|
On October 10 2017 02:35 B.I.G. wrote:
I suck with skaven. Have a real hard time winning against pretty much anyone. Any tips on how I should fight with them?
I don't know about other people, but early on in my Queek campaign I relied heavily on lots of Scavenslaves for my front lines and let Queek do the heavy lifting, with backup from 3-4 Gutter Runners and later Death Globe Bombadiers. I teched straight into Artillery. After you get 2-3 catapults it gets a lot easier to take out basically any army. After getting catapults I teched to Stormvermin and realized that it's hard to fund an army like that early on. If I had to do it again I would skip stormvermin and get the flamethrower units earlier, while continuing to rely on slaves for my front line. With slaves you can pretty much always field an army with 20 units because they are so cheap. By turn 65 I had doom wheels which are just nuts. Artillery + doomwheels and ranged do all my damage and the front line is basically there to keep the enemy in place long enough so that your ranged can win the fights.
|
Skaven scare me deeply Ratmen with mutated units and those teeth. They're obviously the most technologically advanced race but lack centralization and material wealth.
|
On October 10 2017 08:22 Sermokala wrote:
Skaven scare me deeply Ratmen with mutated units and those teeth. They're obviously the most technologically advanced race but lack centralization and material wealth.
The general consensus in the lore is that the Skaven have the technology and numbers (Billions) to completely destroy the surface world if they ever got around to it.
So far they have been to busy fighting and double crossing among themselves to do so.
|
On October 10 2017 08:40 Gorsameth wrote:
So far they have been to busy fighting and double crossing among themselves to do so.
Basically post BW Zerg with swarm vs swarm instead of backstabbing.
|
I'm gonna have to break up with Skaven. NOT suitable at all for me haha
|
In my Queek playthrough I got alot of clanrats and a few slave slingers for him. And walled up the port against the elfs. Got a tiny slave army later to support against the constant elf spam that came from the island, but extra garrison + clanrat summons > high elfs .
As Queek slowly went east along the shores. Teched to catapults first and then to stormvermin for Queek. Which allows him to run over Lizardmen easy peasy.
Before that its just alot of flanking and endless fighting against the Lizardmen. As both sides have no real damage dealers.
And then you won. Because Queek starts near 2 easy defendable warpstone provinces. But because the AI doesnt consider Clanrat summons, you will have alot of defending to do. Manual defending, because the AI doesn't use the Clanrat summons well.
Queek also levels so insanely fast that you get his stormvermin talents really damn fast.
I guess you can do the quest battle and get siege weapons from there ? No clue if it works !
Queek campaign really felt like a 1 rat show for me. Since he and his army can be ultra powerful really fast. And because his ambush chance is insane too. So he can just pick apart the chaos armies that spawn on rituals by himself. But because everything i had was eco. Every army I had were Catas + stormvermin + slave slingers. So didnt see alot other skaven units. Found a priest later on and he could summon more clanrats.
Not really fair to be able to summon up to 16 units and have the ability to force 1v1s vs every other army. But yay power fantasy x3
|
First of all: I'm a complete total war noob. Solidly bronze or silver league in SC2 terms. Campaign mechanics I feel fairly comfortable with but in combat many mechanics such as routing/breaking/shattering elude me. I make poor use of heroes because many abilities I don't completely understand. Stuff like dark shards with or without shields are sometimes a bit difficult to choose because I'm not sure what the penalties, if any, are. However using halberds and such against large etc. I understand. If I see vids from more proficient players I see how their lines often stay pretty intact whereas my battlefield, even if I have the upperhand, often completely turns into chaos with everyone running around like idiots (kinda funny actually). Just to paint a picture.
What did me in with my Queek campaign is a lack of food forcing me to go into fights I couldn't win, while at home my newly hired lords didn't stay loyal long enough to even wait a few turns to recruit an army (essentially wasting all my money on a new 20 stack enemy) at around turn 50.
In retrospect I think I made a few mistakes, like trying to expand too quickly and spending too much money on econ buildings and not teching fast enough. Hence the following questions;
-How many turns in should I start getting army no.2?
-How fast should I tech and to what? I plan to go for catapult and stormvermin next time. By what turn should I have that tech available?
-Which skills and tech should I prioritize? Last time i tried to buff clanrats as they are such a central part of the army. Should I skip that and go straight for buffing elites or even focus more on anything that will help my econ? I once saw a dev post about beast men for example saying that there are two researches that were deliberately put early in the tech tree as they were so essential. Anything like that for skaven?
-General army composition. Does catapult + stormvermin + slave slingers really do the trick? I kinds felt that both clanrats and skaven slaves are pretty useless except for being an annoying meatshield. How much meat shield should I have compared to damage dealers should I have percentage wise?
-And finally general combat tactics. Use the cannonfodder to surround and disrupt so the damage dealers can go to work?
Lot of questions, I know. Thanks guys!
|
On October 11 2017 16:24 B.I.G. wrote:
First of all: I'm a complete total war noob. Solidly bronze or silver league in SC2 terms. Campaign mechanics I feel fairly comfortable with but in combat many mechanics such as routing/breaking/shattering elude me. I make poor use of heroes because many abilities I don't completely understand. Stuff like dark shards with or without shields are sometimes a bit difficult to choose because I'm not sure what the penalties, if any, are. However using halberds and such against large etc. I understand. If I see vids from more proficient players I see how their lines often stay pretty intact whereas my battlefield, even if I have the upperhand, often completely turns into chaos with everyone running around like idiots (kinda funny actually). Just to paint a picture.
What did me in with my Queek campaign is a lack of food forcing me to go into fights I couldn't win, while at home my newly hired lords didn't stay loyal long enough to even wait a few turns to recruit an army (essentially wasting all my money on a new 20 stack enemy) at around turn 50.
In retrospect I think I made a few mistakes, like trying to expand too quickly and spending too much money on econ buildings and not teching fast enough. Hence the following questions;
-How many turns in should I start getting army no.2?
-How fast should I tech and to what? I plan to go for catapult and stormvermin next time. By what turn should I have that tech available?
-Which skills and tech should I prioritize? Last time i tried to buff clanrats as they are such a central part of the army. Should I skip that and go straight for buffing elites or even focus more on anything that will help my econ? I once saw a dev post about beast men for example saying that there are two researches that were deliberately put early in the tech tree as they were so essential. Anything like that for skaven?
-General army composition. Does catapult + stormvermin + slave slingers really do the trick? I kinds felt that both clanrats and skaven slaves are pretty useless except for being an annoying meatshield. How much meat shield should I have compared to damage dealers should I have percentage wise?
-And finally general combat tactics. Use the cannonfodder to surround and disrupt so the damage dealers can go to work?
Lot of questions, I know. Thanks guys!
You can hold off on second and subsequent stacks for quite some time (quite often I run around with just a single stack for over 100 turns while I get my tech and economy up). You should be getting new stacks if your economy can support it or if your main stack is strong enough to be sacking stuff constantly so that you can offset negative income.
As far as combat tactics go:
- put cannon fodder in front of your hitters to soak enemy charges/shooting
- usually you don't need more than 2-4 fodder units (depends on their unit numbers, which is pretty high for Skaven)
- if you want to maintain your lines, group units together and lock them (lock icon next to group number), this will make them keep formation while moving and also makes them choose targets separately based on direction and distance rather than everyone piling on the same target
- leadership is important, if it goes too low (many things influence that, how well they do in combat, if there's something scary or much stronger fighting, being flanked, outnumbered, shot at, presence of nearby lords and heroes, support from other units etc.) the unit routs and you can't do anything with it until it regains composure (it can also rout completely off the field without having a chance to rally, this usually happens if fleeing unit is being chased constantly). Unit routing also spread panic among nearby units (bad news for Skaven and their poor leadership)
- high ground advantage is important
- vigor is important - don't run if you don't have to, just advance slowly towards the enemy and only double-click advance/charge when you're close (if you think it's boring you can always fast-forward time). Exhausted units lose a lot of their combat value and it can be a deciding factor in protracted fights.
|
Thanks manit0u. Most of the things you wrote I'm aware of. The chaos usually doesn't ensue until the lines have clashed and some units start routing or someone starts flanking etc. I guess I might be too easily tricked into pursuit while sometimes you should just soak up the skirmisher's damage until you can actually have an effective response.
Also, it surprises me that there seems to be such a lack of guides of this game. Youtube players get 100k+ followers just playing TWWH so you'd say there is a big enough community to spit out some more in depth guides..
|
On October 11 2017 19:24 B.I.G. wrote:
Thanks manit0u. Most of the things you wrote I'm aware of. The chaos usually doesn't ensue until the lines have clashed and some units start routing or someone starts flanking etc. I guess I might be too easily tricked into pursuit while sometimes you should just soak up the skirmisher's damage until you can actually have an effective response.
Also, it surprises me that there seems to be such a lack of guides of this game. Youtube players get 100k+ followers just playing TWWH so you'd say there is a big enough community to spit out some more in depth guides..
Most of the target market for this game are people who've been playing TW series for years and don't need explanations 
You can always read up guides for previous TW games as most of the mechanics should be the same or at least similar enough to get a grasp on. HeirOfCarthage also makes effort to explain his unit choices,what's going on in the game and why he's doing something while playing. Go check his YT channel. You can learn a lot from both his campaign gameplay and multiplayer battle analysis.
And if you don't want your troops to pursue just set them into guard mode (99% of the time I put my skirmishers into guard mode instead of skirmish mode, so they keep shooting instead of running when attacked. Exception here are units that can shoot on the move. Spearmen and line-holding stuff should also be set to guard mode most of the time so they don't wander off in random directions).
|
Someone told me units now auto run when issuing move commands of any type, and that in order for them to actually walk and not exert themselves to lose vigour, you have to manually click the walk button/hotkey instead of good old single click to walk, double to run.
I haven't been able to play since, but it got me curious as to why that would be the case, and whether or not it can be changed to old control scheme.
|
On October 11 2017 21:42 Divine-Sneaker wrote:
Someone told me units now auto run when issuing move commands of any type, and that in order for them to actually walk and not exert themselves to lose vigour, you have to manually click the walk button/hotkey instead of good old single click to walk, double to run.
I haven't been able to play since, but it got me curious as to why that would be the case, and whether or not it can be changed to old control scheme.
Its in the options menu so no worries ^^
|
One of the few things I do remember HeirofCarthage saying is that your units running to their target actually doesn't have that much of impact on vigor.
|
Mortal Empires info interview
So how big is Mortal Empires?
Huge! It’s all of the Old World, obviously with a massively expanded Southlands area, plus areas of Ulthuan, Naggaroth and Lustria. It’s the most character-heavy, faction-packed and content-dense map we’ve ever made, with 35 different legendary lords playable, and all those lovely new gameplay features from Warhammer II (treasure hunting, new UI gubbins, storms at sea etc).
How does it compare to the ‘Russian datamine’ map that did the rounds after Warhammer 1 shipped?
Pretty bang-on to be honest, but that map doesn’t show you how packed the campaign map really is, how much stuff is in there. I fully appreciate it may look a bit squished from a top-down perspective, but a few turns of playing at ground level are enough to make you realise how massive it is.
So there are some parts of the New World that aren’t in Mortal Empires?
Yeah, there’s a whole bunch of design involved here but to boil it down, we’re balancing end-turn times with how the Old World fits in with the new territories. It’s a question of scale versus practicality, and what’s actually fun to play. We could’ve added more regions, but there’s a cost to the player in terms of ballooning end-turn times and a less-interesting slog of a campaign. And bear in mind we’re building this with WH3 in mind as well.
We’ve been playtesting the shit out of every one of the 35 factions on all the difficulty settings, and I think we’ve got the balance in a good place. It’d be easy to get side tracked worrying about geographical reduction, but in fact there’s double the region count over Warhammer 1. I can’t stress it hard enough but seeing a 2D representation of landmass just doesn’t prepare you for the sense of scale you experience over the course of a 50-hour-plus campaign.
I’d add that Warhammer’s all about big characters, big wars, big events and epic culture clashes. We don’t want an Elf player spending half the game just fighting other elves. We want them to spend it re-enacting the War of the Beard for shits and giggles, and still realising they’ve still only seen a third of the map.
Will any of the Old World Legendary Lords get new start positions?
Not yet but watch this space. Our whole focus right now is getting Mortal Empires in great starting form, which is a massive job as I’m sure you can appreciate. Designing and playtesting new LL startposes is on our wishlist but first things first, we want the campaign in tip-top starting shape and fun from every angle before we start dicking around with it. We have a pretty good track record of tweaking and evolving Warhammer, and we’ll carry on doing that.
Worth noting though that there are some interesting switch-arounds for a couple of the New World Lords. Queek starts play in Karrag Orrud, right at the heel of the World’s Edge Mountains, so he’s in immediate contact with Greenskins and a stone’s throw from the Dwarfs, plus he’s in contention for Karak Eight Peaks along with Skarsnik and Belegar. Teclis has also shifted, to the Star Tower off the east coast of Lustria, so his initial concerns are vamps and rats. His is definitely a tough startpos!
Which improvements from the Vortex campaign will be carried into Mortal Empires?
Pretty much everything, I mentioned a few earlier but there’s also universal territory capture, rogue armies, choke-point battle maps, encounters at sea and coastal reefs. It feels quite different to the Old World campaign when you’re playing as one of the Old World factions.
Rites aren’t something Old World factions will be getting, they’re unique to the New World races and part of what makes them special and different to play.
When will Mortal Empires be available for download?
Soon, in a matter of weeks is the plan. We haven’t put a date on it as we don’t want to release it until we’re really happy with it, but it’ll be out in the very near future.
|
We want them to spend it re-enacting the War of the Beard for shits and giggles
This is actually what I was thinking of doing in my first ME campaign.
Also queek getting near Karak-Eight-Peaks is great I can't wait to defeat him with skarsnik
|
On October 11 2017 16:24 B.I.G. wrote:
First of all: I'm a complete total war noob. Solidly bronze or silver league in SC2 terms. Campaign mechanics I feel fairly comfortable with but in combat many mechanics such as routing/breaking/shattering elude me. I make poor use of heroes because many abilities I don't completely understand. Stuff like dark shards with or without shields are sometimes a bit difficult to choose because I'm not sure what the penalties, if any, are. However using halberds and such against large etc. I understand. If I see vids from more proficient players I see how their lines often stay pretty intact whereas my battlefield, even if I have the upperhand, often completely turns into chaos with everyone running around like idiots (kinda funny actually). Just to paint a picture.
What did me in with my Queek campaign is a lack of food forcing me to go into fights I couldn't win, while at home my newly hired lords didn't stay loyal long enough to even wait a few turns to recruit an army (essentially wasting all my money on a new 20 stack enemy) at around turn 50.
In retrospect I think I made a few mistakes, like trying to expand too quickly and spending too much money on econ buildings and not teching fast enough. Hence the following questions;
-How many turns in should I start getting army no.2?
-How fast should I tech and to what? I plan to go for catapult and stormvermin next time. By what turn should I have that tech available?
-Which skills and tech should I prioritize? Last time i tried to buff clanrats as they are such a central part of the army. Should I skip that and go straight for buffing elites or even focus more on anything that will help my econ? I once saw a dev post about beast men for example saying that there are two researches that were deliberately put early in the tech tree as they were so essential. Anything like that for skaven?
-General army composition. Does catapult + stormvermin + slave slingers really do the trick? I kinds felt that both clanrats and skaven slaves are pretty useless except for being an annoying meatshield. How much meat shield should I have compared to damage dealers should I have percentage wise?
-And finally general combat tactics. Use the cannonfodder to surround and disrupt so the damage dealers can go to work?
Lot of questions, I know. Thanks guys!
1) I wouldn't tie it to any specific turn number, but you have to do some mental arithmetic about what kind of upkeep you can support before you go for army number 2, especially as a loyalty race. The only way to continue upgrading your settlements is to have a steady supply of cash, and if you are spending too much on upkeep you rely on conquest to keep growing. Skaven are a bit better about this, because you can always hire a 2nd lord and then just fill his army with slaves and clanrats, and have them join your real army for a giant meat shield.
2) Again, I wouldn't tie it to a specific turn number, but so far I would agree that getting to Plagueclaw Catapults and Stormvermin as quickly as possible is a good strategy. You want your enemy to come to you, break on your wall of slaves and clanrats, and have your Stormvermin mop them up while still at full strength/vigor.
3) As Queek I would prioritize his faction-wide tree since that gives some pretty insane bonuses to all of your provinces/armies, and results in a better ambush chance, which is arguably Skaven's biggest advantage on the campaign map. After that, I think it's up to you but I made him as good of a lord-killer as I possibly could, because Skaven can be lacking in that department. As for unit buffs, you will get to them eventually, and it depends on how your army has fleshed out at that point.
4) Catapults/Stormvermin ended up being the damage-dealing part of my force, but I used a lot of Gutter Runners (to break formation and deal damage) and slaves to fill in the gaps. Remember that if you bring a 2nd army along, you can stuff it with way more slaves/clanrats than you would normally want to take, because you have the army slots. Late-game, it will be hard for you to compete in 1 army vs 1 army scenarios, because you are supposed to outnumber the enemy.
5) For tactics, I've relied on Gutter Runners to do decent damage, attack war machines, and break unit formations, let the catapults do as much damage from a distance as possible, and then let them burn their vigour on my slaves/clanrats. After that, run the Stormvermin in to clean up. On the battlefield, Skaven's biggest strength is definitely the Clanrat-spawning ability (can't remember the name), which is literally insane. Use it to wipe war machines, use it to capture the point in siege battles, use it to flank skirmishers to keep them in place, use it to flank archers, use it to surround elite units once battle lines have been formed. There are so many uses for this ability, and it is literally what makes Skaven obnoxious to play against in multiplayer, because they can spawn a unit anywhere on the battlefield multiple times.
|
Apparently October 26 is a target release date for the Mortal Empire map. Can't wait.
|
Tagging onto the commenting about getting a new army... you can always check the upkeep of your existing army (character screen and a few other places) to get a good rough estimate of how much income you need to support it. The cheapest armies cost around 2,000 upkeep, and expensive ones can get several times that. You want to make sure you've got a surplus over and above your building upgrades by at least that much to field a full stack.
Partial stacks, however, can be useful particularly for putting down rebellions. If you're dealing with a lot of rebellions (e.g., Kroq-Gar taking notEgypt, Skaven being skaveny, Malekith getting fucked over by mommy), it can be handy to have a little stack that can run around to the next rebel spawn spot and drop it when it arrives like so many unfortunate Advent troopers wandering into overwatch traps.
|
295 settlements, over 100 factions.
Mortal Empires is going to be insane.
|
Looking forward to mortal empires. I just feel like some of the old worlds race mechanics and tech trees might feel underwhelming compared to the newer ones. Hopefully every race gets rites down the the line.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
