EPTNFL 2012 Season - Page 148
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Teoita
Italy12246 Posts
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Ferrose
United States11378 Posts
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
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SweeTLemonS[TPR]
11739 Posts
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
On November 22 2012 13:43 SweeTLemonS[TPR] wrote: But at the same time, there is probably the feeling that they need better play out of the QB. Smith is not going to kill you in games, but he's not going to put the team on his back very often either. It's a risky move, but it could be worth it. I think the real danger is in the move not working out, and it fucking up Smith's mentality to the point that he won't play well for the team. Don't get me wrong, I don't like Smith as a QB. He always has had a weak arm. Worse still, he has taken such a beating over the years that he has lost whatever edge that he had and is too conservative to be an elite QB. Kaepernick made like half a dozen throws last game that Smith either would never try throwing or is simply incapable of making. Hell, Smith has been so bad about missing wide open receivers on the deep ball that I have wanted to stab myself in the eye with a fork while watching him play. Kaepernick definitely has far more potential than Smith. That's obvious to everyone. | ||
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Wolfswood
United States349 Posts
The Bears were frauds all along but the Hawks are legit. The division is still too close to call but I fully expect it to come down to the wire, due in part to Seattle sweeping its remaining divisional games, all of which are at home. | ||
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SweeTLemonS[TPR]
11739 Posts
In other words, shut the fuck up about the Bears being frauds. They lost by 6 to the team that's still considered by most to be the best in the league, and that game could just as easily have been a win with a made field goal from Robbie Gould, and a TD pass that wasn't dropped by Marshall. If you don't know what you're talking about, keep quiet while informed people talk, and learn something. | ||
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SweeTLemonS[TPR]
11739 Posts
On November 22 2012 14:01 xDaunt wrote: Don't get me wrong, I don't like Smith as a QB. He always has had a weak arm. Worse still, he has taken such a beating over the years that he has lost whatever edge that he had and is too conservative to be an elite QB. Kaepernick made like half a dozen throws last game that Smith either would never try throwing or is simply incapable of making. Hell, Smith has been so bad about missing wide open receivers on the deep ball that I have wanted to stab myself in the eye with a fork while watching him play. Kaepernick definitely has far more potential than Smith. That's obvious to everyone. Yeah, I don't think we're disagreeing at all. It's unfortunate for Smith, given all that has happened with his tenure with the Niners, but it's a logical decision to try and rid the team of Smith's shortcomings. Their decision still comes with a ton of risks. I think I'd rather have an experienced guy like Smith in the playoffs over Kaepernick, especially given that he played some lights out football in the play offs last year. First year starters typically don't fair well in the playoffs... but then again, Tom Brady won a Super Bowl after getting a starting spot midway through the season, and they allowed the defense to carry them to the Super Bowl. There are some parallels we can draw from these two scenarios, though it's FAR too early to start speaking Kaepernick's name in the same breath as an all-time great in Brady. | ||
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Wolfswood
United States349 Posts
Indianapolis St. Louis Dallas Jacksonville Detroit Carolina Tennessee Please point out to me one impressive name on that list. The only winning record is Indy and that was Luck's first game ever. The simple fact is Chicago's offense is bad even with Cutler, and with Campbell they are utterly pants. They've been riding a D that has feasted on bad quarterbacks and has been turning the ball over at an unsustainable rate, not to mention the ludicrous amount of points they've generated defensively. Also if you could try to not be such a douchebag just because someone says something not-nice about your team that would be appreciated. I'm one of the few people you're going to find on this board who actually played organized football and even knows what Cover 2 means so please don't jump to conclusions just because someone disagrees with you. | ||
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Ferrose
United States11378 Posts
On November 22 2012 14:15 Wolfswood wrote: Kaepernick, Smith, it doesn't matter, SF is going to get smashed when they head up to Seattle in December. The Bears were frauds all along but the Hawks are legit. The division is still too close to call but I fully expect it to come down to the wire, due in part to Seattle sweeping its remaining divisional games, all of which are at home. That 1-4 road mark says otherwise about Seattle imo. And they aren't getting gifted a home playoff game this year if they make it in. And you even watched a Bears game this year? It's not about who the Bears beat. It's how they beat them. They destroyed all those teams except the Lions, and they held the Lions scoreless till there was less than a minute left in the fourth quarter. Meanwhile teams like Atlanta just barely beat some of the worst teams in the league (they actually have the lowest strength of schedule in the entire NFL and their remianing schedule doesn't get much better), with the only .500 team they beat all year being the Broncos. | ||
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SweeTLemonS[TPR]
11739 Posts
On November 22 2012 14:44 Wolfswood wrote: Chicago's wins: Indianapolis St. Louis Dallas Jacksonville Detroit Carolina Tennessee Please point out to me one impressive name on that list. The only winning record is Indy and that was Luck's first game ever. The simple fact is Chicago's offense is bad even with Cutler, and with Campbell they are utterly pants. They've been riding a D that has feasted on bad quarterbacks and has been turning the ball over at an unsustainable rate, not to mention the ludicrous amount of points they've generated defensively. Also if you could try to not be such a douchebag just because someone says something not-nice about your team that would be appreciated. I'm one of the few people you're going to find on this board who actually played organized football and even knows what Cover 2 means so please don't jump to conclusions just because someone disagrees with you. Texans wins: Miami Jax (2) Denver (not playing well at that time, 1-2 entering that game) Tennessee Jets Baltimore Buffalo Chicago Atl's wins: KC Denver (Again, same as above, Denver played like shit the first 4 weeks) SD Car Was Oak Philly Dal Arizona SF: GB Det NYJ Buffalo Seattle Arizona Chicago Denver: Pit Oakland SD (2) NO Cincy Car Name the impressive wins for those teams. GB for the Texans and Niners? Maybe. GB wasn't playing well until week 6. New Orleans? If they beat them last season it'd be impressive. The Texans beat Baltimore. Atlanta has 0 impressive wins, and has played close with scrub teams. SF beat GB and Chicago, lost to Minnesota, and got torched by the Giants, then tied with the Rams. The Bears may not have beaten impressive teams, but they blew them out. 41-21 vs Indy. 23-6 vs StL, 34-18 vs Dallas, 41-3 vs Jax, 51-20 vs Tennessee. Their losses have been mostly close. 23-10 vs GB (and GB started in plus territory for a good portion of the game, holding them to 23 was good, but the offense was atrocious). 13-6 vs Houston - the best team in the league, and as stated, a dropped TD from Marshall and a missed FG from Gould makes that game a win. Houston made a big play in the red zone one time, and they won because of it. SF killed them, Cutler was out, and they had a great offensive plan to beat them. To call the Bears a fraud is wrong. To say they aren't as good as they've been made out to be (because they were made to be the second best team in the league, and the best to a lot of people) is correct. Calling them over rated would, therefore, be correct. They're an incomplete team that got handled in ONE game this year. But the thing is, there aren't any really complete teams in the league, every one of them has a flaw. The Falcons D isn't good. The Niners offense is questionable. The Texans passing game is questionable in most games (except vs Jacksonville, apparently). The Patriots D sucks. The Packers D sucks, the Ravens D sucks and so does Flacco. The Giants... who the hell knows about them. The Seahawks still have something to prove. Denver was the most complete team, imo, and they just lost their starting HB so time will tell on them. Fraud was a massive overstatement. | ||
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Otolia
France5805 Posts
On November 22 2012 14:44 Wolfswood wrote:I'm one of the few people you're going to find on this board who actually played organized football and even knows what Cover 2 means so please don't jump to conclusions just because someone disagrees with you. Even I know what Cover 2 means. That's not a knowledge only reserved to an elite. Now if you had told me you knew the intricacies of this scheme and why/how is it run, that would be something else. | ||
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Wolfswood
United States349 Posts
I stand by my statement. I don't think Chicago is going to the playoffs, thus, fraud. For what its worth (fuck all) here's how I see the NFC winding up: Atlanta San Francisco Green Bay Dallas Seattle New York No one is catching Atlanta or Green Bay. The west is still up for grabs but Seattle probably dug themselves too deep of a hole by booting too many of their road games early on (which were all by one possession btw). Still, the offense has improved significantly since the first month of the season, and while they have at times been exposed on defense, it's still one of the best units in the league. They also appear to have a pretty favorable schedule down the stretch. So they're in one way or the other. Now its really a crapshoot, but you have to assume at least some fluctuation with the current picture, so I like Dallas to edge New York, while Chicago drops three or four of their remaining and just misses out, because 10-6 might not get it done this year, and 9-7 almost certainly wont. So, yeah. I was never saying the Bears are awful, just that they aren't as good as some have made them out to be, and I'm not going to be as surprised as most when they're sitting at home in January. On November 22 2012 15:16 Otolia wrote: Congratulations, you know something 90% of the football-watching universe doesn't. I don't know what its like in France, but I imagine most of the people who even think about the NFL are pretty hardcore fans. In the US most people who "follow" football are fantasy warriors and girls, the vast majority of whom couldn't even name every position.Even I know what Cover 2 means. That's not a knowledge only reserved to an elite. Now if you had told me you knew the intricacies of this scheme and why/how is it run, that would be something else. also guy below me is correct about Chicago's losses. While they were all to good teams, Green Bay and SF just whipped them. I'm pretty sure the only time Seattle has been down by more than seven points all year was against New England, a game they won. | ||
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Damiani
United States514 Posts
On November 22 2012 15:14 SweeTLemonS[TPR] wrote: Texans wins: Miami Jax (2) Denver (not playing well at that time, 1-2 entering that game) Tennessee Jets Baltimore Buffalo Chicago Atl's wins: KC Denver (Again, same as above, Denver played like shit the first 4 weeks) SD Car Was Oak Philly Dal Arizona SF: GB Det NYJ Buffalo Seattle Arizona Chicago Denver: Pit Oakland SD (2) NO Cincy Car Name the impressive wins for those teams. GB for the Texans and Niners? Maybe. GB wasn't playing well until week 6. New Orleans? If they beat them last season it'd be impressive. The Texans beat Baltimore. Atlanta has 0 impressive wins, and has played close with scrub teams. SF beat GB and Chicago, lost to Minnesota, and got torched by the Giants, then tied with the Rams. The Bears may not have beaten impressive teams, but they blew them out. 41-21 vs Indy. 23-6 vs StL, 34-18 vs Dallas, 41-3 vs Jax, 51-20 vs Tennessee. Their losses have been mostly close. 23-10 vs GB (and GB started in plus territory for a good portion of the game, holding them to 23 was good, but the offense was atrocious). 13-6 vs Houston - the best team in the league, and as stated, a dropped TD from Marshall and a missed FG from Gould makes that game a win. Houston made a big play in the red zone one time, and they won because of it. SF killed them, Cutler was out, and they had a great offensive plan to beat them. To call the Bears a fraud is wrong. To say they aren't as good as they've been made out to be (because they were made to be the second best team in the league, and the best to a lot of people) is correct. Calling them over rated would, therefore, be correct. They're an incomplete team that got handled in ONE game this year. But the thing is, there aren't any really complete teams in the league, every one of them has a flaw. The Falcons D isn't good. The Niners offense is questionable. The Texans passing game is questionable in most games (except vs Jacksonville, apparently). The Patriots D sucks. The Packers D sucks, the Ravens D sucks and so does Flacco. The Giants... who the hell knows about them. The Seahawks still have something to prove. Denver was the most complete team, imo, and they just lost their starting HB so time will tell on them. Fraud was a massive overstatement. Wrong. This is just wrong. Denver was playing good football. I watched all those games. It just so happen that they played their toughest schedule early on. Come on they beat Pittsburgh 31-19. The next week Atlanta outplayed them. Denver only made it a game late 3rd quarter and 4th quarter. The first half of football Manning and comp. was shut down. Week three they played Houston. Manning even in Indy never played Houston good for some reason. He'd always struggle against Houston. Even tho some might say Houston has the best defense out there, Denver manage to put up 25pts against them. Then week 4 they blew the Raiders away.. 37-6. How can u say they played bad the first 4 week? Then they played NE in week 5 and lost. Denver is who they are. Nothing changed from week 1 to week 11. They only look a lil more impressive after week 5 because their opponents from week 6-10 has a combine record of 20-30. You don't think the 49ers blanking out Buffalo @ Buffalo then coming home and blanking out the Jets were impressive wins? Or did you mean impressive teams? Cause beating the Seahawks would be an impressive win there too. Then you went on to say the Bears wins were blowouts but their losses were close. Unless you weren't watching the Packers / Bears game. I do believe the Bears were blown out that game. Granted if you just check the final score it makes it look a lot closer then it really was. Score was 23-3 with like 5 or 6 mins left to play. They were blown out that game. Here were some numbers in that game : 168 total yards. Cutler was 11-27 for 74 yards. 7 sacks 4 int. Wasn't even a game. Then they lost to Houston. That game was played in really bad weather. Hard to tell but they still lost. But teams was playing very conservatively because of the rain. Then they got smothered by the 49ers. Granted Cutler didn't play neither did Smith. So you'd think it was gonna be a close defensive game. But i was wrong. The 49ers moved the ball at will. Don't say it was all CK because the 49ers ran for 121 yards that game. 4.2 yrds/ carry. So in 2 of the 3 losses the Bears had. They were BLOWN out. So you can't really blame the guy for thinking the Bears is a fraud. They beat down bad teams and get pushed around by top tier teams. Hey i by no mean am saying the Bears is a fraud. I think they're a good defensive team. Fantasy football tells me this. But i think you're a lil over aggressive on your post. No teams in the NFL is gonna put up Madden like numbers week in and weeks out. Look at last week Houston vs Jags. Who would of expected the worst offensive teams with a hurt starting QB and RB would of put up those numbers against one of the best defensive teams in the NFL? | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
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SweeTLemonS[TPR]
11739 Posts
I was using his criteria to illustrate how poorly made his point was. If you just look at teams, then many of the wins weren't that impressive. But that's the point of my argument: the Niners looked good because they destroyed the bad teams. The Texans looked good because they destroyed the bad teams. I explained how the Bears/Niners game happened. They came out in C1 to stuff the run, and did it successfully on the first couple of drives. They obviously expected that Kaepernick would not be able to hit the open guy as easily as he did, and their offensive line played, probably, the best game of their season. Once Kaepernick hit open throws, they had to change their scheme, and back the safeties up (because VD was blowing the top off of them). Once the safeties backed up, it was time for Gore and co to start running. And the instant the safeties cheated up, Kaepernick hit them over the top again. It was a bad game for the defense, they were out played, and out coached (I don't like saying this, but the Bears never made a good adjustment to stop the Niners). But it's still just one really bad game. The Bears offense was atrocious vs the Packers. The Packers scoring drives were thus: Start GB 21: FG (48 yards) Start GB 20: TD (27 yd pass - Fake FG) Start Chi 48: FG (35 yards) Start GB 43: FG (54 yards) Start Chi 26: TD (26 yard TD Pass) The defense gave up one TD with three starts near or past midfield. The Packers had another drive that started at their 34, and ended in a punt. The FG fake caught the ST unit off guard, it was a well timed play. If Jay hadn't thrown four INT's and put the defense in such bad situations, it may have been closer, but given their starting positions, it's hard to say the defense did not play well when they held the offense to one TD. It's just that the offense was SO bad. They were pathetically bad that game. On November 22 2012 16:31 xDaunt wrote: Keep in mind that the Bears have been propped up by an obsenely irregular turnover differential. Though their defense is legit, their offense is putrid and was bad even before Cutler went down. Yep, this is something I've said all season. I've had serious concerns about what they could do when the defense slowed down a bit. I still think "fraud" is too strong of a word. To the other guy I'm arguing against: As far as me being rude to people, that's just how I do things in the NFL thread until you show that you're doing more than spouting off stupid shit that the casual fan that doesn't understand the game does. It's test of sorts, a throwing down of the gauntlet. I dislike when people make statements they've heard on TV or the radio and regurgitate them here without being able to back them up. It happens every year from different people, and I've really grown to dislike it, as there are several people here that can do a bit more than just discuss stats and fantasy and the thread would be better if there were more posts from them, and less from uninformed people. I visit health and fitness forums, an area that I'm very new to (and have a lot to learn). What I don't do in those forums is start spouting off bullshit positions without references to back up my position, and I guess I just expect that everyone would do that when they're not well informed on a particular topic, and well informed people are discussing something. | ||
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SweeTLemonS[TPR]
11739 Posts
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000098755/article/nfl-mvp-forecast-peyton-manning-on-top-for-first-time Unsurprisingly, imo, Peyton is winning right now. I think Peyton is also going to win Comeback Player of the Year. | ||
Souma
2nd Worst City in CA8938 Posts
On November 22 2012 05:54 xDaunt wrote: I'd be careful taking the Falcons on the over. They really aren't playing that well right now, and the Bucs are on fire. I don't feel as comfortable with the Falcons as I do the Texans, but I feel the Falcons are just going to torch the Bucs through the air and the Bucs won't be able to keep up. | ||
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Damiani
United States514 Posts
On November 22 2012 17:14 Souma wrote: I don't feel as comfortable with the Falcons as I do the Texans, but I feel the Falcons are just going to torch the Bucs through the air and the Bucs won't be able to keep up. I like the over on this game a lot. But it might be a trap game. Paper wise it has OVER written all over it. With how many points TB been putting up and all. But all i know for sure is im playing all the dogs in college football in big games rivalry. Expecting to go 7-3 at least. Oh only favorite i'm gonna take is Oregon. | ||
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