On October 22 2011 02:01 Josri wrote: Fucking finally, you had no business there
well no thats all they had there which is what the problem is.
You do realize that the war in Iraq, while not 100% about finding WMD, was for more than "business" and "oil" right? If it was about oil we sure as hell wouldn't be sitting on $3+ oil prices. The war with Iraq technically never ended from when it was started in the 1990s when Iraq invaded Kuwait and we had to go in to not only kick Saddam Hussein out of Kuwait but also to keep the Saudi's, our allies, from getting taken over by a crazy dictator. The Gulf War never actually solved the problem that was Saddam Hussein since the coalition, mostly made up of the US, left before taking over Baghdad and chose to allow Saddam Hussein to remain in power instead of pushing for his capture. They figured he would get overthrown but instead he cracked down hard and stayed in power.
The Iraq war about putting an end to a problem that was never finished (Saddam) while using the vast political and social capita that was afforded to the Bush Administration due to the 9/11 attacks. Did they lie to everyone for the real reason we went to Iraq? Mostly yes. Did they go for mainly monetary reasons? No.
Ohhh, the poor saudis. Even Saddam looks like a "bleeding heart" in comparison to the saudi monarchy.
On October 22 2011 03:09 HwangjaeTerran wrote: I mean you have troops in Iraq and Afghanistan, there's talks of "the threat of Iran" and then you pull out. In starcraft terms:why break a solid contain.
Who needs a contain when troops can be deployed in any location on the globe within one day, leave alone missile/bomb/nuclear strikes?
On October 22 2011 02:01 Josri wrote: Fucking finally, you had no business there
well no thats all they had there which is what the problem is.
You do realize that the war in Iraq, while not 100% about finding WMD, was for more than "business" and "oil" right? If it was about oil we sure as hell wouldn't be sitting on $3+ oil prices. The war with Iraq technically never ended from when it was started in the 1990s when Iraq invaded Kuwait and we had to go in to not only kick Saddam Hussein out of Kuwait but also to keep the Saudi's, our allies, from getting taken over by a crazy dictator. The Gulf War never actually solved the problem that was Saddam Hussein since the coalition, mostly made up of the US, left before taking over Baghdad and chose to allow Saddam Hussein to remain in power instead of pushing for his capture. They figured he would get overthrown but instead he cracked down hard and stayed in power.
The Iraq war about putting an end to a problem that was never finished (Saddam) while using the vast political and social capita that was afforded to the Bush Administration due to the 9/11 attacks. Did they lie to everyone for the real reason we went to Iraq? Mostly yes. Did they go for mainly monetary reasons? No.
Ohhh, the poor saudis. Even Saddam looks like a "bleeding heart" in comparison to the saudi monarchy.
Saddam propagated the genocide of an estimated 500,000 Kurds. Such a bleeding heart, yeah?
On October 22 2011 03:11 BlackFlag wrote: Ohhh, the poor saudis. Even Saddam looks like a "bleeding heart" in comparison to the saudi monarchy.
..What? Even if you disagree with the Saudi's you must admit that letting Saddam take over not only Kuwait but then also threaten the Saudi oil fields would be a huge problem for the rest of the world. Pretty much everyone was in agreement that the Gulf War was fought for a good cause.
Who was in that coalition? "Australia, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Belgium, Canada, Czechoslovakia, Denmark, Egypt, France, Greece, Honduras, Hungary, Italy, Kuwait, Malaysia, Morocco, Netherlands, New Zealand, Niger, Norway, Oman, Pakistan, Philippines, Poland, Portugal, Qatar, Romania, Saudi Arabia, Senegal, South Korea, Spain, Sweden, Syria, Turkey, United Arab Emirates, United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, and the United States of America.
Germany and Japan provided financial assistance and donated military hardware, but did not send direct military assistance."
I wish we could have rebuilt the country like what happened with the war-ravaged countries after World War 2. I know it's a totally different environment....But think about it, what could Iraq accomplish if it was like post war Germany, Japan, or Italy? Mouz sports Iraq?
Glad this business is over. However, its not over for the Iraqi civilians.
Awesome! My cousin is stationed in Iraq right now and he plays SC2 custom games with me whenever he's offduty! Now we'll be able to lan again like we were in highschool.
On October 22 2011 02:09 AcuWill wrote: Trying to win an election.
This still makes Obama a liar to his base. He ran on the ticket of getting out and outlined how he was going to do it and never once proceeded with what he said.
100% true he has deployed more troops then he has brought home. The men fed us lies since day one
On October 22 2011 02:09 AcuWill wrote: Trying to win an election.
This still makes Obama a liar to his base. He ran on the ticket of getting out and outlined how he was going to do it and never once proceeded with what he said.
100% true he has deployed more troops then he has brought home. The men fed us lies since day one
???
After Bin Laden's death Obama already issued orders to pull back all the troops that were deployed in the surge to Afganistan. Now he's pulling almost everyone out of Iraq. So I don't see how he deployed more troops than he's going to bring home.
And to AcuWill. Yes he made a campaign promise to bring our military people back as quickly as possible but obviously that was made without all the knowledge about the situation on the ground in Iraq and Afghanistan that he gained as soon as he became president. Last time we went into a fight and then left too quickly Bin Laden was the result. Obama made a promise that he'd bring our boys home and now he's done that. It took a while but it's finally done. How is he a liar?
On October 22 2011 03:26 Sanitarium14 wrote: I wish we could have rebuilt the country like what happened with the war-ravaged countries after World War 2. I know it's a totally different environment....But think about it, what could Iraq accomplish if it was like post war Germany, Japan, or Italy? Mouz sports Iraq?
Glad this business is over. However, its not over for the Iraqi civilians.
What a terrible idea. Almost no one thinks the Iraqis were the aggressors, and that's even considering people in the United States. Even the half-built government Iraq has is considered to be a US puppet government by the majority of people outside the United States. Any sort of government we built there would be considered tainted; the more we "helped", the more illegitimate it would be.
Reconstruction of Germany and Japan after the Second World War was under completely different circumstances against countries that everyone agreed were the belligerents. Pretty much the only thing similar is that Germany, Japan, and Iraq were not very nice people, to put it euphemistically. Not that some of the Allies were any better but hey, we won.
It would appear the US is leaving without taking all the oil with them.
Could it be the people that think the entire universe revolves around oil were wrong? No...no that can't be. If we did that we would have to admit we have nearly no understanding of the complex world, we need to be able to reduce complex geo political problems to a single word.
We must hurry to the tin cave, there is no time we have to make up some fantasy scenario where the US is still taking all the oil without actually taking a single drop of oil. Imagine if we don't this, we might have to...say we were wrong...dear god, anything but that.
On October 22 2011 03:46 zalz wrote: Well how strange is this?
It would appear the US is leaving without taking all the oil with them.
Could it be the people that think the entire universe revolves around oil were wrong? No...no that can't be. If we did that we would have to admit we have nearly no understanding of the complex world, we need to be able to reduce complex geo political problems to a single word.
We must hurry to the tin cave, there is no time we have to make up some fantasy scenario where the US is still taking all the oil without actually taking a single drop of oil. Imagine if we don't this, we might have to...say we were wrong...dear god, anything but that.
You thought we meant that the army would go there and physically take barrels of oil back with them? That's not how the world works. You replace the regime that hates you with a regime that likes you. That's how you get oil.
On October 22 2011 03:46 zalz wrote: Well how strange is this?
It would appear the US is leaving without taking all the oil with them.
Could it be the people that think the entire universe revolves around oil were wrong? No...no that can't be. If we did that we would have to admit we have nearly no understanding of the complex world, we need to be able to reduce complex geo political problems to a single word.
We must hurry to the tin cave, there is no time we have to make up some fantasy scenario where the US is still taking all the oil without actually taking a single drop of oil. Imagine if we don't this, we might have to...say we were wrong...dear god, anything but that.
You thought we meant that the army would go there and physically take barrels of oil back with them? That's not how the world works. You replace the regime that hates you with a regime that likes you. That's how you get oil.
One of these days I want to raise an army and take oil too. It sounds fun.
On October 22 2011 03:46 zalz wrote: Well how strange is this?
It would appear the US is leaving without taking all the oil with them.
Could it be the people that think the entire universe revolves around oil were wrong? No...no that can't be. If we did that we would have to admit we have nearly no understanding of the complex world, we need to be able to reduce complex geo political problems to a single word.
We must hurry to the tin cave, there is no time we have to make up some fantasy scenario where the US is still taking all the oil without actually taking a single drop of oil. Imagine if we don't this, we might have to...say we were wrong...dear god, anything but that.
You thought we meant that the army would go there and physically take barrels of oil back with them? That's not how the world works. You replace the regime that hates you with a regime that likes you. That's how you get oil.
Where have we replaced a regime that hates us with a regime that likes us? At most we have an uneasy ally. Like I said, if we really did get "oil" out of this somehow, gas prices would not be shooting out the roof. Republicans would not be complaining about federal restrictions preventing them from drilling for oil wherever they want. "Drill Baby Drill" would not be Palin's campaign chant. So realy, where in all of that did we get oil? The real reason we're still in Iraq till now was because the Bush administration decided to throw out all the lessons we learned in all the previous wars and decided as long as we got rid of the bad leader (Saddam) the rest of the country would celebrate and call us heroes. Then we could just hand over the country to them and leave. Obviously that is not how the world worked. Go read "How Wars End" by Gideon Rose and get yourself some knowledge.
EPT
