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Man, I feel sorry for all these guys who seriously think Bioware games are the pinnacle of good writing in video gaming - particularly Mass Effect. I mean, ancient, incomprehensible evil that wants to annihilate all life? Now there's a trope older than dirt, even the Greeks were writing about that one. I'm sorry Reapers, but your gameplan has already been taken, and Cthulhu doesn't take lightly to competition. Talk about a generic villain. You want to know some real villains? Joneleth Irenicus. The Practical Incarnation. Bob Page. The Master. SHODAN. These are actual villains, not some robot whose main claim to fame is talking in a deep voice in a 3 minute confrontation with the player. Bioware games are fun, have great production value, and occasionally some witty dialogue, but they're no literary giants.
On October 28 2010 07:11 Hinanawi wrote:
I haven't played ME2, but ME1's story was mostly garbage. I guess I'll have to check out ME2 since people here are saying it's got a good story.
If you didn't like ME1's plot, you definitely will not like ME2, it's even worse. It doesn't even shed much light on the plot or establish some kind of foundation for the resolution to the mytharc or something, it's just a kind of stopgap story that could've been an expansion to ME1.
It's a great game though, way more fun than ME1.
On October 28 2010 07:49 JohannesH wrote:
I've been meaning to play MotB after all the good things I've heard of it. But a question, how much am I missing out on if I skip the original campaign and start straight with MotB? Even if the story sucks in the vanilla do the other aspects, combat, exploration etc. make up for that how much?
Honestly, the story of NWN2 was so generic and unremarkable you could read up on Wikipedia and not have missed out on much. It was a pretty fun game though. If you don't play it and skip straight ahead to MotB, there are no in-game penalties or anything, there are a couple of passing references (mostly to your former companions) that you won't get, but otherwise it works very well as a standalone story, and it's leagues ahead of NWN2's plot.
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On October 28 2010 08:36 Krigwin wrote:
Man, I feel sorry for all these guys who seriously think Bioware games are the pinnacle of good writing in video gaming - particularly Mass Effect.
I don't think there is anything worse than someone who says "Man I feel sorry for those people that think something I don't". I'm sure your points are valid and shit but the beginning to this post makes you come off as some pretentious asshat.
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On October 28 2010 04:55 Mogwai wrote:
Super Monkey Ball 2
Incredible story with one of the greatest bad guys ever (Dr. Bad Boon, *shudder* what an evil fucker...). The character development of AiAi is really remarkable and think everyone can relate to his development from the title screen glimpse we get of him as an immature and self-serving adolescent ("I really love Bananas!") to a true hero willing to lay it all on the line for everyone from his slutty girlfriend to his once bitter rival to his son from the future who came back to foil Dr. Bad Boon's diabolic plot.
lololololololololol : D
Super Monkey Ball is awesome!!
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On October 28 2010 06:19 Thojorin wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2010 20:28 Doko wrote:
Don't think it makes the top but I personally really enjoyed Gabriel Knight 2: The beast within.
I need to play through Torment again and see it with fresh eyes, I was kinda young when I did my first run at it.
i agree. but why didn't you mention Gabriel Knight 1 and 3, which IMO were even better story-wise?
I played GK 3 but not the first (could never manage to get it running on my pc) GK3 was really good as well but for some reason I always felt too constricted in that game and the story just dint flow as smoothly as the beast within.
I guess seeing a filmed game as a kid struck me more as awesome at the time.
They both have a special place in my gaming career but if i had to choose id go with gk2.
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On October 28 2010 08:44 Pfhor wrote:
I don't think there is anything worse than someone who says "Man I feel sorry for those people that think something I don't". I'm sure your points are valid and shit but the beginning to this post makes you come off as some pretentious asshat.
I didn't say they were somehow wrong in their opinion or belittle their intelligence, I only lamented their lack of experience. If anyone has played all the games I have mentioned and still think Bioware games have the best stories, then good for them, but I hardly think that's case.
Why so offended bro?
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On October 28 2010 05:21 awesomoecalypse wrote:
FF7's story is retarded. Not only did nobody alive understand it the first time they played it through, even after your understand it and write it down in the simplest terms possible, it still seems nonsensical and poorly plotted. There's too much going on, too many elements are underexplained, and far too much hinges on various Deus Ex Machina.
It has wonderful characters. For the time, it was absolutely groundbreaking from a graphics/scale standpoint. It was one of the most epic games ever made, and also one of the most influential. It will always rank as one of my favorites, if only for how blown away I was by it as a 15 year old.
But objectively speaking, the story is not good.
I agree with the OP that PST probably has the best story. The Longest Journey also has a great one.
What was so hard to understand? Evil corporation seeks to harvest the natural resources of the planet, terrorist group opposes them. Later, a greater evil arises and with the same goal, only on a larger scale. Essentially, the planet is given a collective consciousness made up of the deceased life force of all living things. The goal here is to enforce strong themes of environmentalism.
Certainly not the best story but far from retarded. I'd also give it credit for the original setting, I don't think any rpg has ever tried to cross summons, magic, and monsters with a world so similar to our own. Usually it's the generic medieval quest or its polar opposite the sci-fi future.
Try Chrono Cross for perhaps the convoluted storyline ever written in a game. Fuck up a much better one too  .
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i saw the title and was going to talk about planescape: torment
couldn't agree more
never played a game with a better story
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Could someone finally explain me why one can think that KOTOR has a good storry?
The "revelation" can be seen from miles ahead (the first time in game i heard of Revan and my Amnesia it was clear what would happen...).
The rest of it is just "go from Planet to Planet to reforge the Triforce.. eh... Starmap to find the Deathstar... Eh... Superweaponfactorything. The only Notable character is HK47 or whatever that Robot was named.
Kotor 1 has his moments and is a very good game, but not for it's story... As is Mass Effect.
If your talking of an overall Story than that is something entirely diffrent than...
...being pure atmospheric awesomness (Shadow of the Colossus).
...walking from A to B over C/D and awaiting the next cutscene (Silent Hill 1-XX and others).
...being told in an overly complicated way what actually is going on (Final Fantasy 7 and others).
...having characters you can talk with (Mass Effect, Dragon Age and others).
...having a big "oh wow" moment (Kotor, which is a bad example because you see it from miles away).
...having some good written quest plots (Kotor, Mass Effect).
...Reuniting the Triforce/Starmap/Allies.... (Kotor 1+2, Zelda, Mass Effect, Dragon Age)... HORRIBLE PLOT DEVICES!
PS:T is not as atmospheric as Shadow of the Colossus, it does not have awesome Cutscenes and the overall "feel" of Silent Hill, it's "big" story is actually not very complicated (you are immortal, you have amnesia, you want to get rid of it, you get rid of it).... It's the way the story is brougth to you, it's the miriad of little details on the way that change a little depending on how you do something, it's the miriads of things you probably miss even thou they are extremly important (i never found my "journal"... Which for about 1/3+ of the game is your main goal... There are tons of other things i never found out and i wasn't playing a low int/wis char), it's your NPC's that actually follow you because they have believable reasons to follow you, heck, some of them them know more about you than you do yourself, they won't tell you this because they did not like your earlyer "lives/personalities" but are nonetheless bound to you.
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Everyone mentions either FFX or FFVII, but my favourite game/story was definitely FFVIII.
I cannot remember a single character or scenery that I did not like in this game, also the soundtracks...especially the FFX theme.
These games are just awesome, last one I played was FFXII on PS2 which heavily collided with my high school finals. I was like: you study a little bit and then you play a little bit to get your mind of history and stuff...I basically endend up playing the whole game with two or three sleeping breakes lol.
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On October 28 2010 07:49 JohannesH wrote:Show nested quote +On October 28 2010 07:11 Hinanawi wrote:Neverwinter Nights 1 and 2 have awful vanilla campaigns, but Hordes of the Underdark was pretty good, and Mask of the Betrayer was great. I've been meaning to play MotB after all the good things I've heard of it. But a question, how much am I missing out on if I skip the original campaign and start straight with MotB? Even if the story sucks in the vanilla do the other aspects, combat, exploration etc. make up for that how much?
You won't miss out on a whole lot, but I have a feeling MotB might make you feel like you did miss quite a bit with how it references things. You'll also meet some characters you met in the vanilla campaign, and the conversations won't make much sense if you haven't played it.
I would suffer through the vanilla campaign if I were you. Keep your expectations for the vanilla story extremely low and you can still have some fun with the game itself, it's got decently good combat and mechanics.
One warning is that NWN2 (and the expansions) are HUGE resource hogs, so if your computer is old then expect ridiculous load times between areas.
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Star Control 2 has not been mentioned here yet? It's certainly my #1 for best story in a movie/book/game of all time, and it happens to have an excellent acronym.
The game was ported to windows under the name "Ur-Quan Masters" several years back and is available on sourceforge. If you were not aware of this game and want to experience the greatest old school space opera of all time then give it some research then check it out!
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Xenogears by far. One of those games where you can play over and over and learn more about the story each time... I thought the gameplay was pretty great too, tbh. And it has pretty great music to boot.
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(you are immortal, you have amnesia, you want to get rid of it, you get rid of it)
When I read that, I puked. I read the rest of your paragraph, and chugged it back up somewhat (why waste a perfectly good meal/floor?), but the puking was still valid.
This is like saying "Lord of the Rings: Hairy footed guys. Last Ring of power, throw into volcano, evil dude dies. That's it"
And yeah, thumbs up for PST. Best Video game brothel ever (and you cannot even get naked with any of them... I think?), best Sensorium ever, best plot about AMNESIA. One thing I loved about the game was abusing immortality, like that guy who's all "immortals don't exist lol" and you can snap your neck right in front fo the guy and he's all "oh. Fuck. Uh...", or that other guy who's like "I dunno what killing people is like. Can I stab you to death? would you mind?" Easiest 1000 gold ever. Ditto for signing the Dead Pact. Easy as hell XP.
Gotta thumbs down Heavy Rain as best VG story, by which I mean best VIDEO GAME story. The game is not a game. It's a film that is disguised like a game, with some added bullshit about interactive plot weaving or something silly like that. It's a very well dressed up Choose Your Own Adventure novel. It's an interesting concept for a game, but it's ultimately flawed because this should just be a FILM, not a GAME. There's very little game in it.
This isn't to say that you shouldn't have film influences with your game (the easy reference here is Hideo Kojima, a massive film nerd and also a massive game designer nerd, and his MGS series, but there's probably heaps others I'm not mentioning), just don't make it a film with game influences, if you get me.
The story was decent enough, and the twist was extremely well executed. Just not something I want to see more of.
As for Bioware, well, the stories themselves usually suck, in that they haven't developed much from KOTOR. You are a Jedi/Jedi equivalent, you can be cool or a dick, and you go aroudn saving the universe from persistent evil thing A/B/C. At least, this is the grand overall arc which sucks (kotor 1 being the exception because it's 'you are revan' twist is pretty damn good). what sucks LESS is the smaller infusions of narative that makes it more interesting, like this:
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/extra-credits/1974-Enriching-Lives
Or the DA:O quest with the possessed kid where it's like, oh shit. do I kil the kid or the wife? But, to safe the kid I have to use blood magic. can I trust this seemingly dependable wizard (turns out you could, unfortunately!). And then Alistair yells at me nonetheless (dick).
What I do like about RPG's is when they force the player to create his own morality, like what the video above describes. FO3's DLC Point Lookout did this (pity about the rest of FO3, heh), by compltely stripping Karma away from the quests. The only way to change Karma was to steal stuff, and there was like one place you could do that. The game made you choose between a robotic telepathic brain, and a ghoul shotgun-armed doctor with a massive chip on his shoulder. You listened to them both, considered their differences, weighed them up and picked one and rolled with it. Now, in this case they're not being as serious as they could be (I mean, it's a freakin' brain!) but it's good.
New Vegas does this a lot as well. It doesn't paint the NCR, Ceaser's Legion or Mr House (the 3 big players of New Vegas) as being particularly good or evil. I'd go into further specifics, but spoilers. I advise, if you have this game, to find Ceaser, Mr House and the NCR guy, talk to them. Get their opinions, get their world views. It's neat.
PS:T does that, but we already mentioned it once this post. I spose I'll mention again that I liked the voice acting, and the game has like the only voice actress that doesn't suck (Jennifer Hale; Falls-From-Grace). I remember playing ME1 for a few hours, hating it, uninstalling it and then realising that she voice the female shepard. I mean, I probably woulda played a few hours more if the person I was playing didn't have a shitty voice, but what can you do?
Choosing your own morality should now become staple for all RPG writing crews. Karma systems should be erased, or at least highly sidelined. It shouldn't so easy to find the good option, the neutral option and the evil option. Or perhaps they should, but the consequences should be more pronounced, and it should be more of an actual decision then just "well, I feel like being the Goodly Paladin, AGAIN".
For example, take the biggest morality cliche in RPG's. A man is being attacked by 2-3 assailants. The good option is to fight the assailants off. The evil option is to help the assailants. The neutral option is to not get involved, just keep walking. Almost all morality choices are offshoots of this. Now let's expand a little.
DnD makes things a bit more interesting with it's Chaotr/neutral/lawful choice, extending the possible choices from 3 to 9. If you were lawful good, you wouldn't fight them off but you would call for authorities to stop the fighting. If you were chaotic evil you'd kill them all. If you were lawful evil you'd fight off the assailants and then demand huge reparations from the victim. But the essential morality of the situation hasn't been resolved, which is that there are attackers anda poor individual. So how do we thicken the plot?
Simple. No innocent parties. What if the attackers were Law men? Not gangsters, hired from the local crimelord, but policemen with a badge and little patience, because who wants to bother with due process with these degenerates who are goign to be in jail most their lives and die young anyway. Then you'd be breaking the law by helping out the man, for even if he's not a criminal, which makes you go "hmm, which is the right idea here?". The coppers aren't necessarily evil people, they are just dealing with a shitty job that hates them. Yes, I'm thinking of The Wire here, btw, Season 1.
This is still a fairly concept. But, from there, we can extend this to encompass pretty much any theme we want such as human rights, philosophy (Ceaser does this, seriously, go talk to that guy!), discrimination, whatever. We just need to be able to frame it in the context of a serious player decision that induces a good amount of critical thinking and self introspection. This is where writing gets toooooooough, but there's no reason why this shouldn't provide too much of a challenge.
The other way to handle morality is to make the consequences extreme. Like, if I wanna be the good guy I should be Pariah'd for being violent. Take the above example. Say the guy getting attacked is a Priest, and the onyl way to stop the attackers was to kill them. The priest is quietly thankful to be alive, but should demonize me (I mean, full fucking on) for resorting to the only option I had to save him; violence. I shouldn't be a gleaming halo of brilliance and sunshine farts, I should be a goddamn anti-hero who struggles with himself, what he does and what happens because of it. And woe to those who would want to be the 'evil' guy in this situation!
As for more VG's and stories I liked, well...
The Witcher was decent. It does try and forge your own morality, but unfortunately it does so in a way that suggests you were 'right' to pick this option. It's very much like SC2's single player, when it gave you choices. None of them were inherently evil, or the 'wrong' one. I liked how it tried to make me think about which was the best choice, but I hated how it treated the player afterwards, by giving you the moral high ground on any decision. Still, the Witcher was decently handled, now if more native-englishs speakers could make intense games liek that, I'd be a happier man for it.
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On October 26 2010 10:06 Shrinky Dink wrote:
Mass Effect 1/2 was probably the best storyline ever.
Not to mention it is someway different for almost EVERY player (every cutscene is interactive with 2-6 options of dialogue). interactive gameplay that can very much change an already amazing storyline will almost always be better then a storyline you just go along with.
Hands down Mass Effect. (Not to mention the books are really good as well.)
ME 1 and 2 were contrived trash storywise. Incredibly boring.
PS:T of course is possibly the greatest, but I don't see many people bringing up Xenogears. I grew up playing that game without knowing the intricacies within it, but holy shit, when I found out what the game was actually representing, I fell in love all over again.
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On October 27 2010 19:42 Tilorn wrote:
During my 19 years of gaming expirience I'd say what games had the best story in my oppion:
1) Legacy of Kain
2) Mass Effect 1 & 2
3) Devil May Cry 3 and 4 to some extent
4) Warcraft 3 and TFT
5) Neverwinter Nights
6) KotOR
7) Starcraft (the books would be a strong 3rd place, but the game only 7th)
8) Dragon Age
9) Amnesia - The Dark Descent
10) And I almost forgot Syberia!! I don't really know on what spot to squeeze this amazing game (read story) so I'll let it chill on the 10th spot even tho it's probably better then that.
Just my 2c.
amnesia had the stupidest ending. it ranked up there with the ending of kotor 2.
seriously, how high do you have to be to just sit down, write an awesome story and then literally bend over and shit out the last paragraphs, purely for the sake of "completion"
On October 28 2010 17:54 ZZangDreamjOy wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2010 10:06 Shrinky Dink wrote:
Mass Effect 1/2 was probably the best storyline ever.
Not to mention it is someway different for almost EVERY player (every cutscene is interactive with 2-6 options of dialogue). interactive gameplay that can very much change an already amazing storyline will almost always be better then a storyline you just go along with.
Hands down Mass Effect. (Not to mention the books are really good as well.) ME 1 and 2 were contrived trash storywise. Incredibly boring. PS:T of course is possibly the greatest, but I don't see many people bringing up Xenogears. I grew up playing that game without knowing the intricacies within it, but holy shit, when I found out what the game was actually representing, I fell in love all over again.
i wouldnt go so far as to call ME's plot trash. how original can you be, making video games nowadays? I'm usually a sucker for the "man on impossible quest" games, but this was special because of the character depth and dialogue that enhanced the plot to where i didnt even really mind that specters were basically a ripped off version jedi. i mean fuck, seth green even piloted your god damn ship.
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I'm surprised no one has mentioned Suikoden II yet..
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On October 28 2010 08:49 Krigwin wrote:Show nested quote +On October 28 2010 08:44 Pfhor wrote:
I don't think there is anything worse than someone who says "Man I feel sorry for those people that think something I don't". I'm sure your points are valid and shit but the beginning to this post makes you come off as some pretentious asshat. I didn't say they were somehow wrong in their opinion or belittle their intelligence, I only lamented their lack of experience. If anyone has played all the games I have mentioned and still think Bioware games have the best stories, then good for them, but I hardly think that's case. Why so offended bro?
He already told you why he's offended, because you come off sounding like a huge elitist asshole in that post.
I'm a huge ME fan and as such I obviously disagree with you. Sure, the idea of an ancient "evil" (they're actually not evil, just deterministic) has been used countless times before, and the writers at Bioware surely have H.P. Lovecraft as one of their main influences, but show me one, only one type of villain that hasn't been used endless times before. There is none. No matter how special your villain might be, he will just be a derivative of some villain-form that's existed before.
Then, generalizing the whole writing and how it's carried out by only mentioning the major plot line is like saying "The Wire is really a poorly written TV Show. It's about police, drugs, and black people (or it's about "america sucks, it's going down"). That's been used sooo many times before. duh"
It's like you're assuming that a story can only be good if the major plotline is something hugely innovative, and that's just bullshit.
While it doesn't belong to the main plot, the universes of Bioware games were always very expansive. They seem to think about every little detail in their worlds, which makes them believable and gives food for exploration and for thought. It's one of those games where you stop playing, go to bed and think about how awesome it would be if some of that stuff would actually be possible.
Then there's the huge cast of believable characters. Most of them have obvious characteristic traits and are part of some kind of niche, but all of that doesn't make them bad characters. Quite the opposite, most of them evoke some kind of emotion in you when thinking about them. I hated Jack. Such a forced "I'm super alternative and don't give a shit about anything!"-bitch. But I loved Rex, and Grunt. From a superficial standpoint, all of those 3 characters are pretty bland, but the combination of being able to explore them in much detail (with backgrounds on the history of their entire species) and the voice acting make them awesome.
You mention great production value in Bioware games, and that's exactly what it comes down to when telling a story in a video game nowadays. Of course it's different when reading a book, or playing an old RPG where you read 99% of the plot instead of seeing it play out or getting it played for you by voice actors. And that's where Mass Effect is epic at. You may not like the 3 minute reaper confrontation, but it sure gave ME chills, and looking at the youtube comments of a couple of let's plays that contain this section of the game, a whole lot of others must have felt like me.
Have you played the Metal Gear Solid games? The plots of those games are huge "WTF?" inducing piles of Hideo-Kojima brainstorming sessions. Doesn't make them any less awesome, and that's all because of the way they are told.
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I rather liked Xenogears story. I'm not a videogame story connoisseur(havent played some of the ones mentioned here), so I'm not going to claim its definitely the best ever, but I havent played too many games I liked the plot as much.
Also, sometimes perception of game plots is heavily tied to the gameplay. It feels like some people are factoring gameplay/delivery, and some arent, which is interesting in itself. (ie some plots are captivating as you're playing through them, but lose meaning when you describe plainly. Things like the sick feeling in your stomach having to grind/move on after some major char just died, and the music is so depressing etc)
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Torment is the best rpg game ive ever played due to its story.
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On October 28 2010 18:18 heishe wrote:
He already told you why he's offended, because you come off sounding like a huge elitist asshole in that post.
I didn't say "Man, you must be stupid to think so and so", I said I felt sorry for you, and that's because you must not have played many games. If that still sounds condescending to you then I don't know what to say, other than to stop being easily offended.
Also, it's not elitism if I'm actually correct in my presumptions, then it's justified. The correct response is not "man, you're a huge elitist asshole!", the correct response is "Bro, I think you're wrong bro, and here's why: elaborate explanation of games played". So, am I correct in my presumptions, bro?
I'm a huge ME fan and as such I obviously disagree with you. Sure, the idea of an ancient "evil" (they're actually not evil, just deterministic) has been used countless times before, and the writers at Bioware surely have H.P. Lovecraft as one of their main influences, but show me one, only one type of villain that hasn't been used endless times before. There is none. No matter how special your villain might be, he will just be a derivative of some villain-form that's existed before.
Then, generalizing the whole writing and how it's carried out by only mentioning the major plot line is like saying "The Wire is really a poorly written TV Show. It's about police, drugs, and black people (or it's about "america sucks, it's going down"). That's been used sooo many times before. duh"
It's like you're assuming that a story can only be good if the major plotline is something hugely innovative, and that's just bullshit.
The point isn't that the villain has a generic modus operandi, the point is that the villain itself is generic. I pointed out the idea of an all-consuming evil being trite because that's all the Reapers are. There's no backstory. No motivation. No badass interactions with the player over and over again. Just a contrived excuse for a three-game mytharc involving some Giant Space Flea group of intergalactic recyclers.
There can be no story without drama. There can be no drama without conflict. There can be conflict without an antagonist. Thus, a story is only as well-written as its villain. Mass Effect's villains are not well-written. Therefore, Mass Effect's main story is not well-written.
While it doesn't belong to the main plot, the universes of Bioware games were always very expansive. They seem to think about every little detail in their worlds, which makes them believable and gives food for exploration and for thought. It's one of those games where you stop playing, go to bed and think about how awesome it would be if some of that stuff would actually be possible.
Then there's the huge cast of believable characters. Most of them have obvious characteristic traits and are part of some kind of niche, but all of that doesn't make them bad characters. Quite the opposite, most of them evoke some kind of emotion in you when thinking about them. I hated Jack. Such a forced "I'm super alternative and don't give a shit about anything!"-bitch. But I loved Rex, and Grunt. From a superficial standpoint, all of those 3 characters are pretty bland, but the combination of being able to explore them in much detail (with backgrounds on the history of their entire species) and the voice acting make them awesome.
You mention great production value in Bioware games, and that's exactly what it comes down to when telling a story in a video game nowadays. Of course it's different when reading a book, or playing an old RPG where you read 99% of the plot instead of seeing it play out or getting it played for you by voice actors. And that's where Mass Effect is epic at. You may not like the 3 minute reaper confrontation, but it sure gave ME chills, and looking at the youtube comments of a couple of let's plays that contain this section of the game, a whole lot of others must have felt like me.
Have you played the Metal Gear Solid games? The plots of those games are huge "WTF?" inducing piles of Hideo-Kojima brainstorming sessions. Doesn't make them any less awesome, and that's all because of the way they are told.
I never said Bioware didn't have good attention to detail, or didn't care about characterization, or any of the other things you're alluding to here. I simply said they were far from the top of the totem pole when it comes to video game writing. It's very possible to be good but not the best. I've always felt Bioware's weakness was that they obviously care a lot about creating a diverse and interesting cast, but never have a really good backdrop for that cast to interact on (except for maybe KotOR). This is actually kind of interesting because it's typically JRPGs that have a good cast and a generic main story, and Bioware is rather the most well-known WRPG developer, but really as the years have come and gone they've kind of turned into a Western JRPG developer (as is proven by Dragon Age 2).
Bioware largely gets by on dazzling aesthetics and "EPIC" conflicts for the casual crowd and that's really the secret to their success (aside from all the dating simulators), but saying that's the best writing is like saying Transformers is the best movie. If you ran into a bunch of teenagers who thought Transformers was like, the best thing that ever happened to cinema, and had never seen the original Star Wars, or Aliens, or Terminator movies, wouldn't you feel sorry for them? If they've actually seen all of those movies and still think Transformers is 10/10, then clearly we just have a case of differing opinions here, but if they've never even heard of them, isn't that a thing to lament?
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EPT
