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On June 10 2013 03:20 CROrens wrote:
Am i wrong in saying that not being able to play used games is a HUGE deal breaker for ALOT of people? How is it in the USA or western europe?
Here in Croatia not many people can afford to pay 80$ for every game (keep in mind, thats 10% of the average monthly salary here!)
Well, some shops in EU got up to 120% profit from selling used games and thats huge. Used to be less but we changed it.
Its different in UK, they got really low prices there.
Lets say Injustice came out and it cost 60e, we buy it from you for 20e (24e if you are buying something else). And we will sell your used injustice for 45e.
And look you can save 15e thats amazing ! this is HUGE deal for our customers. thats why more than 50% customers buy used games.
Even EA games. Who cares you cant play it over internet. And thats another problem. I would say 70-80% plays only offline.
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Eh, you could probably see it as an attempt to balance the discussion. With the rabid nature of internet communities, sometimes over lies and untrue rumors, it makes sense to want to counteract that on some degree. I mean, we had Reddit sleuths go on a manhunt a couple of months back after the Boston bombing, targeting the wrong people. That happens much more often than people want to admit, and when it happens to a company they lose a lot of money. At one point long ago, they would do a bunch of press reports, but the backlash in these communities just turn into a bunch of "lol, damage control!" circlejerks. Now they're trying different tactics (supposedly).
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On June 10 2013 04:17 aksfjh wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2013 04:16 NukeD wrote:On June 10 2013 04:11 aksfjh wrote:
I'm not even sure why people would be upset over the Reddit thing in the first place. We know companies pay for good reviews on websites or use other tactics to make themselves look better. This is just more of the same from a business. Because its illegal and extremely pathetic? I wasn't aware using social media in a marketing campaign was illegal...
Well false advertising and disloyal competition is illegal and that certainly seems to be what Microsoft is doing here (if that article is trustworthy) so... whats your point?
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Well, if used games are important to you, you aren't a big revenue source for Microsoft. And if you never buy used games you dont care, so they don't really risk a lot by making it difficult for you.
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On June 10 2013 05:04 Catch]22 wrote:
Well, if used games are important to you, you aren't a big revenue source for Microsoft. And if you never buy used games you dont care, so they don't really risk a lot by making it difficult for you.
Surely people who buy used games also buy some new games as well. Turning them away is a bad idea, especially when as we've seen, they're going after the motion-sensing crowd. So they sell a copy of Xbox Fit or Xbox Bowling to everyone, and then never sell anything else again, just like what happened with the Wii. Only the Xbox One will cost way more than the Wii did, so it won't even sell that many of those.
They're driving away the audience that buys lots of games for years so they can get the audience that buys a single motion sensing gimmick game. It's a huge mistake, and I can't believe they're doing it, considering Nintendo did basically the same thing last generation, and ended up reporting their first quarterly loss over it.
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On June 10 2013 05:04 Catch]22 wrote:
Well, if used games are important to you, you aren't a big revenue source for Microsoft. And if you never buy used games you dont care, so they don't really risk a lot by making it difficult for you.
I don't think the used game stuff as in retailer buying you're game back after you're finnished with it is that important for most people . ( Well unless the game truely sucks but then you're at fault ) . Lending , Renting or buying/selling games privatly thats a different question.
There's quite a few console exclusive games i might be willing to pay 5-10 bucks for at best but not 20+. ( similar to why i have so many games on steam ) And so far i did so for consoles on Ebay/garage sales/flea markets . If they eliminates those sales without giving me something similar to the steam sales i'm mighty pissed.
Btw there's an interview with Warren Spector argueing that if games weren't this damn expensive consoles people wouldn't have demand for used games. ( http://www.forbes.com/sites/johngaudiosi/2013/06/07/warren-spector-said-if-publishers-didnt-overcharge-for-games-people-wouldnt-have-to-buy-them-used/ )
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Russian Federation410 Posts
I finally got it, X1 is not a gaming console, it is a HTPC, a Media Center PC. If you look at this from media PC perspective, it all lines up:
1. More or less standard PC hardware: 8-core AMD CPU/GPU, 8 gigs of ddr3 ram, a 500GB HDD. a Blu-ray drive, standard network connectivity solutions.
2. Windows 8 OS (or a modified version of it).
3. No used games (Steam and other digital distribution platforms killed used games market years ago)
4. (Almost) always connected to the internet
5. Supports pretty much every input format: voice, gesture, gamepad, mouse, keyboard, (remote?).
The only difference I can think of is paid online multiplayer service (xbox live gold),
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On June 10 2013 05:10 Millitron wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2013 05:04 Catch]22 wrote:
Well, if used games are important to you, you aren't a big revenue source for Microsoft. And if you never buy used games you dont care, so they don't really risk a lot by making it difficult for you. Surely people who buy used games also buy some new games as well. Turning them away is a bad idea, especially when as we've seen, they're going after the motion-sensing crowd. So they sell a copy of Xbox Fit or Xbox Bowling to everyone, and then never sell anything else again, just like what happened with the Wii. Only the Xbox One will cost way more than the Wii did, so it won't even sell that many of those. They're driving away the audience that buys lots of games for years so they can get the audience that buys a single motion sensing gimmick game. It's a huge mistake, and I can't believe they're doing it, considering Nintendo did basically the same thing last generation, and ended up reporting their first quarterly loss over it.
The original Wii crushed Xbox 360 and PS3 when you talk about console numbers, it really wasn't even close, so that's why their doing it, it's hard to argue with the numbers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_video_game_consoles_(seventh_generation)#Comparison) .
Microsoft wants a piece of that pie
The problem with Nintendo numbers is the Wii U was not good enough, I don't know who decided to release the Wii U as is, but it was obviously a misstep, they tried to reach back out to core video game players somewhat with it, and they failed doing so, and the casual wii users did not see enough there to justify buying a new system.'
The xboxone kinect is a large enough leap, it should attract people to it, just not sure how many, and I agree, the price point is really important.
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On June 10 2013 05:53 BlueBird. wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2013 05:10 Millitron wrote:On June 10 2013 05:04 Catch]22 wrote:
Well, if used games are important to you, you aren't a big revenue source for Microsoft. And if you never buy used games you dont care, so they don't really risk a lot by making it difficult for you. Surely people who buy used games also buy some new games as well. Turning them away is a bad idea, especially when as we've seen, they're going after the motion-sensing crowd. So they sell a copy of Xbox Fit or Xbox Bowling to everyone, and then never sell anything else again, just like what happened with the Wii. Only the Xbox One will cost way more than the Wii did, so it won't even sell that many of those. They're driving away the audience that buys lots of games for years so they can get the audience that buys a single motion sensing gimmick game. It's a huge mistake, and I can't believe they're doing it, considering Nintendo did basically the same thing last generation, and ended up reporting their first quarterly loss over it. The original Wii crushed Xbox 360 and PS3 when you talk about console numbers, it really wasn't even close, so that's why their doing it, it's hard to argue with the numbers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_video_game_consoles_(seventh_generation)#Comparison) . Microsoft wants a piece of that pie The problem with Nintendo numbers is the Wii U was not good enough, I don't know who decided to release the Wii U as is, but it was obviously a misstep, they tried to reach back out to core video game players somewhat with it, and they failed doing so, and the casual wii users did not see enough there to justify buying a new system.' The xboxone kinect is a large enough leap, it should attract people to it, just not sure how many, and I agree, the price point is really important.
Yes, the Wii sold lots and lots of consoles, but aside from selling Wii Fit's to old people, it sold basically no games. Nintendo DID report their first quarterly loss after the Wii, that's indisputable.
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On June 10 2013 05:41 Go0g3n wrote:
I finally got it, X1 is not a gaming console, it is a HTPC, a Media Center PC. If you look at this from media PC perspective, it all lines up:
1. More or less standard PC hardware: 8-core AMD CPU/GPU, 8 gigs of ddr3 ram, a 500GB HDD. a Blu-ray drive, standard network connectivity solutions.
2. Windows 8 OS (or a modified version of it).
3. No used games (Steam and other digital distribution platforms killed used games market years ago)
4. (Almost) always connected to the internet
5. Supports pretty much every input format: voice, gesture, gamepad, mouse, keyboard, (remote?).
The only difference I can think of is paid online multiplayer service (xbox live gold),
Pretty much this. They're just continuing the evolution of the Xbox360.
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On June 10 2013 04:48 maartendq wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2013 03:30 Ratch! wrote:On June 10 2013 03:20 CROrens wrote:
Am i wrong in saying that not being able to play used games is a HUGE deal breaker for ALOT of people? How is it in the USA or western europe?
Here in Croatia not many people can afford to pay 80$ for every game (keep in mind, thats 10% of the average monthly salary here!) And is 30% over here. It's a huge deal in other parts of the world. With all due respect, but if a video game of 80 EUR/USD costs 30% of someone's monthly pay, that person needs to set his priorities straight.
Western Europe and the US accounts for the largest chunk of all console sales because people in these areas have a larger disposable income. Microsoft is focussing on that market, not on the peripheries. Does Peru even have access to Xbox live?
Will need to set his priorities straight, because until now you could have bought an used game from another guy for 20euro or less.
My point is, 140million x360/ps3 consoles were sold, do you guys think that banning used games will reduce that number? Because i know if i cant play used games i wont be able to afford the console, and theres probably alot of people like me.
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On June 10 2013 05:53 BlueBird. wrote:
The problem with Nintendo numbers is the Wii U was not good enough, I don't know who decided to release the Wii U as is, but it was obviously a misstep, they tried to reach back out to core video game players somewhat with it, and they failed doing so, and the casual wii users did not see enough there to justify buying a new system.
Also, if I've understood right, a lot of casuals aren't even aware that Wii U is a new console. Some people think it's just extra equipment for Wii. A name like Wii 2 could have fixed this.
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On June 10 2013 04:48 maartendq wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2013 03:30 Ratch! wrote:On June 10 2013 03:20 CROrens wrote:
Am i wrong in saying that not being able to play used games is a HUGE deal breaker for ALOT of people? How is it in the USA or western europe?
Here in Croatia not many people can afford to pay 80$ for every game (keep in mind, thats 10% of the average monthly salary here!) And is 30% over here. It's a huge deal in other parts of the world. With all due respect, but if a video game of 80 EUR/USD costs 30% of someone's monthly pay, that person needs to set his priorities straight. Western Europe and the US accounts for the largest chunk of all console sales because people in these areas have a larger disposable income. Microsoft is focussing on that market, not on the peripheries. Does Peru even have access to Xbox live?
I was thinking about the minimun wage when i wrote that. Its like 15-20% of the average, but the main point is that people were able to play on their xbox/ps because of the possibility of buying used games.
And of course there is access.
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On June 10 2013 11:26 Ratch! wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2013 04:48 maartendq wrote:On June 10 2013 03:30 Ratch! wrote:On June 10 2013 03:20 CROrens wrote:
Am i wrong in saying that not being able to play used games is a HUGE deal breaker for ALOT of people? How is it in the USA or western europe?
Here in Croatia not many people can afford to pay 80$ for every game (keep in mind, thats 10% of the average monthly salary here!) And is 30% over here. It's a huge deal in other parts of the world. With all due respect, but if a video game of 80 EUR/USD costs 30% of someone's monthly pay, that person needs to set his priorities straight. Western Europe and the US accounts for the largest chunk of all console sales because people in these areas have a larger disposable income. Microsoft is focussing on that market, not on the peripheries. Does Peru even have access to Xbox live? I was thinking about the minimun wage when i wrote that. Its like 15-20% of the average, but the main point is that people were able to play on their xbox/ps because of the possibility of buying used games. And of course there is access.
I think you can make video game purchases go a long way, I know some people like to play 4000 games and get bored of games fast and switch, but I personally like to play one game a lot, and get a lot of mileage out of it. I can see those with low amounts of disposable income having an xbox and playing something like Skyrim like crazy. Obviously if you want the new sports games everytime they come out, the new Gears of War + Halo + Call of Duty each year, + other big titles, the costs are going too accumulate.
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On June 10 2013 05:41 Go0g3n wrote:
I finally got it, X1 is not a gaming console, it is a HTPC, a Media Center PC. If you look at this from media PC perspective, it all lines up:
1. More or less standard PC hardware: 8-core AMD CPU/GPU, 8 gigs of ddr3 ram, a 500GB HDD. a Blu-ray drive, standard network connectivity solutions.
2. Windows 8 OS (or a modified version of it).
3. No used games (Steam and other digital distribution platforms killed used games market years ago)
4. (Almost) always connected to the internet
5. Supports pretty much every input format: voice, gesture, gamepad, mouse, keyboard, (remote?).
The only difference I can think of is paid online multiplayer service (xbox live gold),
This is the point I've been trying to raise since like page 30 or something, lol. It's a media center with gaming on the side, not a game console with media on the side. Hence why it's called the 1, kinda signalling they're trying to restart the wheel on the Xbox. 1 as in this isn't "really" a continuation of the 360.
The gaming portion is honestly fine I guess, we'll have to wait a few years before we find out if the difference between the One and PS4 are actually significant. And I've never bought a used game in my life so I have no clue how that argument goes.
On June 10 2013 04:42 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
But mass downvotes of critical opinions and boosting pro views is frowned upon and rightly so.
I think the point here is that it happens all the time all over the place and the only time people get upset is when they actually find out this happens, when it clearly already happens with every single company already and they just choose to get upset at the times when it becomes relevant and entertaining to get upset.
On June 09 2013 06:10 Djzapz wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2013 05:37 AnomalySC2 wrote:On June 08 2013 15:59 TheRabidDeer wrote:On June 08 2013 15:52 Cramsy wrote:On June 08 2013 09:28 Ponera wrote:
I am already pissed off at the fee to play online on xbox360. There has been nothing but reasons NOT to invest in a console again.
Are the retards in charge of this trainwreck COMPLETELY oblivious to the overwhelming negative feedback? I've yet to see one person on the internet post positively about this...which makes me wonder about the troll potential lol
LOL You're giving reddit and TL a little too much credit there champ Erm, every gaming website said only bad things after the conference. A lot of tech sites had bad things to say too. Can you link to a reputable tech site that sang praises? It's pretty negative overall it seems. There are certainly alot of trolls on the internet but amidst all the memes and blatant fanboy flaming there are plenty of reasonable posters that are worried about the xbone. I still don't think people are making a big enough deal about the kinect surveillance cam. Most people seem to hate on the 24 hour online check-in and used games stance the most. IMO people probably won't really be paying attention about the always-connected kinect when evidence shows that Microsoft has been doing dubious things with it. I'm more annoyed by the fact that you have to buy the damn thing in the first place. I don't want a kinect, I have no use for it whatsoever. Why wouldn't people have the option to buy the Xbone without the fucking thing?
They said during the reveal that the Kinect sensor was going to be part of the system anyways, and the only reason it's actually a physically attached device instead of being inside the Xbox was so you would have the option to relocate the Xbox more easily if you wanted to use the Kinect parts, i.e. keep the Kinect part in one place while your Xbox is in another.
The whole point of the Xbox One is to enable integration with all these touch/motion features. Think of it like having a Nintendo DS without the touchscreen. It's not really a DS is it? It's the same with the One. It's not really the One without this stuff. It's just that lots of consumers can't really wrap their heads around the One not just being a central gaming device.
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On June 10 2013 04:48 maartendq wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2013 03:30 Ratch! wrote:On June 10 2013 03:20 CROrens wrote:
Am i wrong in saying that not being able to play used games is a HUGE deal breaker for ALOT of people? How is it in the USA or western europe?
Here in Croatia not many people can afford to pay 80$ for every game (keep in mind, thats 10% of the average monthly salary here!) And is 30% over here. It's a huge deal in other parts of the world. With all due respect, but if a video game of 80 EUR/USD costs 30% of someone's monthly pay, that person needs to set his priorities straight.
Think for a second how stupid that is to say, that is like saying that somebody who starves in India needs to get his priorities right. It isn't they fault that they get paid less then 1/6 of the salary that they would get for doing the same job in Belgium, it is a result of how the history of they country had unfold. If Belgium would be east from Germany you would be paid much less for doing the same job, how would you set it right, make a time traveling machine?
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On June 10 2013 14:23 Polis wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2013 04:48 maartendq wrote:On June 10 2013 03:30 Ratch! wrote:On June 10 2013 03:20 CROrens wrote:
Am i wrong in saying that not being able to play used games is a HUGE deal breaker for ALOT of people? How is it in the USA or western europe?
Here in Croatia not many people can afford to pay 80$ for every game (keep in mind, thats 10% of the average monthly salary here!) And is 30% over here. It's a huge deal in other parts of the world. With all due respect, but if a video game of 80 EUR/USD costs 30% of someone's monthly pay, that person needs to set his priorities straight. Think for a second how stupid that is to say, that is like saying that somebody who starves in India needs to get his priorities right. It isn't they fault that they get paid less then 1/6 of the salary that they would get for doing the same job in Belgium, it is a result of how the history of they country had unfold. If Belgium would be east from Germany you would be paid much less for doing the same job, how would you set it right, make a time traveling machine?
I think he meant he needs to reconsider even buying video games if it costs 30% of his pay, not that he's insulting him based on his wage.
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If even most of this is true I am selling my 360 and getting a PS3. No more money for MS from me.
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I hope they have a Q&A and are asked about a multiplatform titles and DRM. They can tell the truth or outright lie about it.
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EPT
