Europa Universalis IV - Page 61

Dangermousecatdog

United Kingdom7084 Posts

June 05 2014 13:21 GMT

#1201

I'm not sure I understand. You want to westernise without reforming the government? But you need to reform the government before westernisation. Just play the game how you want to play it. Or adapt to whatever situation occurs.

As for westernisation, I think it is connected to the tech cost penalty. I am not sure.

Broetchenholer

Germany1950 Posts

June 05 2014 15:51 GMT

#1202

I just want to have a chance at actually stepping up to the western powers in the Americas and i wonder how i should do it. Westernisation is a major pain in the ass, but might in the end get me the farthest, while never reforming the government helps me short time but will be very very week until i finally reform the government to jump 15-20 techlevels. I am asking for advise how to proceed, because both options seem to be really bad to me.

LSB

United States5171 Posts

June 05 2014 18:25 GMT

#1203

On June 05 2014 18:08 Monsen wrote:

Show nested quote +

I hope you try it, but I think any WC attempt is doomed to fail with the current rebel mechanics. (Force limits don't matter at all- you'll be at 0 manpower from squashing all the rebel uprisings for the entire game). Maybe with the fast coring you can get enough money to support a myriad mercs but I doubt it.

This might be actually the easiest time to do it. I've been taking it pretty slow. But cores complete so fast (compared to the insane scaling before) and aggressive expansion decay is really fast too.

Here's my current progress so far Tripoli is my vassal. (Vassal integration is nice and fast too), and Malmulks are the only one in a coalition against me.
+ Show Spoiler +

And a Check in at 1600. Gearing up for a war against the timmies. I took naples and pissed off the entire italian region so I am too scared to touch europe. It didn't take very long for the aggressive expansion to burn off. Currently only austria is in a coaltion against me.

+ Show Spoiler +

On a side note, I don't think diplomatic is necessary anymore

Dangermousecatdog

United Kingdom7084 Posts

June 05 2014 18:42 GMT

#1204

On June 06 2014 00:51 Broetchenholer wrote:
I just want to have a chance at actually stepping up to the western powers in the Americas and i wonder how i should do it. Westernisation is a major pain in the ass, but might in the end get me the farthest, while never reforming the government helps me short time but will be very very week until i finally reform the government to jump 15-20 techlevels. I am asking for advise how to proceed, because both options seem to be really bad to me.

You are weak no matter what, if you don't reform the government. The tech you gain from reforming the government will be much more worth than losing all those ideas and buildings, unless you really need the colonists or stability and revolt risk or whatever. Westernisation is another matter that depends on circumstance.

419

Russian Federation3631 Posts

June 06 2014 01:25 GMT

#1205

Anyone got any suggestions for a Najd start (1.5, as I tend to avoid playing new patches until they are stable)? Goal is to become Holy Roman Emperor.

I could in theory convert to Orthodox off Ethiopia's three provinces at game start, or I could try to vassal-annex Georgia. I would also need to secure a strong position against Timurids and later, Ottomans.

Monsen

Germany2548 Posts

June 06 2014 08:58 GMT

#1206

I still have an old Najd 1.5 start savegame around somewhere- basically, turn 0 noCB on Hausa, then ally the ottomans, beat Iraq out of QQ, beat Persia out of the Timmies, then go north against the tartars (to cut off Russia from Siberia) and south to claim Afrika before the colonizers come. After that it should be plain sailing into the rest of Asia (I'm assuming you're trying Jihad). I went exploration first idea- worked out fairly well because you can reach the islands in the Indian ocean and reach the cape fairly quickly. (You obviously don't need religious ideas with the +1 from Najd idea and Judea)

I also theorized about restarting until you get a decent diplo heir, and hope to get rid of your king asap (if I recall correctly Najd starting ruler is awful) and doing the whole "steal Capverden at 99% from Portugal" -> move capitol Colonisation game abuse. Might take a couple of tries though and depends largely on how fast Portugal progresses. In my second Granada campaign I didn't even want to colonize the Americas but for some reason Portugal tried (and apparently failed) to get the African coast first, and the capverden were still uncolonized somewhere around 1470+ whereas they usually are close to finishing the colony in the early 60s. So, when I finished the Re-Reconquista, Andalusian La Plata controlled all of South America!
Good luck.

Monsen

Germany2548 Posts

June 06 2014 09:11 GMT

#1207

On June 06 2014 03:25 LSB wrote:

Show nested quote +

On a side note, I don't think diplomatic is necessary anymore

No offense dude, but you were talking about a world conquest. You have 200 years left to get all of Europe, North and South America, Asia plus islands and Afrika. At this rate you'll not even manage to get Europe, let alone the rest of the world.

edit: noticed you just mistyped the year in your post, getting that far in 1500 is certainly far more progress.
My advise would be to focus on the HRE/ becoming emperor for the extra -10% coring costs. Together with the admin/economic policy you can get up to ~83% reduction.
Good luck.

419

Russian Federation3631 Posts

June 06 2014 09:31 GMT

#1208

Echoing the above points:

Unless you've already converted to Orthodox the HRE is going to take a long while to consume.

The classic England WC opener was so effective because it allowed neutralization of the other major colonizers: Russia, France, Portugal, Spain - before 1500. You really haven't started on that (maybe you've released Perm?) - while its true you can annex-transfer the CNs, it'll still be a problem.

419

Russian Federation3631 Posts

June 06 2014 09:33 GMT

#1209

actually trying to get the HREmperorship as Najd - I feel like Jihad is going to require much more mistake-free play than I'm realistically capable of (I got 80% of my army stackwiped in my first war during the campaign, still won, but obviously that was not idea).

Its 1495 and I've managed to vassalize all the other Arabians and soon will have 5-6 orthodox provinces to work with. 24% religious RR hasn't revolted for the last couple of years though

also having that iqta "new sultan" event is wonderfully craptastic, 0/0/0 leaders are some how able to competently execute palace coups apparently

Monsen

Germany2548 Posts

June 06 2014 09:50 GMT

#1210

Is it even possible to do achievements on an old patch?
Anyways, what kind of orthodox provinces are you talking about- Georgia could get you in trouble with Otto, while moving your capitol to Ethiopia might not work. How did you do it?

419

Russian Federation3631 Posts

June 06 2014 10:42 GMT

#1211

Is it even possible to do achievements on an old patch?

nope, but I play using a "cores never expire" so I wouldn't be able to get them anyways.

I decided to convert using the Ethiopians. You don't need the rebels to take your capital if you're willing to take a -3 stab hit. Orthodox just needs to be dominant religion, of course that is sort of tricky to pull off.

Some selling provinces to vassals and voila:

[image loading]

somehow Ottomans are still friendly. Amazingly enough by cunning use of diversionary war declarations they haven't taken a single Mamluk province.

Monsen

Germany2548 Posts

June 06 2014 10:52 GMT

#1212

On June 06 2014 19:42 419 wrote:

Show nested quote +

somehow Ottomans are still friendly. Amazingly enough by cunning use of diversionary war declarations they haven't taken a single Mamluk province.

Haha, good job, but I don't like your chances of them staying friendly once you switch

Broetchenholer

Germany1950 Posts

June 07 2014 00:56 GMT

#1213

My god the AI is so fucking stupid. Playing as Pequot, controlling NA and parts of the caribbean + Mexico. Having colonies in Panama creates a colonial nation for me and i think, nice, maybe they colonize for me. What they do though is to attack the Spanish colonial nation next to them. Spain get's called into it, portugal gets called into it, GB gets called into it and Naples as well

I become warleader and am 6-7 militarytech behind. How can the AI make such basic diplomatic mistakes? Even if it counts me as equal to GB, Spain and Portugal based on base tax or some bullshit like that, thanks to the colonial nations it would still have been 1:2 army numbers. I have no idea how i survived that...

Monsen

Germany2548 Posts

June 07 2014 07:46 GMT

#1214

The AI being stupid is nothing new. Every player is taking advantage of it all the time. I've no idea why you would want a colony in America when your capital is on the continent though. Just always have a land connection and get the full manpower/cash?

annedeman

Netherlands350 Posts

June 07 2014 08:56 GMT

#1215

nooos, i just fucked up my ironman gelre->netherlands game, i dowed on france wo was fighting an alliance of bohemia(blobbed and emperor), and I was allied with castille and austria and thought this was a good oppertunity to prevent france who hates my guts from blobbing further, but austria had just fought venice and his 72k manpower was stuck in italy(venice still owned a stroke of land to cut off austria from its mainland while austria took some provinces in middle italy) while 50 k manpower of castile was stuck on the babary coast due to naval superiority of france, so i got wrecked.

i guess thats part of the learning process

edit: castille had formed spain

Monsen

Germany2548 Posts

June 07 2014 09:25 GMT

#1216

Yeah, shit like that happens. I had a very similar experience in my first try with Granada where I took over the Balkans. I was westernized, allied with Ottomans to the south(east), Hungary to the north was just getting crushed by Austria+ friends, while Castille just had declared war on Aragon. "Time to get those Aragon holdings in Italy" I thought (Aragon was allied to Hungary).

A few days later: tiny Tuscany and Ferrara declare coalition war on me, for some reason the emperor (Austria) joins in. Austria immediately makes peace with Hungary and starts carpet sieging my lands, the Ottomans break their alliance. After occupying half of the aragonese homeland, Castille crumbles under aragonese/portuguese pressure and peaces out. Ottomans declare war on my vassal Serbia (used Serbia to not get border problems with Otto), Naples declares war on me.

From picking on a weakened target with the strongest nation as my ally to 4 different wars, two of which are against the biggest bullies on the playground, within a few months. Fun times

Broetchenholer

Germany1950 Posts

June 07 2014 14:02 GMT

#1217

I didn't even know, this would prevent it

I just saw that juicy 7 basetax province (Cartagena?) and thought, well, better get that before spain and portugal take the whole coast. Then they both expanded in different directions and i had two provinces there as my foot in the door.

Aaaand, i thought it wasn't even possible for your colonial nation to call you into war with another colonial nation. Could it be the problem is, that i am somehow also allied to them?

419

Russian Federation3631 Posts

June 08 2014 00:07 GMT

#1218

Aaaand, i thought it wasn't even possible for your colonial nation to call you into war with another colonial nation. Could it be the problem is, that i am somehow also allied to them?

as a colonial overlord, you can always get into a CN vs CN war by using enforce peace. However, if you do so, their overlord also gets called in.

What likely happened is that Spain enforced peace on your CN because theirs was losing, that automatically pulls you into the war as well.