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Cel.erity
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States4890 Posts
July 10 2013 05:53 GMT
#8281
In a draft, you open 3 packs and see 3 rares + whatever rares get passed to you.

In a sealed, you open 6 packs and see 6 rares, period.

So yeah, drafting would be more efficient if you're hunting for a specific card.
We found Dove in a soapless place.
whatwhatanut
Profile Joined December 2010
United States195 Posts
July 10 2013 08:03 GMT
#8282
On July 10 2013 14:53 Cel.erity wrote:
In a draft, you open 3 packs and see 3 rares + whatever rares get passed to you.

In a sealed, you open 6 packs and see 6 rares, period.

So yeah, drafting would be more efficient if you're hunting for a specific card.


No, you also can get foil rares and mythic rares, in the few sealeds ive done i average maybe 6.5 rares. Especially in the more recent sets that have flipcards and the land could be rare in dgm. Close enuf though i guess.
deth2munkies
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States4051 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-10 12:41:48
July 10 2013 12:41 GMT
#8283
On July 10 2013 17:03 whatwhatanut wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 10 2013 14:53 Cel.erity wrote:
In a draft, you open 3 packs and see 3 rares + whatever rares get passed to you.

In a sealed, you open 6 packs and see 6 rares, period.

So yeah, drafting would be more efficient if you're hunting for a specific card.


No, you also can get foil rares and mythic rares, in the few sealeds ive done i average maybe 6.5 rares. Especially in the more recent sets that have flipcards and the land could be rare in dgm. Close enuf though i guess.


Which also means that you'll get passed a rare in draft. Draft will damn near always get you more and has the potential for even more, especially considering some rares are good in constructed but not draft (i.e. Progenitus in MM, Notion Thief in DGM, every shockland, etc.)
Cel.erity
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States4890 Posts
July 10 2013 13:59 GMT
#8284
On July 10 2013 17:03 whatwhatanut wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 10 2013 14:53 Cel.erity wrote:
In a draft, you open 3 packs and see 3 rares + whatever rares get passed to you.

In a sealed, you open 6 packs and see 6 rares, period.

So yeah, drafting would be more efficient if you're hunting for a specific card.


No, you also can get foil rares and mythic rares, in the few sealeds ive done i average maybe 6.5 rares. Especially in the more recent sets that have flipcards and the land could be rare in dgm. Close enuf though i guess.


But everything you said also applies to packs opened in draft...
We found Dove in a soapless place.
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-10 14:25:58
July 10 2013 14:22 GMT
#8285
On July 10 2013 13:43 Shotcoder wrote:
You specifically said you wanted for aggro decks so you don't get beat for lethal. I don't know how turn 2-3 having a -4/-4 isn't reliable for you as esper, especially on the draw.


That was for Doom Blade. DW is for specific creatures and 1 drops. WP is for catch-many early on. I don't like the terribleness of the card later on when I am building a deck for the later turns. The specificness of the card WP (and it is specific) when it can kill things something I rather not deal with.

Also, it isn't -X/-X, its +X/-X which sometimes is relevant.

Edit:

As for that Sealed vs. Draft debate, I am not following the arguments for Sealed. I don't see how you are getting more value one way than you would another? If you are hunting for specific cards, then draft since you see more cards and there's always a chance people will pass you things they can't play.
Get it by your hands...
mavignon
Profile Joined November 2010
France369 Posts
July 10 2013 14:43 GMT
#8286
For money cards it does not change much because nobody will pass Voice or Sphinx's Revelation, ever. Other cards I think it's just best to buy them.

The exception might be lands. I have seen shock lands in draft as late as 4th pick. I guess everybody playing 8-4 has them and don't care anymore but it's pretty nice for us new players to not spend 4 tix on basic utility cards...
CruelZeratul
Profile Joined May 2010
Germany4588 Posts
July 10 2013 15:22 GMT
#8287
Hey Cel.erity, did you stop streaming completely?
micronesia
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States24761 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-10 15:47:44
July 10 2013 15:45 GMT
#8288
Regarding one drop creatures (which I know to avoid unless you have a good reason for one of them), how are these?




Slitherhead: You can cast it with either of two colors, and later you can create a +1/+1 counter for free, so this seems okay, although only in a golgari deck

Rakdos Cackler: Potentially a 2/2 swinging on turn 2. Good if you are utilizing Rakdos/Unleash. This creature also benefits from allowing you to have either basic land in order to cast it immediately.

Nivmagus Elemental: Only worth it if your deck allows you to utilize the ability, which is unlikely.

Judge's Familiar: A flying 1/1 with the ability to counter a spell, but the counter won't be a surprise, and 1/1 isn't a big enough threat to really be worth it even if you can get it out immediately.

Deathrite Shaman: Good good card, one drop or not. The abilities are great.

Dryad Militant: 2/1 for 1 mana isn't bad, and the card is good if the ability hurts your opponent.

Blistercoil Weird: Soso if you have a lot of instants and sorceries. Otherwise it's just a 1/1 for one.

Boros elite: Good if you are using an aggressive deck, otherwise not that good.

Dutiful Thrull: Can be a good blocker if you are using Orzhov Colors, but that's only good if you know you will be on the defensive

Cloudfin Raptor: evolves and flies, so good for one mana; can be great

Realmwright: I've been told it's bad; I'd think it could be good at least in a case where blue is your main color but you are using several other secondary/splash colors

Shadow Alley Denizen: only worth it if most of your creatures are black and you plan to win with combat damage

Thrull Parasite: good because of extort, and possibly the other ability, although that's unlikely

Foundry Street Denizen: Nah, not worth it

Legion Loyalist: Good and worth it due to haste and battalion ability. This card is useful even mid-late game despite being a one drop

Experiment One: Evolves and can regenerate, so good

Spire Tracer: Only good if you are using a mechanic like cipher a lot, which is unlikely if you have green creatures

Beckon Apparition: A 1/1 flier isn't that useful, but being able to exile a card from your opponent's graveyard might be very helpful against the right opponent




I tend to overvalue one drops, so please let me know which ones are actually terrible even though I said they weren't lol
ModeratorThere are animal crackers for people and there are people crackers for animals.
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
July 10 2013 15:53 GMT
#8289
Cards I will always play are probably, Raptor, Thrull Parasite, Loyalist, Experiment One, Cackler, Boros Elite.

Cards I will most likely play, Dutiful Thrull, Dryad Militant.

Cards I will play if I have the support, Denizens, Shaman, Slitherhead.

Cards I will play because I need to, Spire Tracer, Apparition, Familiar

Cards I rather drop than play the deck, the Weirds.
Get it by your hands...
deth2munkies
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States4051 Posts
July 10 2013 16:09 GMT
#8290
Spire Tracer is good because of Forced Adaptation and bloodrush, not cipher.
slyboogie
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States3423 Posts
July 10 2013 16:52 GMT
#8291
On July 11 2013 00:45 micronesia wrote:
Regarding one drop creatures (which I know to avoid unless you have a good reason for one of them), how are these?




Slitherhead: You can cast it with either of two colors, and later you can create a +1/+1 counter for free, so this seems okay, although only in a golgari deck

Rakdos Cackler: Potentially a 2/2 swinging on turn 2. Good if you are utilizing Rakdos/Unleash. This creature also benefits from allowing you to have either basic land in order to cast it immediately.

Nivmagus Elemental: Only worth it if your deck allows you to utilize the ability, which is unlikely.

Judge's Familiar: A flying 1/1 with the ability to counter a spell, but the counter won't be a surprise, and 1/1 isn't a big enough threat to really be worth it even if you can get it out immediately.

Deathrite Shaman: Good good card, one drop or not. The abilities are great.

Dryad Militant: 2/1 for 1 mana isn't bad, and the card is good if the ability hurts your opponent.

Blistercoil Weird: Soso if you have a lot of instants and sorceries. Otherwise it's just a 1/1 for one.

Boros elite: Good if you are using an aggressive deck, otherwise not that good.

Dutiful Thrull: Can be a good blocker if you are using Orzhov Colors, but that's only good if you know you will be on the defensive

Cloudfin Raptor: evolves and flies, so good for one mana; can be great

Realmwright: I've been told it's bad; I'd think it could be good at least in a case where blue is your main color but you are using several other secondary/splash colors

Shadow Alley Denizen: only worth it if most of your creatures are black and you plan to win with combat damage

Thrull Parasite: good because of extort, and possibly the other ability, although that's unlikely

Foundry Street Denizen: Nah, not worth it

Legion Loyalist: Good and worth it due to haste and battalion ability. This card is useful even mid-late game despite being a one drop

Experiment One: Evolves and can regenerate, so good

Spire Tracer: Only good if you are using a mechanic like cipher a lot, which is unlikely if you have green creatures

Beckon Apparition: A 1/1 flier isn't that useful, but being able to exile a card from your opponent's graveyard might be very helpful against the right opponent




I tend to overvalue one drops, so please let me know which ones are actually terrible even though I said they weren't lol


Familiar plus two Civic Sabers made for some weird games in those RTR days.

If you can get two power for 1 mana without a drawback, it's usually a good enough card to play.
"We dug coal together." Boyd Crowder, Justified
Shotcoder
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States2316 Posts
July 10 2013 16:54 GMT
#8292
On July 10 2013 23:22 Judicator wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 10 2013 13:43 Shotcoder wrote:
You specifically said you wanted for aggro decks so you don't get beat for lethal. I don't know how turn 2-3 having a -4/-4 isn't reliable for you as esper, especially on the draw.


That was for Doom Blade. DW is for specific creatures and 1 drops. WP is for catch-many early on. I don't like the terribleness of the card later on when I am building a deck for the later turns. The specificness of the card WP (and it is specific) when it can kill things something I rather not deal with.

Also, it isn't -X/-X, its +X/-X which sometimes is relevant.

Edit:

As for that Sealed vs. Draft debate, I am not following the arguments for Sealed. I don't see how you are getting more value one way than you would another? If you are hunting for specific cards, then draft since you see more cards and there's always a chance people will pass you things they can't play.


Still the card is better than doom blade especially since you are looking to main deck the card. It hits every you're concerned about while you'll feel like a moron hold a doomblade when your opponent goes turn 2 Aristocrat or turn 3 Valroz. Plus it will sit dead in your hand if they drop a sire or any of of the black colored bombs.

WP Still should reliably hit 4 toughness creatures up to like turn 4-5 unless you're dumping your hand for 1 for 1 trades.
Shotcoder - C+ BW Terran, Gold LoL(ADC Main)
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
July 10 2013 17:12 GMT
#8293
On July 11 2013 01:54 Shotcoder wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 10 2013 23:22 Judicator wrote:
On July 10 2013 13:43 Shotcoder wrote:
You specifically said you wanted for aggro decks so you don't get beat for lethal. I don't know how turn 2-3 having a -4/-4 isn't reliable for you as esper, especially on the draw.


That was for Doom Blade. DW is for specific creatures and 1 drops. WP is for catch-many early on. I don't like the terribleness of the card later on when I am building a deck for the later turns. The specificness of the card WP (and it is specific) when it can kill things something I rather not deal with.

Also, it isn't -X/-X, its +X/-X which sometimes is relevant.

Edit:

As for that Sealed vs. Draft debate, I am not following the arguments for Sealed. I don't see how you are getting more value one way than you would another? If you are hunting for specific cards, then draft since you see more cards and there's always a chance people will pass you things they can't play.


Still the card is better than doom blade especially since you are looking to main deck the card. It hits every you're concerned about while you'll feel like a moron hold a doomblade when your opponent goes turn 2 Aristocrat or turn 3 Valroz. Plus it will sit dead in your hand if they drop a sire or any of of the black colored bombs.

WP Still should reliably hit 4 toughness creatures up to like turn 4-5 unless you're dumping your hand for 1 for 1 trades.


You already posted the list of cards that doom blade can't hit and we went through it already so not going to re-hash that argument. I felt like a moron holding doom blade 2 standard cycles ago too, but that doesn't the card is bad. Plus that match up is so much more even if not tilted in Esper's favor at this point with Ratchet Bombs.
Get it by your hands...
Cel.erity
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States4890 Posts
July 10 2013 19:50 GMT
#8294
On July 11 2013 00:22 CruelZeratul wrote:
Hey Cel.erity, did you stop streaming completely?


Nope, I try to stream about once or twice a week. My vods haven't been saving because one of my settings got changed, but I changed it back.
We found Dove in a soapless place.
deth2munkies
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States4051 Posts
July 10 2013 19:56 GMT
#8295
On July 11 2013 04:50 Cel.erity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 11 2013 00:22 CruelZeratul wrote:
Hey Cel.erity, did you stop streaming completely?


Nope, I try to stream about once or twice a week. My vods haven't been saving because one of my settings got changed, but I changed it back.

Really? Twitch stopped sending me updates because it hates hotmail, I must have just been missing all the times you were on.
Shotcoder
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States2316 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-11 01:46:56
July 11 2013 00:54 GMT
#8296
On July 11 2013 02:12 Judicator wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 11 2013 01:54 Shotcoder wrote:
On July 10 2013 23:22 Judicator wrote:
On July 10 2013 13:43 Shotcoder wrote:
You specifically said you wanted for aggro decks so you don't get beat for lethal. I don't know how turn 2-3 having a -4/-4 isn't reliable for you as esper, especially on the draw.


That was for Doom Blade. DW is for specific creatures and 1 drops. WP is for catch-many early on. I don't like the terribleness of the card later on when I am building a deck for the later turns. The specificness of the card WP (and it is specific) when it can kill things something I rather not deal with.

Also, it isn't -X/-X, its +X/-X which sometimes is relevant.

Edit:

As for that Sealed vs. Draft debate, I am not following the arguments for Sealed. I don't see how you are getting more value one way than you would another? If you are hunting for specific cards, then draft since you see more cards and there's always a chance people will pass you things they can't play.


Still the card is better than doom blade especially since you are looking to main deck the card. It hits every you're concerned about while you'll feel like a moron hold a doomblade when your opponent goes turn 2 Aristocrat or turn 3 Valroz. Plus it will sit dead in your hand if they drop a sire or any of of the black colored bombs.

WP Still should reliably hit 4 toughness creatures up to like turn 4-5 unless you're dumping your hand for 1 for 1 trades.


You already posted the list of cards that doom blade can't hit and we went through it already so not going to re-hash that argument. I felt like a moron holding doom blade 2 standard cycles ago too, but that doesn't the card is bad. Plus that match up is so much more even if not tilted in Esper's favor at this point with Ratchet Bombs.


So I don't understand why you play a card that is extremely narrow purposefully. It makes zero sense when the alternatives are better. I'm not rehashing an argument I'm fortifying why it doesn't make sense.

2 Standard cycles ago it was bad vs 2 match ups, now it's plain awful without something like go for the throat to back it up.

Edit: The inclusion of ratchet bomb doesn't make playing bad cards better.
Shotcoder - C+ BW Terran, Gold LoL(ADC Main)
Tosstriss
Profile Joined November 2011
Canada334 Posts
July 11 2013 03:06 GMT
#8297
Which booster pack has the better value in RTR/GTC/DGM because where I go for FNM we get a free booster. Each time I open DGM I always get disappointed with the rares I get.
NotSorry
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States6722 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-11 03:37:31
July 11 2013 03:35 GMT
#8298
On July 11 2013 12:06 Tosstriss wrote:
Which booster pack has the better value in RTR/GTC/DGM because where I go for FNM we get a free booster. Each time I open DGM I always get disappointed with the rares I get.

RTR aiming for Sphinx's rev, Deathrite Shaman, Jace, AOS, dual lands and others.
We have now sunk to a depth at which restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. - Orwell
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
July 11 2013 03:51 GMT
#8299
On July 11 2013 09:54 Shotcoder wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 11 2013 02:12 Judicator wrote:
On July 11 2013 01:54 Shotcoder wrote:
On July 10 2013 23:22 Judicator wrote:
On July 10 2013 13:43 Shotcoder wrote:
You specifically said you wanted for aggro decks so you don't get beat for lethal. I don't know how turn 2-3 having a -4/-4 isn't reliable for you as esper, especially on the draw.


That was for Doom Blade. DW is for specific creatures and 1 drops. WP is for catch-many early on. I don't like the terribleness of the card later on when I am building a deck for the later turns. The specificness of the card WP (and it is specific) when it can kill things something I rather not deal with.

Also, it isn't -X/-X, its +X/-X which sometimes is relevant.

Edit:

As for that Sealed vs. Draft debate, I am not following the arguments for Sealed. I don't see how you are getting more value one way than you would another? If you are hunting for specific cards, then draft since you see more cards and there's always a chance people will pass you things they can't play.


Still the card is better than doom blade especially since you are looking to main deck the card. It hits every you're concerned about while you'll feel like a moron hold a doomblade when your opponent goes turn 2 Aristocrat or turn 3 Valroz. Plus it will sit dead in your hand if they drop a sire or any of of the black colored bombs.

WP Still should reliably hit 4 toughness creatures up to like turn 4-5 unless you're dumping your hand for 1 for 1 trades.


You already posted the list of cards that doom blade can't hit and we went through it already so not going to re-hash that argument. I felt like a moron holding doom blade 2 standard cycles ago too, but that doesn't the card is bad. Plus that match up is so much more even if not tilted in Esper's favor at this point with Ratchet Bombs.


So I don't understand why you play a card that is extremely narrow purposefully. It makes zero sense when the alternatives are better. I'm not rehashing an argument I'm fortifying why it doesn't make sense.

2 Standard cycles ago it was bad vs 2 match ups, now it's plain awful without something like go for the throat to back it up.

Edit: The inclusion of ratchet bomb doesn't make playing bad cards better.


Need the card to kill things before the wrath, and to kill things after the wrath. WP doesn't fulfill that role consistently, not the latter at least.
Get it by your hands...
Shotcoder
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States2316 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-11 04:19:53
July 11 2013 04:07 GMT
#8300
On July 11 2013 12:51 Judicator wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 11 2013 09:54 Shotcoder wrote:
On July 11 2013 02:12 Judicator wrote:
On July 11 2013 01:54 Shotcoder wrote:
On July 10 2013 23:22 Judicator wrote:
On July 10 2013 13:43 Shotcoder wrote:
You specifically said you wanted for aggro decks so you don't get beat for lethal. I don't know how turn 2-3 having a -4/-4 isn't reliable for you as esper, especially on the draw.


That was for Doom Blade. DW is for specific creatures and 1 drops. WP is for catch-many early on. I don't like the terribleness of the card later on when I am building a deck for the later turns. The specificness of the card WP (and it is specific) when it can kill things something I rather not deal with.

Also, it isn't -X/-X, its +X/-X which sometimes is relevant.

Edit:

As for that Sealed vs. Draft debate, I am not following the arguments for Sealed. I don't see how you are getting more value one way than you would another? If you are hunting for specific cards, then draft since you see more cards and there's always a chance people will pass you things they can't play.


Still the card is better than doom blade especially since you are looking to main deck the card. It hits every you're concerned about while you'll feel like a moron hold a doomblade when your opponent goes turn 2 Aristocrat or turn 3 Valroz. Plus it will sit dead in your hand if they drop a sire or any of of the black colored bombs.

WP Still should reliably hit 4 toughness creatures up to like turn 4-5 unless you're dumping your hand for 1 for 1 trades.


You already posted the list of cards that doom blade can't hit and we went through it already so not going to re-hash that argument. I felt like a moron holding doom blade 2 standard cycles ago too, but that doesn't the card is bad. Plus that match up is so much more even if not tilted in Esper's favor at this point with Ratchet Bombs.


So I don't understand why you play a card that is extremely narrow purposefully. It makes zero sense when the alternatives are better. I'm not rehashing an argument I'm fortifying why it doesn't make sense.

2 Standard cycles ago it was bad vs 2 match ups, now it's plain awful without something like go for the throat to back it up.

Edit: The inclusion of ratchet bomb doesn't make playing bad cards better.


Need the card to kill things before the wrath, and to kill things after the wrath. WP doesn't fulfill that role consistently, not the latter at least.


...I don't even...

Edit: So you aren't running 4 Revelation and 3-4 think twice?
Shotcoder - C+ BW Terran, Gold LoL(ADC Main)
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