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KwarK
United States42007 Posts
On June 13 2016 20:19 Yhamm wrote: shit episode sadly :/ any idea of what is this "old rumour" Qyburn is talking about to Cersei? The Mad King was going to burn down everything before Jaime stopped him. That suddenly became relevant again when it was included in Bran's visions so I'm thinking Cersei is looking into it. | ||
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karazax
United States3737 Posts
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ZasZ.
United States2911 Posts
On June 13 2016 23:59 karazax wrote: The whole reason Arya left Westeros is because she has no where to go and no one left alive as far as she knows, so going back is a rather random decision. It might make sense is she was trying to escape the Faceless Men, but if Jaqen just lets her go then not so much. Of course it makes sense, the whole driving force behind her character since Season 2 has been revenge on the people who destroyed her family. Remember her list? She has to go back to Westeros if she's going to knock more people off of it. | ||
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palexhur
Colombia730 Posts
On June 13 2016 19:49 Biff The Understudy wrote: Also what is this crap with "Oh she is wounded therefore she shouldn't be able to jump and how come her wound didn't get infected this and that..." Who the hell cares? It's a story, guys, it's not real life, and you don't need to look at a TV show looking as hard as possible for plot holes everywhere. . What I find amusing is that even people like me who likes the show find this disturbing, but your brain doesnt, it is impossible to accept all that horrible writing in an estelar TV Show, maybe for you it will be acceptable if suddendly Cersei is able to beat ten sword men at the same time with her fists, but some people just find that kind of things very shitty in a show of this caliber. | ||
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killerdog
Denmark6522 Posts
The Tyrion "joking around" scene was dumb too, like fourth episode where they've tried to have those three be entertaining. Turns out even peter dinklage can't make watching paint dry entertaining forever... At least both those plotlines seem resolved now though, so we'll have actual stuff happen in the danerys plotline, and Arya is going to go do stuff too. I have high hopes that both groups will be interesting from here on out, but holy shit that was some catastrophically bad television to round it off. I don't really mind when plots are a bit silly, or there are tiny inaccuracies or someone gets somewhere too fast. But some of the sequences are just completely terribly done and destroy any sense of immersion you had before. The Jamie/blackfish scenes felt pretty good personally, actual character development, interesting enough dialogue, nothing felt too forced or anything. Also nice to see Jamie finally deciding what his priorities are, so he'll maybe be assertive for once when he gets back to kings landing :p Also nice to have the hound back, I'd missed his character, and his scenes were short but sweet. Felt like we had exactly what we needed to position him for whatever's coming next. TLDR: Half the episode was shit (arya+tyrion) but at least it was shit in a way that points towards maybe not being shit anymore in the future. Other half (jamie/hound) was entertaining and pretty good. Did anyone else notice the Hound switching into a thick scottish accent for a line or two when they were discussing around the campfire towards the end? Also did sexy jesus actually smile!?!?!! | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
Also; I don’t think Sexy Jesus is going to go after her. Remember the speech about the god wanting a name. I think Arya declaring her name and who she wants to be is enough for him to leave her alone. We don’t know a lot of about the faceless god thing, but I think someone deciding who they is something that god supports. Still betting on sexy Jesus giving her a mask as a parting gift. | ||
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killerdog
Denmark6522 Posts
On June 14 2016 00:20 Plansix wrote: Of course there were practical reasons for Arya to not go home, along with her own reasons to not try to find her sister or other allies, or really anyone. But there is also the aspect of her character that part of her wanted to be anyone else but Arya Stark. Part of the reason she left was because she wanted to become a ninja assassin and was relatively immature. Over the course of her "training" + watching the play she had a magical thing called maturing slightly, realised being a moral-less assassin wasn't for her, and realised that there are much worse things one can be than "Arya Stark." Basically just a much more violent version of standard: teenager angst + circumstance leading to rejecting who they are, only to come to terms with and embracing it after facing the reality of the world. On June 14 2016 00:20 Plansix wrote: Also; I don’t think Sexy Jesus is going to go after her. Did you not see Sexy Jesus's sexy smirk at the end? He's a good guy now | ||
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karazax
United States3737 Posts
On June 14 2016 00:08 ZasZ. wrote: Of course it makes sense, the whole driving force behind her character since Season 2 has been revenge on the people who destroyed her family. Remember her list? She has to go back to Westeros if she's going to knock more people off of it. So why leave Westeros in the first place? She had virtually zero character growth, and she gained about the same increase in fighting skills as Pod has with Brienne or Arya was getting with the Hound. So why go back now? It's not like she is now a trained assassin. When's the last time she recited her list for that to suddenly be her focus again now? Then Jaqen letting her go when he was the one who ordered her death makes no sense. | ||
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Redox
Germany24794 Posts
On June 14 2016 00:12 palexhur wrote: What I find amusing is that even people like me who likes the show find this disturbing, but your brain doesnt, it is impossible to accept all that horrible writing in an estelar TV Show, maybe for you it will be acceptable if suddendly Cersei is able to beat ten sword men at the same time with her fists, but some people just find that kind of things very shitty in a show of this caliber. I thought the writing of this epsiode was horrible but surely not because Arya was able to move around with her wound lol. That indeed seems like nitpicking and calling it the worst thing in this episode is straight up nonsense. Wounded people do incredible stuff in movies all the time, no matter if high or low budget. And it was not even her leg that was wounded but her belly, so why should she not be able to run and jump with adrenaline pumping as her death is imminent. Also she got wounded during her jump much more realistically than is usual in movies. And lastly Arya is supposed to be super tough now which is exactly what these scenes were supposed to show. | ||
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killerdog
Denmark6522 Posts
On June 14 2016 00:27 karazax wrote: So why leave Westeros in the first place? She had virtually zero character growth, and she gained about the same increase in fighting skills as Pod has with Brienne or Arya was getting with the Hound. So why go back now? It's not like she is now a trained assassin. When's the last time she recited her list for that to suddenly be her focus again now? Then Jaqen letting her go when he was the one who ordered her death makes no sense. She left Westeros in part to become an assassin, and in part to escape all the shit that was happening to her in westeros. She even stashed her stuff before going in so she was clearly always intending to not fully let "Arya" go. Then she has the play remind her of all the shit back in westeros, combined with realising that the "assassins" aren't going to help her become a warrior for justice to avenge her family, but rather they'd just turn her into a moral-less sellsword who kills for the highest bidder. And then the Waif tries to kill her. She's had another long while to mature a bit more and come to terms with what happened in westeros, plus she's now super against becoming like the waif, so obviously she now wants to just fuck all this shit and go back to westeros. She's not a super perfect assassin now, but she's definitely trained a ton, and is far more dangerous than she was when she arrived. As for why Jaqen did what he did, we don't know anything about his motives. You're assuming he even liked the waif, maybe he was hoping she would kill the waif. Maybe the entire point of all these "tests" wasn't to break her, but rather to make her properly embrace who she was and fully steel her resolve. We really don't know much about the faceless men. On June 14 2016 00:32 Redox wrote: I thought the writing of this epsiode was horrible but surely not because Arya was able to move around with her wound lol. That indeed seems like nitpicking and calling it the worst thing in this episode is straight up nonsense. Wounded people do incredible stuff in movies all the time, no matter if high or low budget. And it was not even her leg that was wounded but her belly, so why should she not be able to run and jump with adrenaline pumping as her death is imminent. Also she got wounded during her jump much more realistically than is usual in movies. And lastly Arya is supposed to be super tough now which is exactly what these scenes were supposed to show. It was silly to have her limp around the house, then seconds later be jumping 2 storeys, rolling around and sprinting fine, then have her trip and suddenly be a cripple again, but that's really not my main complaint about that scene. The waif was just ridiculous, the super robotic head turns, the artifical looking running, the unnatural straight ahead gaze. She didn't even look human, it literally looked like something out of terminator... Unless they were clumsily going for some take on "she gave up her humanity in the process of trying to become a faceless" style, and Arya defeated that approach by instead embracing her own, then it was just terrible TV in my opinion. And if that was the comparison they were trying to make, they could have done it much much better and more naturally... | ||
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dutchfriese
2554 Posts
On June 13 2016 20:32 KadaverBB wrote: Might be time to stop reading this thread, it is just getting more and more negative after each episode. Guess so? I see people making perfectly valid criticisms of sloppy writing calling out unnecessary and nonsensical fluff. Time padding is usually a good sign that the writers are blanking. | ||
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Redox
Germany24794 Posts
On June 14 2016 00:35 killerdog wrote: She left Westeros in part to become an assassin, and in part to escape all the shit that was happening to her in westeros. She even stashed her stuff before going in so she was clearly always intending to not fully let "Arya" go. Then she has the play remind her of all the shit back in westeros, combined with realising that the "assassins" aren't going to help her become a warrior for justice to avenge her family, but rather they'd just turn her into a moral-less sellsword who kills for the highest bidder. And then the Waif tries to kill her. She's had another long while to mature a bit more and come to terms with what happened in westeros, plus she's now super against becoming like the waif, so obviously she now wants to just fuck all this shit and go back to westeros. She's not a super perfect assassin now, but she's definitely trained a ton, and is far more dangerous than she was when she arrived. As for why Jaqen did what he did, we don't know anything about his motives. You're assuming he even liked the waif, maybe he was hoping she would kill the waif. Maybe the entire point of all these "tests" wasn't to break her, but rather to make her properly embrace who she was and fully steel her resolve. We really don't know much about the faceless men. Yeah as we can not see what is going on in the characters head the writers literally spelled it out for us by showing us a stage play and Arya reacting to it (with the actress badly overacting btw). They could not have made it any more clear. And yet people dont get it. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
When the Waif goes to kill Arya, did he order it or did she ask? I can’t remember, but I think she asks and then he assents to the request. I wonder if he ever would have asked the waif to kill Arya had the waif not requested to. | ||
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Redox
Germany24794 Posts
On June 14 2016 00:37 dutchfriese wrote: Guess so? I see people making perfectly valid criticisms of sloppy writing calling out unnecessary and nonsensical fluff. Time padding is usually a good sign that the writers are blanking. I read just this page and the last and most of the crticism was straight up laughable. I came here being mad about the episode I just watched but now find myself defending it simply because the criticism here is so bad. | ||
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killerdog
Denmark6522 Posts
On June 14 2016 00:37 dutchfriese wrote: Guess so? I see people making perfectly valid criticisms of sloppy writing calling out unnecessary and nonsensical fluff. Time padding is usually a good sign that the writers are blanking. I think there's a difference between people complaining about poor television, stuff like really badly Choreo'd fights or badly written/acted scenes, and the people just bitching about plot points because they haven't bothered to even consider arguments in favour of it happening. I'm guilty of complaining about a few cases where I've felt that the standard of filming has just dropped dramatically compared to the rest of the show, but I find it incredibly tilting when people start going "THIS WAS OUT OF CHARACTER" or something despite the show super clearly explaining every step of that characters motivation. Or randomly calling episodes "pure filler" then there were like 30 pivotal plot/character developments in it. Personally I still think the majority of the show is pretty good and hype though, it's just the odd bad scene really letting the momentum down, which makes them feel all the more jarring/bad in comparison too  Everything's in place for some really epic shit to go down in the next two episodes now. Although I have a niggling feeling the next episode will start AFTER Mereen has been saved by Danerys/the Dothraki, so we'll miss out on a really epic battle. Hopefully I'm wrong though~ | ||
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Sent.
Poland9108 Posts
On June 14 2016 00:39 Plansix wrote: You have to ask yourself why he sent Arya to see the play about her family and kill the lead actress. Was it a contract or was it a test to see who Arya wanted to be? Maybe he wanted Arya Stark to be a follower of the faceless god. Or he didn’t care either way? When the Waif goes to kill Arya, did he order it or did she ask? I can’t remember, but I think she asks and then he assents to the request. I wonder if he ever would have asked the waif to kill Arya had the waif not requested to. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On June 14 2016 00:42 Redox wrote: I read just this page and the last and most of the crticism was straight up laughable. I came here being mad about the episode I just watched but now find myself defending it simply because the criticism here is so bad. The fact we keep seeing the same reductive comments passing themselves as criticism is irritating. But the surface level “writing is bad” seems to be all folks can muster. | ||
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palexhur
Colombia730 Posts
On June 14 2016 00:39 Redox wrote: Yeah as we can not see what is going on in the characters head the writers literally spelled it out for us by showing us a stage play and Arya reacting to it (with the actress badly overacting btw). They could not have made it any more clear. And yet people dont get it. My pov is that for me only 5 minutes were interesting: Hound scene was watchable without dissapoinment, so YES, for me was the worst episode in all the GoT Show if for you it is not, good for you, hf. | ||
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Biff The Understudy
France7811 Posts
On June 14 2016 00:42 Redox wrote: I read just this page and the last and most of the crticism was straight up laughable. I came here being mad about the episode I just watched but now find myself defending it simply because the criticism here is so bad. That's still better than me: I liked the episode and came here to discuss with fellow nerds what could happen next and find a wall of negativity and "laughably bad writing" critics who say that everything is garbage because of some medical stuff in Arya storyline. Arya was mostly cured, and could have spent weeks in remissions for as much as we know, and after falling, she is bleeding a bit again. And then kills the Waif and that's it. Apparently that's horrible and that's all there is to talk about. Don't know why. When you watch a fantasy story you have to be a bit less crazy critical about plot holes. I'm expecting any day someone saying the writing is so crap because the wings of the dragons are too small for them to fly. I think we could make a GOT hatred (or GOT : how much better it was before) thread, and discuss about the actual show with people who still like it. In the last 100 pages, for every positive comment there has been five posts pouring negativity. That's just annoying. | ||
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bardtown
England2313 Posts
Also, my guess for next episode: wildlings lose to Ramsay, but Petyr shows up and routs the Boltons, then massacres Jon, Sansa and the remaining wildlings. | ||
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