One issue that I have with her work is that these in-game attitudes do not necessarily apply to real-life. If there is research indicating that they do, then she has a real slam dunk of an argument. If not, then she needs to go back to the drawing board.
Gaming Can Change The World - Page 4
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RosaParksStoleMySeat
Japan926 Posts
One issue that I have with her work is that these in-game attitudes do not necessarily apply to real-life. If there is research indicating that they do, then she has a real slam dunk of an argument. If not, then she needs to go back to the drawing board. | ||
anch
United States5457 Posts
I understand WoW does give coordination and social skills but that's only if you are top of the management. Underlings follow order because they want to stay in the guild, just as a employee follow his order to keep his job. I dont see how playing 1 more hour per day can change anything. Games are still games, it cant just teach kids algebra and reasoning of the real world. Its not like "hey if we screw up this financial project (raid) we can always try again tomorrow". I know my arguement are weak, just want to point it out. | ||
CommanderFluffy
Taiwan1059 Posts
On March 19 2010 08:12 Alou wrote: Games have social interaction. Do people not talk and strategize on TeamSpeak or Ventrilo? It may not be face to face, but you don't need to see someone to interact with them. Interaction through a computer is still interaction. The social interaction through a computer screen, a microphone are all very different from interacting with someone face to face. You miss out on a huge part of human interaction that is body language. | ||
RosaParksStoleMySeat
Japan926 Posts
On March 19 2010 08:22 CommanderFluffy wrote: The social interaction through a computer screen, a microphone are all very different from interacting with someone face to face. You miss out on a huge part of human interaction that is body language. Don't forget about the anonymity aspect of online social interaction ![]() | ||
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Manifesto7
Osaka27148 Posts
On March 19 2010 08:21 RosaParksStoleMySeat wrote: I am more interested in the effect that games have on cognitive development. I'd like to hear about some neurobiology studies on left and right hemisphere involvement in the playing of certain games. I'd like to see the levels of brain activity while playing games compared to activity levels involved in other activities such as watching television, surfing the Internet casually, and studying. One issue that I have with her work is that these in-game attitudes do not necessarily apply to real-life. If there is research indicating that they do, then she has a real slam dunk of an argument. If not, then she needs to go back to the drawing board. You might be interested in part of the sarcraft progaming documentary done by national geographic (which is on youtube, and was done by the member "The Storyteller" on TL). It goes into the brain activity of progamers. | ||
RosaParksStoleMySeat
Japan926 Posts
On March 19 2010 08:30 Manifesto7 wrote: You might be interested in part of the sarcraft progaming documentary done by national geographic (which is on youtube, and was done by the member "The Storyteller" on TL). It goes into the brain activity of progamers. Morning man. You're up early xD. That does sound really interesting. I'll check it out. | ||
StRyKeR
United States1739 Posts
On March 18 2010 13:20 Cloud wrote: You mean like adding a tv news show? Or placing a starving african child on the back of your teen magazine? Or a satirical novel? It has been done over and over and it hasn't worked for shit. People just don't like facing reality. They are only rational when they're playing a game, reading a novel or drowning in a gallon of whisky. Yet they turn into some kind of blind, dumb, deaf and mature zombie when facing reality. Clearly, the avenues you mentioned have been tried and haven't worked. I think you're missing the point though. I'm saying that there are many useful activities in the world that are in fact games. Sports, math competitions, playing "pretend" as kids, etc. These activities add value to the world. The question is can we port this over to computer games. I'm sure there are computer games that at least VAGUELY fall into this area. I don't claim that there ARE any computer games that truly add value. | ||
TaG]SiG
United Kingdom53 Posts
EDIT decided to elaborate e.g. Cash Is King - money is more valuable today than tomorrow. Positive Multiplier Effect - put money in the system and it can be used to create more money Capacity Utilization - having one factory running at 100% is cheaper than 2 running at 50% But i would say overall my gaming careers has probably had a negative impact on potential Interesting ideas, especially the video that links to commercialism, but i think the scale of these ideas must be reduced drastically. learning to drive a car in a simulator is not learning to drive a car | ||
Judicator
United States7270 Posts
On March 19 2010 08:22 anch wrote: The lady puts too much positive effect on playing WoW. I understand WoW does give coordination and social skills but that's only if you are top of the management. Underlings follow order because they want to stay in the guild, just as a employee follow his order to keep his job. I dont see how playing 1 more hour per day can change anything. Games are still games, it cant just teach kids algebra and reasoning of the real world. Its not like "hey if we screw up this financial project (raid) we can always try again tomorrow". I know my arguement are weak, just want to point it out. I don't think she does; she more or less emphasis points that are often ignored by critics of WoW and when the "positives" of WoW/gaming are explored it more often than not leads to the success of the game in terms of player base, profits, or how it changed the field. In other words, there's a clear distinction that is drawn between the gaming world and real world when in fact the distinction hasn't been as clear for I would guess the last 20 years. She's in essence making that argument in an exaggerated way. Going along with WoW, individuals in the (average) raiding guilds quickly learn a few things; not everyone tries their best, not everyone has the best intentions of the guild in mind , not everyone respect and/or like you based on their opinion regardless of how trivial or senseless it maybe, and etc. On the other hand, it's hardly an accurate portrayal of the real world (whatever you want to define that as), but it certainly shares some parallels that are very similar. Also, there is the danger of over-extrapolating/overstating of the apparent facts in a situation like this. Lastly, there are a few studies now that show certain video games improve some aspects of cognitive functions like memory and spatial learning as well as teamwork, organization, and etc. So its not all games are just games. Tetris has been used for neurological studies more frequently this past decade. | ||
Alou
United States3748 Posts
On March 19 2010 12:36 Judicator wrote: I don't think she does; she more or less emphasis points that are often ignored by critics of WoW and when the "positives" of WoW/gaming are explored it more often than not leads to the success of the game in terms of player base, profits, or how it changed the field. In other words, there's a clear distinction that is drawn between the gaming world and real world when in fact the distinction hasn't been as clear for I would guess the last 20 years. She's in essence making that argument in an exaggerated way. Going along with WoW, individuals in the (average) raiding guilds quickly learn a few things; not everyone tries their best, not everyone has the best intentions of the guild in mind , not everyone respect and/or like you based on their opinion regardless of how trivial or senseless it maybe, and etc. On the other hand, it's hardly an accurate portrayal of the real world (whatever you want to define that as), but it certainly shares some parallels that are very similar. Also, there is the danger of over-extrapolating/overstating of the apparent facts in a situation like this. Lastly, there are a few studies now that show certain video games improve some aspects of cognitive functions like memory and spatial learning as well as teamwork, organization, and etc. So its not all games are just games. Tetris has been used for neurological studies more frequently this past decade. I agree with a lot of this. I think the people just pushing this away as crazy are the ones with a very negative look at gaming (Despite gaming themselves?) and are the ones missing out. There are skills developed in games, that could have real world value if we figure out how to translate them into the real world. Jane Mcgonigal is at the beginning of her career and still figuring things out, but she does have an interesting theory that does hold some truth. | ||
GGTeMpLaR
United States7226 Posts
pretty sure this is like a speech project or something related to public speaking (after seeing the end logo, it IS basically some public speaking program/school) and she just happened to pick what she thought would be an "easy topic/easy A" or "something she would enjoy working on" she made as many logical fallacies as a politician | ||
Alou
United States3748 Posts
On March 19 2010 23:43 GGTeMpLaR wrote: I would have turned it off after 5-10 minutes if I didn't think she was a cutie pretty sure this is like a speech project or something related to public speaking (after seeing the end logo, it IS basically some public speaking program/school) and she just happened to pick what she thought would be an "easy topic/easy A" or "something she would enjoy working on" she made as many logical fallacies as a politician It's TED. It's a convention where people go and talk about whatever they want. Tons of brilliant people are invited and you only get in with an invitation. And she isn't a student. She's been designing games for years. I've played one and they are pretty interesting. | ||
Railxp
Hong Kong1313 Posts
We've all had the "oh wow! i didn't think this crazy cheese would work!" moments. As she said, gamers win because they are willing to do crazy out of the box strats. And her idea sounds exactly just like one of those. | ||
QuanticHawk
United States32051 Posts
On March 20 2010 04:43 Railxp wrote: She used some far-fetched exaggerations to make her point, but we are all gamers here and have all seen those starcraft-applied-to-girl-problems threads. Yes, what could possibly go wrong with a bunch of socially inept people posting on the internet and utilizing starcraft analogies to creep on girls. | ||
tissue
Malaysia441 Posts
Also failure in a game has less impact, you just dust yourself off and try again - it's just a game, after all. Failure in real life can have huge social, economic, and emotional consequences. For every epic win achieved, don't forget the endless amounts of epic fail. | ||
Alou
United States3748 Posts
On March 20 2010 05:32 tissue wrote: Gaming has lots of transferable skills... if you are 9 years old, or lack a logically functioning mind. Also failure in a game has less impact, you just dust yourself off and try again - it's just a game, after all. Failure in real life can have huge social, economic, and emotional consequences. For every epic win achieved, don't forget the endless amounts of epic fail. So? If we take this 'I can do anything' mentality we get in gaming and put it in real life we will have fails (just like everyone does, whether you're a gamer or not), but also perhaps more chances at epic wins. A chance to really affect the world in a positive way because we have a mentality that makes us feel like we can do something positive if we give it a try. I think it's at least worth a shot and further research. She needs more research for her theory, but it is still a very good theory. | ||
CharlieMurphy
United States22895 Posts
On March 19 2010 23:59 Alou wrote: It's TED. It's a convention where people go and talk about whatever they want. Tons of brilliant people are invited and you only get in with an invitation. And she isn't a student. She's been designing games for years. I've played one and they are pretty interesting. I thought some of the people had to pay thousands of dollars to go to events and even more if they were doing a speech. | ||
Alou
United States3748 Posts
On March 20 2010 05:41 CharlieMurphy wrote: I thought some of the people had to pay thousands of dollars to go to events and even more if they were doing a speech. You get invited, then you have to pay a couple thousand of dollars to attend. The money covers the cost of the conference and usually goes to a prize each year, although previously there were multiple prizes. The prize money is meant to be used to help further a person's research or wish or whatever they're talking about. They've given over 1 million if I'm correct. | ||
LG)Sabbath
Argentina3022 Posts
On March 19 2010 08:14 Manifesto7 wrote: Stuff like this is pretty tepid. It is interaction, but so is buying my gas, working on a school project, or organizing a family dinner. There is only so much stock you can put in these types of "learning situations". I think most people are missing the point on this. You can learn social skills from other stuff, like you can learn to be a leader from being put in a mid-management position at your job, but you probably won't give a shit if your team gets results or not, or get really bored and tired of it, whereas at a game, you'd be motivated to improve your social skills because that would result in an improvement on your status as a gamer, and this probably applies even to WoW. tl;dr wow guild leader wants to improve as a leader, employee doesnt give a shit about leadership | ||
ComradeDover
Bulgaria758 Posts
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