitimate sources. Deal with it. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-08-30/paul-ryan-s-hypocritical-attack-on-barack-obama.htmlRyan criticized Obama for ignoring his own debt commission. “They came back with an urgent report. He thanked them, sent them on their way, and then did exactly nothing.” That urgent report? Technically, it wasn’t a report from the debt commission. Too many of its members dissented from the report for it to be adopted as the commission’s official report. One of those dissenters was Paul Ryan. I swear, this is the face of modern conservatism that's evolved over the past few elections: misrepresenting anything and everything for the sake of winning, with the expectation that we should all just see it as good fun, like you do. And when someone acknowledges what you're doing, just accuse them of the very thing which you're guilty of, so as to make everything one dichotomy of accusations. Nothing is correct or incorrect, just Democrat and Republican. We see how much Republicans sincerely enjoy this. Taking an Obama quote out of context and parading it as your number-one slogan as the centerpiece of your convention. How many Republicans cheered at that quote, "I built that", knowing it's just a mockery of something that's been twisted and taken completely out of context? I will honestly thank god when all this fails to impress the majority of U.S. voters. It will reaffirm my faith in humanity. Reading through that article, he didn't really lie about anything. Just left out key details about his involvement with the plans mentioned, hence the title being 'Paul Ryan's hypocritical Attacks' and not 'Paul Ryan's False Attacks'. Calling him a liar and calling him a hypocrit is a huge difference.
The report wasn't from the Debt Commission -- that's a lie. He says "they" gave it to him, referring to the Debt Commission, detaching himself from something he was a part of -- that's a lie. He should have said "we" gave it to him.
But they didn't. The Debt Commission didn't adopt that report, as Paul Ryan himself vetoed it.
Everything about it is a lie.
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On August 31 2012 14:29 Leporello wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 13:31 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:25 Roe wrote:On August 31 2012 13:20 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:18 Adreme wrote:On August 31 2012 13:16 xDaunt wrote:On August 31 2012 13:13 Defacer wrote:On August 31 2012 13:06 xDaunt wrote:
All in all, it was a good convention for Romney and the republicans. Some of the speeches were exemplary, particularly those given by Paul Ryan, Condi Rice, and Ann Romney. I think the case was made that needed to be made. Now, Romney is free to dump his $200 million war chest into the election and really start the national campaign. We will see how it goes.
I'm interested in seeing what the democrats do. I'm expecting 1) a celebration of feminism, and 2) more arguments about the failed republican policies of the past. I'm curious as to how democrats are going to present their accomplishments of the past four years. They are going to have to present something demonstrably positive rather than just tearing republicans down. Holy shit ... we actually agree! Oh wait, I actually thought Paul Ryan was meh. Rubio was strong, and a natural speaker. And Romney did as great job humanizing himself, even though he leaned on the same old talking points at the end. Rubio spoke in nice platitudes. Ryan drew blood and really hurt Obama. That is why liberals are bending over backwards to "fact check" his speech. Its kind of weird when you qutoation mark facts as though facts are evil and you shoudl be able to accuse someone of whatever you want. Fact checking implies truth seeking. That is not what the liberals are doing, so I put it in quotes. Tell me more. I'm too tired to go through it all again. There's been plenty of discussion about it in this thread already. Paul Ryan knowingly lied, even about things which he had personal experience with. It's been proven numerous times in this thread, through very legitimate sources. Deal with it. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-08-30/paul-ryan-s-hypocritical-attack-on-barack-obama.htmlShow nested quote +Ryan criticized Obama for ignoring his own debt commission. “They came back with an urgent report. He thanked them, sent them on their way, and then did exactly nothing.” That urgent report? Technically, it wasn’t a report from the debt commission. Too many of its members dissented from the report for it to be adopted as the commission’s official report. One of those dissenters was Paul Ryan. I swear, this is the face of modern conservatism that's evolved over the past few elections: misrepresenting anything and everything for the sake of winning, with the expectation that we should all just see it as good fun, like you do. And when someone acknowledges what you're doing, just accuse them of the very thing which you're guilty of, so as to make everything one dichotomy of accusations. Nothing is correct or incorrect, just Democrat and Republican. A battle of feigned certitude. "Fact checkers" is another term of derision now, I suppose. Brilliant. We see how much Republicans sincerely enjoy this. Taking an Obama quote out of context and parading it as your number-one slogan as the centerpiece of your convention. How many Republicans cheered at that quote, "I built that", knowing it's just a mockery of something that's been twisted and taken completely out of context? I will honestly thank god when all this fails to impress the majority of U.S. voters. It will reaffirm my faith in humanity.
Here's a news flash: Ryan didn't lie with regards to his comments about the debt commission. I'll let you ponder why and will explain tomorrow if you fail to figure it out.
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Fact checking implies truth seeking. That is not what the liberals are doing, so I put it in quotes.
It's called opposition research. Seek to discredit the points your opponent makes not from a regard for the facts, but to combat and damage the speaker. Every hard hitting speech, given by a Republican or any conservative figure, causes a big rush for a story to find something ANYTHING wrong about it just to diminish its impact, give talking points to the political TV news shows. If you follow American mainstream media publications for long enough, and with an open mind, it just makes you laugh after a while. We went into this a few pages back so I won't rehash it all now.
CNN begrudgingly gave it some truth.
Related: NYT Public Editor, doing his job, takes some fire for it
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EPT
