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NBA Offseason 2012 - Page 66

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krndandaman
Profile Joined August 2009
Mozambique16569 Posts
August 10 2012 06:37 GMT
#1301
--- Nuked ---
RowdierBob
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
Australia13385 Posts
August 10 2012 06:40 GMT
#1302
People shouldn't give Stern too much shit for this. The Hornets situation was very different.
"Terrans are pretty much space-Australians" - H
Ace
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States16096 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-10 06:55:47
August 10 2012 06:48 GMT
#1303
On August 10 2012 15:36 RowdierBob wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 10 2012 15:27 Ace wrote:
I love how the Lakers keep the rape train going. Orlando is as usual, stupid.

Denver is going to be a MONSTER team next year, or at least has the potential to be.


Haha, yeah. Philly, Denver and LA are actually all better from this trade, but Orlando is getting so monumentally shit on it beggars belief as to why they'd okay it...

Maybe they'll "miraculously" win the lotto in a couple of year ala the Hornets or Chicago.


Lmao yea. Amazingly Orlando turned down two MONSTER offers from Brooklyn and Houston (unprotected first rounders are GOLD) for this heap of shit.

I think Hollinger sums it up best (Insider Article c/p'd)


ESPN.com | August 9, 2012
That's it?

Wait, let me rephrase that.

THAT'S IT????!?!?!?!?!?!?

John McEnroe-like wonder fills me at the reported Dwight Howard trade to the Lakers. You cannot be serious! I keep hoping in vain for David Stern to intervene and void the trade for basketball reasons. Or any other reason.

This deal makes a mockery of the new collective bargaining agreement's alleged fairness to small markets; Orlando is selling one of the best players in the NBA for pennies on the dollar, while the rich only get richer. (But the tax-paying Lakers can't sign-and-trade Matt Barnes -- that'll show 'em!)

Mark my words: When we have our next lockout in 2016, this trade will be one of the flash points. The Lakers have a $99 million payroll, and will go over the century mark if and when Devin Ebanks and Barnes re-sign. For the small-market owners, all they can do is count the luxury tax dollars from L.A. and golf clap over their 53-win glass ceiling. That's better than losing money, but they're still hermetically sealed off from a taste of the championship unless they're either incredibly lucky or incredibly brilliant. (Schedule alert: The Lakers don't visit the House That Dwight Built And Promptly Vacated until March 12.)

To review the known details for each team in this complex deal, which is pending a Friday morning trade call:

- The Lakers give up Andrew Bynum, Christian Eyenga and a protected 2017 first-round pick, and receive Howard, Chris Duhon and Earl Clark.

- The Nuggets give up Arron Afflalo, Al Harrington and a protected first-round pick, and receive Andre Iguodala.

- The Sixers give up Iguodala, Nikola Vucevic, Moe Harkless and a protected first-round pick that can be no earlier than 2015, and receive Bynum and Jason Richardson.

- The Magic give up Howard, Richardson, Duhon and Clark, and receive Afflalo, Harrington, Vucevic, Harkless, Eyenga and the three protected first-round picks mentioned above.

Basically, I like this deal for the other three teams ... and hate it for Orlando. Let's break it down for each one:

Orlando Magic

I don't feel totally comfortable ripping them because I don't know what competing offers they had, but I have a hard time believing they couldn't do better than this. Suddenly, overpaying Brook Lopez doesn't sound so bad.

The Magic didn't generate that much salary-cap savings, but they don't really need to. They'll have max cap room heading into the 2013 offseason, and they'll be even further under cap if they cut partially guaranteed deals belonging to Harrington and Hedo Turkoglu.

But let's put it this way: The two players they received as salary ballast wouldn't have been my first two choices from the three other rosters in this deal.

Afflalo is a halfway decent scorer who decided he was The Man last season and stopped played defense. He's a hard-working, quality player, but he's also owed $31 million over the next four years and he'll be 27 years old by the start of this coming season.

Harrington had a nice 2011-12 too, but Denver was wise to sell high. He's also a Fluke Rule player (i.e., his stats can be expected to regress sharply next season), has a bad knee and is 32 years old. Just what you need to rebuild.

Together, the Afflalo and Harrington make nearly as much as Howard, and I'd argue that their two contracts have negative value going forward (although the Magic could still cut Harrington after the season and save half the money since his deal is only 50 percent guaranteed).

Oh, the Magic got some other things out of it, but it's all flotsam. They received three first-round picks, but they won't get much immediate help from those -- Philly's pick won't arrive until 2015 at the earliest, and the pick from the Lakers won't be available until 2017.

The Magic also get two recent draft picks in the deal, Harkless and Vucevic, so they'll argue that they got five first-round picks for Howard. But they'll likely end up being five low-value firsts at the back end of the draft. In fact, they're guaranteed to be bad, since our Marc Stein reports that all three future ones are lottery protected. Of the other two, Vucevic is a solid backup center but nothing special, and I thought Harkless was a reach as a first-rounder.

Instead, the only lottery pick Orlando gets out of this is its own, after what figures to be a 19-win season in 2012-13 leaves the Magic with a top-five pick.

The amazing part, however, is what Orlando didn't get out of this: No Bynum. No Pau Gasol. Not even an Iguodala. I have a hard time believing they couldn't stick the Lakers with Harrington and Magic forward Glen Davis in return for Gasol, given that the Lakers had no other realistic means of acquiring Howard.

It appears Orlando wants to rip its roster down to the studs and emulate the Oklahoma City model -- after all, new general manager Rob Hennigan came from the Thunder -- and perhaps they can pull it off. Now all they have to do is select an all-time great and two other All-Stars in the next three drafts, and they'll be all set to emulate the Thunder.

Los Angeles Lakers

This is going to be so funny next summer when Howard spurns the Lakers to sign with the Hawks.

(Wakes up.)

Holy hell, it's good to be the Lakers. After somehow parlaying a pile of backyard trash into Steve Nash, they now have converted the very good Andrew Bynum into the absolutely dominant Dwight Howard. As reported, they somehow didn't have to give up Gasol, or even take back any bad contracts. But I'm sure they're crying a river over the 2017 first-round pick they had to give up. You'll excuse the Spurs and Thunder for feeling like they're playing a game that's rigged against them.

It leaves the Lakers with a bit of a Miami in 2010-11 scenario, where the pieces don't quite fit and they have to figure out how to make them mesh. As it was with Miami, having pieces like these means it probably doesn't matter.

Process this: Pau Gasol is the fourth option. The Lakers are running the pick-and-roll with Nash and Howard, Gasol lifting for the mid-range J and Kobe lurking on the weak side? Good luck defending that.

There is some risk that Howard will leave after the season, but it was equally present with Bynum. The new CBA incentivizes players to test free agency, so flight risk is part of the equation going forward. But again, when you're the Lakers, flight risk is much less of a problem than it is for, oh, say, Orlando.

Philadelphia 76ers

I've been harsh on Philly's front office, but this is a heck of a deal for them. Players like Bynum weren't going to just show up in Philadelphia, but between having his Bird Rights and his growing up in nearby central Jersey, he's about as minimal a flight risk as they could hope to get.

Suddenly, the Sixers have a building block in the middle, and it didn't even cost them that much. Iguodala is a heck of a player and will be missed, but the other assets they relinquished were fungible. And even though Richardson is on a bad contract, he isn't exactly dead weight -- especially with a big man to draw double-teams.

Of course, this makes the preceding events of the summer only look more foolish. Elton Brand would have been great next to Bynum, there's no need for Kwame Brown to play a minute on this roster (not that there was before) and Nick Young and Dorell Wright are redundant next to Richardson. Philly still has some work to do to get its roster shipshape for opening day. (Also, Philly: Any time you want to sign a backup point guard, go right ahead. Really.)

But as for this trade? There's no way Philly couldn't do this deal. When you're one of the Other 25 in the league, you have to take chances on elite players when they come. The Sixers are taking a calculated gamble, and it should pay off. Their worst-case scenario is they get one year of Bynum and drop Iguodala's contract, which isn't necessarily a bad thing on its own.

Denver Nuggets

I love this deal for the Nuggets. Loveitloveitloveit. Iguodala is a hellacious wing stopper, the perfect compliment for Danilo Gallinari, and his transition play will only be more terrifying surrounded by all of that speed in Denver. The Nuggets are selling high on two players (Afflalo and Harrington) who may have peaked last season (especially Harrington), and move themselves a bit closer to making their no-stars model a viable one for getting beyond the first round of the playoffs.

The only little fly in the ointment is that they helped the Lakers get Howard. Um, that's gonna be a problem. But Denver got better too, and did so while actually improving its cap position, since Iguodala only has two years left on his deal. The Nuggets wriggle out of about $23 million in future money, or $16 million if you subtract the non-guaranteed part of Harrington's deal, and put themselves in position to be a cap team in 2014 if this doesn't work.

As an aside, it also appears that the Nuggets have become masters of what we'll call the "delayed sign-and-trade." After mild overpays of both Nene and Afflalo last summer, done to keep each from departing without compensation, Denver quickly moved them along before the deals came back to bite them. The race between Wilson Chandler and JaVale McGee to be the next one should be entertaining.


Seriously though how do you come out of a 4 team trade without even the 3rd best player and some shitty protected picks? Is Hennigan a fucking moron? lmao holy shit

Edit 2: Lmao crap I can't stop laughing hahahaha. AL FUCKING HARRINGTON! 32 year old Al Harrington is the face of the franchise?! hahahahahahahahahahaha
Math me up, scumboi. - Acrofales
RowdierBob
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
Australia13385 Posts
August 10 2012 07:07 GMT
#1304
Nah dude, they have Afflalo too!

And some high first round picks.

I didn't like the Nets' deal, but at least it was better than this (marginally).

But if Houston was really offering everything and the kitchen sink--which was previously rumoured--then Hennigan needs to be fired.
"Terrans are pretty much space-Australians" - H
Ace
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States16096 Posts
August 10 2012 07:15 GMT
#1305
The Nets deal was better. Any franchise giving you unprotected picks when you want to rebuild is great. Getting 3 protected picks (one in 2017 lmao) from teams going to the playoffs for sure is just a worse deal, compounded by the fact that you don't get any great players AND you don't shed bad contracts.

I mean...I guess they'll eventually have cap space but no marquee FA to use it on. Fucking morons lmao.
Math me up, scumboi. - Acrofales
XaI)CyRiC
Profile Joined October 2002
United States4471 Posts
August 10 2012 07:17 GMT
#1306
I can only assume that D12 and Bynum, and their people, were doing everything they could to discourage HOU from trading for either of them. Either that or it was made clear to HOU that D12 would not re-sign with them and make a stink all season, and they didn't want any part in helping the Lakers get him. The Rockets had the best assets for ORL by far, so something must have been going on.
Moderator
Ace
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States16096 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-10 07:55:52
August 10 2012 07:39 GMT
#1307
hahahahahaha

http://truebluenation.com/forum/index.php?/topic/23349-the-dwight-howard-drama-unfolds/page__st__9756


Bruce Arthur ‏@bruce_arthur

And of course, nine of the 12 members of the 2012 team play in Miami, NY, OKC, or LA. And that's without Wade, Howard, and Bosh.


Bruce Arthur ‏@bruce_arthur

But don't worry, small markets: you could probably trade for the rest of the 2008 team: Carlos Boozer, Michael Redd, and Tayshaun Prince.


Bruce Arthur ‏@bruce_arthur

Oh, and at the time those nine 2008 players played for Cleveland, Orlando, Utah, New Orleans, Dallas, Toronto, Denver, Miami and the Lakers.


Bruce Arthur ‏@bruce_arthur

Now those nine guys from 2008 play for the Lakers, the Clippers, the Knicks, the Nets, and the Heat. So, yeah.


Pretty sure there's a lockout coming in 2016
Math me up, scumboi. - Acrofales
slyboogie
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States3423 Posts
August 10 2012 08:59 GMT
#1308
On August 10 2012 15:27 Ace wrote:
I love how the Lakers keep the rape train going. Orlando is as usual, stupid.


Denver was involved. Too soon.
"We dug coal together." Boyd Crowder, Justified
TwoToneTerran
Profile Joined March 2009
United States8841 Posts
August 10 2012 09:45 GMT
#1309
On August 10 2012 17:59 slyboogie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 10 2012 15:27 Ace wrote:
I love how the Lakers keep the rape train going. Orlando is as usual, stupid.


Denver was involved. Too soon.


What? Rape has nothing to do with mass shootings, regardless of the poor taste in analogy.
Remember Violet.
Daozzt
Profile Joined July 2010
United States1263 Posts
August 10 2012 09:55 GMT
#1310
On August 10 2012 18:45 TwoToneTerran wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 10 2012 17:59 slyboogie wrote:
On August 10 2012 15:27 Ace wrote:
I love how the Lakers keep the rape train going. Orlando is as usual, stupid.


Denver was involved. Too soon.


What? Rape has nothing to do with mass shootings, regardless of the poor taste in analogy.


Was probably a jab towards Kobe.
Zorkmid
Profile Joined November 2008
4410 Posts
August 10 2012 13:34 GMT
#1311
On August 10 2012 15:10 XaI)CyRiC wrote:
As a Lakers fan, all I can do is smile


I envy you, you get to watch Steve Nash every night
seanisgrand
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States1039 Posts
August 10 2012 13:44 GMT
#1312
Lakers got the guy they needed in order to discourage the exploitation of Steve Nash by other speedy WC point guards. The fact is that they needed a guy like Dwight who would actually bring it every night. Bynum had all the capacity in the world to play this role but he simply did not have that defensive intensity or desire.

I'm not entirely sold on Dwight as a player and I never have been, but I think that Dwight as a personality and player fit what the Lakers are trying to build much better than Andrew did.

As far as other fans or teams complaining about the Lakers getting another favorable trade their way as well as the whole "What CBA?" sentiment, I'll just quote Kobe from a few years ago after receiving a fine from the league office:

"Fuck it, don't care, can afford it."
This is well below quality expected of a post in any forum. -Empyrean
MassHysteria
Profile Joined October 2010
United States3678 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-10 15:25:02
August 10 2012 15:16 GMT
#1313
Lakers get Duhon as well? Oh hells yes.!! It wouldn't surprise me if Blake gets amnestied now, although I can also see why they wouldn't want to do that either (depth). They would definitely amnesty MWP if they had someone else decent at SF..

And too soon to be talking about lockouts already lol. We haven't even seen the effects of this last season's lockout yet and people are wanting another one? Wait until teams have to pay the multiple-year luxury tax in a few years to say anything, or even just wait until next season when a lot of the new provisions for FA kicks in. Only until teams actually have to sign the big checks for the league will we then know if this CBA changed anything at all, or how little/big changes it did produce. One trade doesn't mean that much for the effects of the CBA.

edit; if anything, this trade can almost still be classified under the last CBA still.
"Just ban all the J's...even jinklejoes" --unnamed source
Zorkmid
Profile Joined November 2008
4410 Posts
August 10 2012 15:17 GMT
#1314
On August 11 2012 00:16 MassHysteria wrote:
Lakers get Duhon as well? Oh hells yes.!! It wouldn't surprise me if Blake gets amnestied now, although I can also see why they wouldn't want to do that either (depth). They would definitely amnesty MWP if they had someone else decent at SF..

And too soon to be talking about lockouts already lol. We haven't even seen the effects of this last season's lockout yet and people are wanting another one? Wait until teams have to pay the multiple-year luxury tax in a few years to say anything, or even just wait until next season when a lot of the new provisions for FA kicks in. Only until teams actually have to sign the big checks for the league will we then know if this CBA changed anything at all, or how little/big changes it did produce. One trade doesn't mean that much for the effects of the CBA.


They should keep Blake. With Howard in the middle, he's going to have open 3's all day.
rei
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States3594 Posts
August 10 2012 15:27 GMT
#1315
It's ganna be interesting to see how well Kobe does without dominating the ball. He won't be getting 20shots a game every night for sure. and Howard is ganna get all kind of loops, all he had to do is run toward the basket without the ball. And then finally This LA defense is upgraded big time, and look out for 50point blow outs when they stomp through weak teams and make nba competition looks like a joke.
GET OUT OF MY BASE CHILL
Zorkmid
Profile Joined November 2008
4410 Posts
August 10 2012 15:29 GMT
#1316
On August 11 2012 00:27 rei wrote:
It's ganna be interesting to see how well Kobe does without dominating the ball. He won't be getting 20shots a game every night for sure. and Howard is ganna get all kind of loops, all he had to do is run toward the basket without the ball. And then finally This LA defense is upgraded big time, and look out for 50point blow outs when they stomp through weak teams and make nba competition looks like a joke.


NBA competition IS a joke.

I hope they fix it.
Tiegrr
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States607 Posts
August 10 2012 15:34 GMT
#1317
Ugh. LA is the new Heat in terms of casual NBA bandwagoning.
seanisgrand
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States1039 Posts
August 10 2012 15:40 GMT
#1318
LA has always been the casual NBA bandwagoner team. The Heat merely took the crown for a couple seasons.
This is well below quality expected of a post in any forum. -Empyrean
dgsdm
Profile Joined March 2012
198 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-10 16:00:29
August 10 2012 15:59 GMT
#1319
Just posted on fb by Kobe:

"Well, it looks like Superman has found a home. I wish nothing but the best for Big Bynum. I hope he follows what was a great season last year with an even better one next year. I know LA is excited about the deal and rightfully so. The Lakers landed a piece that will hopefully carry the franchise long after I'm gone. I have spoken to Dwight Howard already and we are locked and loaded to bring back the title. Wow, what a summer Jimmy and Mitch have had so far. Unreal! I'm focused on our semifinal game vs Argentina but I had to pause for a few to send you my thoughts, in case you were curious.."



I'm moving to LA pretty soon and I'm looking to buy game tickets. For those of you guys living in LA, can you guys give me some advice on where and how I should go about getting tickets?
Chunhyang
Profile Joined December 2011
Bangladesh1389 Posts
August 10 2012 16:07 GMT
#1320
See, NOW you veto.
If you could reason with haters, there would be no haters. YGTMYFT
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