On July 20 2010 14:25 Illusion. wrote: lol, i dont know why so many naive people like you fall for that kind of anti-semetic propaganda.
perhaps because you live in a country run by jews?
most Americans dont realize this, since the USSR is dissolved, USA has been the most frequent use of veto power in the UN and majority of it was used to protect Israel when the rest of the world has condemned their atrocities.
give me an example of these "Atrocities" your making yourself sound like a neo-nazi.
Blatant violation of international law as it pertains to settlements in occupied territories, denial of humanitarian aid in many cases (as certified by Amnesty), and other shady activities involving the diverting of drinking water to Israeli settlements for swimming pools whilst the Gazans go thirsty for lack of water, to name a few.
america and israel know full well that iran will never use a nuke...it would be national and political suicide to those who run and control iran...they may have the ability to train suicide bombers and finance radicals....but they are not stupid to destroy everything they have achieved over some palestinians they don't even like...
if anything israel and USA are scared shitless that they're monopoly on the nuclear weapon in the region is being threatened and a country unlike pakistan who is USA's bitch is going to have them...they are going to lose their ability, option and constant threat of military action against iran....nuclear powers do not go to war with eachother. so any future beef between iran and the west that goes violent will be fought through proxies...and thats a battle that iran can win unlike a conventional war with israel/USA...and this scenario scares the US and Israel
basically, the US, its lap dogs like saudi arabia and israel are throwing a hissyfit because their ability to bully a country around and contain its power is being threatened
Bullying or not, just because the US happens to own nukes doesn't mean other countries should. The less that owns them, the better, since all it really takes is one person in charge to decide to make that "crazy" decision. You are trying to argue a case of "ethics" in international politics, which is flawed in and by itself. Ethically, I don't support a fuck ton that this country is doing but as a citizen, boy am I glad it's following through with them since it benefits this country and by extension, me.
However, I fail to see how Saudi Arabia giving Israel clear skies to attack Iran is a positive thing for us. As many have mentioned, we are already carrying flak for the support of Israel and I'm not sure how playing out another Middle Eastern conflict is good for our interests. Israel can only play the "preemptive strike defense" card for so long.
Given Israel's history I don't think it's at all unreasonable for Israel to maintain that if its neighbours ever got another chance they'd act to wipe Israel out. They've tried it several times already. The only thing that keeps the peace is that history suggests Israel would win which would just be embarrassing. So on the contrary, the longer Israel keeps doing pre-emptive strikes the better. By maintaining a strong defence Israel stops the Middle East from imploding.
On July 20 2010 14:25 Illusion. wrote: lol, i dont know why so many naive people like you fall for that kind of anti-semetic propaganda.
perhaps because you live in a country run by jews?
most Americans dont realize this, since the USSR is dissolved, USA has been the most frequent use of veto power in the UN and majority of it was used to protect Israel when the rest of the world has condemned their atrocities.
give me an example of these "Atrocities" your making yourself sound like a neo-nazi.
On July 20 2010 14:53 KissBlade wrote: Bullying or not, just because the US happens to own nukes doesn't mean other countries should. The less that owns them, the better, since all it really takes is one person in charge to decide to make that "crazy" decision. You are trying to argue a case of "ethics" in international politics, which is flawed in and by itself. Ethically, I don't support a fuck ton that this country is doing but as a citizen, boy am I glad it's following through with them since it benefits this country and by extension, me.
However, I fail to see how Saudi Arabia giving Israel clear skies to attack Iran is a positive thing for us. As many have mentioned, we are already carrying flak for the support of Israel and I'm not sure how playing out another Middle Eastern conflict is good for our interests. Israel can only play the "preemptive strike defense" card for so long.
if every major power has a nuclear weapon, conventional war and actual military action against countries that own nukes will not be a logical option...the cold war didn't turn hot because both sides knew they would both be destroyed....if say only US or Russia had nukes, the war would have gone hot and the side without nukes would have lost or bowed down to the side that did...
basically, the US and Israel are afraid that they are going to lose leverage over Iran...if Iran remains nuke free, the US and Israel can bomb it, destroy infrastructure, contain its economy and or destabilize it as much as they want...a nuclear iran means those things would not be a smart idea.
its not like the US owns 1 or 2 nukes and no one else should have them...they have more than a 1000 located in places in the world where they could strike any place whenever they want...Israel has nuclear weapons pointed at probably every one of its neighbours. this is what allows israel to fuck everyone and not care what their neighbours do...if iran gets a nuke, israel will have to start behaving itself....and israel like a child is throwing a hissyfit.
On July 20 2010 14:58 KwarK wrote: Given Israel's history I don't think it's at all unreasonable for Israel to maintain that if its neighbours ever got another chance they'd act to wipe Israel out. They've tried it several times already. The only thing that keeps the peace is that history suggests Israel would win which would just be embarrassing. So on the contrary, the longer Israel keeps doing pre-emptive strikes the better. By maintaining a strong defence Israel stops the Middle East from imploding.
except israel's enemies will eventually acquire nuclear weapons. in fact, iran has actually gotten a lot stronger because its only major enemy Iraq was destroyed while the iraqi government, army and police are shia muslims with strong loyalties to the iranian clergy and mullahs
On July 20 2010 14:39 Elegy wrote: Blatant violation of international law as it pertains to settlements in occupied territories,
I would like to stress, once again, the ludicrous nature of the very concept of "international law". Law requires authority to back it. There is no authority that can "legitimately" claim the right to enforce international law, nor is there an authority that even has the strength to stand up to Israel that actually wants to do so.
There are no laws in war, and Israel is in a war, no matter what idealists say.
denial of humanitarian aid in many cases (as certified by Amnesty),
Because Amnesty international is a completely unbiased source whose word is gospel, right?
There's as much evidence for the "aid" that was denied being military in nature as there is against it.
On July 20 2010 14:39 Elegy wrote: Blatant violation of international law as it pertains to settlements in occupied territories,
I would like to stress, once again, the ludicrous nature of the very concept of "international law". Law requires authority to back it. There is no authority that can "legitimately" claim the right to enforce international law, nor is there an authority that even has the strength to stand up to Israel that actually wants to do so.
There are no laws in war, and Israel is in a war, no matter what idealists say.
denial of humanitarian aid in many cases (as certified by Amnesty),
Because Amnesty international is a completely unbiased source whose word is gospel, right?
There's as much evidence for the "aid" that was denied being military in nature as there is against it.
your right there is no international law...i never really believed in it either. its just something the powerful use against their weaker enemies when its convenient...it works one way only really
On July 20 2010 15:12 afg-warrior wrote: your right there is no international law...i never really believed in it either. its just something the powerful use against their weaker enemies when its convenient...it works one way only really
so Iran is still vulnerable to any aistrike, the S-300 promised by Russia long ago are not going to be delivered, now the Russian say its because of the sanctions but the deal was made long before any of this happened. The s-300 would boost iranians defense capabilities and make any airstrike by Usa or Israel even more difficult.
"The S-300 is regarded as one of the most potent anti-aircraft missile systems currently fielded [2]. Its radars have the ability to simultaneously track up to 100 targets while engaging up to 12."
On July 21 2010 03:52 ImFromPortugal wrote: "Russia dismisses Iran, insists pending missile deliveries covered by sanctions (AP)"
so Iran is still vulnerable to any aistrike, the S-300 promised by Russia long ago are not going to be delivered, now the Russian say its because of the sanctions but the deal was made long before any of this happened. The s-300 would boost iranians defense capabilities and make any airstrike by Usa or Israel even more difficult.
"The S-300 is regarded as one of the most potent anti-aircraft missile systems currently fielded [2]. Its radars have the ability to simultaneously track up to 100 targets while engaging up to 12."
That's good. The delivery of the S-300 system was what was most likely to percipitate war, since Isreal does not have access to F-22 or B-2 bomber. F-35 stealth is a crapshot.
In any event, I think that people are too hard on Isreal's strategies and tactics. Look at it this way. If one day a bunch of people from Mexico started lobbing rockets over the US border at US cities, the US would say "WTF YOU STOP THAT RIGHT NOW MEXICO"
If it happened again the US would say "THAT'S IT YOU RETARDS" and invade mexico to take control of the situation. But of course when Isreal does it everyone says "noooooooo it's been going on for decades, you doing stuff now is out of proportion!"
I mean, Iran having nukes would be like Cuba having nukes - a hostile nation (Except I think Iran is much more hostile to Isreal than Cuba is to the US) next door that repeatedly said they wanted to wipe you off the map.
I'm in Canada, and I for one welcome our (old) American overlords!
On July 21 2010 03:52 ImFromPortugal wrote: "Russia dismisses Iran, insists pending missile deliveries covered by sanctions (AP)"
so Iran is still vulnerable to any aistrike, the S-300 promised by Russia long ago are not going to be delivered, now the Russian say its because of the sanctions but the deal was made long before any of this happened. The s-300 would boost iranians defense capabilities and make any airstrike by Usa or Israel even more difficult.
"The S-300 is regarded as one of the most potent anti-aircraft missile systems currently fielded [2]. Its radars have the ability to simultaneously track up to 100 targets while engaging up to 12."
That's good. The delivery of the S-300 system was what was most likely to percipitate war, since Isreal does not have access to F-22 or B-2 bomber. F-35 stealth is a crapshot.
In any event, I think that people are too hard on Isreal's strategies and tactics. Look at it this way. If one day a bunch of people from Mexico started lobbing rockets over the US border at US cities, the US would say "WTF YOU STOP THAT RIGHT NOW MEXICO"
If it happened again the US would say "THAT'S IT YOU RETARDS" and invade mexico to take control of the situation. But of course when Isreal does it everyone says "noooooooo it's been going on for decades, you doing stuff now is out of proportion!"
I mean, Iran having nukes would be like Cuba having nukes - a hostile nation (Except I think Iran is much more hostile to Isreal than Cuba is to the US) next door that repeatedly said they wanted to wipe you off the map.
I'm in Canada, and I for one welcome our (old) American overlords!
can you please state or quote where they said they want to wipe israel of the map?
On June 13 2010 02:15 Zionner wrote: I have a bad feeling some serious shit is going to go down soon
lol @ this...
cmon dude, really? were going to war with iran. its going to be somewhere between bad and nuclear holocaust.
ill bet any1 cold hard $$ were (USA + friends) at war with iran within 3 years. ill give 3:1. ill give 1:1 its within 18 months.
I'll take that bet at 1:1 odds with USA + friends, which means what exactly. UN involvement. 2+ countries that we have good relations with at time of war decleration? How much you thinking about betting?
On June 13 2010 02:15 Zionner wrote: I have a bad feeling some serious shit is going to go down soon
lol @ this...
cmon dude, really? were going to war with iran. its going to be somewhere between bad and nuclear holocaust.
ill bet any1 cold hard $$ were (USA + friends) at war with iran within 3 years. ill give 3:1. ill give 1:1 its within 18 months.
I'll take that bet at 1:1 odds with USA + friends, which means what exactly. UN involvement. 2+ countries that we have good relations with at time of war decleration? How much you thinking about betting?
the iranian retaliation would make the world tremble.