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On November 19 2013 08:09 Ecael wrote:Show nested quote +On November 19 2013 07:59 WolfintheSheep wrote:On November 19 2013 07:31 Ecael wrote:
Shoujo and Josei is decently useful, seinen and shounen though are pretty damned useless. Not completely useless, it really depends on what you're using the classifications for. For example, if you want sci-fi where there's war and people die, yeah, completely useless. But if you prefer hard sci-fi (GUNNM, for example) over soft sci-fi (like...Index-verse? Someone remind me of another shounen sci-fi), then seinen is a fairly good guideline. Or even comparing two very similar manga like YKK (seinen) or Aria (shounen), the former has a lot more emphasis on the world changing and questioning why things are happening (even if they're never explained), while the latter just let's the mysteries come and go. The difference isn't really what content is in the stories, it's about where the emphasis is placed. Eh, I am not sure what your point is. Are you trying to say that the two show a different emphasis on the type of content? If so, sure they do, but the distinction is eclectic enough to make them useless as categories to sort preferences with. The differences between josei and shoujo tends to be more uniform as to make them not completely worthless in that regard.
I dont think hard sci fi or soft sci fi has anything to do with what you would call shounen. Still he has some what of a point
I agree that at the end of the day its a lazy generalization but then what else are you going to do ?
Or are you telling him index isnt shounen? In which case how would you classify something like index at all? (no you cant say trash)
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On November 19 2013 08:46 WolfintheSheep wrote:Show nested quote +On November 19 2013 08:09 Ecael wrote:On November 19 2013 07:59 WolfintheSheep wrote:On November 19 2013 07:31 Ecael wrote:
Shoujo and Josei is decently useful, seinen and shounen though are pretty damned useless. Not completely useless, it really depends on what you're using the classifications for. For example, if you want sci-fi where there's war and people die, yeah, completely useless. But if you prefer hard sci-fi (GUNNM, for example) over soft sci-fi (like...Index-verse? Someone remind me of another shounen sci-fi), then seinen is a fairly good guideline. Or even comparing two very similar manga like YKK (seinen) or Aria (shounen), the former has a lot more emphasis on the world changing and questioning why things are happening (even if they're never explained), while the latter just let's the mysteries come and go. The difference isn't really what content is in the stories, it's about where the emphasis is placed. Eh, I am not sure what your point is. Are you trying to say that the two show a different emphasis on the type of content? If so, sure they do, but the distinction is eclectic enough to make them useless as categories to sort preferences with. The differences between josei and shoujo tends to be more uniform as to make them not completely worthless in that regard. Again, it depends entirely on what preferences you're trying to sort by. If you say "I want a story that focuses on world building", then the seinen and shounen distinction is actually really useful. Or you want a manga about life after high school. Josei and shoujo just seem more uniform because they cover less genres in general (far less fantasy/sci-fi/extreme supernatural), and because there's a stereotypical art-style. But there's still a lot of josei that look like shoujo on the surface, especially using western values.
Hmm there is no real point to waste time discussing specifics for this, so I'll refrain on that. My question is, would you consider something as vague as what you listed a useful metric? If so, ok.
On November 19 2013 08:48 Rebs wrote:Show nested quote +On November 19 2013 08:09 Ecael wrote:On November 19 2013 07:59 WolfintheSheep wrote:On November 19 2013 07:31 Ecael wrote:
Shoujo and Josei is decently useful, seinen and shounen though are pretty damned useless. Not completely useless, it really depends on what you're using the classifications for. For example, if you want sci-fi where there's war and people die, yeah, completely useless. But if you prefer hard sci-fi (GUNNM, for example) over soft sci-fi (like...Index-verse? Someone remind me of another shounen sci-fi), then seinen is a fairly good guideline. Or even comparing two very similar manga like YKK (seinen) or Aria (shounen), the former has a lot more emphasis on the world changing and questioning why things are happening (even if they're never explained), while the latter just let's the mysteries come and go. The difference isn't really what content is in the stories, it's about where the emphasis is placed. Eh, I am not sure what your point is. Are you trying to say that the two show a different emphasis on the type of content? If so, sure they do, but the distinction is eclectic enough to make them useless as categories to sort preferences with. The differences between josei and shoujo tends to be more uniform as to make them not completely worthless in that regard. I dont think hard sci fi or soft sci fi has anything to do with what you would call shounen. Still he has some what of a point I agree that at the end of the day its a lazy generalization but then what else are you going to do ? Or are you telling him index isnt shounen? In which case how would you classify something like index at all? (no you cant say trash)
I am saying that comparatively, shounen and seinen cover a ton of random shit to the point that they are pretty damn useless as a metric to sort with.
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On November 19 2013 08:52 Ecael wrote:Show nested quote +On November 19 2013 08:46 WolfintheSheep wrote:On November 19 2013 08:09 Ecael wrote:On November 19 2013 07:59 WolfintheSheep wrote:On November 19 2013 07:31 Ecael wrote:
Shoujo and Josei is decently useful, seinen and shounen though are pretty damned useless. Not completely useless, it really depends on what you're using the classifications for. For example, if you want sci-fi where there's war and people die, yeah, completely useless. But if you prefer hard sci-fi (GUNNM, for example) over soft sci-fi (like...Index-verse? Someone remind me of another shounen sci-fi), then seinen is a fairly good guideline. Or even comparing two very similar manga like YKK (seinen) or Aria (shounen), the former has a lot more emphasis on the world changing and questioning why things are happening (even if they're never explained), while the latter just let's the mysteries come and go. The difference isn't really what content is in the stories, it's about where the emphasis is placed. Eh, I am not sure what your point is. Are you trying to say that the two show a different emphasis on the type of content? If so, sure they do, but the distinction is eclectic enough to make them useless as categories to sort preferences with. The differences between josei and shoujo tends to be more uniform as to make them not completely worthless in that regard. Again, it depends entirely on what preferences you're trying to sort by. If you say "I want a story that focuses on world building", then the seinen and shounen distinction is actually really useful. Or you want a manga about life after high school. Josei and shoujo just seem more uniform because they cover less genres in general (far less fantasy/sci-fi/extreme supernatural), and because there's a stereotypical art-style. But there's still a lot of josei that look like shoujo on the surface, especially using western values. Hmm there is no real point to waste time discussing specifics for this, so I'll refrain on that. My question is, would you consider something as vague as what you listed a useful metric? If so, ok. Show nested quote +On November 19 2013 08:48 Rebs wrote:On November 19 2013 08:09 Ecael wrote:On November 19 2013 07:59 WolfintheSheep wrote:On November 19 2013 07:31 Ecael wrote:
Shoujo and Josei is decently useful, seinen and shounen though are pretty damned useless. Not completely useless, it really depends on what you're using the classifications for. For example, if you want sci-fi where there's war and people die, yeah, completely useless. But if you prefer hard sci-fi (GUNNM, for example) over soft sci-fi (like...Index-verse? Someone remind me of another shounen sci-fi), then seinen is a fairly good guideline. Or even comparing two very similar manga like YKK (seinen) or Aria (shounen), the former has a lot more emphasis on the world changing and questioning why things are happening (even if they're never explained), while the latter just let's the mysteries come and go. The difference isn't really what content is in the stories, it's about where the emphasis is placed. Eh, I am not sure what your point is. Are you trying to say that the two show a different emphasis on the type of content? If so, sure they do, but the distinction is eclectic enough to make them useless as categories to sort preferences with. The differences between josei and shoujo tends to be more uniform as to make them not completely worthless in that regard. I dont think hard sci fi or soft sci fi has anything to do with what you would call shounen. Still he has some what of a point I agree that at the end of the day its a lazy generalization but then what else are you going to do ? Or are you telling him index isnt shounen? In which case how would you classify something like index at all? (no you cant say trash) I am saying that comparatively, shounen and seinen cover a ton of random shit to the point that they are pretty damn useless as a metric to sort with.
Which is fine, but do you have a reasonable alternative ?
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On November 19 2013 08:55 Rebs wrote:Show nested quote +On November 19 2013 08:52 Ecael wrote:On November 19 2013 08:46 WolfintheSheep wrote:On November 19 2013 08:09 Ecael wrote:On November 19 2013 07:59 WolfintheSheep wrote:On November 19 2013 07:31 Ecael wrote:
Shoujo and Josei is decently useful, seinen and shounen though are pretty damned useless. Not completely useless, it really depends on what you're using the classifications for. For example, if you want sci-fi where there's war and people die, yeah, completely useless. But if you prefer hard sci-fi (GUNNM, for example) over soft sci-fi (like...Index-verse? Someone remind me of another shounen sci-fi), then seinen is a fairly good guideline. Or even comparing two very similar manga like YKK (seinen) or Aria (shounen), the former has a lot more emphasis on the world changing and questioning why things are happening (even if they're never explained), while the latter just let's the mysteries come and go. The difference isn't really what content is in the stories, it's about where the emphasis is placed. Eh, I am not sure what your point is. Are you trying to say that the two show a different emphasis on the type of content? If so, sure they do, but the distinction is eclectic enough to make them useless as categories to sort preferences with. The differences between josei and shoujo tends to be more uniform as to make them not completely worthless in that regard. Again, it depends entirely on what preferences you're trying to sort by. If you say "I want a story that focuses on world building", then the seinen and shounen distinction is actually really useful. Or you want a manga about life after high school. Josei and shoujo just seem more uniform because they cover less genres in general (far less fantasy/sci-fi/extreme supernatural), and because there's a stereotypical art-style. But there's still a lot of josei that look like shoujo on the surface, especially using western values. Hmm there is no real point to waste time discussing specifics for this, so I'll refrain on that. My question is, would you consider something as vague as what you listed a useful metric? If so, ok. On November 19 2013 08:48 Rebs wrote:On November 19 2013 08:09 Ecael wrote:On November 19 2013 07:59 WolfintheSheep wrote:On November 19 2013 07:31 Ecael wrote:
Shoujo and Josei is decently useful, seinen and shounen though are pretty damned useless. Not completely useless, it really depends on what you're using the classifications for. For example, if you want sci-fi where there's war and people die, yeah, completely useless. But if you prefer hard sci-fi (GUNNM, for example) over soft sci-fi (like...Index-verse? Someone remind me of another shounen sci-fi), then seinen is a fairly good guideline. Or even comparing two very similar manga like YKK (seinen) or Aria (shounen), the former has a lot more emphasis on the world changing and questioning why things are happening (even if they're never explained), while the latter just let's the mysteries come and go. The difference isn't really what content is in the stories, it's about where the emphasis is placed. Eh, I am not sure what your point is. Are you trying to say that the two show a different emphasis on the type of content? If so, sure they do, but the distinction is eclectic enough to make them useless as categories to sort preferences with. The differences between josei and shoujo tends to be more uniform as to make them not completely worthless in that regard. I dont think hard sci fi or soft sci fi has anything to do with what you would call shounen. Still he has some what of a point I agree that at the end of the day its a lazy generalization but then what else are you going to do ? Or are you telling him index isnt shounen? In which case how would you classify something like index at all? (no you cant say trash) I am saying that comparatively, shounen and seinen cover a ton of random shit to the point that they are pretty damn useless as a metric to sort with. Which is fine, but do you have a reasonable alternative ?
Nope, would be nice, but nothing that convenient.
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On November 19 2013 08:52 Ecael wrote:Show nested quote +On November 19 2013 08:46 WolfintheSheep wrote:On November 19 2013 08:09 Ecael wrote:On November 19 2013 07:59 WolfintheSheep wrote:On November 19 2013 07:31 Ecael wrote:
Shoujo and Josei is decently useful, seinen and shounen though are pretty damned useless. Not completely useless, it really depends on what you're using the classifications for. For example, if you want sci-fi where there's war and people die, yeah, completely useless. But if you prefer hard sci-fi (GUNNM, for example) over soft sci-fi (like...Index-verse? Someone remind me of another shounen sci-fi), then seinen is a fairly good guideline. Or even comparing two very similar manga like YKK (seinen) or Aria (shounen), the former has a lot more emphasis on the world changing and questioning why things are happening (even if they're never explained), while the latter just let's the mysteries come and go. The difference isn't really what content is in the stories, it's about where the emphasis is placed. Eh, I am not sure what your point is. Are you trying to say that the two show a different emphasis on the type of content? If so, sure they do, but the distinction is eclectic enough to make them useless as categories to sort preferences with. The differences between josei and shoujo tends to be more uniform as to make them not completely worthless in that regard. Again, it depends entirely on what preferences you're trying to sort by. If you say "I want a story that focuses on world building", then the seinen and shounen distinction is actually really useful. Or you want a manga about life after high school. Josei and shoujo just seem more uniform because they cover less genres in general (far less fantasy/sci-fi/extreme supernatural), and because there's a stereotypical art-style. But there's still a lot of josei that look like shoujo on the surface, especially using western values. Hmm there is no real point to waste time discussing specifics for this, so I'll refrain on that. My question is, would you consider something as vague as what you listed a useful metric? If so, ok. Show nested quote +On November 19 2013 08:48 Rebs wrote:On November 19 2013 08:09 Ecael wrote:On November 19 2013 07:59 WolfintheSheep wrote:On November 19 2013 07:31 Ecael wrote:
Shoujo and Josei is decently useful, seinen and shounen though are pretty damned useless. Not completely useless, it really depends on what you're using the classifications for. For example, if you want sci-fi where there's war and people die, yeah, completely useless. But if you prefer hard sci-fi (GUNNM, for example) over soft sci-fi (like...Index-verse? Someone remind me of another shounen sci-fi), then seinen is a fairly good guideline. Or even comparing two very similar manga like YKK (seinen) or Aria (shounen), the former has a lot more emphasis on the world changing and questioning why things are happening (even if they're never explained), while the latter just let's the mysteries come and go. The difference isn't really what content is in the stories, it's about where the emphasis is placed. Eh, I am not sure what your point is. Are you trying to say that the two show a different emphasis on the type of content? If so, sure they do, but the distinction is eclectic enough to make them useless as categories to sort preferences with. The differences between josei and shoujo tends to be more uniform as to make them not completely worthless in that regard. I dont think hard sci fi or soft sci fi has anything to do with what you would call shounen. Still he has some what of a point I agree that at the end of the day its a lazy generalization but then what else are you going to do ? Or are you telling him index isnt shounen? In which case how would you classify something like index at all? (no you cant say trash) I am saying that comparatively, shounen and seinen cover a ton of random shit to the point that they are pretty damn useless as a metric to sort with.
I've found it to be a fairly solid guideline for some searches. Like I mentioned, hard sci-fi and soft sci-fi is divided quite neatly. Same with fantasy (like "LotR vs Harry Potter", where one has a clearly defined world and the other uses magic as a catch-all).
Slice-of-life has generally worked as well, like if I want a story about characters doing anything, that's basically shounen, whereas if I want a story that's explores a time-period or lifestyle/career, that's basically seinen.
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Give me examples of your hard scifi seinen and soft scifi shounen.
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On November 19 2013 09:08 Sentenal wrote:
Give me examples of your hard scifi seinen and soft scifi shounen.
Well, I mentioned GUNNM as hard sci-fi. There's also Planetes. I guess Starship Operators...sort of?
Soft sci-fi is more like Gundam, Infinite Ryvius, FMP.
It's actually hard to think of many sci-fi manga/anime that aren't half magic/fantasy/supernatural.
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What about Votoms and Dougram? Or Patlabor? All of which are recognized for how hard scifi they are.
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Haven't actually sought out much of the Mecha genre. Though...I have been meaning to watch Patlabor...
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Patlabor is very good. If you do intend to watch it, I could give you a short primer so you would know where to start and what order would be good to watch them in.
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On November 19 2013 09:31 Sentenal wrote:
Patlabor is very good. If you do intend to watch it, I could give you a short primer so you would know where to start and what order would be good to watch them in.
Requesting that.
edit: holy shit NNB. Well played, rabbit, well played.
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On November 19 2013 09:33 Maxie wrote:Show nested quote +On November 19 2013 09:31 Sentenal wrote:
Patlabor is very good. If you do intend to watch it, I could give you a short primer so you would know where to start and what order would be good to watch them in. Requesting that. edit: holy shit NNB. Well played, rabbit, well played.
Renge continues to be cute as hell.
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On November 19 2013 09:33 Maxie wrote:Show nested quote +On November 19 2013 09:31 Sentenal wrote:
Patlabor is very good. If you do intend to watch it, I could give you a short primer so you would know where to start and what order would be good to watch them in. Requesting that. edit: holy shit NNB. Well played, rabbit, well played.
Keep in mind that there are two different timelines with Patlabor. You should start with the 1st OVA. This is both first chronologically, and first with production order. It is an excellent sampler for the series as a whole. It has the seriousness of the movies, and the light-heartedness of the TV Series, all in one 7 episode OVA. OVA1 is then followed by Movie 1 and then Movie 2. These two, especially the second, are very serious films (for example, the 2nd film themed about war and peace, and gets pretty heavy with that), with a directing style very characteristic of Mamoru Oshii. There is a 3rd Movie, but its so different from everything else in the series it might as well not even be Patlabor (not that its bad or anything, just wayyy different). Up to you if you want to watch that one.
Then the other timeline starts with the TV Show. The show is mostly fun stuff following the lives and exploits of SV2, with more serious arcs thrown in occasionally. Its followed by the 2nd OVA which is pretty much 16 more episodes of the TV series (which is a good thing).
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Holy crap this season of Monogatari so many summary episodes X_X
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Canada4481 Posts
On November 19 2013 06:17 TanKLoveR wrote:Show nested quote +On November 19 2013 06:07 Ecael wrote:
Did you google and managed to miss wikipedia entries? I only read a few lines of the entry, didn't see anything different and moved on lol. But I found another link, apparently Josei is aimed at 18+ girls and Shoujo at younger girls  . They are basically the same though lol, maybe shoujo could be more silly but that's it. Wonder under what genre White album and WA2 fall though.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shōjo_manga
Shōjo, shojo, or shoujo manga (少女漫画 shōjo manga?) is manga marketed to a female audience roughly between the ages of 10 and 18.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josei_manga
Josei manga (女性漫画?, lit. comics for women, pronounced [dʑosei]) also known as "ladies" (レディース redīsu?) or "ladies' comics" (レディコミ redikomi?, lit. "LadyComi") is a type of manga created mostly by women for late teenage and adult female audiences. Readers range from 15 to 44.
I don't think you even read a single sentence.
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On November 19 2013 09:53 Slaughter wrote:
Holy crap this season of Monogatari so many summary episodes X_X
It's exactly one recap/summary per arc or rather inbetween arcs (obviously no recap in episode 1 and the last one). No idea if it was intentionally but that makes up for exactly another arc (kanbaru anyone?) so I'd guess they left out that arc when they realized they need more workforce for something else (I'm looking at you madoka), which means the kanbaru arc was orignially planned to be aired in s2. The latter part is obviously just speculation from me and no idea if that's true but that'd make somewhat sense as people usually tend to say that recaps in Anime aren't (ever?) planned.
Is there information out about wether the next episode will be recap as well? Ecael and I did joke in irc about it asking if they're going to recap Kizu (yet unaired). Nagi or Kaze mentioned that they could recap S2 which would be even more meh :|
It would however probably help in a sense as the show started sooooo long ago, I rewatched the first arc yesterday to get some better idea of the timeline because it felt like I completly forgot about everything and there's so much stuff that I couldn't recall anymore that makes sense now :3
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I don't think they would do a recap of Kizu unless the movie they have been promising is close to being released as a form of hype. But who knows with Monogatari. I am sad Kanbaru got the axe but I guess its because it has some spoilers in it?
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Kanbaru is basically entirely spoilers just because of the time that it is taking place at is after everything thus far, lol.
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On November 19 2013 10:30 Ecael wrote:
Kanbaru is basically entirely spoilers just because of the time that it is taking place at is after everything thus far, lol.
if that's the case my explanation makes no sense though, because they must have known that beforehand.
And yeah the part about recapping Kizu was mostly just jokes. Commi has monogatari as airing in 5 days. They usually changed that to 13 days or whatever else it is if a recap is to happen because they're leaving those out. So they at least think there's not going to be a recap, or they're to lazy to change that despite changing it for every other recap.
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Man this NNB episode was so chill. Reminds me of how I felt when I watched Uchouten.
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EPT
