On August 26 2014 04:04 KwarK wrote:
The rules of economics do not exist in a vacuum. You have to enter being stabbed into an economic cost benefit analysis. The idea of a free market that exists independently of society is an artificial distinction.
The rules of economics do not exist in a vacuum. You have to enter being stabbed into an economic cost benefit analysis. The idea of a free market that exists independently of society is an artificial distinction.
Imagine people arguing over the definition of entropy. And then someone jumps into the discussion to say that string theory is complete crock. That is what is happening here.
This whole discussion started when someone tried to justify the prices of drugs using moral arguments. I pointed out that the important factor behind drug prices is the demand structure of the market, and everything else (that's unregulated) exponentially decays into irrelevancy.
I'm not selling some kind of viewpoint. Demand is an economics term with a well-defined meaning which you have to try quite hard to misconstrue. It is not a moral concept any more than entropy is a moral concept in physics. Additionally, the demand structure theory works perfectly fine in an economy where you have to take into account being stabbed. It is not a philosophy or an ideal. It is a mathematical entity.
On August 26 2014 04:29 Mysticus wrote:
The price of an item in economics reflects a profit maximizing equilibrium when all other factors are accounted for.
Medicine in general, but in the US in particular is a field where all concepts of free economic exchange fails. Hospitals have geographic monopolies in most parts of the country and the demand curved they are faced with is as close to the theoretical static demand as anything in the real world. They can charge anything they like for their services, and often do.
This statement is only true in some kind of perfect auction vacuum (I don't know how else to describe it, as it doesn't exist):
The price of an item is whatever someone is willing to pay for it.
Edit2:
I think the fundamental understanding difference is here:
The fact that the demand for the product was generated by some external factor doesn't matter.
It absolutely matters. A market price can only be set in a market that both parties (buyer and seller) willingly engage in. Otherwise it's something that is not trade.
The price of an item in economics reflects a profit maximizing equilibrium when all other factors are accounted for.
Medicine in general, but in the US in particular is a field where all concepts of free economic exchange fails. Hospitals have geographic monopolies in most parts of the country and the demand curved they are faced with is as close to the theoretical static demand as anything in the real world. They can charge anything they like for their services, and often do.
This statement is only true in some kind of perfect auction vacuum (I don't know how else to describe it, as it doesn't exist):
The price of an item is whatever someone is willing to pay for it.
Edit2:
I think the fundamental understanding difference is here:
The fact that the demand for the product was generated by some external factor doesn't matter.
It absolutely matters. A market price can only be set in a market that both parties (buyer and seller) willingly engage in. Otherwise it's something that is not trade.
See my response to KwarK. When I say "The price of an item is whatever someone is willing to pay for it," I maybe should have said value instead of price. But it's still true. All the time. You're talking about something entirely different. You're talking about how healthy markets should/shouldn't work and so on and so forth. But at the end of the day, the value or price of an item is a concept that works perfectly fine in a completely corrupt and horribly-functioning economy.
"The fact that the demand for the product was generated by some external factor doesn't matter." When you draw the graph at the end of the day, the demand curve still functions whether your market is engaging in healthy or unhealthy activity. A market that's not functioning in a healthy way will still operate by satisfying the demand structure. Whether it should or shouldn't is a completely different topic.