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Sorry for double post:
Okay heres the secret to double up.
The 2nd shot travels backwards based on the direction that MF is not the creep.
IE if she shoots it in the face, it will come out its ass, if she shoots it in its right side, it will come out the left.
All you have to do is not stand directly in a line with a ranged minion and her. if you're off to one side then your chances of getting hit are much less.
apparently it tries to pick a target in a 70 degree arc behind the target, if it cant, then it goes up to 180 degrees to find a target.
Ok that gives me a better understanding of how it works, but she's often moving so fast she can get within that sweet spot of an angle before I can react anyway. I guess I need a practice partner or something. I think FotMing with her is over though for the most part, I've been seeing alot less of her lately. I should preemptively learn to counter Sona.
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I'm a noob Kassadin and I don't know how you guys dominate your lanes early game. You are talking about dominating MF Vlad Trist, all ranged characters which I can't do anything except for Q, which doesn't do that much damage. I really find it tough zoning with only Q and being melee. Do you level up 2 or 3 lvls of Q before 6? I dont hit much with my Q. Is there a video anywhere of a Kassadin owning a lane?
Thanks!
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First level Q = lasthitting
Lvl 2 Q = harassing
On solo lanes i go R>Q>E>W
Just keep firing it and your oponent will eventually have to go heal, don't take to much hits lasthitting and fire your E as soon as it gets up together with Q. It really is just spamming, i also strengthen my early game by going clarity/teleport, clarity allows me to stay on the lane spamming q for quite a length of time, go back teleport back losing only 2/3 creeps, hold out till clarity, use clarity, you can keep on the lane endlessly and its really hard to gank kassadin at lvl 6. Silence also ruins peoples days.
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I wonder how do high level player play Miss Fortune? I just reinstalled the game to play before going bed with a couple friends, but I don't really know the optimal way to play her. I just make IE as fast as possible and upgrade Q W Q E Q R Q E Q etc. I was wondering if it's worthy upgrading E over W first or not.
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Judge how much CC they have, and whether you can auto attack freely or not.
Generally R>Q>W>E, but this changes with every game. For example if you solo a melee, you probably want Lvl 3 Impure before going for Q.
IE -> LW is solid, but go for Manamune in a dual lane. If they have no CCs, mass Thirsters is good.
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On September 20 2010 19:27 Yiruru wrote:
Judge how much CC they have, and whether you can auto attack freely or not.
Generally R>Q>W>E, but this changes with every game. For example if you solo a melee, you probably want Lvl 3 Impure before going for Q.
IE -> LW is solid, but go for Manamune in a dual lane. If they have no CCs, mass Thirsters is good.
Thanks a lot :D
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On September 20 2010 12:23 radmax86 wrote:
How do you do against sivirs who are very good with their spell shields?
I switch E and Q. I power E instead, because it's an instant cast and Sivir has crappy attack range so she can't actually punish you for threatening with E... more often than not she'll waste her shield trying to stop the E. Or if you're going for the kill you can just ping the shield off with level 1 Q and hammer her with E. Even more funny is that if she goes back too far you can actually beat her in a standing fight with level 1 W a lot of times.
Edit:
On September 20 2010 17:25 -Kato- wrote:
I'm a noob Kassadin and I don't know how you guys dominate your lanes early game. You are talking about dominating MF Vlad Trist, all ranged characters which I can't do anything except for Q, which doesn't do that much damage. I really find it tough zoning with only Q and being melee. Do you level up 2 or 3 lvls of Q before 6? I dont hit much with my Q. Is there a video anywhere of a Kassadin owning a lane?
Thanks!
Yes you just spam-level Q unless you're vs Sivir. I just noticed I haven't recorded a solo lane Kass game in like, forever.
Edit2:
I also find it really funny how people are like "I grab blue buff and Elixir and get an imba rift cd!" as if I've never done it and it's the secret to not failing at your "job" against ranged DPS.
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Russian Federation4235 Posts
Looking for opinion on Xin Zhao builds.
Basically, his W and Q have GREAT synergy with CDR and AS, so does his innate although that's probably irrelevant. I've tried going tanky with him, but to be honest he doesn't really do that much with tank items and his tanking kicks in like in super late game. Red buff > Mallet any day, especially considering that Xin can go into jungle at any point of the game.
Right now I'm building GB/B into Starks into GA if the game is long enough. Skillbuild is EQWQQR, then R > Q > W > E and frankly this is the only build I've had any success with. The point of the build is to abuse the cooldown reduction, armor penetration and attack speed so that I land my 225 damage physical nuke (Q is essentially it) 3 times until the buff from my W expires. Coupled with APen and my ult, it seems like a great burst. The lack of ASPD items until Starks is compensated by AS marks, prioritizing W over E and Ghostblade's active. Blue buff included as well, with full 40% CDR I once even managed to ult twice in the same fight->mop up sequence.
How do high elo players build Xin? Is this close to truth/efficient enough or there are better options? This build gives great DPS (probably the best Xin can unfold), but is very weak to any kind of stuns/attack speed debuffs because you both need to stay in melee range and continue attacking to keep reducing your cooldowns.
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HSGG builds a gimmicky all-offense build; Smash and Brees build basically pure tank.
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Russian Federation4235 Posts
On September 20 2010 19:49 Southlight wrote:
HSGG builds a gimmicky all-offense build; Smash and Brees build basically pure tank.
Pure tank means what? Sunfire? I find that with 'generic tank items' i simply do 0 damage and have a weak 1.7 second slow and a weak 1 second stun with like a 10 second CD which makes me a walking ultimate. And what is the skill build? The most reasonable looks like R > W > E > Q with 1 rank in every skill early, but I have not really tried tank Xin that much. I've tried HoG spam, but I simply die to casters unable to kill anyone.
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Actually I'd like to know too, and if someone had a guide to jungling with Xin that'd be sweet. I'm pretty slow at it but I'm not sure if that's me or Xin being slow at jungling. It's weird because I can otherwise jungle great with pretty much any character.
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On September 20 2010 16:01 spinesheath wrote:Show nested quote +So is this really meant seriously?
You want to play her as an extremely weak autoattacker with a lot of scouting? Because that's all you get to do if you don't max W asap. Sure, being a support hero can be nice and fun, but Ashe has no way to dish out damage without Volley.
Yeah right, the damage scaling on Volley is crap (even if you assume 5 hits, but at least you have 5*AD then). I would keep it at level 1 if it weren't for the cooldown. But turns out that you need it at rank 5 as soon as you hit level 9. At 4 seconds, it is decently spammable. At 2.4 seconds, it almost feels like Hate Spike.
On a sidenote, I've been getting Philosopher's Stone more often lately. Almost every game. Works pretty well. Mana for 1 additional Volley every 30 seconds actually ups my damage output quite a bit between level 9 and 18 where I am often OOM. I don't like getting blue buff since I max CDR early anyways, and usually there is an ally who can use it better.
I'll gladly take it from an enemy though :p
Shurelia's Firecrest (the new item that builds from Philo) doesn't sound like a good idea though. I don't see a place in my build for it. Too expensive early, and too weak late game.
Perfect example of your typical "bad" Ashe player.
Ashe has a weak autoattack? Because having a gold advantage against their solo mid for the entire early and mid game totally means you can't buy +dmg items. Not at all.
Volley is her main damage skill? Volley is useful for DPS and AoE slow. Spamming it early and mid game is simply out of the question. Any competent team will have at least one character focus you. Volley is an initiating skill and an AoE slow before it's DPS. Even late game, doing an autoattack +50 damage every 2.4 seconds? What a joke. If you consider that DPS (it can't even crit) then you must see Ashe as one of the best carries in the game. Which she's not.
Besides, getting Philo Stone on Ashe completely changes the build, so you're already talking about something all together different.
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On September 20 2010 20:14 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:
And what is GB/B?
Ghostblade / Brutalizer
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On September 20 2010 20:14 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:
And what is GB/B?
Ghostblade/Brutalizer
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On September 20 2010 20:19 Jazriel wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2010 16:01 spinesheath wrote:So is this really meant seriously?
You want to play her as an extremely weak autoattacker with a lot of scouting? Because that's all you get to do if you don't max W asap. Sure, being a support hero can be nice and fun, but Ashe has no way to dish out damage without Volley.
Yeah right, the damage scaling on Volley is crap (even if you assume 5 hits, but at least you have 5*AD then). I would keep it at level 1 if it weren't for the cooldown. But turns out that you need it at rank 5 as soon as you hit level 9. At 4 seconds, it is decently spammable. At 2.4 seconds, it almost feels like Hate Spike.
On a sidenote, I've been getting Philosopher's Stone more often lately. Almost every game. Works pretty well. Mana for 1 additional Volley every 30 seconds actually ups my damage output quite a bit between level 9 and 18 where I am often OOM. I don't like getting blue buff since I max CDR early anyways, and usually there is an ally who can use it better.
I'll gladly take it from an enemy though :p
Shurelia's Firecrest (the new item that builds from Philo) doesn't sound like a good idea though. I don't see a place in my build for it. Too expensive early, and too weak late game. Perfect example of your typical "bad" Ashe player. Ashe has a weak autoattack? Because having a gold advantage against their solo mid for the entire early and mid game totally means you can't buy +dmg items. Not at all. Volley is her main damage skill? Volley is useful for DPS and AoE slow. Spamming it early and mid game is simply out of the question. Any competent team will have at least one character focus you. Volley is an initiating skill and an AoE slow before it's DPS. Even late game, doing an autoattack +50 damage every 2.4 seconds? What a joke. If you consider that DPS (it can't even crit) then you must see Ashe as one of the best carries in the game. Which she's not. Besides, getting Philo Stone on Ashe completely changes the build, so you're already talking about something all together different.
She has no gold advantage because every real carry outfarms her by nature of their actual farming skills (Trist's explosive shot taking down creep waves really quickly, MF just raining a whole wave down, etc.) She takes too long, even with +gold, that it doesn't matter.
She has no gold advantage because other actual carries have innate skills that give them the equivalent of a lot of free gold. Tristana's +100% attack speed is the equivalent of some 2000 gold, which would take an ungodly amount of farm for Ashe to match, not to mention when we go back to the above Trist would still be doing more, and faster.
It's debatable to call Volley her main "damage" skill but it's certainly her main skill (aside from ECA), because her "job" is to poke people from afar when you're sieging or defending a siege.
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![[image loading]](http://img832.imageshack.us/img832/5160/maladyisthebest.png)
Zilean left, rammus sucked, and corki who was supposed to be our carry all game only insulted us and acted like it wasn't his fault that we lost a teamfight 4v5 because the OTHER team initiated, and he was just sitting in mid farming the entire time when he could have helped. I was 7-3-6 before zilean left, and at the very beginning was 4-0.
Malady fiddle is a pro build imo.
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On September 20 2010 19:55 BluzMan wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2010 19:49 Southlight wrote:
HSGG builds a gimmicky all-offense build; Smash and Brees build basically pure tank. Pure tank means what? Sunfire? I find that with 'generic tank items' i simply do 0 damage and have a weak 1.7 second slow and a weak 1 second stun with like a 10 second CD which makes me a walking ultimate. And what is the skill build? The most reasonable looks like R > W > E > Q with 1 rank in every skill early, but I have not really tried tank Xin that much. I've tried HoG spam, but I simply die to casters unable to kill anyone.
Sorry, I'm not really sure I just remember Mog and Brees talking about it. If you can't find their previous posts (which I can't) then it's prolly better to wait for them/nag Mog than for me to guess, hahah.
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On September 20 2010 19:48 BluzMan wrote:
Looking for opinion on Xin Zhao builds.
Basically, his W and Q have GREAT synergy with CDR and AS, so does his innate although that's probably irrelevant. I've tried going tanky with him, but to be honest he doesn't really do that much with tank items and his tanking kicks in like in super late game. Red buff > Mallet any day, especially considering that Xin can go into jungle at any point of the game.
Right now I'm building GB/B into Starks into GA if the game is long enough. Skillbuild is EQWQQR, then R > Q > W > E and frankly this is the only build I've had any success with. The point of the build is to abuse the cooldown reduction, armor penetration and attack speed so that I land my 225 damage physical nuke (Q is essentially it) 3 times until the buff from my W expires. Coupled with APen and my ult, it seems like a great burst. The lack of ASPD items until Starks is compensated by AS marks, prioritizing W over E and Ghostblade's active. Blue buff included as well, with full 40% CDR I once even managed to ult twice in the same fight->mop up sequence.
How do high elo players build Xin? Is this close to truth/efficient enough or there are better options? This build gives great DPS (probably the best Xin can unfold), but is very weak to any kind of stuns/attack speed debuffs because you both need to stay in melee range and continue attacking to keep reducing your cooldowns.
Wouldn't you get more from APen Marks, since APen becomes better the more you stack? With GB/B, runes and masteries, you can get 70 APen which is basically 100% APen to squishies for quite a while. Dunno, maybe ASpd is better on Xin, but it sounds a bit weird. Would have to make precise calculations.
On September 20 2010 20:19 Jazriel wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2010 16:01 spinesheath wrote:So is this really meant seriously?
You want to play her as an extremely weak autoattacker with a lot of scouting? Because that's all you get to do if you don't max W asap. Sure, being a support hero can be nice and fun, but Ashe has no way to dish out damage without Volley.
Yeah right, the damage scaling on Volley is crap (even if you assume 5 hits, but at least you have 5*AD then). I would keep it at level 1 if it weren't for the cooldown. But turns out that you need it at rank 5 as soon as you hit level 9. At 4 seconds, it is decently spammable. At 2.4 seconds, it almost feels like Hate Spike.
On a sidenote, I've been getting Philosopher's Stone more often lately. Almost every game. Works pretty well. Mana for 1 additional Volley every 30 seconds actually ups my damage output quite a bit between level 9 and 18 where I am often OOM. I don't like getting blue buff since I max CDR early anyways, and usually there is an ally who can use it better.
I'll gladly take it from an enemy though :p
Shurelia's Firecrest (the new item that builds from Philo) doesn't sound like a good idea though. I don't see a place in my build for it. Too expensive early, and too weak late game. Perfect example of your typical "bad" Ashe player. Ashe has a weak autoattack? Because having a gold advantage against their solo mid for the entire early and mid game totally means you can't buy +dmg items. Not at all. Volley is her main damage skill? Volley is useful for DPS and AoE slow. Spamming it early and mid game is simply out of the question. Any competent team will have at least one character focus you. Volley is an initiating skill and an AoE slow before it's DPS. Even late game, doing an autoattack +50 damage every 2.4 seconds? What a joke. If you consider that DPS (it can't even crit) then you must see Ashe as one of the best carries in the game. Which she's not. Besides, getting Philo Stone on Ashe completely changes the build, so you're already talking about something all together different.
Let's say you got 200 minion kills, that's quite a bit into the game and you should have strong equip by then. About 4k gold just from minions, add like 500-1500 from kills, assists, towers, dragons. Probably around 1-3k from the normal gold/sec, no idea how much that really is.
By that point you probably got 500-700 extra gold from E if you max it asap. That's... 14-19 AD. HOLY SHIT!
I max Volley. I spam Volley. Not only do I deal AD+80 instead of AD+40, I deal that damage 5 times as often, and I hit several enemies with it (how many champs have a 3+ AD ratio on a 4 second CD spell?). Oh and I also got 150 extra gold from my level 1 E. A whopping 4 damage!
Yes Ashe has a weak autoattack. Do you see any +AD passive/active on her? +ASpd? +Range? +Splash? +%HP damage? She has a slow and 600 range, which is almost nullified by her having to stand still while performing a long attack animation and her low base speed. That's it.
Ashe shines with her AoE DPS/Slow and Single Target Stun/Nuke (3-4 second combo).
She is not a single target DPS like Kog Maw or Tristana.
Not even sure what you mean by "the build". Can I assume that you build her IE>LW because that's what ranged physical DPSers do?
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the next person that builds a manamune on miss fortune is going to get their ass kicked personally by me.
tiamats all the way yo
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EPT
