EPTIt has good matchups against everything except storm and cloudpost, which aren't quite as popular as they used to be.
Magic: The Gathering - Page 140
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deth2munkies
United States4051 Posts
It has good matchups against everything except storm and cloudpost, which aren't quite as popular as they used to be. | ||
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DCLXVI
United States729 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + 4x birds of paradise 2x avacyn's pilgrim 4x strangleroot geist 4x drogskol captain 1x stormbound geist 3x phyrexian metamorph 2x solemn simulacrum 1x dungeon geist 1x thrun, the last troll 2x acidic slime 1x vorapede 1x sun titan 1x primeval titan 1x frost titan 1x elesh norn, grand cenobite 4x birthing pod 3x sword of war and peace 4x razerverge thicket 4x hinterland harbor 4x sunpetal grove 1x seachrome coast 6x forest 3x island 1x gavony township 1x moorland haunt Any suggestions for it? I enjoy playing 1 of each titan for personal reasons, but I suppose I could change that. I have had some trouble with the lands coming in tapped too frequently so I cut back on the seachromes, but the rest of the deck plays out well. I am considering moving the thrun to the sideboard for more metamorphs but other than that I don't have a good idea what to sideboard. more artifact hate and some lifegain will need to be there(acidic/corruptor and hollowhenge/peace strider), spellskite seems good, and I have been considering corrosive gale. I do not know if I want to put any oblivion rings or other non creature removal spells. Am I missing any good removal spells to chain into? Perilous myr and brutalizer exarch seem to be my only options. | ||
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slyboogie
United States3423 Posts
On March 05 2012 07:39 DCLXVI wrote: I've been playing around with a pod list after stealing some ideas from an author I normally disregard...J. Vizaro... still here it is + Show Spoiler + 4x birds of paradise 2x avacyn's pilgrim 4x strangleroot geist 4x drogskol captain 1x stormbound geist 3x phyrexian metamorph 2x solemn simulacrum 1x dungeon geist 1x thrun, the last troll 2x acidic slime 1x vorapede 1x sun titan 1x primeval titan 1x frost titan 1x elesh norn, grand cenobite 4x birthing pod 3x sword of war and peace 4x razerverge thicket 4x hinterland harbor 4x sunpetal grove 1x seachrome coast 6x forest 3x island 1x gavony township 1x moorland haunt Any suggestions for it? I enjoy playing 1 of each titan for personal reasons, but I suppose I could change that. I have had some trouble with the lands coming in tapped too frequently so I cut back on the seachromes, but the rest of the deck plays out well. I am considering moving the thrun to the sideboard for more metamorphs but other than that I don't have a good idea what to sideboard. more artifact hate and some lifegain will need to be there(acidic/corruptor and hollowhenge/peace strider), spellskite seems good, and I have been considering corrosive gale. I do not know if I want to put any oblivion rings or other non creature removal spells. Am I missing any good removal spells to chain into? Perilous myr and brutalizer exarch seem to be my only options. Why 4 captains? Just cut some captains for Phantasmal Images, since it looks like that's what you're trying to do anyways. And Archon of Justice at the 5 is probably your best utility removal option if you don't like Oblivion Rings and Beast Withins. I'd also consider mainboarding Garruk Relentless, though I've heard different things from different people, I think it plays well. And for whatever reason, I don't like Swords in Pod decks. | ||
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
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Shotcoder
United States2316 Posts
I went 3-1 at FNM and the deck wasn't even running that well, I think I mulled to 6 twice every match and never had the turn two mana leak. The options with tragic slip, dissipate, black sun....etc just make the deck so versatile. I just need to pick up the ratchet bombs so I can finish it. One deck I do want to look at is the Junk Planeswalkers deck. It doesn't look great but it looks fun as hell dropping planeswalkers. | ||
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dignity
Canada908 Posts
I would also like to say that this deck is insane in the current meta. Having the ability to wipe the board as often as you like via black suns is so good in this aggro filled meta. Once you resolve 2 curses on a delver they just die. Creature based decks just get wiped out. Tokens actually have a bit of a better chance if they side in celestial purges/witchbane orbs. I think we would get stomped against a mono-green aggro though. Not sure never tested against that type of deck. One thing I tried was using curses of death's hold, karn, and (believe it or not) painful quandary. It is such a hard lock its insane. They draw creatures, they either play it and discard more cards or take a lava axe, and the creature will probably die anyways since I have curses out, or it gets exiled by karn. They draw instants, they either play it or gets exiled. They draw land, they play it and I exile it with karn. I know painful quandary is not exactly a good top deck and its quite useless when you don't have the other 2 pieces out, but it does make for forcing awkward plays by your opponent. I'm only using it as a filler right now. | ||
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OblivionMage
Canada377 Posts
On March 05 2012 10:52 Judicator wrote: If you don't Sword, then there's no point, you're just running a shitty Pod deck. I don't like the deck simply because I don't think its consistent enough, so whatever helps with you run more consistently without Pod will work. Personally, I want to try Unburial Rites with Pod back up. Birthing Pod decks don't universally include swords. Many have 1-2 Feast and Famine in the sideboard, many don't. See: http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazine/article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/eventcoverage/ptdka12/stddecks http://www.wizards.com/Magic/Digital/MagicOnlineTourn.aspx?x=mtg/digital/magiconline/tourn/3492325 etc... | ||
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
I already took out the Curses main board since Delver went towards Finkel's version, if your local meta is heavy with Geist builds, then yes Curse is better, otherwise take them out, you do have better options. The UWb version of Delver cannot beat UB, it's not even close unless they stick a Moorland Haunt. As for limiting to your threats to just Karn/Snapcaster/Drownyard or opening a deck slot for a Grave Titan/Sphinx/etc, I prefer neither, I don't like tapping for mana on my turn and you're playing for a 9-drop more often than a 6 drop. Bloodline Keeper, Batterskull on the other hand are much more respectable on turns 7 and 8 respectively and diversify your threat lines. Sideboarding is tricky, right now over half my sideboard is dedicated to mono-Green and Frites specifically as those are UB's worst match ups. Efficiency is highly valued in control decks and more so in UB since you are effectively sculpting the board not necessarily through card advantage but through squashing opponent's play lines. Both mG and Frites are stupidly efficient and you need to squash that somehow, I usually board in 6-8 cards for either matchup depending on the build. Only 4 slots are dedicated to the UB mirror, one of which isn't beatable by the UB deck or will elicit a fight really fast if they have a clue. Also, I highly discourage playing Lily unless you are very familiar with the deck and have a good read on the opponent. If you find yourself using it commonly as a 3 mana edict at sorcery speed, you goofed. A particular line of play that some players aren't comfortable with is the turn 3 Lily on the play and just start stripping their hand even at the cost to you, put them into top deck mode, and just win off of your instant draw spells or just race them with mill. And Oblivion Mage, run a Pod deck in today's environment and let me know how consistent it runs, just thinking about the popular match ups against competent players makes me cringe unless you are running well. Edit: For those of you starting UB, have fun figuring out mG. I had to dig real deep for that sideboard tech. | ||
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Xiphos
Canada7507 Posts
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Shotcoder
United States2316 Posts
On March 06 2012 11:00 Judicator wrote:+ Show Spoiler + Oh, now you people are on UB's nuts after I told you so. Yes this is me telling you that I told you so. I told you so. Over 2 weeks ago. Okay, I am done. I already took out the Curses main board since Delver went towards Finkel's version, if your local meta is heavy with Geist builds, then yes Curse is better, otherwise take them out, you do have better options. The UWb version of Delver cannot beat UB, it's not even close unless they stick a Moorland Haunt. As for limiting to your threats to just Karn/Snapcaster/Drownyard or opening a deck slot for a Grave Titan/Sphinx/etc, I prefer neither, I don't like tapping for mana on my turn and you're playing for a 9-drop more often than a 6 drop. Bloodline Keeper, Batterskull on the other hand are much more respectable on turns 7 and 8 respectively and diversify your threat lines. Sideboarding is tricky, right now over half my sideboard is dedicated to mono-Green and Frites specifically as those are UB's worst match ups. Efficiency is highly valued in control decks and more so in UB since you are effectively sculpting the board not necessarily through card advantage but through squashing opponent's play lines. Both mG and Frites are stupidly efficient and you need to squash that somehow, I usually board in 6-8 cards for either matchup depending on the build. Only 4 slots are dedicated to the UB mirror, one of which isn't beatable by the UB deck or will elicit a fight really fast if they have a clue. Also, I highly discourage playing Lily unless you are very familiar with the deck and have a good read on the opponent. If you find yourself using it commonly as a 3 mana edict at sorcery speed, you goofed. A particular line of play that some players aren't comfortable with is the turn 3 Lily on the play and just start stripping their hand even at the cost to you, put them into top deck mode, and just win off of your instant draw spells or just race them with mill. And Oblivion Mage, run a Pod deck in today's environment and let me know how consistent it runs, just thinking about the popular match ups against competent players makes me cringe unless you are running well. Edit: For those of you starting UB, have fun figuring out mG. I had to dig real deep for that sideboard tech. I switched to the finkle list and I can say I missed Control. Control is the first archetype that I've enjoyed playing. This list I'm currently running is: + Show Spoiler + lands 4x Darkslick Shores 4x Drowned Catacombs 3x Nephalia Drownyard 2x Ghost Quarter 7x Swamps 7x Islands Creatures 3x Snapcaster 2x Consecrated Sphinx 1x Grave Titan Spells 3x Tragic Slip 3x Black Sun's Zenith 2x Curse of Death's hold 2x Doom blade 1x Go For the throat 2x Tribute to hunger 1x Blue Sun's Zenith 3x Think Twice 3x Dissipate 4x Mana leak 3x Forbidden Alchemy Sideboard: 1x Despise 2x Nihil Spellbomb 2x Surgical Extraction 2x Bloodline Keeper 2x Phantasmal Image 2x Flashfreeze 1x Batterskull 1x Karn Liberated 1x Black Sun's Zenith 1x Nephalia Drownyard I really need the ratchet bombs, and was actually thinking of a third curse. My meta is still filled with Mono Black Poison, Mono Black Zombies, UB Zombies, and UW Delver. I just want the consistency of drawing it since it shuts down so much in the format. I've been leaning toward cutting the Sphinx for another grave titan and another spell as well. The fact grave leaves the 2/2s is a lot more relevant than the extra cards most of the time. Drownyard is a powerhouse too, favorite card in the deck by far. I played our 1 mono red play friday and got rolled. Landing a turn 2 shrine or turn 4 manabards ends the game unless you get to batterskull. Which is why I plan on getting a second one to replace one of those phantasmal images in the board. With the dropping of Wolf Run at our store I'm leaning toward taking it out of the board and siding it back in for major tournaments. It pays to be the only control player at the store too. Most of them don't know the match-up or get too frustrated while getting milled out to focus. I know I've played a few people that scooped after just 2-3 turns of an active drownyard. The variance on the deck still bothers me though. Keeping amazing hands and watching your draws just crush you is painful but it rewards you with mediocre hands turning out to be winnable when you stabilize at 6-7 life. Can you explain the Bloodline's in the side? I'll admit I was netdecking for the most part with this list(I tested bone to ash in the deck but the card is garbage). I normally bring it in, in the creature heavy match up like Zombies but I really fight with bringing it in as I dont think it's 100% better than any of the other sideboard options like the black sun and batterskull. | ||
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OblivionMage
Canada377 Posts
On March 06 2012 11:00 Judicator wrote: And Oblivion Mage, run a Pod deck in today's environment and let me know how consistent it runs, just thinking about the popular match ups against competent players makes me cringe unless you are running well. I was only really talking about the Swords. That being said, while it's not in any way the best deck at the moment, it's absolutely a part of the metagame, and has decent results. In the past two days online in Standard Daily events, there were 18 Birthing Pod lists that did well in the 11 events. It hasn't won a GP or anything big, but the deck and it's variants exist and are strong. | ||
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
@Shotcoder Bloodline I already explained, you as a UB player against another competent player unless you already saw their hand, can NOT comfortably tap out before turn 6 on your turn. Even on turn 6, it's not plausible for you to do it (except that Lily line of play on 3). So just add 3 mana for dissipate or 4 for snapcaster-leak/negate or 5 for snapcaster-dissipate for any of your tap mana on my turn plays, so 4 mana isn't that bad. Bloodline Keeper rapes in the mono-Green (infinite chump blockers and kills Garruks) and acts like a very fast clock where eventually you can just swing for lethal in one turn if they let you develop the board. I like it in the UB/UW mirror where BSZs and Days usually come out and they are spot removal light also. They need to o-ring it or purge it so its another threat in that regards. As for the comparison to Batterskull, they usually come in at the same time for me. Also Surgical Extraction is very good in the UB build, better than Spellbomb by far because...the illusory card advantage not so illusory given how UB is positioned right now. There shouldn't be too much variance in the UB build, only you need to recognize what is keep-able based on the match up. This is the SB I took to Gameday except +Batterskull -Bloodline Keeper + Show Spoiler + SB: 1 [SOM] Ratchet Bomb SB: 1 [M12] Negate SB: 2 [NPH] Surgical Extraction SB: 2 [ISD] Bloodline Keeper SB: 2 [ISD] Curse of Death's Hold SB: 1 [M12] Phantasmal Image SB: 1 [SOM] Volition Reins SB: 1 [SOM] Nihil Spellbomb SB: 1 [NPH] Hex Parasite SB: 1 [M12] Flashfreeze SB: 1 [ISD] Sever the Bloodline SB: 1 [NPH] Life's Finale | ||
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slyboogie
United States3423 Posts
On March 05 2012 10:52 Judicator wrote: If you don't Sword, then there's no point, you're just running a shitty Pod deck. I don't like the deck simply because I don't think its consistent enough, so whatever helps with you run more consistently without Pod will work. Personally, I want to try Unburial Rites with Pod back up. God, when was the last time Pod was even good. I don't like Swords in Pod decks because it opens you up to Grudge sideboards in R/G aggro decks, which might be the only match up that Pod has a nice game one against. I like Pod decks because I like the card, like Puresteel Paladin, it's fun to play with. Definitely wouldn't recommend it if you're trying to go out there and crush GP Newark. | ||
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dignity
Canada908 Posts
Bloodline keepers are also great for facing spirit decks. Gives you the ability to hold onto black suns until you force an overextend. Ratchet bombs are a must right now. If they are on the play and resolve a turn 2 anthem with a turn 3 lingering souls you are in trouble. Being able to ratchet bomb all their anthems after you wiped out their tokens with a black sun puts them in a terrible position, and once you start laying out the curses its game over. On the stablizing issue I feel there isn't any difference in terms of luck compared to other decks. If anything I found people are wary of counterspells you may or may not have in hand and you can get away with just keeping a removal hand, provided you have some draw in it. About moorland haunt giving you trouble, I found that resolving enough curses just end the game. It just might be people around here not being prepared for it but resolving even 2 just ends the game. You can easily afford to tap out and resolve a turn 5 curse after a turn 4 black sun, provided you have a follow up to wipe out any survivors turn 6. This only works against non-blue decks though. Yes, we know you told us so Judicator. I just never put it together since I didn't have a single snapcaster/lily back before DKA was released and they were mandatory back then. You can much more comfortably play without them now. Ps: My friend told me that my deck is the most unfun deck to play against ever. He says its worst than against cawblade. I don't blame him. | ||
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Shotcoder
United States2316 Posts
On March 06 2012 18:24 dignity wrote: My current build of UB has no titan level creatures at all simply because my meta is filled with phantasmals. I am currently keeping curses in because my meta is also very delver heavy. I am heavily leaning on army of the damned as a really good finisher too. If they have only one answer you straight up win. Bloodline keepers are also great for facing spirit decks. Gives you the ability to hold onto black suns until you force an overextend. Ratchet bombs are a must right now. If they are on the play and resolve a turn 2 anthem with a turn 3 lingering souls you are in trouble. Being able to ratchet bomb all their anthems after you wiped out their tokens with a black sun puts them in a terrible position, and once you start laying out the curses its game over. On the stablizing issue I feel there isn't any difference in terms of luck compared to other decks. If anything I found people are wary of counterspells you may or may not have in hand and you can get away with just keeping a removal hand, provided you have some draw in it. About moorland haunt giving you trouble, I found that resolving enough curses just end the game. It just might be people around here not being prepared for it but resolving even 2 just ends the game. You can easily afford to tap out and resolve a turn 5 curse after a turn 4 black sun, provided you have a follow up to wipe out any survivors turn 6. This only works against non-blue decks though. Yes, we know you told us so Judicator. I just never put it together since I didn't have a single snapcaster/lily back before DKA was released and they were mandatory back then. You can much more comfortably play without them now. Ps: My friend told me that my deck is the most unfun deck to play against ever. He says its worst than against cawblade. I don't blame him. My friends say the same thing. They just sit told me they don't mind getting beaten in the face by a titan or Sphinx. But when you watch all of your answers get milled away it just makes the defeat even demoralizing. I've found around here, because no one else plays control...no one plays around counter spells. kinda sad but when they run something important into it they get really pissed off. The only reason I'm not a fan of Army is because it doesn't answer anything. When you play it they can just swing through it. at least with Grave titan they have to remove the titan and the zombies. Sphinx still feels good when I cast it since the overall number of vapor snags in my meta is getting smaller but it just doesnt give you that AH HA I WIN now feeling. Even though the card advantage from it eventually gives you that. I kinda want to try a one of Increasing Confusion in place of the Blue Sun. Makes your clock slightly faster and most of the time I find myself casting Blue Sun on them for the mill more so than the Oh shit I need a couple cards right now. | ||
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dignity
Canada908 Posts
The main issue with playing bomby creatures in my meta is because of phantasmal images everywhere. I prefer army just for a more diverse threat. Most people will side out mass removal against you once they know you are control, so it follows the same logic as bloodline keepers. My friend doesn't mind being milled so much as that the deck stops the other decks cold by about turn 8, but takes 15 more turns to end the game. Theres also something very demoralizing about getting black sunned 8 times in a game. This might be attributed to the fact that I rarely mill them out since I only have 1 drownyard. Several weeks ago those things were everywhere and now I can't find a single one. | ||
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
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dignity
Canada908 Posts
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Shotcoder
United States2316 Posts
We had our first Tuesday Standard and only 8 people showed up -_- I started against Mono black infect and punted when I alchemied away a curse for a go for the throat to answer her Skittles to be later killed by inkmoths and then game 3 was just piss poor play all around on my part. Second round I played Wolf run and got dominated by a nut draw. dropping Acidic slime on 4, Prime time on 5, prime time on 6 then inferno on 7. Proceeded to win games 2 with Drownyard with flashfreeze and snapcaster back up, and game 3 with Karn/drownyard lock down. Third round was Mono Black Zombies. game 1 stalled him out and won with Drownyard and game 3 turn 5 batterskull, turn 6 batterskull(Put a second batterskull in the side) wins you games... overall I'm thinking of dropping Sphinx for another Grave Titan and Karn mainboard. my sideboarding looked like + Show Spoiler + Wolf Run -1 Blue Sun -2 Curse -3 Think Twice +2 Flashfreeze +1 Phantasmal Image +1 Despise +1 Karn +1 Black Sun Mono Black Zombies -1 Blue Sun -2 Sphinx -1 Grave Titan -2 Ghost Quarter -1 Think Twice +1 Black Sun +2 Batterskull +2 Bloodline Keeper +1 Drownyard +1 Despise Mono Black Infect -1 Blue Sun -2 Doom Blade -2 Sphinx +1 Black Sun +1 Despise +2 Bloodline +1 Karn I know taking out the think twices is probably incorrect but they just felt bad to me overall I'm happy with how the deck plays. I've gone 3-1 and 2-1 respectively losing to Mono red and Mono black infect Also do you guys happen to play legacy at all? I've been puttering around in the format and I enjoy it a lot less than I do Standard or modern and I can figure out why. Maybe it's my unfamiliarity with the cards but it just makes me feel meh. | ||
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wunsun
Canada622 Posts
OMFG.... so overpowered. Before, I didn't realize that it pumps itself during the first strike of its double strike, so basically, it can get 2 +1/+1 counters on it every combat step if it hits. Jeeez. Demolished me. | ||
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