EPTWarhammer 40k : Space Marine - Page 5
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colingrad
United States210 Posts
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Bartuc
Netherlands629 Posts
On September 01 2011 11:05 Brethern wrote: Hitting reload, allows you to detonate the grenades at will. Am I seriously the only person to know this? Ah that's what I was missing, thanks :-) time for another playthrough then! | ||
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Rick Roy
United States59 Posts
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DrunkenTemplar
Australia647 Posts
On September 01 2011 18:00 Rick Roy wrote: I thought it was awful I was bored pretty quickly Report to your nearest inquisitor for purging. Seriously though I pre-ordered in the hope that this would be great and I found the demo to be really good (perhaps not as great as TB said in the video, but still pretty damn fine and worth buying). It's at the very least worth checking out. FOR THE EMPRAAAAAAAH!!! | ||
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L0thar
987 Posts
http://www.spacemarine.com/forums/topic/3772 It looks very ordinary, but fun nonetheless. | ||
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turdburgler
England6749 Posts
ill try out the demo later but my hopes arent high. it looks like a solid game, but basically a gears of war clone; right down to the sound effects, movement style, colouring, melee style, 4 weapon selection screen etc etc. gears of war was ok too but i didnt find any lasting play time from that either. im not sure a single soldier focused game is even right for the IP. the warhammer board game is an turn based tactics game so i dont see why the game developers have kept away from just making something like that for so long. neither base building or single unit heroism is part of why people get in to warhammer. | ||
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r33k
Italy3402 Posts
On September 02 2011 22:47 turdburgler wrote: the melee combat looked really good in terms of feeling physical in the TB demo but it looked really shallow? it seemed to fall into the same trap as a lot of games with regening health, that it seemed to easy to survive if u just run away? ill try out the demo later but my hopes arent high. it looks like a solid game, but basically a gears of war clone; right down to the sound effects, movement style, colouring, melee style, 4 weapon selection screen etc etc. gears of war was ok too but i didnt find any lasting play time from that either. im not sure a single soldier focused game is even right for the IP. the warhammer board game is an RTT game so i dont see why the game developers have kept away from just making something like that for so long. neither base building or single unit heroism is part of why people get in to warhammer. Actually the regen only gives you a little portion of your total health. But fluffwise, that is the correct way the black carapace works. In combat you get half your health (at medium difficulty) by doing executions but you are vulnerable to damage while channeling those. Fury mode instantly refills your health, kills medium hp mobs in a short range around you and gives you 4x damage. Nope. You have no idea what you are talking about. I am sorry I had to read your whole post. | ||
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ZasZ.
United States2911 Posts
On September 02 2011 22:47 turdburgler wrote: the melee combat looked really good in terms of feeling physical in the TB demo but it looked really shallow? it seemed to fall into the same trap as a lot of games with regening health, that it seemed to easy to survive if u just run away? ill try out the demo later but my hopes arent high. it looks like a solid game, but basically a gears of war clone; right down to the sound effects, movement style, colouring, melee style, 4 weapon selection screen etc etc. gears of war was ok too but i didnt find any lasting play time from that either. im not sure a single soldier focused game is even right for the IP. the warhammer board game is an RTT game so i dont see why the game developers have kept away from just making something like that for so long. neither base building or single unit heroism is part of why people get in to warhammer. On higher difficulties, running away doesn't always work because it seems like the Nobs have a homing beacon on you. The execution system is actually a very efficient way to regain health, you just have to look for opportunities where you can get one off when you're not being swarmed. I'd agree with the Gears of War parallels, but it's hard to tell from the demo where the story will go or what sort of other things are available in single players/multi player. Have to disagree with your last point though...single unit heroism is DEFINITELY a part of why people get into warhammer. At least from my experiences playing the tabletop game, there were few moments as exhilarating as your last man standing holding the line against superior odds and superior numbers. It's supposed to be 3 against a thousand, that's 40K. | ||
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turdburgler
England6749 Posts
On September 02 2011 23:17 r33k wrote: Actually the regen only gives you a little portion of your total health. But fluffwise, that is the correct way the black carapace works. In combat you get half your health (at medium difficulty) by doing executions but you are vulnerable to damage while channeling those. Fury mode instantly refills your health, kills medium hp mobs in a short range around you and gives you 4x damage. Nope. You have no idea what you are talking about. I am sorry I had to read your whole post. the base regen is just a small amount but he got a full fury bar very quickly which enabled him to very quickly regen his health, even against a nob he just ran off while his team makes the orcs not bother with him, the nob was too cumbersome to offer any threat. you can say i have no clue but if you arent going to explain why then atleast come up with some points rather than try to come across as an internet cool guy by thinking 'nope' is a good enough response On September 02 2011 23:21 ZasZ. wrote: On higher difficulties, running away doesn't always work because it seems like the Nobs have a homing beacon on you. The execution system is actually a very efficient way to regain health, you just have to look for opportunities where you can get one off when you're not being swarmed. I'd agree with the Gears of War parallels, but it's hard to tell from the demo where the story will go or what sort of other things are available in single players/multi player. Have to disagree with your last point though...single unit heroism is DEFINITELY a part of why people get into warhammer. At least from my experiences playing the tabletop game, there were few moments as exhilarating as your last man standing holding the line against superior odds and superior numbers. It's supposed to be 3 against a thousand, that's 40K. but hero units in the board game come at a cost. thats part of the depth of the game. telling you you have to play a hero has to be a worse situation. why not allow the choice between playing a squad where tactical choices and commands win you battles, or playing a solo hero unit? it would be stylistically the same as the board game while adding depth to what appears to be just another third person shooter | ||
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Haemonculus
United States6980 Posts
Tabletop warhammer is totally different for balance reasons. It would be silly if one marine could actually take out a hundred orks on the table. But in a computer game, it would be equally silly if each regular ork was a significant threat. Nobs are scary in both, as they should be. S4 base and 4 attacks is nothing to scoff at on the tabletop, and they soak up damage crazy well in the computer game. Imagine going up against a Warboss! Eep! Does anyone know of the confirmed races in the game? For single and multiplayer? I assume the campaign is only as a space marine, (which is fine), but in multiplayer I think it'd be awesome, (albeit hard to balance) if there were multiple races. Do we at least get to shoot chaos marines, tyranids, eldar, etc? | ||
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ZasZ.
United States2911 Posts
On September 03 2011 01:16 turdburgler wrote: the base regen is just a small amount but he got a full fury bar very quickly which enabled him to very quickly regen his health, even against a nob he just ran off while his team makes the orcs not bother with him, the nob was too cumbersome to offer any threat. you can say i have no clue but if you arent going to explain why then atleast come up with some points rather than try to come across as an internet cool guy by thinking 'nope' is a good enough response but hero units in the board game come at a cost. thats part of the depth of the game. telling you you have to play a hero has to be a worse situation. why not allow the choice between playing a squad where tactical choices and commands win you battles, or playing a solo hero unit? it would be stylistically the same as the board game while adding depth to what appears to be just another third person shooter It sounds like you would have enjoyed DoW2. Very little base-building, and you control a small squad of tactical specialists. This is the first good shooter in the 40K franchise. I think we should embrace it. Who knows what the multiplayer will be like though. | ||
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[Agony]x90
United States853 Posts
Even still, the TT is by no means close to the actual fluff. One Space Marine is worth tens of thousands of lives of basic imperial guard. In the actual fiction, one chapter of space marines contains 1000 space marines, along with an array of supporting servitors, pilots, technician etc. who are all human or human equivalent. Of these 1000 troops, it is very rare for the chapter to lose a single space marine in an operation (apart from the epic mega battles that they always portray in all the artwork) and when they do fall, they must always be harvested for their gene seed, which is a foreign object placed into their bodies that reconfigure their genetic code to match that of their primarchs, who in turn were basically clones of the Emperor. That is a Space Marine. An imperial guardsmen is one in a billion in his army alone. The imperial guard has thousands of these armies stationed all over the known galaxy. Imagine these men as fanatical, religious, blind following soldiers trained to kill and fight. They are constantly reminded of their religious duty to their emperor and if they fail always face the possibility of execution. This means that they are human, just like us, but that they will almost always fight tooth and nail, train to be in tip top shape and basically are, by our standards, super troops. However, these guys die by the tens of thousands in battles where the space marines would close to none. This is because no matter how well they are trained, they are leagues below any other race out there in terms of equipment and natural physical ability. For this reason, while the space marines are very tactical and smart about their approaches to battle, the Imperial Guard have no choice but to attack in massive droves on men (think Enemy at the Gates style). This is basically saying, you may think this game shows the Space Marine as too strong, but as far as I could tell with the demo, this is how it should be. Regular Orkz are idiots with only half a brain enough to charge into battle. You occasionally meet Nobz, and these guys are basically on par with Space marines. This is perfect, because you only see a couple from time to time. Otherwise, it's natural to run into a dozen basic orkz and kill them with a team of 3 (should be 5 really) without too much trouble. The Orkz are, afterall, a horde army like the imperial guard. Now, i don't know about the chaos though. I hope that the majority of what you fight are cultists of sorts, because Chaos Space Marines are Space Marines with 10,000 years experience of fighting, just lacking the technology that the current Marines have. Ideally, one Space Marine will not be able to kill droves of CSM, but I won't be able to see that til the game comes out :-p. /FICTION RANT | ||
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turdburgler
England6749 Posts
i just played the demo on normal difficulty. i found my suspicion was basically correct. although the duel nob at the end was some threat i ended up using my fury to instantly kill the first one then i ran in circles stun executing orcs to get back to full health before clearing up the second nob. because they made you immune to interuption during special moves the nob was hitting me but i was just out regening his damage by executing orks constantly. this kills all difficulty, you shouldnt need to say "i guess i need to play on hard" after 1 go. this may sound like i struggled by i avoided taking the free power axe offered to you so it should of been much harder for me to win, it has the 'cod problem' that you dont have to value your squad because they never die (or in cod they reinforce forever) this rewards hiding and not actually taking part if you are in a bad position as apposed to working your way out of it, your allies will win you the battle eventually. On September 03 2011 01:38 ZasZ. wrote: It sounds like you would have enjoyed DoW2. Very little base-building, and you control a small squad of tactical specialists. This is the first good shooter in the 40K franchise. I think we should embrace it. Who knows what the multiplayer will be like though. like i said its a solid game and a solid shooter. i just feel its using the 40k IP to shift copies rather than to bring anything unique to the genre. On September 03 2011 01:33 Haemonculus wrote: It'd be hard to balance separate game modes like that. I assumed from the demo that you're a force commander or something, or some sort of Space Marine champion type. Tabletop warhammer is totally different for balance reasons. It would be silly if one marine could actually take out a hundred orks on the table. But in a computer game, it would be equally silly if each regular ork was a significant threat. Nobs are scary in both, as they should be. S4 base and 4 attacks is nothing to scoff at on the tabletop, and they soak up damage crazy well in the computer game. Imagine going up against a Warboss! Eep! Does anyone know of the confirmed races in the game? For single and multiplayer? I assume the campaign is only as a space marine, (which is fine), but in multiplayer I think it'd be awesome, (albeit hard to balance) if there were multiple races. Do we at least get to shoot chaos marines, tyranids, eldar, etc? i dont agree that its even a balance concern. for example if the squad mode was harder, who cares? it gives you a choice you otherwise doesnt have and its no different to choosing to play on hard instead of normal, then claiming normal is imbalanced  i agree that it would be silly if i wanted 'realism' but imagine this scenario instead. in the table top game orcs get standard squad size of 50? if the missions enabled you to take on 10-20 orcs at a time, its realistic you could come away with 0 losses. rinse repeat with different execution and terrain/planning. then the end boss is a nob squad or something, where you will take losses but its the end of the mission so who cares. its also allows you to be in charge of several squads of throw-away imperial gaurd while staying in cannon without being a force commander. basically what im asking for is a modernisation of rites of war, who else played that when it was new? :D played that shit to death On September 03 2011 01:42 [Agony]x90 wrote: This is basically saying, you may think this game shows the Space Marine as too strong, but as far as I could tell with the demo, this is how it should be. Regular Orkz are idiots with only half a brain enough to charge into battle. You occasionally meet Nobz, and these guys are basically on par with Space marines. This is perfect, because you only see a couple from time to time. Otherwise, it's natural to run into a dozen basic orkz and kill them with a team of 3 (should be 5 really) without too much trouble. The Orkz are, afterall, a horde army like the imperial guard. Now, i don't know about the chaos though. I hope that the majority of what you fight are cultists of sorts, because Chaos Space Marines are Space Marines with 10,000 years experience of fighting, just lacking the technology that the current Marines have. Ideally, one Space Marine will not be able to kill droves of CSM, but I won't be able to see that til the game comes out :-p. /FICTION RANT : ) but just think how special you made space marines sound, then finish up with. but a nob is fine too. i know space marines are supposed to win 100 times in 100 against random orcs, im ok with that. my problem is that its not interesting game play, so why focus on it? there has to be danger for the gameplay to be exciting beyond the first 30 mins. sorry if i expect more than 1 play through from a single player focused game  overall i probably think that the imperium vs orc just isnt an interesting conflict, its been done to death by everyone before and after the release of warhammer. one thing dawn of war actually did ok was show how the different races were all part of a war, giving a variety of opponents beyond endless piles of retarded green soldiers | ||
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Haemonculus
United States6980 Posts
Hmmm well supposedly CSM tech should be better than regular SM tech simply because technology is going downhill in the 40k universe. The "dark age of technology" was 10 thousand years ago, ending with the heresy and all that. This is why "ancient" tech is so powerful, and everyone forgot how to build all the old fancy stuff. So things like land raiders and specialist plasma weapons are so rare because no one really knows how they work, they just build them by copying the old stuff. So in theory, with CSMs having armor/weapons actually built long ago, it should be better. Now they used to justify this with the old codecies by giving CSMs access to veteran traits, while SMs instead benefited from the "and they shall know no fear" rule. This was to represent the CSMs each individually being thousands of years old, while most of the loyalist marines alive today have been created since. However nowadays they give everyone and their mother veteran traits -.-;; If they do include chaos marines, I really hope they add the full chaos spectrum. Khorne is soooo boring. The idea of shooting at a crazed berzerker charging at you with two chainaxes is scary, but come on, let's have a little diversity! | ||
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r33k
Italy3402 Posts
On September 03 2011 01:53 Haemonculus wrote: More nerdy fluff incoming: Hmmm well supposedly CSM tech should be better than regular SM tech simply because technology is going downhill in the 40k universe. The "dark age of technology" was 10 thousand years ago, ending with the heresy and all that. This is why "ancient" tech is so powerful, and everyone forgot how to build all the old fancy stuff. So things like land raiders and specialist plasma weapons are so rare because no one really knows how they work, they just build them by copying the old stuff. So in theory, with CSMs having armor/weapons actually built long ago, it should be better. Now they used to justify this with the old codecies by giving CSMs access to veteran traits, while SMs instead benefited from the "and they shall know no fear" rule. This was to represent the CSMs each individually being thousands of years old, while most of the loyalist marines alive today have been created since. However nowadays they give everyone and their mother veteran traits -.-;; If they do include chaos marines, I really hope they add the full chaos spectrum. Khorne is soooo boring. The idea of shooting at a crazed berzerker charging at you with two chainaxes is scary, but come on, let's have a little diversity! That is closer to a fanfic than canon. CSM don't follow a codex astartes, if we're lucky Cavatore won't be working on their next codex and fluff will be closer to the index again. I doubt CSM will be diversified and/or playable for two reasons: the gritty atmosphere of the game (holy shit they actually tried making it grimdark) would make it a nightmare to publish, and 40k chaos isn't about 4 colors. 40k chaos space marines are best defined as mutated space demigods, and having 4 fancy pants chapters in the game with very little personal importance in the fluff would be just silly. Not to mention that they would be moving 4 gods' chapters to one spot without any sort of black crusade leading chapter. | ||
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L0thar
987 Posts
On September 03 2011 01:53 Haemonculus wrote: More nerdy fluff incoming: Hmmm well supposedly CSM tech should be better than regular SM tech simply because technology is going downhill in the 40k universe. The "dark age of technology" was 10 thousand years ago, ending with the heresy and all that. This is why "ancient" tech is so powerful, and everyone forgot how to build all the old fancy stuff. So things like land raiders and specialist plasma weapons are so rare because no one really knows how they work, they just build them by copying the old stuff. So in theory, with CSMs having armor/weapons actually built long ago, it should be better. Now they used to justify this with the old codecies by giving CSMs access to veteran traits, while SMs instead benefited from the "and they shall know no fear" rule. This was to represent the CSMs each individually being thousands of years old, while most of the loyalist marines alive today have been created since. However nowadays they give everyone and their mother veteran traits -.-;; If they do include chaos marines, I really hope they add the full chaos spectrum. Khorne is soooo boring. The idea of shooting at a crazed berzerker charging at you with two chainaxes is scary, but come on, let's have a little diversity! Just a slight correction, the Dark Age of Technology ended long before first SM were created (Lexicanum says M15 - M25). The CSM don't have access to the technology of that era (luckily, it would be the end for other races lol). But yeah, the technology goes downhill in 40K, so the old stuff of CSM is often better than the stuff loyalist SM get. But not always, there were some improvements made or STCs found, which puts Imperium tech aheads of Chaos in some areas... | ||
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Ethenielle
Norway1006 Posts
edit: I believe it was mentioned in the gamescom interview posted earlier in the thread. | ||
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intotheheart
Canada33091 Posts
Sounds really familiar and TB LOVES his Deus Ex. | ||
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TotalBiscuit
United Kingdom5437 Posts
On September 03 2011 03:00 IntoTheheart wrote: Wait is this John Bain (TotalBiscuit)? Sounds really familiar and TB LOVES his Deus Ex. Sup | ||
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Horst
338 Posts
 A captain wouldn't be a member of a tactical marine combat unit, and would have a command squad consisting of 5 members. Maybe we get a sweet cinematic intro showing half the squad being cut down in an epic battle like DOW 1? | ||
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