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Zinn usually in criminal justice around the world the idea is taken that you are innocent of something unless you can by the presentation of evidence, be judged be to guilty.
I felt the need to emphasise this because "how do you know, mayb he has molested a child" is one of the more idiotic things I've read in this thread, and considering this thread is full of some of the most emotionally charged, non rational, ignorance infused condemnation and contempt believe me thats not a good thing.
The person your quoting is stating he doesnt believe the person deserves punishment because he hasn't harmed anyone.
If your main argument is "well he might have" well on that logic so might you...
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On November 06 2011 15:03 Zinnwaldite wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2011 14:58 Carush wrote:On November 06 2011 14:51 MrDudeMan wrote:On November 06 2011 14:20 yarkO wrote:
A 'little fetish' doesn't mean shit to me. If you knowingly accessed child porn, then your brain deserves to be scrambled on the sidewalk under my boots. That is so beyond fucked up that I can't even think of rational words to describe it.
Just because he didn't molest a kid doesn't mean he deserves to walk around. I wouldn't want people like that walking the streets, undressing my kids with their perverted eyes.
But I will concede that it is fucked up to some degree I can't comprehend that his punishment would have been lighter had he actually touched someone. Both are equal crimes to me. He may not have touched the children in those photos/videos, but SOMEBODY did and he enjoyed it.
Fuck this guy and fuck every guy like him. Right up the ass with a barbed stick.
Multiple times. You're fucked up. Kind of ridiculous that the punishment is this severe. The guy has a fucked up fetish, who cares. I wonder if the people claiming he deserves the sentence criticize crazy catholics for having god hates fags signs. this these people didn't choose to have these fucked up fetushes they just got unlucky a guy like this doesn't deserve punishment imo he didn't touch any kids he kept it to himself and we give him life i'm so fucking glad i'm into legs and ass and not children How can you know? Maybe he has molested a child,, maybe he got away with it.. By keeping his fetish to himself instead of trying to combat it he shows a complete disregard for children's safety and he needs to be punished. Life might be very harsh,, too harsh some would say. I can't judge wheter it is or not because the guy is to me worth less than todays breakfeast, just like many other nameless sacks of flesh out there. It might be better if he gets marked as a pedophile so that people will know he's out there and know to keep their guard up around him.
He's innocent until proven guilty. You're being stupidly judgmental and you're making assumptions based on one quality of a person.
He's been proven guilty of possession of child pornography, not of molesting or assaulting a child.
Here's the thing...you really aren't in an immediate position to be so condescending. The fact of the matter is, as others have written, sexual fetishes tend to not be things within our control. He indulged in his apparent fetish for underage children, and he should be punished for it, yes. However, giving him life in prison instead of a chance to reform when he didn't directly endanger or assault a child is dumb.
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First-degree murderers is the same as looking at pictures?
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This is freaking...I don't even know how to express my rage.
LIFE?
He didn't DO anything. He just downloaded pictures, as OP said probably didn't even pay for them.
This is RIDICULOUS. When you have IRL rapists and murderers getting less, that's simply bullshit.
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United States1618 Posts
The article says it will be appealed, of course.
This judge... just makes me think. You know how you always get annoyed at the stupidity and irrationality of certain people, and end up thinking you are better than some people? These feeling can be emotional and are often tied to "the moment" of things, but nevertheless... I think we can safely say that the average TL user is a more rational human being than this judge.
I really wish someone knew this judge's name so the media could start investigating the mind of a madman. The power of a judge is great. The fact that one would ponder in his brain about appropriate punishments for this... knowing all of the facts (no previous offenses, didn't pay, didn't molest, etc) and give life in prison - is unacceptable for a judge. This man cannot have a rational mind, and needs to be investigated. I don't care if you want to "send a message" or even if you are certain it will be appealed, you do not make a ruling like this. The hyperbole of it is mind-staggering. I just can't get over how such a twisted person can be a judge and have such power over the life of another human.
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On November 06 2011 15:07 scrdmnttr wrote:
In response to the OP, it is an eye for an eye.
You think that these children that are exposed to this sort of suffering and abuse can completely recover and live normal lives? No - their lives are ruined, and now, so is his life. First of all, even if he were the one who abused these children, I think it's hard to make a comparison like the one you're trying to. Would I prefer to have been sexually abused as a child or to spend the rest of my life in prison? Of course that would be a horrible choice to have to make, but if I had to make it, I I'd choose the former.
In any case, he's not the one who caused these children's abuse, and any contribution that he may have made to it is miniscule compared to his punishment. Go ahead and agree with the verdict if you like, but I don't see how you can honestly call it "an eye for an eye".
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On November 06 2011 15:07 scrdmnttr wrote:
In response to the OP, it is an eye for an eye.
You think that these children that are exposed to this sort of suffering and abuse can completely recover and live normal lives? No - their lives are ruined, and now, so is his life.
Truthfully, the state was probably making a political statement, simply warning other pedophiles.
Nonetheless, to me, being in any way involved in child pornography is unforgivable, and his sentence was just.
He isn't involved in the shooting. He isn't involved in the raping. He likely (according to OP) isn't paying.
He is right-clicking, saving, and fapping.
You've done it too, just not to these particular bitmap distributions.
How the fuck is that "eye for an eye"?
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This is a sad story, he just watch and get life sentence.
He didn't even do it.
At the end of the day, judge is still a normal human being,
decision made by people with authority is not always right.
Then the commoners have to suck thumb  .
Sad life sometimes
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How the hell did this man become a judge? The average bum on the street probably has a better moral compass than the guy ruling over god knows how many crimes a year.
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On November 06 2011 15:07 PH wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2011 14:48 Kamais_Ookin wrote:I am deeply sad and embarrassed about the justice system of U.S. A more severe injustice has occurred and it's not the viewing of CP, it's the ridiculous life-time jail with no chance of parole. Absolutely sickening how more heinous crimes get less duration of punishment, Back in the day many, many people thought being gay is horrible but now people are more respectable towards it. I hope one day pedophiles will be viewed the same way. Pedophile is the same thing as being gay, you can't change it so why is only one of them being condemned? Of course, I'm not talking about the act of molesting the child but rather the viewing of a realistic portrayal of it. For example: On November 06 2011 14:05 Hiroruby wrote:
Yes, we can all agree that child exploitation is wrong. What I can't understand, is the unconditional condemnation of people aroused by it. Think for a moment with me. Think (not to hard mind you!) about whatever it is that gets you aroused. Did you ever in your life make a concious decision to be turned on by that? ( cumshots, anal, big breasts, whatever).
I think in most cases, the answer is no. You were attracted to it, and you always have been, to some extent. An obvious example here are gay people, they don't make a choice to become aroused by other men or women. They simply do. Now please, take that principle and apply it to child porn. These people shouldn't be chemically castrated, exiled, or even "treated", whatever that means, seeing as you can't get rid of an innate desire.
In my opinion there should just be an open market of lolicon hentai for those people. Call me crazy, but I think satisfying their demands in a way that harms absolutely no one, and hell, will even provide employment, can't be a bad thing. Artists are pretty ingenious. Make movies that are realistic, make shit that looks appealing. If it is good, then demand for the "real" product will be negated among people willing to control their desires. These are people you don't want to lock up, because they can keep their shit together.
No, this won't stop the other people from attacking real children. Nothing can, much like you can't stop people from murdering others once they get the idea. What it will do is sate the desires of otherwise contributing members of society, who just have an obtuse fetish.
In summary: Give an outlet for pedophiles who don't want to break the law. Don't look down on them because they have urges, look down on people who actually harm others with those urges. Prison is for people who damage the world, not people who want ot have an orgasm quickly so they can get back to browsing reddit, go to work, or read a book.
Pedophilia in and of itself isn't bad when you put it that way, sure. But in NO way should it ever be viewed the same way as homosexuality is now. It should not ever be encouraged in any way. You're going way too far off the opposite end. Why should the fetish of underage children be punished but not of gay? I understand that if you stick your cock in a little girls ass you deserve to be locked away for a long time but I simply can't understand why viewing some CP can induce jail time let alone life in prison. Anyone with a fetish of big tits or anal etc etc can watch all the porn they want but pedo's can't watch cp, where is the freedom? I don't agree with the bs arguement of watching = supporting. First of all he's not even paying for the damn thing and whether he watches or not it's still going to be uploaded. Does watching a violent horror movie with a axe smashed between the eyes mean you support murder? A rape scene!?
User was temp banned for this post.
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this is fucking ridiculous
in what world is this even allowed
did the guy even have a lawyer
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The sentencing doesn't upset me, but what does upset me is that actual child molesters who really physically rape children get much less of a sentence than this. Some facts are most definitely left out of this article....And I'd kind of like to know what they are.
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On November 06 2011 15:18 Kamais_Ookin wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2011 15:07 PH wrote:On November 06 2011 14:48 Kamais_Ookin wrote:I am deeply sad and embarrassed about the justice system of U.S. A more severe injustice has occurred and it's not the viewing of CP, it's the ridiculous life-time jail with no chance of parole. Absolutely sickening how more heinous crimes get less duration of punishment, Back in the day many, many people thought being gay is horrible but now people are more respectable towards it. I hope one day pedophiles will be viewed the same way. Pedophile is the same thing as being gay, you can't change it so why is only one of them being condemned? Of course, I'm not talking about the act of molesting the child but rather the viewing of a realistic portrayal of it. For example: On November 06 2011 14:05 Hiroruby wrote:
Yes, we can all agree that child exploitation is wrong. What I can't understand, is the unconditional condemnation of people aroused by it. Think for a moment with me. Think (not to hard mind you!) about whatever it is that gets you aroused. Did you ever in your life make a concious decision to be turned on by that? ( cumshots, anal, big breasts, whatever).
I think in most cases, the answer is no. You were attracted to it, and you always have been, to some extent. An obvious example here are gay people, they don't make a choice to become aroused by other men or women. They simply do. Now please, take that principle and apply it to child porn. These people shouldn't be chemically castrated, exiled, or even "treated", whatever that means, seeing as you can't get rid of an innate desire.
In my opinion there should just be an open market of lolicon hentai for those people. Call me crazy, but I think satisfying their demands in a way that harms absolutely no one, and hell, will even provide employment, can't be a bad thing. Artists are pretty ingenious. Make movies that are realistic, make shit that looks appealing. If it is good, then demand for the "real" product will be negated among people willing to control their desires. These are people you don't want to lock up, because they can keep their shit together.
No, this won't stop the other people from attacking real children. Nothing can, much like you can't stop people from murdering others once they get the idea. What it will do is sate the desires of otherwise contributing members of society, who just have an obtuse fetish.
In summary: Give an outlet for pedophiles who don't want to break the law. Don't look down on them because they have urges, look down on people who actually harm others with those urges. Prison is for people who damage the world, not people who want ot have an orgasm quickly so they can get back to browsing reddit, go to work, or read a book.
Pedophilia in and of itself isn't bad when you put it that way, sure. But in NO way should it ever be viewed the same way as homosexuality is now. It should not ever be encouraged in any way. You're going way too far off the opposite end. Why should the fetish of underage children be punished but not of gay? I understand that if you stick your cock in a little girls ass you deserve to be locked away for a long time but I simply can't understand why viewing some CP can induce jail time let alone life in prison. Anyone with a fetish of big tits or anal etc etc can watch all the porn they want but pedo's can't watch cp, where is the freedom? I don't agree with the bs arguement of watching = supporting. First of all he's not even paying for the damn thing and whether he watches or not it's still going to be uploaded. Does watching a violent horror movie with a axe smashed between the eyes mean you support murder? A rape scene!?
I'm just going to assume you're trolling....You don't really seem to know what you're talking about, and you don't make any sense. Someone being murdered with an axe in a movie isn't real...You do know this, don't you?
However, a child being raped/molested and video taped or having photographs taken of them and distributed online IS real. You see, there happens to be a difference between reality, and fiction. Movies are fiction, and child porn is very much a part of reality. And regardless of whether he is paying for it or not, he IS, in fact, supporting it by downloading it.
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United States1618 Posts
But there are people that watched videos of murders. Aren't they supporting murders by doing so?
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On November 06 2011 15:23 RoosterSamurai wrote:
And regardless of whether he is paying for it or not, he IS, in fact, supporting it by downloading it.
Wouldn't this depend on whether or not he paid for the child pornography? If it was mirrored or 4chaned, he wasn't even paying for ads on CP sites, let alone content.
I'm fairly certain that if you don't pay for something and get it anyways, you actually harm the distributors. At least, the law has ruled like that for...pretty much anything in industry.
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seriously? I say 9 months tops for this guy, anything more is a joke.
there has to be something else? how could a guy get a life sentence for that?
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On November 06 2011 15:23 RoosterSamurai wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2011 15:18 Kamais_Ookin wrote:On November 06 2011 15:07 PH wrote:On November 06 2011 14:48 Kamais_Ookin wrote:I am deeply sad and embarrassed about the justice system of U.S. A more severe injustice has occurred and it's not the viewing of CP, it's the ridiculous life-time jail with no chance of parole. Absolutely sickening how more heinous crimes get less duration of punishment, Back in the day many, many people thought being gay is horrible but now people are more respectable towards it. I hope one day pedophiles will be viewed the same way. Pedophile is the same thing as being gay, you can't change it so why is only one of them being condemned? Of course, I'm not talking about the act of molesting the child but rather the viewing of a realistic portrayal of it. For example: On November 06 2011 14:05 Hiroruby wrote:
Yes, we can all agree that child exploitation is wrong. What I can't understand, is the unconditional condemnation of people aroused by it. Think for a moment with me. Think (not to hard mind you!) about whatever it is that gets you aroused. Did you ever in your life make a concious decision to be turned on by that? ( cumshots, anal, big breasts, whatever).
I think in most cases, the answer is no. You were attracted to it, and you always have been, to some extent. An obvious example here are gay people, they don't make a choice to become aroused by other men or women. They simply do. Now please, take that principle and apply it to child porn. These people shouldn't be chemically castrated, exiled, or even "treated", whatever that means, seeing as you can't get rid of an innate desire.
In my opinion there should just be an open market of lolicon hentai for those people. Call me crazy, but I think satisfying their demands in a way that harms absolutely no one, and hell, will even provide employment, can't be a bad thing. Artists are pretty ingenious. Make movies that are realistic, make shit that looks appealing. If it is good, then demand for the "real" product will be negated among people willing to control their desires. These are people you don't want to lock up, because they can keep their shit together.
No, this won't stop the other people from attacking real children. Nothing can, much like you can't stop people from murdering others once they get the idea. What it will do is sate the desires of otherwise contributing members of society, who just have an obtuse fetish.
In summary: Give an outlet for pedophiles who don't want to break the law. Don't look down on them because they have urges, look down on people who actually harm others with those urges. Prison is for people who damage the world, not people who want ot have an orgasm quickly so they can get back to browsing reddit, go to work, or read a book.
Pedophilia in and of itself isn't bad when you put it that way, sure. But in NO way should it ever be viewed the same way as homosexuality is now. It should not ever be encouraged in any way. You're going way too far off the opposite end. Why should the fetish of underage children be punished but not of gay? I understand that if you stick your cock in a little girls ass you deserve to be locked away for a long time but I simply can't understand why viewing some CP can induce jail time let alone life in prison. Anyone with a fetish of big tits or anal etc etc can watch all the porn they want but pedo's can't watch cp, where is the freedom? I don't agree with the bs arguement of watching = supporting. First of all he's not even paying for the damn thing and whether he watches or not it's still going to be uploaded. Does watching a violent horror movie with a axe smashed between the eyes mean you support murder? A rape scene!? I'm just going to assume you're trolling....You don't really seem to know what you're talking about, and you don't make any sense. Someone being murdered with an axe in a movie isn't real...You do know this, don't you? However, a child being raped/molested and video taped or having photographs taken of them and distributed online IS real. You see, there happens to be a difference between reality, and fiction. Movies are fiction, and child porn is very much a part of reality. And regardless of whether he is paying for it or not, he IS, in fact, supporting it by downloading it. First of all, download does not = support otherwise there would be no such thing as piracy, paying = support. Regarding my examples, it doesn't matter if it's fictious or not. The point is, are you going to act out on what you see on your monitor? If pedo's can't watch their CP then guess what, they're probably going to be forced to step it up to the next level and nobody wants that.
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Um - there is absolutely no way that this guy should receive a life sentence for this.
But if you think he shouldn't be punished, you're a fucking idiot. Period. End of discussion. It is not a valid opinion to hold that someone possessing child pornography should not be punished. Get the fuck off our forum you pathetic human beings.
User was temp banned for this post.
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On November 06 2011 15:10 PH wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2011 15:03 Zinnwaldite wrote:On November 06 2011 14:58 Carush wrote:On November 06 2011 14:51 MrDudeMan wrote:On November 06 2011 14:20 yarkO wrote:
A 'little fetish' doesn't mean shit to me. If you knowingly accessed child porn, then your brain deserves to be scrambled on the sidewalk under my boots. That is so beyond fucked up that I can't even think of rational words to describe it.
Just because he didn't molest a kid doesn't mean he deserves to walk around. I wouldn't want people like that walking the streets, undressing my kids with their perverted eyes.
But I will concede that it is fucked up to some degree I can't comprehend that his punishment would have been lighter had he actually touched someone. Both are equal crimes to me. He may not have touched the children in those photos/videos, but SOMEBODY did and he enjoyed it.
Fuck this guy and fuck every guy like him. Right up the ass with a barbed stick.
Multiple times. You're fucked up. Kind of ridiculous that the punishment is this severe. The guy has a fucked up fetish, who cares. I wonder if the people claiming he deserves the sentence criticize crazy catholics for having god hates fags signs. this these people didn't choose to have these fucked up fetushes they just got unlucky a guy like this doesn't deserve punishment imo he didn't touch any kids he kept it to himself and we give him life i'm so fucking glad i'm into legs and ass and not children How can you know? Maybe he has molested a child,, maybe he got away with it.. By keeping his fetish to himself instead of trying to combat it he shows a complete disregard for children's safety and he needs to be punished. Life might be very harsh,, too harsh some would say. I can't judge wheter it is or not because the guy is to me worth less than todays breakfeast, just like many other nameless sacks of flesh out there. It might be better if he gets marked as a pedophile so that people will know he's out there and know to keep their guard up around him. He's innocent until proven guilty. You're being stupidly judgmental and you're making assumptions based on one quality of a person. He's been proven guilty of possession of child pornography, not of molesting or assaulting a child. Here's the thing...you really aren't in an immediate position to be so condescending. The fact of the matter is, as others have written, sexual fetishes tend to not be things within our control. He indulged in his apparent fetish for underage children, and he should be punished for it, yes. However, giving him life in prison instead of a chance to reform when he didn't directly endanger or assault a child is dumb.
I didnt judge him, i said i can't. But something needs to be done in these cases, but yes, life might be too harsh(again i can't judge wheter it is or not) . He should get help, he should've gotten help a long time ago, instead of partially embracing this shit. He has taken a huge shit on so many people by watching and taking pleasure in seeing children getting destroyed, and he needs to own up to that.
I never said he should get life, or that life is the right punishment. Just saying that he should be punished becase he made the choice of enjoying what he is, when that means surrendering to something that might lead to him molesting children.
Forced counceling and surveillance is something i think would be fitting, even though that's not even a punishment. Some com-service on top of it maybe.
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EPT
