EPTInteresting note: apparently MSWord thinks all passive sentences are grammatically incorrect
spelling reform in English speaking countries - Page 2
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GloomyBeaR
United States77 Posts
Interesting note: apparently MSWord thinks all passive sentences are grammatically incorrect | ||
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optical630
United Kingdom768 Posts
On January 29 2011 00:28 Hawk wrote: Extra u's in words be stupid. Plus, American English is part of this country's identity. It reminds the Brits every day that we are so awesome that we needed our own specialized language to convey this awesomeness. also, there are hardly any kind of issues that arise from this. Mostly Brits or Americans telling one another that they spell like retards, that's about it. Either spelling is understood by either group spell things properly dammit! blue with an E through with an ough colour with a u it clearly(doesnt) make(s) sense why we made english more complicated than it needs to be silly americans making things easier! | ||
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Whiladan
United States463 Posts
In other news, it's aluminum...not aluminium. | ||
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Perscienter
957 Posts
On January 29 2011 00:29 ghermination wrote: Yeah and make those damned Peruvians, Chileans, Argentineans, Paraguayans, Uruguayans, and members of dozens of other Spanish speaking countries speak REAL Spanish! Not their stupid made up dialects! Countries change languages based on their own culture. Dialects are just natural and it's not possible to get rid of them. I'm talking about spelling, not dialects. We have different dialects in the German speaking world, too, and it works nevertheless. Most people won't ever get the pronunciation of foreign languages right, anyway. That's not the problem. The typeface, grammar, spelling is the problem, because it is most important what someone wants to say. On January 29 2011 00:39 Shockk wrote: We've had a spelling reform in Germany not so long ago, remember? The goal was to simplify the language and to make it easier to learn and use for non-germans. The result was a horrible failures. It's been 15 years and people in Germany/Austria/Switzerland still refuse to use the new version, schools were not sure how to handle things (and some still are). While it may have been made easier for some, it produced some linguistic abominations ("delphin" -> "delfin" comes to mind *shudder*). Languages should develop naturally, and they're certainly not something that could be regulated. Let alone internationally. The first spelling reform wave was broken, yes. But they corrected it. If German teachers don't know how teach it then that is their fault. If someone has problems using 'f' instead of 'ph', that is their fault. I know it doesn't look familiar, but it's very easy to apply. The same goes for 'ß' into 'ss'. That rule change was reasonable. But 'kennenlernen' is still not 'kennen lernen', of course. It's more of a political problem that the Bundestag didn't care to ask any linguists in time at all. We have a huge academical world, which could shoulder the work which needs to be done to create the pillars for a language reform. Politicians just failed again. | ||
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Jemmani
United States76 Posts
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Dyme
Germany523 Posts
In Germany we had a few spelling reforms during 1st to 10th grade. And then the school teachers weren't allowed to give grades for spelling and partially grammar for a while because no one knew what was correct. Basically this spelling reforms mainly stopped people from knowing what is right instead of making stuff easier. | ||
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kazansky
Germany931 Posts
On January 29 2011 00:25 Perscienter wrote: English is the most important lingua franca in the world and it still lacks a coherent spelling and pronunciation. Especially the former needs to be reformed. Since English has been introduced as a second language in so many countries, it often deteriorates in this regions. Then again not even the U.S.-Americans speak Oxford British English. They had to invent their own style for whatever reasons in the first place. My suggestion is this: adopt the British spelling. U.S.-exclusive vocabulary should be included in the language. Only one English language should be taught in today's schools over the world. Is it really so difficult to write harbour with a 'u'? What do you think? I actually don't understand your problem. For international english, OBE is the spelling of choice, so its normed. Well, the americans spell differently when they're with themselves. But who is bothered? As a German you might know that Austria and Switzerland has a different spelling aswell, and it is no problem whatsoever. | ||
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Cloud
Sexico5880 Posts
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Perscienter
957 Posts
On January 29 2011 01:02 Jemmani wrote: Spain spanish and mexican spanish are very different also. Does that mean anyone speaking one or the other should change? Yes, that is very annoying. Especially when poorer countries deviate, because they often don't have infrastructure to develop and supply their own official sub class of the language. They just mess things up and confuse the people. | ||
hifriend
China7935 Posts
On January 29 2011 00:25 Perscienter wrote: They had to invent their own style for whatever reasons in the first place. Because language is static. | ||
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gongryong
Korea (South)1430 Posts
Language only needs two things to be successful: to communicate and be flexible. The communication part may not always be absolute hence the second part. Yet, flexibility is itself checked by the limits of communication. Language can only remain relevant if it evolves with the context and consciousness of the users. A fixed and final language easily dies or becomes a novelty. As an aside, English as a lingua franca is a function of power, and not an innate strength of the language. Nonetheless, as far as English goes, I think the more the merrier. If my stint in Europe taught me anything, it is that English is actually enriched, not corrupted, by localization. There is even a move now to accommodate technology-driven changes in the language, such as "tho" and "u", and im in favor of it. | ||
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SirazTV
United States209 Posts
Also, how do you spell blue without an e? | ||
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Duban
United States548 Posts
spell things properly dammit! blue with an E through with an ough colour with a u it clearly(doesnt) make(s) sense why we made english more complicated than it needs to be silly americans making things easier! You realize that we do spell them blue and through right? Ok, there's no u in American english "color" though. | ||
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
On January 29 2011 01:20 Duban wrote: You do realize that we spell it blue, and through right? Yeah there's no u in color though. Our traffic signs and fast food signs spell it thru, tho. | ||
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storm8ring3r
Germany227 Posts
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Cloud
Sexico5880 Posts
On January 29 2011 01:14 Perscienter wrote: Yes, that is very annoying. Especially when poorer countries deviate, because they often don't have infrastructure to develop and supply their own official sub class of the language. They just mess things up and confuse the people. Latin american literature is by no means inferior to spanish literature and not one of the authors is trying to imitate "proper spanish". | ||
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Black Gun
Germany4482 Posts
also the regional german dialects are almost not decipherable for "foreigners" to this dialect. guys from bavaria have trouble following a conversation in broad northern german dialect, just like guys from northern germany have trouble understanding a strong bavarian dialect. (every non-german look up the word "Weißwurschtäquator" now!  )i dont really think the minor differences between british and american english are of concern. what concerns me more is that certain grammar rules are so regularly violated that i as a foreigner often times start to wonder if im doing it correct just because i get insecure when reading all the wrong grammar used by native english speakers. a good example would be "more than": about 40% of all occurrences of this word here on tl are spelled "more then" and i dont see a difference in the frequency of this mistake between the native speakers and the foreigners. | ||
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Perscienter
957 Posts
On January 29 2011 01:06 kazansky wrote: I actually don't understand your problem. For international english, OBE is the spelling of choice, so its normed. Well, the americans spell differently when they're with themselves. But who is bothered? As a German you might know that Austria and Switzerland has a different spelling aswell, and it is no problem whatsoever. No one is for themselves any more. What's the difference between Austrian, Switzerland and German spelling? On January 29 2011 01:11 Cloud wrote: You should be more worried about internet lingo which is actually destroying the English language. I am, but a thread considering that topic would be closed soon. That is also more a problem of public vs. private rooms and the fact that ad-financed companies have to cater to everyone without imposing sufficient rules. On January 29 2011 01:17 gongryong wrote: Language only needs two things to be successful: to communicate and be flexible. The communication part may not always be absolute hence the second part. Yet, flexibility is itself checked by the limits of communication. Language can only remain relevant if it evolves with the context and consciousness of the users. A fixed and final language easily dies or becomes a novelty. I have no problem with that. Our German (unified) language still changes. If there was a governing body for English language as a whole, then this would not impede the evolution of the English language. On January 29 2011 01:17 gongryong wrote: As an aside, English as a lingua franca is a function of power, and not an innate strength of the language. It's not only a function of power. English was elected to be the lingua franca because of its clear alphabet for example. It's really to most people less difficult to learn than Spanish and especially German and French. | ||
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Mortality
United States4790 Posts
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NoobSkills
United States1597 Posts
On January 29 2011 00:25 Perscienter wrote: English is the most important lingua franca in the world and it still lacks a coherent spelling and pronunciation. Especially the former needs to be reformed. Since English has been introduced as a second language in so many countries, it often deteriorates in this regions. Then again not even the U.S.-Americans speak Oxford British English. They had to invent their own style for whatever reasons in the first place. My suggestion is this: adopt the British spelling. U.S.-exclusive vocabulary should be included in the language. Only one English language should be taught in today's schools over the world. Is it really so difficult to write harbour with a 'u'? What do you think? English as a language has been introduced as a second language because of the USA not because of England. So, if people are learning English to talk to those from the USA then it would probably be a good idea to learn the United State's way of spelling and pronuciation. I myself know 3 languages and all of them have many dialects. It doesn't all form into one narrow picture just because we want it to. Is it really so difficult to exclude the 'u'? | ||
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