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On June 22 2011 19:20 maJes wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 19:16 M2 wrote:On June 22 2011 19:03 don_kyuhote wrote:On June 22 2011 18:54 M2 wrote:
Sorry, another noob question about Dota: How much money the creeps provide and why is different amount every time? Some kind of random range? If yes, does anybody knows them approximately? something like 38~48 gold coins for melee creeps and 40ish~51ish gold coins for mage creep. So its better to kill the mages if you have to choose? I thought the melees:-)) It's better to kill all the creeps 
Yes, but you don't know about my noobish worries:-)) I am trying to master (or better said get to know) new heroes one at a time and now I am working on Balanar the night demon and I played few games and read few guides and the mother fucker has too many viable options in terms of skill and items builds so I am experimenting which one is best for me.
Now I am trying to use a build where you have 1 point early on void and fear and max the night hunting (forgot the name, the passive skill) first, so you depend ot your speed and attack rate to kill heroes while using void just for slow heroes and last hitting creeps in the lane since it is not so much mana in the 1st level and its ok for last hitting when you cannot do it the other way( its recommded from the guide where it is exlipicitly said that u need some amount of items before start running in the night or the build will not work)
So, it was important to me on where should I spend my mana for last hits
)
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On June 22 2011 19:33 M2 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 19:20 maJes wrote:On June 22 2011 19:16 M2 wrote:On June 22 2011 19:03 don_kyuhote wrote:On June 22 2011 18:54 M2 wrote:
Sorry, another noob question about Dota: How much money the creeps provide and why is different amount every time? Some kind of random range? If yes, does anybody knows them approximately? something like 38~48 gold coins for melee creeps and 40ish~51ish gold coins for mage creep. So its better to kill the mages if you have to choose? I thought the melees:-)) It's better to kill all the creeps Yes, but you don't know about my noobish worries:-)) I am trying to master (or better said get to know) new heroes one at a time and now I am working on Balanar the night demon and I played few games and read few guides and the mother fucker has too many viable options in terms of skill and items builds so I am experimenting which one is best for me. Now I am trying to use a build where you have 1 point early on void and fear and max the night hunting (forgot the name, the passive skill) first, so you depend ot your speed and attack rate to kill heroes while using void just for slow heroes and last hitting creeps in the lane since it is not so much mana in the 1st level and its ok for last hitting when you cannot do it the other way( its recommded from the guide where it is exlipicitly said that u need some amount of items before start running in the night or the build will not work) So, it was important to me on where should I spend my mana for last hits )
Now I understand that you might be a newbie,but Dota is not like sc. You don't have to ''know'' builds,less more executing them perfectly. Dota requires three things,gaming sense,teamwork and map awareness. To grasp what I mean by gaming sense,try to observe 2 top carries solo laning,when they harass,when they hit creeps,when they draw aggro,when they stay behind the tower,if you can explain their actions your understaning of the game is solid.
Boy I got off,anyway I saw you a bit fixated on the ''build'',thought I might as well throw an advise,lol.
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On June 22 2011 19:33 M2 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 19:20 maJes wrote:On June 22 2011 19:16 M2 wrote:On June 22 2011 19:03 don_kyuhote wrote:On June 22 2011 18:54 M2 wrote:
Sorry, another noob question about Dota: How much money the creeps provide and why is different amount every time? Some kind of random range? If yes, does anybody knows them approximately? something like 38~48 gold coins for melee creeps and 40ish~51ish gold coins for mage creep. So its better to kill the mages if you have to choose? I thought the melees:-)) It's better to kill all the creeps Yes, but you don't know about my noobish worries:-)) I am trying to master (or better said get to know) new heroes one at a time and now I am working on Balanar the night demon and I played few games and read few guides and the mother fucker has too many viable options in terms of skill and items builds so I am experimenting which one is best for me. Now I am trying to use a build where you have 1 point early on void and fear and max the night hunting (forgot the name, the passive skill) first, so you depend ot your speed and attack rate to kill heroes while using void just for slow heroes and last hitting creeps in the lane since it is not so much mana in the 1st level and its ok for last hitting when you cannot do it the other way( its recommded from the guide where it is exlipicitly said that u need some amount of items before start running in the night or the build will not work) So, it was important to me on where should I spend my mana for last hits )
On Bala I think max void, 1 point in fear and then max hunter in the night after prioritizing void with ulti whenever. In general, you shouldn't be using single target spells to last hit unless your lane really sucks for you; I especially wouldn't recommend doing it with bala (guide sounds dumb, you take away your nuking power early/mid game so you can last hit creeps with it -_- and you won't have much auto attack damage early game). Get a stout shield when you start which will help you take a lot less damage in lane and practice actually last hitting the creeps. Try to farm a quick treads, vanguard (ring of health is amazing for laning) and bottle and urn. At night go around ganking and killing everything, at day farm.
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Balanar's impact on a game relies way too much on what you can farm during the first 6 minutes and then subsequently what you can achieve in the next 6 in terms of ganking. It's really not a hero I'd recommend for newbie. Better that you quickly familiarize with how it works and what it does and move on instead of trying to figure out specific builds.
As for the furion/aghanims discussion:
Midas is way riskier than Aghanims because you can have a much bigger impact on the game with other items around the time you'd get Midas than with Aghanims. With noone posting anything I decided to do a few numbers; You get 3 "free" bounces from Agha in terms of initial damage and then another 2 at the end. In terms of creeping it's fairly significant because with an unupgraded wrath you need to get in the 14-15th bounce range to kill a melee creep in midgame and with it capped on 16 that's pretty much only a few casters and a handful of melee creeps at best unless the creepwaves were evenly damage somehow. Aghanim's is then atleast probably 5 extra CS per ult so it should be like 20 minutes before its earned itself back which is a lot. The HP boost and the potential to get herokills you wouldn't otherwise get with a weaker ult adds up though... Then again you could argue getting an Orchid at around the same cost or a hex slightly faster holds even more potential than that.
I guess my decision would rest on the game-situation, if the midgame is stalled because we can't tackle them in a straight up teamfight then Agha is probably the way to go, otherwise not.
Again I'd never get Agha/play furion as carry in a competitive or semi-competitive game because its just arrogant and awful against/with good players.
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Incorrect, that's a very common misconception on NS that you HAVE to gank during the first night. You can just as easily pull a stupid good farm and have your team drag the game out. He's pretty fucking impossible to kill during the first night if you play defensively with him.
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Yea, if you get total free farm and come out with a 15 minute relic or Aghs it's perfectly fine. But, 9/10 times it is better to go kill stuff.
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On June 22 2011 21:53 Judicator wrote:
Incorrect, that's a very common misconception on NS that you HAVE to gank during the first night. You can just as easily pull a stupid good farm and have your team drag the game out. He's pretty fucking impossible to kill during the first night if you play defensively with him.
Except you can't expect anything from your team in random games. Naturally, if you're NS in a dual-lane and not lvl 7+ or so with the first night you're much less likely to be able to gank properly and thus farming is the better option.
That said being a non-factor in the first 15 minutes of any random/pub-style game is one of the best ways to easily lose, especially if you're a melee.
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On June 22 2011 22:52 Corr wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 21:53 Judicator wrote:
Incorrect, that's a very common misconception on NS that you HAVE to gank during the first night. You can just as easily pull a stupid good farm and have your team drag the game out. He's pretty fucking impossible to kill during the first night if you play defensively with him. Except you can't expect anything from your team in random games. Naturally, if you're NS in a dual-lane and not lvl 7+ or so with the first night you're much less likely to be able to gank properly and thus farming is the better option. That said being a non-factor in the first 15 minutes of any random/pub-style game is one of the best ways to easily lose, especially if you're a melee.
Funnily enough, that's what I have been doing with most carries in pubs on DotaCash and just play run away from pubs until I can roll them. The problem with trying to gank in those games is that NS solo ganking isn't efficient because once again, you're depending on your teammates to know how to help you. I find it extremely difficult to get people to time their skills properly so the gank is more efficient than the time I would spend farming in a lane by myself.
Of course random scrubs rage at me for playing so passively the first 15-20 mins or so, but then I roll the other team around the 25 min mark and that's end of that.
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On June 22 2011 15:35 FinestHour wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 13:45 xZiGGY wrote:
apparantly theres mods to play practice mode whilst hon is down, so ive been testing the crap out of various jungle builds D: Can you share some of these?
http://forums.heroesofnewerth.com/showthread.php?t=124256
also 12 day stat rollback MASSIVE RAGE since like I've been on holiday for the past fortnight or so. >.<
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Judicator wrote:
Funnily enough, that's what I have been doing with most carries in pubs on DotaCash and just play run away from pubs until I can roll them. The problem with trying to gank in those games is that NS solo ganking isn't efficient because once again, you're depending on your teammates to know how to help you. I find it extremely difficult to get people to time their skills properly so the gank is more efficient than the time I would spend farming in a lane by myself.
Of course random scrubs rage at me for playing so passively the first 15-20 mins or so, but then I roll the other team around the 25 min mark and that's end of that.
Yeah attempting to gank when you rely on allies to initiate or soak up disables is an awful headache. I think NS is one of the easier heroes to pull it off with due to his silence and fairly high hp earlygame. I can't speak for NA-pubs/dotacash as I've pretty much never played there. I'm quite used to playing with russians at iCCup by now and it almost doesn't matter how low their skill is they'll always attempt to push/gank and very rarely stall. Obviously it backfires occasionally but more often than not vs similar baddies the game will be at an almost lockdown because your allies won't get a footing in the game again after getting owned badly in lanes. Back when I played dotaleague SIG's and similar places scrubs weren't nearly as aggressive and you could usually catch a break for 5-10 minutes during midgame and gain some ground back.
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hahah
The stats rollback is hilarious. Personally I don't really care as I haven't played on 'serious' names for a long time, I just lost a couple ~1830 accounts back down to 1800. But I have quite a few friends who gained their 1900s and went back to like 1820. If that happened to be me I'd probably like it though, because I really don't care about being higher ranked when it ruins the queue times. Since everything is rolled back though, the queues will still be exactly the same proportionally so I guess it doesn't really matter in this case.
What's dumb is that S2 apparently didn't have a backup of their data that was newer than 2 weeks old, upgraded both their main data and backups at the same time, somehow catastrophically blew everything up, and had to revert to some obviously very old data. Just hilarious.
On June 22 2011 16:19 Crimson wrote:
Idejder's twitter:
We will explain more soon: 1) There is a 12 day rollback of all stats 2) the store is fully unlocked for everyone to use for now(<3 from us)
looks like shop thing is only temporary
This is irrational but fuck I think it's dumb as hell to put a <3 into that statement, it turns it from a serious statement of their truly massive fuckup into a cutesy little statement like it's some small gift because S2 loves their customers so much they can't be fucked to not be intelligent enough not to take down the main and redundant shit at the same time
oh and last, yes range > melee, gives more xp and gold, but there's only 1 of them to 3 melees ;d
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The day after I break 1900 (got to 1911 to be exact) the servers go down then everything gets rolled back to earlier in the month. Now back at 1850 and probably going to lose most my games since I mainly solo queue.
Not that I care enough to be upset over it, I just find it funny and annoying at the same time 
Stay tuned next week/month for the next S2 fail.
S2 addressing the issue:
+ Show Spoiler +
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my alt went from 1700 to 1500 so i dunno how i feel about that ;p but losing 700-1000 silver coins is a pain in the ass especially since this is the only major clump of freetime im gonna have in quite some time lol
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Anyone want to marathon a few games after my exam to get back our PSR we had before?
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2week rollback...
isn't that pretty fuckign ridiculous? how often do they backup their servers? :|
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God. I played a game where we killed off 2 of hellbournes lanes but then they managed to get megas after a bad engagement. We managed to hold them off and both sides got megas. We just tried to throne it eventually but they used fortitude at 2% and killed most of us while we were just whacking the throne. In the end, 4 of legion was dead while 3 of hellbourne was still up. The throne was literally one hit away from dying and our FA got frozen by glacius.I thought we were screwed but her SKELETON walked up to the throne and killed it. And the replay is lost forever because it was in the last 2 weeks -_-.
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On June 23 2011 02:51 FliedLice wrote:
2week rollback...
isn't that pretty fuckign ridiculous? how often do they backup their servers? :|
once every 2 weeks?
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On June 23 2011 03:14 JeeJee wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 02:51 FliedLice wrote:
2week rollback...
isn't that pretty fuckign ridiculous? how often do they backup their servers? :| once every 2 weeks?
that'd be kind of pathetic...
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EPT
