EPTdunno how much you guys play on emperor, but the ai is going to race ahead in tech very shortly
[Civ 4] Succession Game 3 - Page 5
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jfourz
Ireland421 Posts
dunno how much you guys play on emperor, but the ai is going to race ahead in tech very shortly | ||
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Fen
Australia1848 Posts
Not to sidetrack the thread however, but there is an issue that seems to be coming up. Since my last edit of the roster, 4 more people have asked to sign up. Now this is great, I'm really happy that everyone is having fun and wanting to play. However this puts our roster up to 14. Thats 280 game turns until each player gets another shot. Our last game was 511 turns long. Meaning we would be looking at each person getting 2 shots (remember however that some people will pass on their turns). There also seems to be interest for another game on a lower difficulty mode. Ive added some polls to this spoiler just to gauge what everyones opinions on this is. + Show Spoiler + I see 3 options for handling the large roster. Allowing anyone who wants to join to join. Closing the signups or splitting the roster and starting a second game. Poll: How should we handle the large roster? Split the roster and start a second game (16) Close signups for the rest of this game (1) The more the merrier (0) 17 total votes Your vote: How should we handle the large roster? (Vote): The more the merrier Also, if you are interested in playing in a noble succession game of civ4, please vote in this poll. If we do play a noble game, we will have to go on good faith that noble is your appropriate skill level. Meaning if you can beat a noble computer comfortably, then you should not be playing. Smashing a computer really isnt all that fun and defeats the purpose of these games. If you can beat a noble, then you should be playing in the main game. Poll: Would you participate in a noble game? Yes (6) No (1) 7 total votes Your vote: Would you participate in a noble game? | ||
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igotmyown
United States4291 Posts
On June 01 2010 23:20 Keilah wrote: Mathcrafting sounds waaaay cooler than arithmetic, and it reminds us of the word theorycrafting, which is waaaay cooler than "thinking about the game." Interesting note about the whipping, but it balances out to be 45 hammers/pop anyways. (45) = (45)(0.5)(2), the (0.5) and (2) coming from wonder penalty and stone bonus respectively. And chopping is almost 2 turns saved per chop, not sure how you got 18 = 30? obv we don't just instachop every forest before starting manual construction, if that's what you were thinking. We need to expand a lot and build workers first. Then, once we have 4-5 workers, we pre-chop the forests, then chop/build/slave the pyramids in 2-4 turns. That way we have almost no chance of wasting turns on the pyramids, we lose nothing at all if someone completes them before we start, and all we really lose is the worker turns and forests that could have been put into more settlers and praetorians and stuff. Saying the 50% penalty balances out with the stone bonus is a highly misleading argument, since every other source of hammers will provide double hammers. You could just say pyramids with stone cost 375, and whipping provides 22.5 hammers per pop. In any case, you're going to have to whip 8 population (size 16 city) to match your original estimate. About wasting turns: production is production. If you chop 1 forest for pyramids and spend 1 turn on a praetorian (18 hammers), you're in the same position you would be if you spent 1 turn on pyramids (18 hammers) and chopped 1 forest into a praetorian. Furthermore, if you 2 pop whipped a barracks/praetorian, you'll get 90 hammers, which is worth 5 turns of production (18 x 5). If you 2 pop whip to finish off a pyramids, you'll get 90 hammers, but it will only be worth 2.5 turns of production (18 x 2 x 2.5 ). Also chopping has an opportunity cost during which you could be improving special resources. It will take 5 worker turns per chop, and with 5 workers it will 10 turns to perform 9 chops, so it's going to take you at least 6 turns to get all your chops into your pyramids. Of course, people can play however they like, and there is some advantage to this mass chopping strategy if they highly doubt they can border pop the stone (15 turns after monument), quarry (9 worker turns) and road it in time on emperor difficulty. I just want to point out it's really not that efficient or particularly effective. It's epic speed and the AI also builds 1.5 x slower, so your timing windows for wonders are also 1.5x longer. | ||
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catabowl
United States815 Posts
Just wondering. | ||
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Fen
Australia1848 Posts
Here is the current roster RisingTide Energizer mcneebs ShloobeR miseiler h3r1n6 duckett Mystlord catabowl Keilah Dobrev Soda nosliw j4s We are at duckett's turn at the moment, so we can simply split from Mystlord down to j4s and start a new game. Its up to you guys if you want to start a completely new game, or start from the same game and compete to see which team can get a higher score or something. If anyone is opposed to this style of split, or wishes to stay in this game (or be included in the split), please speak up. Also 5 people have expressed interest in a noble game so I will set one of those games up as well. One final note Duckett you have only about 15 hours left to post a "got it" notice before play will be passed on. | ||
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catabowl
United States815 Posts
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LeperKahn
Romania1852 Posts
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ShloobeR
Korea (South)3851 Posts
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Eben
United States769 Posts
On June 03 2010 10:33 ShloobeR wrote: Two teams running on the same map sounds pretty fun actually that does sound cool. It'd be interesting to compare how the two games ended up | ||
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JustAnotherKnave
United States67 Posts
reminds me of that old TV show Sliders | ||
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Keilah
731 Posts
I'm sticking with expand into pyramids. There are more forests than just the ones that NEED to be chopped, so if we plan to chop them all we can use the first bunch for settlers and workers, and use the rest for the pyramids. My original estimate was correct, because I said that each pop gives 45 hammers of a 750 hammer wonder, which is the same as each pop giving 22.5 of a 375. Pyramids vs Praetorians - assuming we use 3 pop of whip in making the pyramids and then immediately change into police state (incorrectly ignoring the turn of anarchy), we will reach 30 praetorians at the same time as if we'd just started building them immediately. 30 is more than we need for an early war, so the pyramids WILL delay our first attack - but everything after 30 praetorians is pure gravy, plus we have to option to switch into representation if we don't want to war again soon. Oh, and no noble game for me =[ | ||
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Keilah
731 Posts
On June 02 2010 11:16 Energizer wrote: and btw keilah, there is no way to catch up in the pyramid race after expanding. Its either one or the other because if we expand, the trees will go to settlers. Even if we dont chop the settlers, the cpu will already be 3/4 the way done. And worst case scenario where we dont have iron, we will always have the option to use our horses to quickly capture the nearest iron resource (Not to kill the civi, just gain the iron) Just to respond to this, it's incorrect because even if the AI is 3/4 of the way done when we start working on the pyramids, we'll still get it first as long as we do a lot of quick chops because the AI will be manually building while we chop/whip. Since we begin by pre-chopping (chopping until the forest needs only 1 turn to complete the chop), we will only take 3-4 turns from putting our city on the pyramids to completion. That means only a tiny tiny chance of there being any wasted hammers turned into gold, and if the AI gets pyramids before we start those 3-4 turns... so what? We just use the chops to make praetorians. | ||
Mystlord
United States10264 Posts
Same settings for both games of course. And I was under the impression that the Noble people will go start their own thread? | ||
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Keilah
731 Posts
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ShloobeR
Korea (South)3851 Posts
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Fen
Australia1848 Posts
On June 03 2010 15:08 Mystlord wrote: If we're going to do the same map/game, should we split it ideologically? Judging from the earlier poll, we have a pretty clear split down the middle for Expand with Praetorians vs Oracle/Pyramid. We could split it that way and see which strategy worked best. Same settings for both games of course. And I was under the impression that the Noble people will go start their own thread? Yes thats correct Sorry if I wasn't clear. We split this game based on who wants to go for the pyramids/oracle and who wants to go for praetorians and the other team just takes the current save and continues onwards with their preferred strategy. Or the splitters could start from the very start of this game with the 4000BC save if they wanted to instead (it might be hard to get the pyramids without starting again). As for the noble game, this is completely seperate. Im still not completely convinced it will work but I've had a few people ask me about it and theres no reason why we can't try. Can people please indicate which side of the split they would like to go on. | ||
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Luddite
United States2315 Posts
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Keilah
731 Posts
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Badjas
Netherlands2038 Posts
Make sure the games don't run out of sync with time too much so as to not give the game that is running late an unfair advantage in scouting. | ||
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ShloobeR
Korea (South)3851 Posts
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