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I think its ok to ask this here.
I used to play magic a long time ago. Stopped at Mirrodin block, when ravager affinity was dominating.
This weekend I felt like playing again and bought a MTG:Online account, did some research and built a monogreen infect to play some standard, just because its very simple and cheap.
The problem is that I don't like to play those aggro deck, I used to play UBr Psychatog, UWg Mirari and even the aggro decks had some kind of control like UG Madness.
So, is there any heavy control deck like those old one (if someone remember them)? Is there any other cheap option that I will be able to play after rotation?
Also, any tips for a starter in online mtg would be helpful.
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On September 11 2012 01:10 cLAN.Anax wrote:Was wondering what use Unleash would have been for (an extra +1/+1 to remove the ability to block didn't sound too good...), but it makes absolute sense on Chaos Imps. Well done, Wizards.  I assume Nivmagus is good against control decks? Say you have that out and you play an instant or sorcery. Opponent tosses out a Cancel (or equivalent to counter). You exile your spell on the stack and put 2 counters on Nivmagus. You don't have the spell you wanted to play, but they're out an instant, and your creature is stronger. Am I interpreting that right? Or would your own spell not be a legal target for your opponent anymore once you exile it?
You interpreted it correctly.
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On September 11 2012 02:12 Tur wrote:
I think its ok to ask this here.
I used to play magic a long time ago. Stopped at Mirrodin block, when ravager affinity was dominating.
This weekend I felt like playing again and bought a MTG:Online account, did some research and built a monogreen infect to play some standard, just because its very simple and cheap.
The problem is that I don't like to play those aggro deck, I used to play UBr Psychatog, UWg Mirari and even the aggro decks had some kind of control like UG Madness.
So, is there any heavy control deck like those old one (if someone remember them)? Is there any other cheap option that I will be able to play after rotation?
Also, any tips for a starter in online mtg would be helpful.
There is no such thing as a cheap control deck. Once R2R comes out, control will probably get better from what's been spoiled so far, but right now it's pretty dead thanks to tempo/aggro/pod outpacing their ability to deal with it. I'd say the best control deck in the format is one you probably won't like, but it's Esper Planeswalkers. Super expensive, taps out a lot, wraths a lot, etc.
For starting out on MTGO, it just depends whether or not you like drafting. If you like drafting and can do it well (there's billions of streams/articles/videos out there to help), you can theoretically go infinite by winning drafts and selling some of the packs to make money and using the rest to draft again.
If you don't like drafting, it'll be a lot like paper, you can speculate by buying low and selling high when cards get their 15 minutes, but other than that it's just slightly less expensive but identical to paper.
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On September 11 2012 02:31 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2012 01:10 cLAN.Anax wrote:Was wondering what use Unleash would have been for (an extra +1/+1 to remove the ability to block didn't sound too good...), but it makes absolute sense on Chaos Imps. Well done, Wizards. I assume Nivmagus is good against control decks? Say you have that out and you play an instant or sorcery. Opponent tosses out a Cancel (or equivalent to counter). You exile your spell on the stack and put 2 counters on Nivmagus. You don't have the spell you wanted to play, but they're out an instant, and your creature is stronger. Am I interpreting that right? Or would your own spell not be a legal target for your opponent anymore once you exile it? You interpreted it correctly.
Aaaaaaooohhhhh, then that's sneaky. I like.
@Tur: I can't help you too much, but you've come to the right place. After a search or two, this was the closest thing I found to a general MTG thread. Posting ideas and thoughts and questions about almost anything pertaining to the game is accepted here, I've found.
If you're strapped for cash or just don't want to spend money, I'd recommend Magic Workstation or Cockatrice instead of MTGO, as they're entirely free and can help you test deckbuilds that you might want to run someday. But it seems the more competitive folks use MTGO, so that would be something to consider too.
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Oh, I played a lot of workstantion and apprentice too. But to me the feeling of trading a card or buying that one that you were looking for is what make me enjoy magic, since paper is a bit too much time consuming and the places I went to play some FNM dont even exist anymore I picked MTGO.
I know control is expensive, I asked a cheaper option to Infect, since its out in October. Something I can play until I finish the control deck. I was thinking about some Delver deck.
I like draft, I did win the 2 new player draft event, but I dont think that count. I will try that later and see if I can keep drafting without spending a lot of money on it, like on paper draft.
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http://wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/mm/212
Me: How about we just do proliferate for tokens?
Ken: What would that mean?
Me: Whenever you, let's call it propagate, you get a copy of each type of token you have on the battlefield.
Ken: Explain in greater detail.
Me: Okay, I have two 1/1 Squirrel tokens.
Ken: We're not going to have Squirrel tokens.
Me: My example takes place in an alternate dimension where we can have Squirrel tokens. I call it the Odyssey dimension. :D
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On September 11 2012 03:12 Tur wrote:
Oh, I played a lot of workstantion and apprentice too. But to me the feeling of trading a card or buying that one that you were looking for is what make me enjoy magic, since paper is a bit too much time consuming and the places I went to play some FNM dont even exist anymore I picked MTGO.
I know control is expensive, I asked a cheaper option to Infect, since its out in October. Something I can play until I finish the control deck. I was thinking about some Delver deck.
I like draft, I did win the 2 new player draft event, but I dont think that count. I will try that later and see if I can keep drafting without spending a lot of money on it, like on paper draft.
Just draft.
Delver is the closest things to the decks you played minus Wake. I want to say that there's no equivalent to Wake, but Primeval Titan decks would count.
UB control is like Tog but much less secure since you have no Upheaval bailout. Something I don't suggest you play because you need a solid number of games to understand the lines and then much more to understand how to tweak it from time to time.
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On September 11 2012 07:46 Judicator wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2012 03:12 Tur wrote:
Oh, I played a lot of workstantion and apprentice too. But to me the feeling of trading a card or buying that one that you were looking for is what make me enjoy magic, since paper is a bit too much time consuming and the places I went to play some FNM dont even exist anymore I picked MTGO.
I know control is expensive, I asked a cheaper option to Infect, since its out in October. Something I can play until I finish the control deck. I was thinking about some Delver deck.
I like draft, I did win the 2 new player draft event, but I dont think that count. I will try that later and see if I can keep drafting without spending a lot of money on it, like on paper draft. Just draft. Delver is the closest things to the decks you played minus Wake. I want to say that there's no equivalent to Wake, but Primeval Titan decks would count. UB control is like Tog but much less secure since you have no Upheaval bailout. Something I don't suggest you play because you need a solid number of games to understand the lines and then much more to understand how to tweak it from time to time.
One thing that I notice is that Standard seems to be much more diverse. There's a lot of decks on top 8.
In Odyssey, Onslaught and Mirrodin it was all about a deck owning everything up and people trying to build a counter to it that doesn't lose to everything else.
As far as I can tell those delver decks seems to be really good, but there's a lot of options.
I will try some draft, better go with M13, right?
If anyone want to add me, my name there is turr.
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On September 11 2012 08:45 Tur wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2012 07:46 Judicator wrote:On September 11 2012 03:12 Tur wrote:
Oh, I played a lot of workstantion and apprentice too. But to me the feeling of trading a card or buying that one that you were looking for is what make me enjoy magic, since paper is a bit too much time consuming and the places I went to play some FNM dont even exist anymore I picked MTGO.
I know control is expensive, I asked a cheaper option to Infect, since its out in October. Something I can play until I finish the control deck. I was thinking about some Delver deck.
I like draft, I did win the 2 new player draft event, but I dont think that count. I will try that later and see if I can keep drafting without spending a lot of money on it, like on paper draft. Just draft. Delver is the closest things to the decks you played minus Wake. I want to say that there's no equivalent to Wake, but Primeval Titan decks would count. UB control is like Tog but much less secure since you have no Upheaval bailout. Something I don't suggest you play because you need a solid number of games to understand the lines and then much more to understand how to tweak it from time to time. One thing that I notice is that Standard seems to be much more diverse. There's a lot of decks on top 8. In Odyssey, Onslaught and Mirrodin it was all about a deck owning everything up and people trying to build a counter to it that doesn't lose to everything else. As far as I can tell those delver decks seems to be really good, but there's a lot of options. I will try some draft, better go with M13, right? If anyone want to add me, my name there is turr.
Draft whatever you can that will net you cards that remain legal for standard in rotation.
Theoretically there are many decks that can top 8 any given PT, but realistically there are 1 or 2, it's completely dependent on the meta. Flipped Delvers on turn 2 pretty much means you are favored in any match up like 9:1.
It's also no different than from what you described. Any given decks have to be able to pass the can it beat Delver test if it wants to compete. If you can, you're probably doing pretty well.
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Uncommon 2/1 Flyer for U, sacrifice it unless you return another creature you control to it's owner's hand:
+ Show Spoiler +
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eh not in love with that card, unless you can get some sorta roaring primadox thing going on there.
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On September 11 2012 12:07 semantics wrote:
eh not in love with that card, unless you can get some sorta roaring primadox thing going on there.
1 mana reuse Snapcaster/Augur of Bolas isn't irrelevant. 2/1 flying body isn't something to scoff at either. Sure it's at sorcery speed, but still good value.
Edit:
That card makes Slip and Abrupt End seem so much better.
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Rare sorcery 2BG: Search your library for two creature cards. Put one in your hand and the other in your graveyard.
+ Show Spoiler +
Rare instant 1U: Return target non-land permanent you don't control to it's owner's hand. Overload 6U
+ Show Spoiler +
Rare creature 1 B/R B/R: Trample. ETB with +1/+1 counters equal to life lost by opponents this turn. 0/0
+ Show Spoiler +
Rare enchantment 2 W/G W/G: At the beginning of your upkeep, populate.
+ Show Spoiler +
Devastation Tide everyone else for CMC 7 seems like it will be a house in Commander. Probably too costly for Constructed and depends on the speed of the format for Limited. I'm trying to figure out what's left for overload. Tap/untap target creature, destroy target artifact, can't block this turn...?
The Rakdos creature seems like too much work. Selesnya gets a 4/4 for 1WG. It doesn't have trample, but how often can a BR deck do four damage on turn three using no mana?
The Golgari search seems like a good enabler for a Frites deck, but I don't know if it's any better than Grisly Salvage. Costs 2 more, but you're guaranteed to hit your reanimation target.
Populate stuff seems overcosted, probably worried that it would be too degenerate so they erred on the side of caution.
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On September 11 2012 12:12 Judicator wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2012 12:07 semantics wrote:
eh not in love with that card, unless you can get some sorta roaring primadox thing going on there. 1 mana reuse Snapcaster/Augur of Bolas isn't irrelevant. 2/1 flying body isn't something to scoff at either. Sure it's at sorcery speed, but still good value. Edit: That card makes Slip and Abrupt End seem so much better.
yeah for standard and modern you obv get that interaction, i was just thinking in limited as that is what i play 99% outside of that just casual, it probably cost me about the same or less and i find it more satisfying doing fnm every week and mtgo then slapping down 100-200 to just hit one standard deck.
On September 11 2012 13:08 last.resistance wrote:Rare sorcery 2BG: Search your library for two creature cards. Put one in your hand and the other in your graveyard. + Show Spoiler +Rare instant 1U: Return target non-land permanent you don't control to it's owner's hand. Overload 6U + Show Spoiler +Rare creature 1 B/R B/R: Trample. ETB with +1/+1 counters equal to life lost by opponents this turn. 0/0 + Show Spoiler +I'm trying to figure out what's left for overload. Tap/untap target creature, destroy target artifact, can't block this turn...?
Well i mean it's just changing spells from single to all targeting, so any spell you can think of that is single target can potentially be made into overload version.
So i mean you get red and blue arch type spells
CT=combat trick
Reds
1-X damage effects(although there is split there is also X where X is like number of X you have etc)
Sac creature do dmg = to power
Destroy artifacts
Cannot block
CT First/double strike
CT +power
CT Haste
Temp Mind Control
Prey upon, ie just creatures fighting each other
Land Destruction(btw they already made that card it's called Boom-Bust a split card from Planar Chaos)
Blues
Bounce to hand or top of deck
Tap Creatures
Unblockable
Sac and scry
Return inst or sorc from graveyard to library/hand
Mind Control(lol i doubt that though)
CT Hexproof(i guess now that shroud isn't a thing)
CT Flying
CT -power
Clone/Copy creature
Counter spell? but not sure how it would be worded
Not sure how to fit draw mechanics in there that wouldn't feel like it's just being worded just to use the mechanic
Possibly being blue red some sorta damage creature each creature damage draw a card
There are probably more things but i can't think of any
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So at a quick glance, for tokens in the upcoming standard we have:
+ Show Spoiler +0/1 Goat
1/1 Goblin
1/1 Human
1/1 Saproling
1/1 Soldier
1/1 Flying Spirit
1/1 Flying Bird
1/1 Lifelink Vampire
1/1 Deathtouch Wolf
1/2 Reach Spider
2/2 Cat
2/2 Homunculus
2/2 Wolf
2/2 Vigilance Knight
2/2 Zombie
2/2 Flying Drake
2/2 Flying Vampire
3/3 Beast
4/4 Hellion
4/4 Flying Angel
5/5 Flying Demon
6/6 Worm
8/8 Vigilance Elemental
X/X Ooze
X/X Rat
Make a token of any creature on the battlefield for 1UU.
Enchantment that makes a token of any creature in your graveyard at the beginning of your upkeep, exiled at EoT for 2WW.
Also just in: Rare creature 4UU: 5/6 Flying Discard two non-land cards with same name: Draw four cards
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Green white will really need some sorta functional reprint of privileged position
+ Show Spoiler +
Really i can see GreenWhite actually be very enchantment heavy, else it's just gonna be beats and make more which isn't terribly interesting.
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I think GW could use a sort of reverse Alpha Brawl/communal Prey Upon. All your creature do damage equal to their power to one creature, that creature gets to do damage equal to it's power to one creature you control.
Outside of Selesnya charm (which does have the ability to exile fatties) we've only seen two spells that aren't creature or enchantments from GW, both of which have Populate. One makes a token and the other is a combat trick. The guild seems a little too focused right now.
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^
agreed so unless there is some synergy going on though enchantments or creatures with powers of enchantments as that seems to be the way mtg is going, gw would be boring. Because tokens are vanilla creatures maybe have haste of flying but that's about it, and so if you have a bunch of spells and creatures that put tokens into play for populate you need room to do a bit more substance then that.
But i suppose if they get spells similar to like Ghostway or something to protect against wraths they be okay as just build and beats.
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On September 11 2012 12:12 Judicator wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2012 12:07 semantics wrote:
eh not in love with that card, unless you can get some sorta roaring primadox thing going on there. 1 mana reuse Snapcaster/Augur of Bolas isn't irrelevant. 2/1 flying body isn't something to scoff at either. Sure it's at sorcery speed, but still good value. Edit: That card makes Slip and Abrupt End seem so much better.
You'd have to be pretty ballsy to make that play, lol. Value is one thing but playing this guy for that purpose seems very greedy.
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Uncommon sorcery XG: Put an X/X green Ooze token onto the battlefield,
Rare creature WW: 2/2 First Strike, Whenever it deals combat damage to a player, put a 1/1 Soldier token onto the battlefield.
Rare enchantment 2WW: At the beginning of your upkeep, detain target creature an opponent controls.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://media.wizards.com/images/magic/tcg/products/rtr/zj4yipcnwb_en.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://media.wizards.com/images/magic/tcg/products/rtr/v21b0f6up2_en.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://media.wizards.com/images/magic/daily/arcana/1057_ljcp3xren3_gameday_1.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/IYSLc.jpg)
