On October 21 2018 17:45 SatsuinoHado wrote: The moment hu ud and orc start to play with nukers like before is the moment everyone will see how fragile and weak kotg is. But if you want to out do a caster with 2 dispelable spells without dispel or proper nuke you are done for. In november finals of WGL i bet there even top elfs wont get top 3
Well assuming perfect balance (and equal numbers of players for all races), there's a 42% chance of no nightelves making top3 anyway, so I dont really see how this could be taken to prove anything.
It proves that in wc3 like a lot other games the thing that people think is op is in fact the unwillingness of people to adapt and not blindly copy strats. Then again 99% of people just like to follow something they were convinced it is strong or optimal from top players. Anyone who played the game in its prime or at least watched the game can tell you about how people complained about tower rushes in Hu vs Ne then Creolopus defended 3 tower rushes with warden and 2 archers vs defend footmans and boom people overnight stopped doing it. I guess flavor of the month is considered op. If you try to outlast hero whos sole purpose early game is pickoffs and midgame long battles with multiple entangles they will lose. In 1 2 months when people start to farm with almost to no units and start to harass elfs and this keeper is exposed to his weakness but for now I guess we "discuss" how to nerf a hero instead of how to counter hero. Fyi this game did not have single patch for 10 years and this game continued to be played proffesionally with new different strats for years before Sc2 killed it.
I did watch wc3 during its prime long enough to even remember the guy from your signature as a wc3 player (ot is that you yourself). I dont disagree with your wc3-arguments, but I have a problem with the idea of taking an event that is almost be a single cointoss to confirm or deny anything.
On October 21 2018 17:45 SatsuinoHado wrote: The moment hu ud and orc start to play with nukers like before is the moment everyone will see how fragile and weak kotg is. But if you want to out do a caster with 2 dispelable spells without dispel or proper nuke you are done for. In november finals of WGL i bet there even top elfs wont get top 3
Well assuming perfect balance (and equal numbers of players for all races), there's a 42% chance of no nightelves making top3 anyway, so I dont really see how this could be taken to prove anything.
It proves that in wc3 like a lot other games the thing that people think is op is in fact the unwillingness of people to adapt and not blindly copy strats. Then again 99% of people just like to follow something they were convinced it is strong or optimal from top players. Anyone who played the game in its prime or at least watched the game can tell you about how people complained about tower rushes in Hu vs Ne then Creolopus defended 3 tower rushes with warden and 2 archers vs defend footmans and boom people overnight stopped doing it. I guess flavor of the month is considered op. If you try to outlast hero whos sole purpose early game is pickoffs and midgame long battles with multiple entangles they will lose. In 1 2 months when people start to farm with almost to no units and start to harass elfs and this keeper is exposed to his weakness but for now I guess we "discuss" how to nerf a hero instead of how to counter hero. Fyi this game did not have single patch for 10 years and this game continued to be played proffesionally with new different strats for years before Sc2 killed it.
I did watch wc3 during its prime long enough to even remember the guy from your signature as a wc3 player (ot is that you yourself). I dont disagree with your wc3-arguments, but I have a problem with the idea of taking an event that is almost be a single cointoss to confirm or deny anything.
Not to mention how long ago that was. Established strats in younger games are always going to have more ways around them due the the larger number of unknown variables.
I agree with the overall sentiment, particularly in relation to the Keeper fotm, but WC3 got pretty stale in those 10 years. There were minor strategic differences game to game (different creep route here, different expansion timing there) but for the most part matchups always looked really really similar at the highest level. I wouldn't like patching to be this frequent forever, but I'm ok with them doing a bit more in the short term to freshen things up.
On October 21 2018 17:45 SatsuinoHado wrote: The moment hu ud and orc start to play with nukers like before is the moment everyone will see how fragile and weak kotg is. But if you want to out do a caster with 2 dispelable spells without dispel or proper nuke you are done for. In november finals of WGL i bet there even top elfs wont get top 3
Well assuming perfect balance (and equal numbers of players for all races), there's a 42% chance of no nightelves making top3 anyway, so I dont really see how this could be taken to prove anything.
It proves that in wc3 like a lot other games the thing that people think is op is in fact the unwillingness of people to adapt and not blindly copy strats. Then again 99% of people just like to follow something they were convinced it is strong or optimal from top players. Anyone who played the game in its prime or at least watched the game can tell you about how people complained about tower rushes in Hu vs Ne then Creolopus defended 3 tower rushes with warden and 2 archers vs defend footmans and boom people overnight stopped doing it. I guess flavor of the month is considered op. If you try to outlast hero whos sole purpose early game is pickoffs and midgame long battles with multiple entangles they will lose. In 1 2 months when people start to farm with almost to no units and start to harass elfs and this keeper is exposed to his weakness but for now I guess we "discuss" how to nerf a hero instead of how to counter hero. Fyi this game did not have single patch for 10 years and this game continued to be played proffesionally with new different strats for years before Sc2 killed it.
I did watch wc3 during its prime long enough to even remember the guy from your signature as a wc3 player (ot is that you yourself). I dont disagree with your wc3-arguments, but I have a problem with the idea of taking an event that is almost be a single cointoss to confirm or deny anything.
I am that person (I doubt anyone will use my nickname in his signature :D). I used this argument just to give an example. Maybe it was not the best example. I can give you one of my professional career. Back when UD went solo DK and Gargs everyone went DH+Naga. I played Clanwar for my team vs SK Gaming MadQFrog. Who ofc went Gargs + DK but I went solo Panda (which at the time was considered worthless hero) with 2 huntress in to fast 2x AOW hippos and Chimeras. After I went lvl 3 and we fought 2 times he just rage quitted when he saw my first Chimera attacking his towers and he could not kill it. My point is the game gives opportunities but meybe most people dont spend too much time in to thinking about new things and just want to win. Anyway this is my personal believe and I may be a minority.The tournament argument was just statement that most of the top tier pros outplay others based on skill and the balance is not the same as on lower levels not to argue balance based on one tournament. But a lot of people use qualified number of people in specific race to argue balance.
On October 21 2018 17:45 SatsuinoHado wrote: The moment hu ud and orc start to play with nukers like before is the moment everyone will see how fragile and weak kotg is. But if you want to out do a caster with 2 dispelable spells without dispel or proper nuke you are done for. In november finals of WGL i bet there even top elfs wont get top 3
Well assuming perfect balance (and equal numbers of players for all races), there's a 42% chance of no nightelves making top3 anyway, so I dont really see how this could be taken to prove anything.
It proves that in wc3 like a lot other games the thing that people think is op is in fact the unwillingness of people to adapt and not blindly copy strats. Then again 99% of people just like to follow something they were convinced it is strong or optimal from top players. Anyone who played the game in its prime or at least watched the game can tell you about how people complained about tower rushes in Hu vs Ne then Creolopus defended 3 tower rushes with warden and 2 archers vs defend footmans and boom people overnight stopped doing it. I guess flavor of the month is considered op. If you try to outlast hero whos sole purpose early game is pickoffs and midgame long battles with multiple entangles they will lose. In 1 2 months when people start to farm with almost to no units and start to harass elfs and this keeper is exposed to his weakness but for now I guess we "discuss" how to nerf a hero instead of how to counter hero. Fyi this game did not have single patch for 10 years and this game continued to be played proffesionally with new different strats for years before Sc2 killed it.
I did watch wc3 during its prime long enough to even remember the guy from your signature as a wc3 player (ot is that you yourself). I dont disagree with your wc3-arguments, but I have a problem with the idea of taking an event that is almost be a single cointoss to confirm or deny anything.
Not to mention how long ago that was. Established strats in younger games are always going to have more ways around them due the the larger number of unknown variables.
I agree with the overall sentiment, particularly in relation to the Keeper fotm, but WC3 got pretty stale in those 10 years. There were minor strategic differences game to game (different creep route here, different expansion timing there) but for the most part matchups always looked really really similar at the highest level. I wouldn't like patching to be this frequent forever, but I'm ok with them doing a bit more in the short term to freshen things up.
I dont argue to NOT get changes but to have time for people to figure things out before the new changes and inevitable Nerf/Buff's come.
while I am happy about it, especially better BNET, new players and most of the balance that came with 1.29/1.30 and will come, I cant get behind the new graphics.
I hope there is a switch button like SC Remastered.
I read skins, I cry.
At leastt i can finally play female heroes, gonna be fun to have a female death knight fighting a male POTM. (No joking, will set all heroes to female when I got it)
They're not even using hardware tessellation (DX11/OGL4 feature, mainstream GPU support since 2010) on the terrain. Look how flat the ground and water waves are. Come on Activision-Blizzard, even low budget indie developers made better-looking games in recent years.
On November 03 2018 04:40 Lazare1969 wrote: Not impressed.
They're not even using hardware tessellation (DX11/OGL4 feature, mainstream GPU support since 2010) on the terrain. Look how flat the ground and water waves are. Come on Activision-Blizzard, even low budget indie developers made better-looking games in recent years.
I'm not 100% sold on the graphics, but I think the ground should be flat and simple, visual clarity is more important than tall grass and big waves of water.
On November 03 2018 04:40 Lazare1969 wrote: Not impressed.
They're not even using hardware tessellation (DX11/OGL4 feature, mainstream GPU support since 2010) on the terrain. Look how flat the ground and water waves are. Come on Activision-Blizzard, even low budget indie developers made better-looking games in recent years.
I'm not 100% sold on the graphics, but I think the ground should be flat and simple, visual clarity is more important than tall grass and big waves of water.
Warcraft 3 was never meant to be a competitive e-sports game. If you want visual clarity at the cost of bad graphics, turn off the graphics feature, like all the pros who who turn SC2 graphics down to lowest settings.
Remember, this game is far from done. They haven't even done all the races, not even all the Human buildings (the race they worked the most on so far) are in the game.
They will change so much still, even unit models and graphics.
And if I understood Grubby correctly, you can also change to old voices and graphics.
Just having wc3 in the bnet launcher with the new server tech and stuff will do so much.
On November 03 2018 04:58 Garrl wrote: is grubby planning to stream some actual games or is he just gonna stream campaign? surprised there isn't a showmatch or something planned.
It didn't look anything like Blizzard quality to me. I'm sure it's still very early in development. I suppose Blizzcon is a good opportunity and all, but maybe they jumped the gun.
EPT
