On September 10 2011 02:26 Beyonder wrote: What do you play :D
Currently? WH40K - much more dynamic than WFB. Suffers from the same flaws though (armies are too big and luck plays too much of a factor). And trying to get into Infinity, which has awesome models, really good rules and background. Infinity has made it to the top of my tabletop list at the mooment, just because rules are decent, miniatures are awesome and the cost of playable army is around ~50USD.
If you are not joking about a playable army being around $50 bucks thats shocking to me.
I have like 4-5 2.5k pt 40k armies and we all know how fuckin expensive they are.
Sometimes I look back and say god damn that is a lot of money.
At least it is not crack... or maybe crack would be cheaper... hmmmm
They've got pretty damn awesome miniatures, that's what has primarily drawn me to it. Only after that I've discovered the great rules for the game (very tactical and less luck based than Warhammer).
That game looks pretty interesting. I used to play both fantasy and 40k (as well as some specialist games) back in middle school and high school. The GW prices have definitely changed over the past 5 years, much more expensive. And that is the reason I haven't picked it up again. Infinity looks like it is much more reasonably priced and the rules and army lists being downloadable is very helpful.
On September 10 2011 02:26 Beyonder wrote: What do you play :D
Currently? WH40K - much more dynamic than WFB. Suffers from the same flaws though (armies are too big and luck plays too much of a factor). And trying to get into Infinity, which has awesome models, really good rules and background. Infinity has made it to the top of my tabletop list at the mooment, just because rules are decent, miniatures are awesome and the cost of playable army is around ~50USD.
If you are not joking about a playable army being around $50 bucks thats shocking to me.
I have like 4-5 2.5k pt 40k armies and we all know how fuckin expensive they are.
Sometimes I look back and say god damn that is a lot of money.
At least it is not crack... or maybe crack would be cheaper... hmmmm
I'm not joking. Obviously, a big factor here is the fact that your typical "army" in Infinity is going to be composed of 8-10 models (more for huge ass battles, but even then people rarely go over 15).
All the models are metal and I must say that I'm in love with the quality. There's very little mold cast on them and the level of detail is amazing. I basically moved to it because I don't really have time to assemble and paint a lot of minis any more (I'm still struggling to put together my 1.5k CSM and I've only painted one model for it over the past couple of months). I dislike playing with unpainted stuff, looks so much better when it's all done.
This thread brings back so many memories. I still have alot of this stuff mostly unpainted and unassembled. I used to play empire / high elves in battle and eldar in 40k. After assembling one army (i think around 1.5k points ) i realized how much money it would cost me to have the units i wanted so i just quit. Shit was so expensive.
I still have it stashed somewhere cause i never gotgot around to selling it. I wonder if its still worth anything. I may get all the stuff out and write it down and maybe post it here or some WH forums so people can tell me how much its worth. I remember that some miniatures gained value as new editions came out and you could not buy the old ones in the store.
About two years and some ago, I bought the newest WHFantasy rulebook and the Necromantic undead army book, bought some new paint and brushes plus a box of skeletons. I set up a 1k point army, but swore I wouldn't buy any more miniatures untill I'd actually painted those I just bought then. During my original spree of miniature gaming, I'd probably bought tons of stuff, but only painted a fourth of it, so I wanted to be less 'wasteful'.
Of course, I never finished that pack of skellies. I've got 7 basecoated with washing and brushing halfdone and a couple of them complete, but that's as far as I got.
Anyhow, what I was planning for, was
Vampire (100pts) - General w. Dark Acolyte, Cadaverous Cuirass (40pts) 140pts 19x Skeleton warriors (8x19 - 152pts) including Champ, musician, standard bearer (20pts) 172pts
Wight King (75pts) w. Battle Standard (25pts) 100pts 19x Skeleton warriors w. spears (9x20 - 180pts) including Champ, musician, standard bearer (20pts) 200pts
Necromancer w. 2x Dispel Scroll(105pts) riding Corpse Cart w. Unholy Lodestone (100pts) 205pts
5x Black Knights (24x5 - 120pts) including Hell Knight, standard bearer w. Banner of Hellish Vigour (57pts) 177pts
Total 994pts
Will see if I bust out the old paint again. I've since then moved to a lot more roomy apartment, so I've actually got the desk space to keep some stuff up. Lighting's more of an issue, though...
Edit: Back in the day, I played a ton of all non-EPIC platforms. For WH Fantasy, I started out with Orks and Goblins, switched to Chaos and eventually to Skaven. For WH40k, I started out Eldar, switched to Blood Angels, then headed back to Eldar again. For Blood Bowl, I played Wood Elves, then Chaos, and currently Undead Necromantic. For Necromunda, I started out with the girly gang, then switched to the bald guys in trenchcoats-gang - no clue what the names were.
I never really played Mordheim, Space Hulk, Gorkamorka, Manowar, Epic 40k or the space version of Epic 40k. Warhammer quest was a lot of casual fun, though, but not something I spent much time on.
I did play Warzone though. It's based off the swedish Mutant Chronicles RPG, and worked pretty well for a tabletop setup. I ran Brotherhood for most of my time there, but also Dark Legion Ilian for a while. Good fun.
Sweet a Warhammer thread! :D I havent played a game of 40k in many many many years (since gr.9 i think?) but i love collecting and painting the models :D
Currently i have 4 40k armies going a Dark Elder Kabal, trying to get the entire Dark Angels 5th Company with Support Vehicles and a few other models (deathwing and Ravenwing), a small Daemon Hunters Force and a Mechanized Tank Company
Beyonder: You picked a shitty time to start playing wood elves, lol. I used to collect all 3 elf armies, but WEs really struggle to compete in the current game. The newer release armies, (and a lot of the changes in 8th edition) really messed up their strengths.
Manitou: I have a lot of old eldar bits somewhere in storage. I'll try to take an inventory next time I stumble across them.
edit: oh man it's been 2 years since I made this thread. I've barely touched anything warhammer related since, T_T
I picked up a fantasy dwarf starter kit a while ago, got to painting it but never played a game.
two questions,
1) how do you find people to play with of your age and skill level? The games workshop that we have here is filled with 10 year olds, not older people, and literally none of my friends play
2) how the hell do you paint it so nicely? mine look like half as good. Do you assemble then paint? or paint then assemble? or a mixture?
On September 10 2011 23:29 Darpa wrote: I picked up a fantasy dwarf starter kit a while ago, got to painting it but never played a game.
two questions,
1) how do you find people to play with of your age and skill level? The games workshop that we have here is filled with 10 year olds, not older people, and literally none of my friends play
2) how the hell do you paint it so nicely? mine look like half as good. Do you assemble then paint? or paint then assemble? or a mixture?
For your first, I'd suggest asking the guys working there. They're probably much more in touch with people above the kiddy range who enjoys the hobby. If not, try to get in touch with other game clubs in the area, such as board games and such, as they're your second best bet - if they're not warhammer players, they'll probably at least know someone who is, or some clubs that are doing stuff like that.
For your second, it's an aquired skill. For big models, then yea, I paint the bits that would be problematic when assembled each for itself, such as large monster wings and character modifiable weapons. For most rank-and-file units though, i just smash 'em together, give them a quick basecoat, wash 'em for shading effect, brush 'em to get most the original color back, then do some finishing detailing and highlighting.
If you're just starting out painting you can achieve good results really easily with Manit0u's 4-step newbie painting technique:
1 - basecoat (preferably black, easier to work with than white) 2 - apply basic colours 3 - use washes of relevant colour to darken things up 4 - drybrush with base colour or a corresponding lighter tone
It doesn't require a whole lot of skill and makes your stuff look decent. When you get more skill you can then always revisit your models painted this way to add more detail and highlighting.
The biggest trick here is to get the right washes and learning proper drybrushing. With washes you should usually go for the same wash as a colour you applied, but not always. Exception here would be red for example, I'm using brown wash for it as red is too bright, red's good for washing orange/yellow though.
Drybrushing is fairly simple too, just needs a bit of patience:
On September 11 2011 02:01 Manit0u wrote: If you're just starting out painting you can achieve good results really easily with Manit0u's 4-step newbie painting technique:
1 - basecoat (preferably black, easier to work with than white) 2 - apply basic colours 3 - use washes of relevant colour to darken things up 4 - drybrush with base colour or a corresponding lighter tone
It doesn't require a whole lot of skill and makes your stuff look decent. When you get more skill you can then always revisit your models painted this way to add more detail and highlighting.
The biggest trick here is to get the right washes and learning proper drybrushing. With washes you should usually go for the same wash as a colour you applied, but not always. Exception here would be red for example, I'm using brown wash for it as red is too bright, red's good for washing orange/yellow though.
Drybrushing is fairly simple too, just needs a bit of patience:
Uh, I might just be confusing the lingo here, but I'm pretty sure your first point refers to the undercoat rather than the basecoat, while your second point is the basecoat. Of course, things could have changed the last ten years, but I'm pretty sure that's how it works.
Aside from that nitpick though, you've outlined a good guide. I'll build some details upon yours, if you don't mind -
1. Undercoat.
The first step is getting some undercoat on your model. This means covering the entire model with a thin layer of paint. If you plan on using a lot of dark colors, black is the thing to go for. For reds, whites, yellows or generally light colors, you'll want to use a white undercoat. Red and yellow specifically are very transparent as colors, and work really badly on black undercoat.
For some models, where you want to use both dark and light coloration, use white undercoat primarily, then re-coat the desired dark areas with black once the white has dried. This is very good for things such as units with a lot of armor, as you may want the skin or clothes to be light, while the metallics of the armor really comes out better with a dark undercoat.
2. Basecoat.
Once the undercoat is done, you should apply a general layer of color. The point of the basecoat is to outline a general color scheme for your model - a lot of colors can become confusing to look at (and dreadful to paint!), so going for something simple is usually easier on the eyes and easier to paint. I usually pick two or three colors that I cover my miniature with (unless it's a character, which takes more detailing and thus more preparation work), such as green for clothes, pale for skin and brown for belt, boots and gloves. Once I've added this very basic cover to the entire model, I'll move on to the next step.
While you of course must not use thick layers of paint, the basecoat should be even and cover the undercoat well. If you have any white (or black) spots where there should be basecoat, be sure to cover it before progressing. Also, if you feel the undercoat shines through some of the basecoat, give that area another quick layer of basecoat before progressing.
After your model is basecoated, it's ready for basic use. It's got its distinct color and the entire model is painted. Of course, it doesn't look all that good, so many painters prefer adding detailing techniques to improve the apperance of the models.
3. Shading
There's two main methods of shading that I use, but the most straight forward one is using washes. A wash is a very thin-flowing liquid paint that settles in the deep parts of your models without putting much stress on the higher areas. Using wash on areas such as model faces or armor will allow the indents on the model to be painted darker, which gives an apperance of shade.
I usually use one type of wash per basecoat color. So for my old example with the green clothes, pale skin and black shoes, I'd use a dark-green wash on the clothes, a light brown / skin wash for the pale skin, and a dark brown wash for the boots. Don't worry if the parts seem to be too dark or some upper areas are covered with wash - it'll be fixed in the next stage.
4. Highlighting
Once the wash has dried, you'll want to grab out the colors you did the basecoat with. Use this to coat the protruding bits or large areas that are not supposed to be shaded - examples here are the ribs of a skeleton, the forehead, nose, chin and cheeks of a face, the outer ripples of a cloak and so on. How much of the washed area you want to cover is up to you - I prefer recovering most with only having the wash shade the deepest areas, but you might prefer something entirely different.
For highlighting one-colored models or chainmail armor and such, I use drybrushing, as described above.
5. Detailing
Once the basecoat is re-added on top of the wash, you're ready for detailing. This area has two main focuses - details, obviously, but also further highlights.
Details are things like belt buckles, eyes, decorative gems and so on. Depending on the detail you might want to use the basecoat into shading into highlight to get a sense of threedimensionality (such as circular gems for eldar), while some, such as belt buckles and bolts, should only need a black basecoat, a metal overcoat and, if desired, a lighter metal highlight.
Further highlights outline certain lines on your character, such as the edge of cloak ripples, nose bridge/tip and cheekbones, and weapon edges. Highlighting past the basecoat just simply uses lighter and lighter versions of the same color untill you feel you've gotten the effect you want - each new, lighter color should cover a lesser area than the previous, giving it a scale from dark to light.
On September 10 2011 23:29 Darpa wrote: I picked up a fantasy dwarf starter kit a while ago, got to painting it but never played a game.
two questions,
1) how do you find people to play with of your age and skill level? The games workshop that we have here is filled with 10 year olds, not older people, and literally none of my friends play
2) how the hell do you paint it so nicely? mine look like half as good. Do you assemble then paint? or paint then assemble? or a mixture?
1. Cant really answer the first. I havent played in 7ish years...
2. Practice, Practice and more practice. Go online read a few articles here and there. Subscribe or buy the odd issue of White Dwarf (The GW Magazine) since they have good painting articles in them. And keep attempt to try something new or to improve a single thing each time you paint a new model. Whether it be to tighten lines, improve your speed (it typically takes me between 8-10hrs to get through a single model that isnt a vehicle since im slow lol) or whether it be to try NMM (Non-Metallic Metals) or OSL (Object Source Lighting) or stuff lke that.
As for the order you should build and paint... for me it just depends on the model, its significance to me and why im making it. Ill make the model and paint it after if its a standard unit with little detail in hidden spots, i may make parts of the model and then paint it if it has specific parts that have detail in some hard to reach places i want to have accented or some of the time when im doing a model for a painting competition, and ill only do it piece by piece if its a really detailed model that im really trying to make look good (See the pic of the 1/15 scale SM i posted a few above, im doing that section by section due to size, detail and importance to me) So it really just depends on what your trying to do, and what you like to do. Since you can easily paint all models nicely without painting a model piece by piece.
On September 11 2011 02:01 Manit0u wrote: If you're just starting out painting you can achieve good results really easily with Manit0u's 4-step newbie painting technique:
1 - basecoat (preferably black, easier to work with than white) 2 - apply basic colours 3 - use washes of relevant colour to darken things up 4 - drybrush with base colour or a corresponding lighter tone
It doesn't require a whole lot of skill and makes your stuff look decent. When you get more skill you can then always revisit your models painted this way to add more detail and highlighting.
The biggest trick here is to get the right washes and learning proper drybrushing. With washes you should usually go for the same wash as a colour you applied, but not always. Exception here would be red for example, I'm using brown wash for it as red is too bright, red's good for washing orange/yellow though.
Drybrushing is fairly simple too, just needs a bit of patience:
Washes are just very watered-down paints. They're called shades by some companies. If you can't find a wash you need you can always just make it yourself by thinning down the paint with clear water (usually with 1/5-1/7 paint/water ratio, depending on paint). The sole purpose of it is to fill the recesses without covering the original colour.
Whatever route you decide to go (I'd advise getting the washes though, saves you time and will get you better effects if you haven't done it before) you should get the Citadel Badab Black wash. It's called "magic wash" among painters as you can apply it to everything and it produces really outstanding results.
Pro tip for washes, dip the head of a pin or a skewer into some detergent and add the tiniest TINIEST amount to your wash. This breaks the surface tension and causes the wash to flow smoothly into gaps rather than pooling in them , leading to a smoother coat.
Also remember that many light washes beat one heavy wash, the same as coats of paint. Slightly altering the colour of the wash can give a rich hue to an area, for example using brown washes that vary between yellowy and grey brown over skin to give it a rich complexion
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