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Path of Exile - Page 1741

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Guild invites: Message any of EvoSenseOfPride, ScionViableORly, neophyteWham, TheTouchOfGOLD in game
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Private league ladder (finished): https://www.pathofexile.com/private-leagues/league/TeamLiquid and friends
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11766 Posts
January 30 2025 18:56 GMT
#34801
Yes, share sell is public and factual. Tencent having the ability to revoke their role is also public and factual. What are rumors are Chris Wilson no longer showing up at the office, but I feel like his disappearance from the public is sort of a where there's smoke....
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
Miragee
Profile Joined December 2009
8493 Posts
January 30 2025 19:49 GMT
#34802
Yeah, I looked it up now and it happened in March 2024. That news completely went past me somehow... That kind of coincides with the time Chris Wilson stopped appearing publicly, didn't it? Where's my tinfoil hat?
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17242 Posts
January 30 2025 21:45 GMT
#34803
Man, I'm still fuming over this. They need a proper director in place overseeing both projects instead of Jonathan being in charge of everything. It's clear that his focus is exclusively poe2, which means someone else needs to be in place reigning him back from wasting all resources to rush out poe2 content that has no need for urgency.
twitch.tv/cratonz
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands21593 Posts
January 30 2025 22:07 GMT
#34804
On January 31 2025 06:45 Craton wrote:
Man, I'm still fuming over this. They need a proper director in place overseeing both projects instead of Jonathan being in charge of everything. It's clear that his focus is exclusively poe2, which means someone else needs to be in place reigning him back from wasting all resources to rush out poe2 content that has no need for urgency.
PoE 2 has a lot of urgency, they caught the attention of a LOT more players then PoE 1 ever did and as (almost) any company that sees a sudden unexpected explosion in popularity they are now scrambling to try and retain them.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
EchelonTee
Profile Joined February 2011
United States5245 Posts
January 30 2025 23:29 GMT
#34805
That makes sense from a normal business perspective, but if they burn their reputation and long term players, that's a huge loss. PoE1 was built off of having a stellar reputation, esp in comparison to Blizzard. Sure there have been major stumbling blocks (e.g. Archnemesis), but the game and the community always recovered.

Southlight, you're right re: Chris Wilson not being a project manager, I should've used a different word there. He hasn't been anything close to a project manager in many many years. Moreso just with him as overall director it always felt like the ship was going in the right direction, even if there was some turbulence on the way. No matter how much people wanted to hate on Chris' "vision", you can't deny that it was many many years of a great game and relatively well run company. I don't know exactly what happened with Chris, but it really seems like he has minimal involvement these days.

While I trust Mark with respect to gameplay balance and design (really liked him in league / mechanic Q&A's), everything else is kind of in shambles. I think they can right the ship, but if they treat PoE1 with such neglect in the future it'll feel pretty bad as long time supporters
aka "neophyte". learn lots. dont judge. laugh for no reason. be nice. seek happiness. -D[9]
Velr
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Switzerland10668 Posts
Last Edited: 2025-01-31 09:41:51
January 31 2025 09:40 GMT
#34806
I'm surprised by how surprised people are that this is happening. It was allways gonna be either a totally halfassed PoE 1 league or none at all.


Personally I just want a PoE2 reset/content drop or PoE1 reset/league. Don't care either way.



Reddit is beyond gone... Tons of people bitching how they stop playing PoE 2.... Like most of them ever played a league in PoE1for more than 2 months PoE 2 is out...
FaCE_1
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
Canada6167 Posts
Last Edited: 2025-01-31 10:23:53
January 31 2025 10:23 GMT
#34807
there is a couple of private league that are starting if u just want a reset with a bunch of ppl (poe1)
n_n
EchelonTee
Profile Joined February 2011
United States5245 Posts
February 03 2025 03:39 GMT
#34808
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/3716196

some minor hope returned
aka "neophyte". learn lots. dont judge. laugh for no reason. be nice. seek happiness. -D[9]
xM(Z
Profile Joined November 2006
Romania5281 Posts
February 03 2025 15:31 GMT
#34809
i mean ... someone has to say it men, there's not gonna be a poe1 anymore. it'll be left to die like d2, d3, ...
this everything krangled 'league' is the last hooray for poe.
And my fury stands ready. I bring all your plans to nought. My bleak heart beats steady. 'Tis you whom I have sought.
HolydaKing
Profile Joined February 2010
21254 Posts
February 03 2025 17:09 GMT
#34810
That remains to be seen if PoE 1 will be left as a the best game of its series. Because D2 is certainly the best Diablo, especially with mods (Project D2 and MedianXL both have their char)
Miragee
Profile Joined December 2009
8493 Posts
Last Edited: 2025-02-03 21:20:21
February 03 2025 21:19 GMT
#34811
On February 04 2025 00:31 xM(Z wrote:
i mean ... someone has to say it men, there's not gonna be a poe1 anymore. it'll be left to die like d2, d3, ...
this everything krangled 'league' is the last hooray for poe.


This is the kind of doomer mentality I don't really get. GGG is not Blizzard, their track record doesn't make me believe what you are saying is inevitably going to happen. I'm not saying it won't happen but I'm also quite certain they will at least try to run both games at the same time. PoE2 has been out for 2 months and people are already saying 3.26 will never come because GGG is now saying they are delaying it further? Jesus Christ...
Like I said, they might drop PoE at some point. But it will not be before 3.26 and to me it seems highly unlikely it will be this year. To me it seems clear that they will try to run both games and will drop PoE if they realise they cannot handle it.
xM(Z
Profile Joined November 2006
Romania5281 Posts
Last Edited: 2025-02-03 22:41:52
February 03 2025 22:35 GMT
#34812
or you're just sniffin' that copium.
Jonathan is the only game dev left from the original three and he only worked on poe2(for years); even if Mark originally worked(massively) on poe1, lately(at least a full year) he was also on poe2 duty, so basically there's no one left to carry the torch for poe1.

if poe2 grosses double of what poe1 does, then it's bye bye poe1; 'cause math says so.
And my fury stands ready. I bring all your plans to nought. My bleak heart beats steady. 'Tis you whom I have sought.
Miragee
Profile Joined December 2009
8493 Posts
February 04 2025 02:21 GMT
#34813
Ok what's your call then? This event and then never another major update for PoE?
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17242 Posts
February 04 2025 04:53 GMT
#34814
I'd be surprised if POE1 is actually completely dropped, but it definitely feels like it's going to get continuously backburnered. My expectation is that leagues continue to be overly long and a poor amount of resources are spent on them. POE2 is years away from done. If Jonathan isn't already realizing it's nonsensical to torpedo POE1 just to get [next big poe2 patch] out, he's not going to.
twitch.tv/cratonz
xM(Z
Profile Joined November 2006
Romania5281 Posts
Last Edited: 2025-02-04 05:34:49
February 04 2025 05:33 GMT
#34815
poe2, in this shit state of alpha, is worth more than poe1. GGG can make tens of millions on every new act/new class releases; they don't need to 'finish' the game.

poe1 will maybe get some gimmicks ported over from poe2(like wsad), will get some more work on private league options(more mod options for players - league mechanic selection), maybe some more nostalgic short races, but i don't see it getting actual new leagues.
And my fury stands ready. I bring all your plans to nought. My bleak heart beats steady. 'Tis you whom I have sought.
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17242 Posts
Last Edited: 2025-02-04 05:51:50
February 04 2025 05:51 GMT
#34816
I disagree that POE2 alone is worth more than both combined.

POE1 has been setting record numbers league after league. POE2 hype would obviously carry onto POE1; a number of people have already tried it without waiting for a new league.

As I understand it, China does not have separate server for POE2, but does for POE1, which impacts the player numbers we're able to see. POE2 was obviously bigger on launch than POE1, but maybe not by quite as much as it might seem. There's also the hype of a new, long awaited game that always exists; it's very uncertain how well that will carry forward.

POE1 is a known product that consistently makes them a ton of money league after league. It's really bizarre of them to ignore that and focus exclusively on POE2, rather than continue to make a ton of money while using that time to work on POE2. That's why I find this whole "how can we possibly think about POE1" line completely nonsensical. You can think about POE1 because it's a cash cow. POE2 isn't going to disappear off the face of the earth just because you work on POE1.
twitch.tv/cratonz
xM(Z
Profile Joined November 2006
Romania5281 Posts
Last Edited: 2025-02-04 06:25:36
February 04 2025 06:24 GMT
#34817
ok, i think i see what you're not factoring in there - the man power, dev hours, qualified personnel etc, needed.
GGG doesn't have the people/employees to work on both games so it's either one game or the other; in a best case scenario for you, it's one game and then the other and then the first one and so on.
thing is, from any workflow management system metrics, related to efficiency/productivity/work optimization, that will end up to mean an overall drop in quality for both games.

it's a 'don't bite more than you can chew' kind of thing, so unless you just give GGG another 50 to 70 (legal)employees right now ... i'm not seeing your logic make sense.
And my fury stands ready. I bring all your plans to nought. My bleak heart beats steady. 'Tis you whom I have sought.
Harris1st
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Germany6860 Posts
Last Edited: 2025-02-04 08:07:08
February 04 2025 08:05 GMT
#34818
This is risky business:

A lot of the remaining PoE1 players are recurring buyers and left 100s of bucks on the table for PoE1 in the last decade.
A lot of the new players for PoE 2 are one and done players who will pay under 50$ total.
You need the first to have steady income and you need the second if you want to grow.

IMO the earliest they can drop PoE1 is when PoE2 is fully released (all campaign and some more endgame stuff, all announced classes and specialties). Which seems a good year from now
Go Serral! GG EZ for Ence. Flashbang dance FTW
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands21593 Posts
February 04 2025 12:23 GMT
#34819
On February 04 2025 11:21 Miragee wrote:
Ok what's your call then? This event and then never another major update for PoE?
buy time to fix and complete PoE 2, then force everyone to switch to the new game.

They can run both together but in my opinion if they cared about that they would not have pulled everyone and then gone "surprised Pikachu" PoE 1 is delayed for an undetermined amount of time.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
Miragee
Profile Joined December 2009
8493 Posts
Last Edited: 2025-02-04 17:24:46
February 04 2025 17:17 GMT
#34820
On February 04 2025 14:33 xM(Z wrote:
poe2, in this shit state of alpha, is worth more than poe1. GGG can make tens of millions on every new act/new class releases; they don't need to 'finish' the game.

poe1 will maybe get some gimmicks ported over from poe2(like wsad), will get some more work on private league options(more mod options for players - league mechanic selection), maybe some more nostalgic short races, but i don't see it getting actual new leagues.


Ok, I'm pretty sure you will be proven wrong then because PoE will at least get 3.26. Call it sniffing copium all you want but from all we have seen and hear it's just extremely unlikely that they will not release 3.26 unless their studio gets burried by an earthquake or something... What you are talking about might happen in the long run. It's an outcome that seems realistic to me. Just not right now. Again, it has only been 2 month - with Christmas break. They haven't even had the chance to try running both games yet.


On February 04 2025 21:23 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 04 2025 11:21 Miragee wrote:
Ok what's your call then? This event and then never another major update for PoE?
buy time to fix and complete PoE 2, then force everyone to switch to the new game.

They can run both together but in my opinion if they cared about that they would not have pulled everyone and then gone "surprised Pikachu" PoE 1 is delayed for an undetermined amount of time.


Ok, fair. I personally don't believe that's what they are currently aiming for but that might as well end up happening. I don't know for how long Jonathan has been the sole director for both PoE and PoE2 because I have only recently heard him say that in an interview. I agree with what has been said about him in terms of love for PoE2 compared to love for PoE (or lack thereof). I don't think it's a good idea to have him run both games. He's a very passionate and genuine guy, sometimes overly excited, so my personal backseat judgement is that he is just not as good of a manager/director in general. It works for his passion project, PoE2, but I don't think it will work in the long run. Him taking over PoE as well, might have been a short term solution. This is obviously wild speculation from my side, but I could imagine him taking over was more of an emergency reaction to Chris stepping down - maybe because of mental health reasons or something like that.

From the current discussions, I kinda get the feeling that a lot of people (not talking about anyone here in particular) have lost their ability to judge development timeframes realistically. The fact that GGG has been churning out whole leagues with so much content more or less every 3 months is insane. Bumping the cadance to 4 month or more would actually be more healthy imho but that's a whole different story. The fact is, if you look at game development timeframes in general the PoE community has been spoiled but they don't seem to recognise this at large. To me, again, the issue is that GGG/Jonathan seem to have had the same unrealistic expectations for themselves. It's baffling and could have been avoided and communicated. Which comes back to the point in the previous paragraph that Jonathan might just not be that good of a manager for two games - a position he might have stumbled into fairly recently to be fair.

On February 04 2025 15:24 xM(Z wrote:
ok, i think i see what you're not factoring in there - the man power, dev hours, qualified personnel etc, needed.
GGG doesn't have the people/employees to work on both games so it's either one game or the other; in a best case scenario for you, it's one game and then the other and then the first one and so on.
thing is, from any workflow management system metrics, related to efficiency/productivity/work optimization, that will end up to mean an overall drop in quality for both games.

it's a 'don't bite more than you can chew' kind of thing, so unless you just give GGG another 50 to 70 (legal)employees right now ... i'm not seeing your logic make sense.


Imho you have to have different teams, mostly with no overlap (exceptions for art design for example). According to GGG, the past few leagues had like 10-15 devs working on them. I'm not sure on the exact number of people working on PoE2 but it's definitely a 3-digit number. Just on paper it should be doable for them to allocate 20-25 people to PoE1 once PoE2 is fully released but that's my personal guess based on no inside experience whatsoever... It won't be easy but other studios have done it before.
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