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On February 24 2011 16:32 Helios.Star wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 13:58 1tym wrote:On February 24 2011 09:56 Helios.Star wrote:On February 24 2011 08:48 zev318 wrote:damn this would make me wanna go visit detroit On February 24 2011 08:41 Helios.Star wrote:On February 24 2011 07:48 Parnage wrote:
So how could anyone complain about this?
It's 50,000k raised by private means(ie no tax money) to build a statue in a city on presumably private property and all it takes is a city saying "oh okay sure".
Sense when was it okay to tell people what they can and can not do with money they make? It's not the cities money to spend nor is it anyone elses but those who donated for this purpose willingly. No case can be made for misspent taxpayers dollars nor can you tell people what to do with the money they make.
The only reason it's being taken in any manner but "oh neat" is because Detroit can't do it themselves due to misuse of budget, corruption, and rising criminal rates. Not to mention the city is outright de-urbanizing.
I used to live in Michigan. Detroit won't be doomed or saved by a statue but it's nice to see some people care enough to actually try and spruce up the place. Im going to raise $100,000 to buy property and get a 30 ft rainbow colored statue of a violently vomiting toddler giving everybody the finger built right across the street from where you live. Its my money, so you cant tell me I get to do with it. When you build something that affects other people then those in charge do get to say how you spend your money. And I would hardly call a statue of Robocop sprucing up the city. ya man, robocop and vomiting toddler giving everyone the finger, good comparison. A big statue of robocop is exactly like a big middle finger to the city in the eyes of some people if you really think about how the movies portray Detroit, and considering the classic architecture/statues we already have. You know what I used was an extreme example to prove my point, could you really not see that or did you just have to respond to my post? I fail to see the relevance as well. Robocop is a historic icon from the world-wide hit movie who served and protected the citizens of Detroit and eliminated the rampant crime in the city streets. Sure the movie may have over-exaggerated about the city crime scene, but all hollywood movies are like that for dramatic effect. Who's gullible enough to believe everything they see on the movies? Robocop is cool if nothing else. Who's more aknowledged better world-wide than Robocop from Detroit? Tim Allen? How is it exactly a big middle finger to the city? It's not like it's going to be displayed with the classic architecture/statues side to side. Should the city only have classic or artistic statues? What you're saying is like saying if the city has concert hall dedicated to classic music, you cannot have hiphop club somewhere? What has vomiting toddler have to do with anything? Is she/he acknowledged world-wide for his/her heroic actions? You obviously failed to see the point I was trying to make also, which is that it isnt true that people can do whatever they want with their money, like everybody is saying. How about if i put up a statue of a vomiting Steve-O from jackass? Or a statue of one of the members of their cast performing the "poo volcano". Theyre all famous, so its ok right? Are you from Detroit? Michigan? Have you ever been here? The movies make the city look like an absolute crime ridden shithole, and building a statue dedicated to the main character of a movie like that doesn't do the it any favors. The citizens of the city, or the state even, didn't vote for a Robocop statue, and it seems like it was done more as a joke than anything else. Robocop is NOT a historic icon for the city of Detroit, I really don't know where you get that from. Someone like Joe Louis is, which is why we have two statues of him here. Ernie Harwell is, which is why we have a statue of him going into Comerica Park. You say people aren't gullible enough to believe what they say in movies, but all Ive seen about Detroit on these boards are comments about how crappy of a city it is, or how crime ridden it is, or how there are only "shootings and burned out buildings" (a quote taken directly from a GSL cast), and I guarantee less than 5% of those people have even stepped foot in the city let alone lived here for almost 27 years like myself, and people like you end up believing Robocop represents Detroit. Nobody wants to put up statues of Motown singers around the city but when people hear Robocop they jump on it. Its shameful.
99% of the world population does not give a shit about Ernie Harwell and don't even know who he is. Joe Louis is more recognizable, but still not as much as Robocop.
The truth is, people don't give a shit about Detroit in general. At least this made to the headlines and people read about it and that itself is worth far more than $50,000 in terms of promotion effect.
People would not travel to Detroit just to see the statue of Ernie Harwell but some might actually make an effort to see the statue of Robocop.
[edit] According to 2007 sources, Detroit had the sixth highest number of violent crimes among the twenty-five largest cities. It's probably not the most dangerous city in the US but it's not the safe heaven you seem to believe either.
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Metropolis, Illinois has a Superman statue. Why can't Detroit have Robocop? It could certainly help to boost citizen morale.
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On February 24 2011 23:09 1tym wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 16:32 Helios.Star wrote:On February 24 2011 13:58 1tym wrote:On February 24 2011 09:56 Helios.Star wrote:On February 24 2011 08:48 zev318 wrote:damn this would make me wanna go visit detroit On February 24 2011 08:41 Helios.Star wrote:On February 24 2011 07:48 Parnage wrote:
So how could anyone complain about this?
It's 50,000k raised by private means(ie no tax money) to build a statue in a city on presumably private property and all it takes is a city saying "oh okay sure".
Sense when was it okay to tell people what they can and can not do with money they make? It's not the cities money to spend nor is it anyone elses but those who donated for this purpose willingly. No case can be made for misspent taxpayers dollars nor can you tell people what to do with the money they make.
The only reason it's being taken in any manner but "oh neat" is because Detroit can't do it themselves due to misuse of budget, corruption, and rising criminal rates. Not to mention the city is outright de-urbanizing.
I used to live in Michigan. Detroit won't be doomed or saved by a statue but it's nice to see some people care enough to actually try and spruce up the place. Im going to raise $100,000 to buy property and get a 30 ft rainbow colored statue of a violently vomiting toddler giving everybody the finger built right across the street from where you live. Its my money, so you cant tell me I get to do with it. When you build something that affects other people then those in charge do get to say how you spend your money. And I would hardly call a statue of Robocop sprucing up the city. ya man, robocop and vomiting toddler giving everyone the finger, good comparison. A big statue of robocop is exactly like a big middle finger to the city in the eyes of some people if you really think about how the movies portray Detroit, and considering the classic architecture/statues we already have. You know what I used was an extreme example to prove my point, could you really not see that or did you just have to respond to my post? I fail to see the relevance as well. Robocop is a historic icon from the world-wide hit movie who served and protected the citizens of Detroit and eliminated the rampant crime in the city streets. Sure the movie may have over-exaggerated about the city crime scene, but all hollywood movies are like that for dramatic effect. Who's gullible enough to believe everything they see on the movies? Robocop is cool if nothing else. Who's more aknowledged better world-wide than Robocop from Detroit? Tim Allen? How is it exactly a big middle finger to the city? It's not like it's going to be displayed with the classic architecture/statues side to side. Should the city only have classic or artistic statues? What you're saying is like saying if the city has concert hall dedicated to classic music, you cannot have hiphop club somewhere? What has vomiting toddler have to do with anything? Is she/he acknowledged world-wide for his/her heroic actions? You obviously failed to see the point I was trying to make also, which is that it isnt true that people can do whatever they want with their money, like everybody is saying. How about if i put up a statue of a vomiting Steve-O from jackass? Or a statue of one of the members of their cast performing the "poo volcano". Theyre all famous, so its ok right? Are you from Detroit? Michigan? Have you ever been here? The movies make the city look like an absolute crime ridden shithole, and building a statue dedicated to the main character of a movie like that doesn't do the it any favors. The citizens of the city, or the state even, didn't vote for a Robocop statue, and it seems like it was done more as a joke than anything else. Robocop is NOT a historic icon for the city of Detroit, I really don't know where you get that from. Someone like Joe Louis is, which is why we have two statues of him here. Ernie Harwell is, which is why we have a statue of him going into Comerica Park. You say people aren't gullible enough to believe what they say in movies, but all Ive seen about Detroit on these boards are comments about how crappy of a city it is, or how crime ridden it is, or how there are only "shootings and burned out buildings" (a quote taken directly from a GSL cast), and I guarantee less than 5% of those people have even stepped foot in the city let alone lived here for almost 27 years like myself, and people like you end up believing Robocop represents Detroit. Nobody wants to put up statues of Motown singers around the city but when people hear Robocop they jump on it. Its shameful. 99% of the world population does not give a shit about Ernie Harwell and don't even know who he is. Joe Louis is more recognizable, but still not as much as Robocop. The truth is, people don't give a shit about Detroit in general. At least this made to the headlines and people read about it and that itself is worth far more than $50,000 in terms of promotion effect. People would not travel to Detroit just to see the statue of Ernie Harwell but some might actually make an effort to see the statue of Robocop. [edit] According to 2007 sources, Detroit had the sixth highest number of violent crimes among the twenty-five largest cities. It's probably not the most dangerous city in the US but it's not the safe heaven you seem to believe either.
I never claimed it was a safe haven, no large city is, but thank you for putting words in my mouth. If you think Robocop is a more historic figure than Joe Louis than you are an idiot, theres no other way to put it.
People don't give a shit about Detroit? I guess thats why we got all that cash to save the auto industry, because whether or not you want to believe it if Detroit falls the rest of the country will follow behind. The rest of the world isnt supposed to give a shit about Ernie Harwell, only the city and the state need to, but what the people of Detroit DONT give a shit about is Robocop, which is why we haven't put a statue of him up. We don't care that people don't travel here to see a statue of Ernie or Joe Louis fist because its for the citizens of the city not tourists. Theyve come for the casinos, the superbowl, the mbl all star game, the nba finals, and the nhl finals, Robocop is definitely not going to be a larger draw.
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You make some very fair points Helios, but ad hominim attacks completely ruin your argument 
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On February 25 2011 10:14 PassiveAce wrote:You make some very fair points Helios, but ad hominim attacks completely ruin your argument
Meh, the only "attacks" (though there was only one if you could call it that) I did was call someone an idiot for stating as fact that Robocop is more of an icon for the city of Detroit than Joe Louis, and honestly I felt like it was relevant to what I was saying and still don't believe I'm not far off. Nobody gets called out for saying people don't give a shit about the city though, or its icons. But I may just resurrecting a dead thread at this point and I'm done checking back, may it rest in peace. Thanks for recognizing the point(s) I was trying to make though.
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What is the piece of land like? The article says it's the "derelict Michigan Central train station." Is it some out-of-the-way tiny POS nobdoy cares about? Where the statue is going is what really matters. Although I suppose if they do build it, someone could sneak it wherever later.
So many people in this thread did not notice that half of the 50k came from a business (Y u no read?!). The company isn't supporting Robocop because it is a benevolent effect for the people of Detriot. They bought publicity.
Rocky in Philadelphia is also being thrown around as an example of a fake-character statue success, but it isn't all good (in the hood). Racism is a major problem in Philadelphia. You will remember that Philadelphia is where Mumia Abu Jamal was wrongfully put on death row. So there is a statue of a fake white boxer from a movie, and no statues of any number of the real black boxers to have really come from Philadelphia. It was also moved around several times because not everyone likes it.
Robocop isn't even a "good" character like Rocky is. Robocop is a product of an evil mega-corporation. That is literally a product, like what you buy from the store. They took Peter Weller's body against his will and made him a cyborg slave. Really, with transhumanism, crime, evil corporations, etc. on the rise, the least likely thing we'll see "in the near future" from this movie is the impossible happy ending.
The idea of statues is to project some kind of influence on the people who live around it. I can't imagine any positive influence Robocop would exert. Anything funny is ultimately apathetic and cynical, in my opinion.
I'll admit it was a little funny (at first), but Robocop isn't real, it isn't decent, and it's from Hollywood. What is to like?
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On February 25 2011 16:51 Helios.Star wrote:Show nested quote +On February 25 2011 10:14 PassiveAce wrote:You make some very fair points Helios, but ad hominim attacks completely ruin your argument Meh, the only "attacks" (though there was only one if you could call it that) I did was call someone an idiot for stating as fact that Robocop is more of an icon for the city of Detroit than Joe Louis, and honestly I felt like it was relevant to what I was saying and still don't believe I'm not far off. Nobody gets called out for saying people don't give a shit about the city though, or its icons. But I may just resurrecting a dead thread at this point and I'm done checking back, may it rest in peace. Thanks for recognizing the point(s) I was trying to make though.
When did I say Robocop is more of a historic icon than Joe Louis? I only said Robocop is more acknowledged world wide than Joe Louis, because of the hollywood influence and largely due to the fact that Joe Louis's peak was in 1934. It's also true that Transformers is more acknowledged world wide compared to Babe Ruth, but that does not make Transformer more historic figure than Babe Ruth.
Why do you bring up Superbowl, mbl and the nba finals? It's totally irrelveant. So are you saying additional tourists will hurt the Detroit industry? It's like saying because you already getting paid 150K annually as a salary, you would refuse a 10K bonus in the holiday season?
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On February 24 2011 08:41 Helios.Star wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 07:48 Parnage wrote:
So how could anyone complain about this?
It's 50,000k raised by private means(ie no tax money) to build a statue in a city on presumably private property and all it takes is a city saying "oh okay sure".
Sense when was it okay to tell people what they can and can not do with money they make? It's not the cities money to spend nor is it anyone elses but those who donated for this purpose willingly. No case can be made for misspent taxpayers dollars nor can you tell people what to do with the money they make.
The only reason it's being taken in any manner but "oh neat" is because Detroit can't do it themselves due to misuse of budget, corruption, and rising criminal rates. Not to mention the city is outright de-urbanizing.
I used to live in Michigan. Detroit won't be doomed or saved by a statue but it's nice to see some people care enough to actually try and spruce up the place. Im going to raise $100,000 to buy property and get a 30 ft rainbow colored statue of a violently vomiting toddler giving everybody the finger built right across the street from where you live. Its my money, so you cant tell me I get to do with it. When you build something that affects other people then those in charge do get to say how you spend your money. And I would hardly call a statue of Robocop sprucing up the city.
sprucing up the city isn't exactly a requirement when you're going before the zoning board. Deliberately trying to offend a bunch of people would probably not fly though!!
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On February 25 2011 20:20 Chancho wrote:
What is the piece of land like? The article says it's the "derelict Michigan Central train station." Is it some out-of-the-way tiny POS nobdoy cares about? Where the statue is going is what really matters. Although I suppose if they do build it, someone could sneak it wherever later.
So many people in this thread did not notice that half of the 50k came from a business (Y u no read?!). The company isn't supporting Robocop because it is a benevolent effect for the people of Detriot. They bought publicity.
Rocky in Philadelphia is also being thrown around as an example of a fake-character statue success, but it isn't all good (in the hood). Racism is a major problem in Philadelphia. You will remember that Philadelphia is where Mumia Abu Jamal was wrongfully put on death row. So there is a statue of a fake white boxer from a movie, and no statues of any number of the real black boxers to have really come from Philadelphia. It was also moved around several times because not everyone likes it.
Robocop isn't even a "good" character like Rocky is. Robocop is a product of an evil mega-corporation. That is literally a product, like what you buy from the store. They took Peter Weller's body against his will and made him a cyborg slave. Really, with transhumanism, crime, evil corporations, etc. on the rise, the least likely thing we'll see "in the near future" from this movie is the impossible happy ending.
The idea of statues is to project some kind of influence on the people who live around it. I can't imagine any positive influence Robocop would exert. Anything funny is ultimately apathetic and cynical, in my opinion.
I'll admit it was a little funny (at first), but Robocop isn't real, it isn't decent, and it's from Hollywood. What is to like?
The beginning of Eminem's music video for Beautiful was filmed there, it is an increadible old building that was built in 1913, but hasn't been occupied since 1988. It is in pretty bad shape, but people in the area see it as a pretty iconic building.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgT1AidzRWM
I really dont see the point of the statue tho
Also Helios, Detroit has some of the highest violent crime rates in the US for a large city, not to mention that the education system there is the worst of any large city in the country(Very recent news story). Detroit has done everything in its power to earn the perception it has from the rest of the world.
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EPT
