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TieN.nS)
Profile Joined August 2003
United States2131 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-23 21:01:41
February 23 2011 21:01 GMT
#881


New Desk CMV, featuring Chun-Li.

Here's this week's Wakeup SRK podcast featuring Desk as well: http://shoryuken.com/content/wakeup-shoryuken-e051-desk-top-publishing-3706/
Zeroes
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States1102 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-23 21:44:09
February 23 2011 21:32 GMT
#882
On February 24 2011 05:11 PrideNeverDie wrote:
i think a ban/pick phase would help a lot in the competitive scene. it would force players to be more well-rounded and see more creative and interesting combos other than the usual type S.


This isn't DotA, get out of here with that. lol


MvC3 =/ other fighting games either, its good to keep an open mind

Ban/draft would be awesome for mvc3 since there are 3 characters to pick and you have to learn multiple characters anyway to make the best team.

Also draft would broaden the number of characters you see in high level play and increase the skill cap which all the pros are complaining about since the combo system and controls are dumbed down.
Check out my SC Lan pics Here: http://picasaweb.google.com/bunk.habit
shwaffles
Profile Joined July 2010
United States117 Posts
February 23 2011 22:04 GMT
#883
On February 24 2011 06:32 Zeroes wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 24 2011 05:11 PrideNeverDie wrote:
i think a ban/pick phase would help a lot in the competitive scene. it would force players to be more well-rounded and see more creative and interesting combos other than the usual type S.


Show nested quote +
This isn't DotA, get out of here with that. lol


MvC3 =/ other fighting games either, its good to keep an open mind

Ban/draft would be awesome for mvc3 since there are 3 characters to pick and you have to learn multiple characters anyway to make the best team.

Also draft would broaden the number of characters you see in high level play and increase the skill cap which all the pros are complaining about since the combo system and controls are dumbed down.

That would be an awful idea. Banning top characters just leads to the downward spiral of banning the next top characters. Coupled with the fact that this game is barely a week old, it would do nothing but slow down development.
Zeroes
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States1102 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-23 22:16:57
February 23 2011 22:11 GMT
#884
On February 24 2011 07:04 shwaffles wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 24 2011 06:32 Zeroes wrote:
On February 24 2011 05:11 PrideNeverDie wrote:
i think a ban/pick phase would help a lot in the competitive scene. it would force players to be more well-rounded and see more creative and interesting combos other than the usual type S.


This isn't DotA, get out of here with that. lol


MvC3 =/ other fighting games either, its good to keep an open mind

Ban/draft would be awesome for mvc3 since there are 3 characters to pick and you have to learn multiple characters anyway to make the best team.

Also draft would broaden the number of characters you see in high level play and increase the skill cap which all the pros are complaining about since the combo system and controls are dumbed down.

That would be an awful idea. Banning top characters just leads to the downward spiral of banning the next top characters. Coupled with the fact that this game is barely a week old, it would do nothing but slow down development.


do you know how the ban/draft system works? you only get 1 ban if you ban the next top characters then they could pick the top characters.
Check out my SC Lan pics Here: http://picasaweb.google.com/bunk.habit
Ace
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States16096 Posts
February 23 2011 22:16 GMT
#885
On February 24 2011 07:04 shwaffles wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 24 2011 06:32 Zeroes wrote:
On February 24 2011 05:11 PrideNeverDie wrote:
i think a ban/pick phase would help a lot in the competitive scene. it would force players to be more well-rounded and see more creative and interesting combos other than the usual type S.


This isn't DotA, get out of here with that. lol


MvC3 =/ other fighting games either, its good to keep an open mind

Ban/draft would be awesome for mvc3 since there are 3 characters to pick and you have to learn multiple characters anyway to make the best team.

Also draft would broaden the number of characters you see in high level play and increase the skill cap which all the pros are complaining about since the combo system and controls are dumbed down.

That would be an awful idea. Banning top characters just leads to the downward spiral of banning the next top characters. Coupled with the fact that this game is barely a week old, it would do nothing but slow down development.


um...no. Since the "top" characters all work well due to team synergy banning just 1 of them makes some teams unplayable - you either pick a brand new team to fight a different way or try a new character to compete with your other 2.
Math me up, scumboi. - Acrofales
Wesso
Profile Joined August 2010
Netherlands1245 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-23 22:18:56
February 23 2011 22:18 GMT
#886
On February 24 2011 06:32 Zeroes wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 24 2011 05:11 PrideNeverDie wrote:
i think a ban/pick phase would help a lot in the competitive scene. it would force players to be more well-rounded and see more creative and interesting combos other than the usual type S.


Show nested quote +
This isn't DotA, get out of here with that. lol


MvC3 =/ other fighting games either, its good to keep an open mind

Ban/draft would be awesome for mvc3 since there are 3 characters to pick and you have to learn multiple characters anyway to make the best team.

Also draft would broaden the number of characters you see in high level play and increase the skill cap which all the pros are complaining about since the combo system and controls are dumbed down.


It would be a pretty bad idea IMO. In fighting games, everything comes down to how well you know your character. The exact range, exact frame duration of every single move. Banning another persons best character is almost as bad as making him offrace in SC2. It is even worse in team games like MvC. The teams people play are balanced around eachother, if you ban one of the 3 characters, the player most likely needs to play an entirely different team.

Of course, it could be fun on a lower level, as an optional feature.
AlecPyron
Profile Joined May 2010
United States131 Posts
February 23 2011 22:32 GMT
#887
In theory this idea of ban/pick would be good, as they force players to learn more than 1 or 2 team combination, but in practice it doesn't work that way. Even in shallow fighting games, have to learn more than 3 characters at highest competitive level doesn't see practical.
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
February 23 2011 22:37 GMT
#888
On February 24 2011 07:16 Ace wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 24 2011 07:04 shwaffles wrote:
On February 24 2011 06:32 Zeroes wrote:
On February 24 2011 05:11 PrideNeverDie wrote:
i think a ban/pick phase would help a lot in the competitive scene. it would force players to be more well-rounded and see more creative and interesting combos other than the usual type S.


This isn't DotA, get out of here with that. lol


MvC3 =/ other fighting games either, its good to keep an open mind

Ban/draft would be awesome for mvc3 since there are 3 characters to pick and you have to learn multiple characters anyway to make the best team.

Also draft would broaden the number of characters you see in high level play and increase the skill cap which all the pros are complaining about since the combo system and controls are dumbed down.

That would be an awful idea. Banning top characters just leads to the downward spiral of banning the next top characters. Coupled with the fact that this game is barely a week old, it would do nothing but slow down development.


um...no. Since the "top" characters all work well due to team synergy banning just 1 of them makes some teams unplayable - you either pick a brand new team to fight a different way or try a new character to compete with your other 2.


You would think so, but it doesn't progress like this. For example, in MvC2, all the low-tier teams used Tron's assist and most of them abused the shit out of one aspect of the character, aka run-while-building-meter then look for windows. Like Blackheart is considered a one dimensional top (1st or 2nd under god) tier character, but it doesn't make it any more creative, because you're essentially doing the same thing of trying to set up that punishing trap over and over and over again. You would think it would get more creative, but it really doesn't, it just gets more specialized and repetitive. You'll just see the next tier of teams being used and so on, it doesn't mean you are a more complete or skilled player either. If teams were the end all, then you wouldn't always see the same faces (relatively) at the live competitions finals.

Anyways, there was quite amount of history of all of the teams used in MvC2, including some that weren't considered good at its release (cough Storm cough), so give MvC3 some time before attempting to tinker and fix a system that you really don't know how it will play out.

PS - Team synergy is hilarious at this point in MvC3's release, by the pro-drafter's logic, at a similar point in MvC2's release, Strider, Doom, and Blackheart would all end up on someone's ban list in a competition.
Get it by your hands...
Rakanishu2
Profile Joined May 2009
United States475 Posts
February 23 2011 22:46 GMT
#889
On February 24 2011 05:13 TieN.nS) wrote:
This isn't DotA, get out of here with that. lol


Yea, games are required to be completely different in every aspect or it causes a black hole.
10 G's in the packet and I'm ready to roll, on fire like a rocket and I'm ready to blow
Trumpet
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States1936 Posts
February 23 2011 22:58 GMT
#890
Sometimes, these new ideas are worth consideration.

This isn't one of those times.

I'm not practicing the shit out of a character, learning a ton of different variations for enders, where you can roll, where to go to keep pressure, different setups etc. only to have you say "NO STORM LOLOLOL"

I'm sure marvel 2 would have been so much more entertaining if every time someone played sanford they just said "no sentinel!" or vs yipes "No magneto!"

Next, for the osl finals, we tell Jaedong "No, Mr.Dong, you now can only play Protoss lololololol"

We'll get MUCH higher level games that way, I'm sure.

Breesus Christ, I can't believe this discussion is even happening.
rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-23 23:00:38
February 23 2011 23:00 GMT
#891
please no ban pick phases... i liked* mvc2 the way it was* and adding in bans picks would only lower the skill levels since theres less opportunity for specialization
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
KissBlade
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
United States5718 Posts
February 23 2011 23:02 GMT
#892
Lol ... you guys need to get in on the tournament scene, even if it's a local one, before commenting on these things. Bans is such utter nonsense at this point ... Learn to play first. In other words, learn how to get in, learn how to defend, learn how to punish. THEN, maybe then, comment about balance.
Ginseng
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States268 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-23 23:12:42
February 23 2011 23:10 GMT
#893
Oh you stream monsters are still so green. :D

Personally speaking, if you guys really want to improve, you would need to have some practice partners or groups to really train with. With the advent of sf4 and mvc3, there should be a lot more local gatherings or players wanting to get better at new-gen fighting games, so finding a scene shouldn't be too hard. Offline practice gives people so much more reward compared to online, and you get in-person feedback and a real sense of how you compare vs other players around your level.

Also, by playing in a more competitive setting (not online), you can learn a lot more about yourself as a player, and the community as a whole. You start making better decisions and judgement about the community around you.
Contact me via the following: Twitter: @notginseng | Discord: Ginseng#9638
TieN.nS)
Profile Joined August 2003
United States2131 Posts
February 23 2011 23:40 GMT
#894
On February 24 2011 07:58 Trumpet wrote:
Sometimes, these new ideas are worth consideration.

This isn't one of those times.

I'm not practicing the shit out of a character, learning a ton of different variations for enders, where you can roll, where to go to keep pressure, different setups etc. only to have you say "NO STORM LOLOLOL"

I'm sure marvel 2 would have been so much more entertaining if every time someone played sanford they just said "no sentinel!" or vs yipes "No magneto!"

Next, for the osl finals, we tell Jaedong "No, Mr.Dong, you now can only play Protoss lololololol"

We'll get MUCH higher level games that way, I'm sure.

Breesus Christ, I can't believe this discussion is even happening.


I definitely wasn't expecting any more posts about this when I clicked on the topic. lol. Desk comes up with some ridiculous shit and all people want to talk about is trying to shoehorn DotA conventions into other games?
blagoonga123
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States2068 Posts
February 24 2011 00:59 GMT
#895
I tried playing an online game where I spammed the crap out of Sentinel's lasers and Doom's hidden missiles. It worked extremely well. I had totally locked down one of his characters and already chipped away 50% of his life.

I felt completely bored and a little disgusted with myself though so I decided to play my own style. Turns out he was way better than me at that and I lost haha
FOOL! Pain is my friend! Now let me introduce you to it!
101toss
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
3232 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-24 01:18:11
February 24 2011 01:17 GMT
#896
On February 24 2011 07:58 Trumpet wrote:
Sometimes, these new ideas are worth consideration.

This isn't one of those times.

I'm not practicing the shit out of a character, learning a ton of different variations for enders, where you can roll, where to go to keep pressure, different setups etc. only to have you say "NO STORM LOLOLOL"

I'm sure marvel 2 would have been so much more entertaining if every time someone played sanford they just said "no sentinel!" or vs yipes "No magneto!"

Next, for the osl finals, we tell Jaedong "No, Mr.Dong, you now can only play Protoss lololololol"

We'll get MUCH higher level games that way, I'm sure.

Breesus Christ, I can't believe this discussion is even happening.

Bans will happen over time. SF2Turbo Akuma was ignored at first, but people realized that he was severely broken, and thus proceeded to get banned from every tournament.

I think calling the banhammer now seems ill-informed.. I remember SFIV tournaments banned Seth, but it turned out that Sagat, not Seth, was OP.
Math doesn't kill champions and neither do wards
Zlasher
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States9129 Posts
February 24 2011 01:19 GMT
#897
In case anyone wants to wathc, theres a tournament in new york going on right now

www.gamescast.tv/live/spooky
Follow me: www.twitter.com/zlasher
InfeSteD
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States4658 Posts
February 24 2011 01:52 GMT
#898
oh hes got that mango sentinel!!!!!!!!!!

MAKE IT RAIN!

SPIT ON THAT MOTHAFUCKA!

dude Im digging mvc3 a lil... ive had some fun wit doom and sentinel
w/e
itsben
Profile Joined July 2010
435 Posts
February 24 2011 02:13 GMT
#899
So the best way to beat dark phoenix is to get the lead and run away. Someone just did that on spooky's stream and ran away for 59 secs lol. Also jwong will be on again tonight on levelup stream.
Zlasher
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States9129 Posts
February 24 2011 02:26 GMT
#900
Yeah, Wednesday Night Fights will be streamed again and those will be some great games as well.

Link to that (when its up) will be

www.gamescast.tv/live/lvlseries
Follow me: www.twitter.com/zlasher
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