EPT[TV] HBO Game of Thrones - Page 1778
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dmnum
Brazil6910 Posts
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Adreme
United States5574 Posts
On May 13 2019 11:44 Stratos_speAr wrote: This show is a train wreck and it is going to get obliterated by both critic and fan reviews. It 100% deserves all the flak that it's getting. There is basically nothing positive to say about this season from a writing perspective. I feel bad for all of these quality actors that have to go through this farce. The development could make sense. The problem is that there is no development. It's horribly written and incredibly rushed. The execution of her "going mad" is just awful. That's why people are so pissed. How is it rushed? We have seen her prone to moments of it for seasons now, but she was always talked back by all of her advisers, many of whom have now died. She was literally planning on doing this EXACT same thing in season 6 only to barley be talked out of it by Tyrion and that was before everyone important to her died. The only adviser she has left is Tyrion whom she, sort of understandably, does not entirely trust at the moment and so now her madness is truly taking form. | ||
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Topin
Peru10093 Posts
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Nakajin
Canada8989 Posts
But it's still feel more earn than let say, Shae betraying Tyrion. And I prefer a tri-dimensional caracters than a straight up psychopath like Ramsey or Euron (even tho Ramsey had his moment). The show has a lot of problem lately I don't think this is one of them really. It does make the political ending a bit predictable tho, but maybe GOT will surprise me. | ||
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eviltomahawk
United States11135 Posts
On May 13 2019 11:50 Topin wrote: Golden Company LUL Should've brought the elephants for a nice bbq | ||
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FreakyDroid
Macedonia2616 Posts
On May 13 2019 11:48 Adreme wrote: How is it rushed? We have seen her prone to moments of it for seasons now, but she was always talked back by all of her advisers, many of whom have now died. She was literally planning on doing this EXACT same thing in season 6 only to barley be talked out of it by Tyrion and that was before everyone important to her died. The only adviser she has left is Tyrion whom she, sort of understandably, does not entirely trust at the moment and so now her madness is truly taking form. She pretty much single handendly won. What ever army was left surrendered. Then she went apeshit on everybody. That's not even rushed, its just bullshit. | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States45053 Posts
I'm surprised at just how unsatisfying tonight's deaths felt, even though the kill count was ratcheted up big time. Seems like the writers finally realized there's only one episode left. | ||
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TheFish7
United States2824 Posts
It would be foreshadowed by the scene with her father, the mad king, burning Brandon Stark which is what started the whole Robert's Rebellion war in the first place. ("Burn them all" having already foreshadowed what happened in KL). | ||
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Adreme
United States5574 Posts
On May 13 2019 11:58 FreakyDroid wrote: She pretty much single handendly won. What ever army was left surrendered. Then she went apeshit on everybody. That's not even rushed, its just bullshit. Again, she has finally given in to all her worst impulses. In a purely logical sense, she achieved exactly the same thing Cersei did by blowing up the sept. Now that there is no more Lannister army to even consider opposing her and the city sees what happens when you fight against her, she can now rule through fear which is what she talked about doing at the start of the episode because unlike in Essos she is not the one in Westeros who is most loved. This is the culmination of everything she has been for seven seasons except now no one can stop her madness. Its funny how they parallel her to Cersei because they are very similar in character even remarked in season 7 that the difference between them was that Dany choose advisers who checked her worst impulses except they are all dead now so her worst impulses are now running free. | ||
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Sbrubbles
Brazil5776 Posts
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Emnjay808
United States10660 Posts
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Adreme
United States5574 Posts
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On May 13 2019 12:04 Adreme wrote: Again, she has finally given in to all her worst impulses. In a purely logical sense, she achieved exactly the same thing Cersei did by blowing up the sept. Now that there is no more Lannister army to even consider opposing her and the city sees what happens when you fight against her, she can now rule through fear which is what she talked about doing at the start of the episode because unlike in Essos she is not the one in Westeros who is most loved. This is the culmination of everything she has been for seven seasons except now no one can stop her madness. Its funny how they parallel her to Cersei because they are very similar in character even remarked in season 7 that the difference between them was that Dany choose advisers who checked her worst impulses except they are all dead now so her worst impulses are now running free. The entire subplot around her going crazy was not nearly as developed as you give it credit for. For years they've been hyping her up as "Breaker of Chains" and wanting to not be a tyrant. There are numerous examples of this. She's had moments where she's been brutal, but they've always been to those that deserved it. It has shown her as a strong ruler and she has been repeatedly shown to be one to listen to her advisers and desire to rule as a just queen. Yet she completely and totally wins the battle in the first 10 minutes of screen time and then torches literally the entire city. She's been focused on winning the Iron Throne for the entire series up to now, and suddenly she decides to completely destroy the whole city and kill pretty much everyone in it. It's obnoxiously nonsensical, even if she has lost two dragons, Jorah, and Missandei. She complains that "she can only rule through fear" yet this is 100% her fault. The show doesn't even dedicate any time to her advisers actually explaining to her that what she is doing is fucking stupid. They are so rushed that they just skip that part. As I said, the story arc itself makes sense (her going from savior to mad Queen like her father). It could be executed well. The problem is that it was horrifically rushed. The writers have taken pretty much every character in the show and made them a comic book-esque embodiment of one character feature. She's turned into a comic book villain with very little depth at this point. This terrible writing has been evident ever since they ran out of source material. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
I think there is an episode that ends with her listening to the screams of slavers she is having tortured to death in public. Sure, they are slavers. But there are a lot of ways to execute people that isn’t torturing them to death. | ||
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andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
It's also amusing that D&D don't know what walls are for, considering how the wall was a major plot point for 6 seasons. | ||
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Adreme
United States5574 Posts
On May 13 2019 12:10 Stratos_speAr wrote: The entire subplot around her going crazy was not nearly as developed as you give it credit for. For years they've been hyping her up as "Breaker of Chains" and wanting to not be a tyrant. There are numerous examples of this. She's had moments where she's been brutal, but they've always been to those that deserved it. It has shown her as a strong ruler and she has been repeatedly shown to be one to listen to her advisers and desire to rule as a just queen. Yet she completely and totally wins the battle in the first 10 minutes of screen time and then torches literally the entire city. She's been focused on winning the Iron Throne for the entire series up to now, and suddenly she decides to completely destroy the whole city and kill pretty much everyone in it. It's obnoxiously nonsensical, even if she has lost two dragons, Jorah, and Missandei. She complains that "she can only rule through fear" yet this is 100% her fault. The show doesn't even dedicate any time to her advisers actually explaining to her that what she is doing is fucking stupid. They are so rushed that they just skip that part. As I said, the story arc itself makes sense (her going from savior to mad Queen like her father). It could be executed well. The problem is that it was horrifically rushed. The writers have taken pretty much every character in the show and made them a comic book-esque embodiment of one character feature. She's turned into a comic book villain with very little depth at this point. This terrible writing has been evident ever since they ran out of source material. She has been a pretty terrible queen for most of the show with everyone else having to clean up her mess. Also we only ever saw her fight against people and go after people who were so evil they "deserved" it, but we have seen glimpses of her madness all series long. We have seen that she has those traits for years now. That she has all of her fathers madness inside her is not something we are new to seeing. Her advisers were able to reason with her then, but she has always been self righteous, utterly convinced she is destined to save this world, and is quick to kill those who will not kneel to her power. When she had to be talked out of razing cities or slaughtering all her enemies, she had lost nothing in that fight. She was willing to slaughter them and their homes for fighting against her. Now she is fighting against people who have taken everything from her, and still convinced she is saving them, but yet for the first time the common people whom she is fighting for want nothing to do with her. She is not the one they love, she is not the one who is admired. She is used to being loved by the masses but now she has to look on as another gets that. So take that instability , with no one to stop her, and what else was going to happen but this. I would have been disappointed if it hadn't. I will be honest my initial prediction was that Cersei would bait her into burning the red keep by hanging Melisandre's head from it and then the wildfire planted would explode and kill everyone so that in the end both armies die and Cersei can claim to common folk that Dany was the slayer of the innocent and quickly gain a new army, but I think I like this ending far more. | ||
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palexhur
Colombia730 Posts
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Adreme
United States5574 Posts
On May 13 2019 12:36 palexhur wrote: When they surrended is like they bent the kneel to the new Queen, and she wasnt admired by the people of the North so she burns the Southerns, sorry this makes no sense with the development of the character, but you know they hint one hour ago in the show that she could go mad queen, it is just plain stupid, now just end this show in any way, it was fallen un quality pretty quickly after they don't have books to follow. You mean like how they swore before they would join her up north only to abandon her at the last moment. Even rational Dany would probably distrust her. Also her own ALLIES do not want her as queen. I get that they haven't put her penchant for madness in giant neon lettering that says "character is going crazy" but its been there this entire series and the fact that they paid off all that foreshadowing is damn good television. | ||
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On May 13 2019 12:27 Adreme wrote: She has been a pretty terrible queen for most of the show with everyone else having to clean up her mess. Also we only ever saw her fight against people and go after people who were so evil they "deserved" it, but we have seen glimpses of her madness all series long. We have seen that she has those traits for years now. That she has all of her fathers madness inside her is not something we are new to seeing. Her advisers were able to reason with her then, but she has always been self righteous, utterly convinced she is destined to save this world, and is quick to kill those who will not kneel to her power. When she had to be talked out of razing cities or slaughtering all her enemies, she had lost nothing in that fight. She was willing to slaughter them and their homes for fighting against her. Now she is fighting against people who have taken everything from her, and still convinced she is saving them, but yet for the first time the common people whom she is fighting for want nothing to do with her. She is not the one they love, she is not the one who is admired. She is used to being loved by the masses but now she has to look on as another gets that. So take that instability , with no one to stop her, and what else was going to happen but this. I would have been disappointed if it hadn't. I will be honest my initial prediction was that Cersei would bait her into burning the red keep by hanging Melisandre's head from it and then the wildfire planted would explode and kill everyone so that in the end both armies die and Cersei can claim to common folk that Dany was the slayer of the innocent and quickly gain a new army, but I think I like this ending far more. She hasn't had "all of her father's madness". She's had hints of that cold brutality, but part of her character depth was that she consistently chose a different path and wanted to be a just ruler. That's why she became so beloved in Essos. What you're describing makes total sense. It's what a great arc would look like and it would be quite satisfying. The problem is that you're inferring it from a whole lot of nothing. The show doesn't display this development in any way. It ham-fistedly smacks you across the face with it for like an episode and a half and just expects you to accept it. Dany doesn't "lose everything". She's lost 2 people and two dragons. She still has a host of loyal advisers, including Greyworm, Tyrion, Varys (if she hadn't gone off the deep end he'd be loyal), and the Onion Knight, not to mention a massive army that has unwavering loyalty to her and another dragon. She's closer to her goal than she has ever been (her sole goal that she's been willing to give up pretty much anything for up to this point), and her major "threat" to her rule (Jon) is completely in love with her and utterly devoted to her, repeatedly telling her that he doesn't want the throne (despite her half-assed reasoning to not trust him). It's simply terrible design for the show ending. It's poor writing and it 100% lies at the directors' and writers' feet (it was D&D's decision to shorten the series to end at this point; everyone else gave them basically a blank check to go however far they wanted to). This doesn't even touch on the fact that the episode's pacing and logic was terrible; the battle was won in less than 10 minutes with the Scorpions being built as a huge threat that were then casually dismissed by what amounted to a Deus Ex Machina. She won literally the entire battle with the dragon alone, and yet it was constantly built up as "we have an answer for the dragons" but then rapidly turned into Storm Trooper-level of aim. Beyond this, the Iron Fleet played literally zero part in the battle at all when it was supposed to be a major piece, there was no real battle or siege at all, and the episode spent entirely too long on the suspense and/or senseless destruction scenes. We absolutely did not need 5 different scenes of Arya fleeing through the city. After the 2nd or 3rd one they added nothing. Cersei, Jaime, and Euron's deaths were also horrifically unsatisfying and very poorly written when compared to all of the other possibilities (let's also remember how stupid it is for Jaime to go back in the first place, flying in the face of all of his character development). Let's also not forget the long-standing nonsensical issue of people just magically teleporting around a land mass that is supposed to take months to travel across, or the fact that Tyrion just waves away some guards and casually commits treason with nothing addressing 1) why he wasn't executed instantly in the morning and 2) how Davos got away with it. Also, remember that mindlessly slaughtering an entire city of a million people is completely against Greyworm's character and that I don't believe for a second that Missandei's death would turn him to slaughtering so many innocents. Finally, Greyworm's forces and the Northmen both committing an atrocious war crime (killing the Lannister forces that already surrendered) is completely against their character, not to mention the fact that the Northmen just ignore Jon as he's giving orders (also completely absurd). There are a whole host of inconsistencies and plot holes that I have yet to mention as well, but I think this gets my point across. This shit is comparable to the writing in Wings of Liberty when contrasting it with the writing of prior pieces in the series. The writers have decided what plot points every character is going to hit and they don't give a damn if it completely contradicts any and all character development before now. It's ham-fisted and quite lazy, and it's incredibly disappointing considering how great this show was for years. | ||
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FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Netherlands30548 Posts
Dragon fire so powerful that it blows away stone walls in a single swipe. No battle tension at all. No siege plans. What is the point of a battle scene if there is no tension. There was no resistance. No battle developments. Just endless scenes of murder. We get the point after 5 minutes. Why did this need to be an entire hour. Jon Snow, king of the north, has no proper guard detail, and has so little clout he cannot even control the men standing next to him. This is the leader of the realm Varys decides to die for. Jaime goes from years of character development to one dimensional sister lover. He also becomes immune to stabbing by a longsword. Arya forgot all her parcour skills that she used in Essos nor exhibits any of the faceless man super natural stuff that made me believe she could have killed the night king. | ||
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