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On June 15 2012 15:47 DEN1ED wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2012 12:05 Judicator wrote:On June 15 2012 11:38 DEN1ED wrote:
I am aware of that. I'm just saying that they are both good 2 drops that work well with pod AND angel. Not just pod. You also clearly underestimate restoration angel. Basically, are these cards good if you don't have Pod or Angel? The answer frankly is no. The point is the cards are good with either pod or angel where cards like emissary are only good with pod. This way you don't have to be so reliant on always having pod. Also, of course they are going to reprint shocklands. They WANT people playing modern.
Emissary's 2 power and the ability to trade profitably in a creature heavy format is not irrelevant. Visionary and Rats do not trade with X/2s and that is even more relevant in a format with Geists of various forms. Not to mention Emissary can beat down while the other can not.
Pod decks can no longer (since about PT DKA) rely on Pod (or Angel) interactions alone. Visionary and Rats rely heavily on those cards to be worthy of a deck slot. You really think a 2 mana cantrip with a 1/1 body is "good" in today's environment without something to get more out of the card? When you have other 2 drops that puts (or can put) significant pressure on the opponent?
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Just curious, how much were the original shocklands when the first came out? Paper magic. They're currently 20 bucks, while I will probably pony up the money for them, not really excited to be paying 20 bucks.
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New Ajani fucking strong.
Ajani, Caller of the Pride 1WW
+1 Put a +1/+1 counter on a creature.
-3 Target creature gets flying and double strike till EOT.
-8 Put X 2/2 cats into play where X = your life total.
4 loyalty to start.
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On June 16 2012 03:25 deth2munkies wrote:New Ajani fucking strong. Ajani, Caller of the Pride 1WW +1 Put a +1/+1 counter on a creature. -3 Target creature gets flying and double strike till EOT. -8 Put X 2/2 cats into play where X = your life total. 4 loyalty to start.
Are you able to proliferate planeswalker loyalty? Because his ultimate is actually pretty good.
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Yes you can proliferate loyalty. I like him. 4 loyalty to start is a lot for a 3 mana PW. His abilities arn't the best but the -3 on a wolfir silverheart or something is pretty much game. And yes, elvish visionary is a good 2 drop.
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On June 16 2012 04:17 DEN1ED wrote:
Yes you can proliferate loyalty. I like him. 4 loyalty to start is a lot for a 3 mana PW. His abilities arn't the best but the -3 on a wolfir silverheart or something is pretty much game. And yes, elvish visionary is a good 2 drop.
Yep, 4 loyalty means odds are on T3 you can''t kill him through a blocker under most circumstances and at the very least he'll Elspeth jump something, if not pump your guys. And pumping key creatures is even more relevant in a format where Bonfire of the Damned exists.
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Meh, he's alright. Nothing great. You're not going to ultimate him ever or even rarely get 2 activations of his -3. His +1 doesn't play well with Vapor Snag (nor does his -3) and you can't put it on the one 2 drop you want it on (Geist). His mana costs are pretty terrible (compared to the double white cards which present a clear line of play into 2 turn clock) to justify his cost.
Honestly this card seems more built for the sideboard of Delver.
He won't see play until Swords rotates and by then the meta changed. Just a really awkward card. Kind of like Jace 1, the first activation wasn't a big deal, it's the 2nd onwards that it becomes a problem. Yet, this is a format where we can't cast Think Twice so Ajani might not get a second or third hit.
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On June 16 2012 06:28 Judicator wrote:
Meh, he's alright. Nothing great. You're not going to ultimate him ever or even rarely get 2 activations of his -3. His +1 doesn't play well with Vapor Snag (nor does his -3) and you can't put it on the one 2 drop you want it on (Geist). His mana costs are pretty terrible (compared to the double white cards which present a clear line of play into 2 turn clock) to justify his cost.
Honestly this card seems more built for the sideboard of Delver.
He won't see play until Swords rotates and by then the meta changed. Just a really awkward card. Kind of like Jace 1, the first activation wasn't a big deal, it's the 2nd onwards that it becomes a problem. Yet, this is a format where we can't cast Think Twice so Ajani might not get a second or third hit.
You say that like Swords and Snag are going to be in the rotation for 80% of the life of this card...they aren't.
It really fits well into a WW or Boros deck as a 2-3 of. Once Crusader rotates, they'll need another 3 drop apart from Paladin.
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On June 16 2012 08:08 deth2munkies wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2012 06:28 Judicator wrote:
Meh, he's alright. Nothing great. You're not going to ultimate him ever or even rarely get 2 activations of his -3. His +1 doesn't play well with Vapor Snag (nor does his -3) and you can't put it on the one 2 drop you want it on (Geist). His mana costs are pretty terrible (compared to the double white cards which present a clear line of play into 2 turn clock) to justify his cost.
Honestly this card seems more built for the sideboard of Delver.
He won't see play until Swords rotates and by then the meta changed. Just a really awkward card. Kind of like Jace 1, the first activation wasn't a big deal, it's the 2nd onwards that it becomes a problem. Yet, this is a format where we can't cast Think Twice so Ajani might not get a second or third hit. You say that like Swords and Snag are going to be in the rotation for 80% of the life of this card...they aren't. It really fits well into a WW or Boros deck as a 2-3 of. Once Crusader rotates, they'll need another 3 drop apart from Paladin.
I do see a Boros deck becoming an actual deck once rotation happens, but will this card be good enough in the new rotation? The abilities require creatures on the field, doesn't generate any actual card advantage, requires a favorable board state already (one with creatures at that), and doesn't protect itself. It's a meh card at best right now, aka a win-more card.
Sure once SOM block rotates, Ajani gets better, but then you get another slew of cards that may interact negatively with it.
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On June 16 2012 10:16 Judicator wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2012 08:08 deth2munkies wrote:On June 16 2012 06:28 Judicator wrote:
Meh, he's alright. Nothing great. You're not going to ultimate him ever or even rarely get 2 activations of his -3. His +1 doesn't play well with Vapor Snag (nor does his -3) and you can't put it on the one 2 drop you want it on (Geist). His mana costs are pretty terrible (compared to the double white cards which present a clear line of play into 2 turn clock) to justify his cost.
Honestly this card seems more built for the sideboard of Delver.
He won't see play until Swords rotates and by then the meta changed. Just a really awkward card. Kind of like Jace 1, the first activation wasn't a big deal, it's the 2nd onwards that it becomes a problem. Yet, this is a format where we can't cast Think Twice so Ajani might not get a second or third hit. You say that like Swords and Snag are going to be in the rotation for 80% of the life of this card...they aren't. It really fits well into a WW or Boros deck as a 2-3 of. Once Crusader rotates, they'll need another 3 drop apart from Paladin. I do see a Boros deck becoming an actual deck once rotation happens, but will this card be good enough in the new rotation? The abilities require creatures on the field, doesn't generate any actual card advantage, requires a favorable board state already (one with creatures at that), and doesn't protect itself. It's a meh card at best right now, aka a win-more card. Sure once SOM block rotates, Ajani gets better, but then you get another slew of cards that may interact negatively with it.
If you're playing Boros and keep a hand without a 1 or 2 drop, you need to re-evaluate how you play Magic. Ajani is an incremental advantage + a finisher. Especially with something like Champion of the Parish who can grow quite large (and larger with Ajani's help) getting leaped pseudo Elspeth style. Boros doesn't have a playable planeswalker at the moment since Gideon and Chandra are too expensive for too little offensive impact and Tibalt is....Tibalt...
R/W (or RDW, depending on what it gets) is where I'm going to be at after the rotation, I just can't afford swords/caverns/scarslands I need to compete in this format with pretty much any deck (I used to run Flare with my 1 Darkslick shores and a bunch of M10 duals, doesn't quite work anymore). This has me quite excited because I was lamenting the loss of Hero of Bladehold and Mirran Crusader that lend the deck a lot of its top end.
Look at it this way:
1) It's a threat they have to answer. With the overall nerfing of counterspells, they're probably not countering it, which means they need to commit at least 4 power to attacking him, that 4 power is not attacking you or blocking all of your dudes, which allows you to crack back.
2) It pumps X/1s out of easy removal range. There's a ton of X/1 removal in the format, Ajani lets you pump those guys to protect them and makes it incredibly more difficult to remove your dudes.
3) It has 2 possible ways to end the game: Both - skills give you a huge advantage, one being a giant life swing (ostensibly) and the other just flooding the board.
I don't think you could ask for much more aside from a ping/removal ability, but I doubt that'd work as a + skill on a 3 mana planeswalker.
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I think you are over-evaluating his abilities, you're not gonna be realistically using any of - skills very much beyond the first activation. The +1 is a joke of a +1, it needs a creature, sure you can grind out a victory, but hardly turning everything you play into a threat.
As for pumping things out of 1 toughness removal range...it would be great if...those removal weren't instant speed. Dead Weight requires 2 activations, same goes for Pillar.
I am not asking for more in a 3 CMC Walker, I am saying the abilities are more narrow than you think.
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On June 16 2012 11:20 Judicator wrote:
I think you are over-evaluating his abilities, you're not gonna be realistically using any of - skills very much beyond the first activation. The +1 is a joke of a +1, it needs a creature, sure you can grind out a victory, but hardly turning everything you play into a threat.
As for pumping things out of 1 toughness removal range...it would be great if...those removal weren't instant speed. Dead Weight requires 2 activations, same goes for Pillar.
I am not asking for more in a 3 CMC Walker, I am saying the abilities are more narrow than you think.
I'm obviously presenting best case scenario, however point 1 is the one that matters: They HAVE to answer him. That means if they sweep you, they have to at least commit their next attack to Ajani or face his ultimate. He's inevitibility that doesn't die to Day of Judgement or Terminus.
He also gets the +1 even if the creature is killed anyway, so it's not a huge deal.
Also you neglected to mention the doozy: Curse of Death's Hold.
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I thought he'd be pretty neat in some kind of Naya. Too bad he non-bo's with Strangleroot Geist.
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???? Wat. They have 4 turns before they have to worry about Ajani's ultimate and even then a sweeper beats it cleanly since it's herpy derpy sorcery speed 2/2s (3/3s or 4/4s or 5/5s depending on how many anthems you choose to run, but my guess is 0).
But wait, you need creatures to +1 him and if you don't have them...then what? Add counters to their creatures? Then we arrive at the dilemma how does this card actually get you closer to winning the game rather than helping you win the game when you have creatures that can successfully attack which begs the question, would this be better than a burn spell (like Brimestone Volley) in actually closing out a game (because you seem to think he's going to activate ultimate; the "HAVE to answer him")? They actually really don't have to. Slow down, he's not Koth in Mono-Red where they will actually die. Terminus and Day still beat him pretty cleanly, especially with Snapcasters.
Curse of Death's Hold is a one of in most Esper lists and pretty much the card that I look to side out every game (it's not even in my esper builds or flare any more just because it's inferior to both Elesh and Ratchet Bomb). That card sucks. The fact that they're willing to print a non-legendary Betrayal should tell you how bland the card was expected to be.
In either case, I think you'll find him closer to Venser power level than Koth in their appropriate decks. There are times when you get him and you're happy (namely cause of the -3 ability) and there are times where you get him and it's like this does absolutely shit.
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The +1 of Ajani doesn't actually require a creature to use btw, the actual text of the +1 is "put a +1/+1 counter on up to 1 target creature" (from http://www.reddit.com/r/magicTCG/comments/v3p2h/ajani_caller_of_the_pride/)
I don't think he's so great, but I think he'll be a solid planeswalker in Champion of the Parish decks. One very awkward anti-synergy is that in an aggressive white deck, it's not so unlikely that thanks to Silverblade Paladin, all of your creatures already have double strike. I guess it does make his +1 better though.
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On June 16 2012 12:19 Judicator wrote:
But wait, you need creatures to +1 him and if you don't have them...then what? Add counters to their creatures?
UP to one creature
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So you still need to target it? It just means the trigger will still resolve if the target dies. If you don't have a valid target can you still even activate it?
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Don't you just pay the cost of adding 1 loyalty counter, naming 0 targets?
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On June 16 2012 14:32 Judicator wrote:
So you still need to target it? It just means the trigger will still resolve if the target dies. If you don't have a valid target can you still even activate it?
Gaining one loyalty is part of the cost of the ability, even if it's countered, he still gains 1 loyalty. If it dies, the ability is countered, he still gains 1 loyalty.
Same thing as still having to exile a card when your Force gets Forced.
You can activate his +1 and choose 0 creatures and get the +1 as well.
If they sweep and have no pressure (dedicated control) he still ticks up and ultimates. Even if they have yet another sweeper, you're running them out of answers fast. Odds are they'll have to sweep twice before Ajani ultimates given his -3, and even running 4 days, you have to be pretty lucky to have the 3rd for the ultimate.
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Of course you can still activate it if there are no targets in play. UP to one creature. How is that a question at all? Online you will click him and hit +1 and then it will say "select target" and you just hit ok without selecting anything.
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EPT
