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On March 19 2012 04:46 zalz wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2012 04:30 Hidden_MotiveS wrote:On March 19 2012 03:41 zalz wrote:On March 19 2012 02:28 Hidden_MotiveS wrote:Just watched the leak premier. I'm excited. I wonder what parallel... + Show Spoiler +The bender antibenders conflict has to our present day society though. Is it the fight between the rich and the poor? Does it reflect things like the occupy movement? Curious. The bridge in the episode looks like the Golden Gate Bridge. Aang's statue is like the statue of liberty.
I feel like this series will be more relatable than the last, as genocide isn't something the West cares about.
I also like the new name of the Fire nation. It reminds me of the US, if the US used to be a nation bent on military world domination :D
Old fire nation reminds me the most of Nazi Germany.
An extremely Imperialist island nation reminded you of Nazi Germany and the USA? Try scratching that brain of yours. Can you think of one imperialist, industrialized, asian island nation? If the US and Nazi Germany are what comes to mind, you might want to reconsider how clever you are. Avatar wasn't about some poorly disguised political message. They aren't going to go try and solve the 1%/99% issue. They are going to tell a story which appeals to kids and adults at the same time, hoping to repeat the succes that was Avatar. Avatar 1 was a very simple story. Don't expect deep political commentary. They are going to end up with a normal good v evil story. Kids don't care much for shades of gray. Japan? Anyways you seem very condescending. I think kids should get an interest for the shades of grey. Perhaps you underestimate some of them. With comments like: Show nested quote +I feel like this series will be more relatable than the last, as genocide isn't something the West cares about. I thought you had the big boy pants on. You might think that kids should get an interest for shades of grey. Doesn't mean that they do. Overtly complex naratives are the bane of any children show. They have trouble figuring out 3x7. They aren't exactly ready for questions on morality.
You can make great Kid stuff with adult messages, for example, Doctor Seuss.
![[image loading]](http://theadventurous500.com/wp-content/uploads/429400_3198057278655_1482713118_3023489_1894604934_n.jpeg)
But just watched the leaked episode, looks cool. Nice action for kids and perhaps some simplified class warfare stuff for older kids.
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Am I the only one not terribly excited by the first episode?
+ Show Spoiler +I mean, it was alright-ish and you can't expect too much from the very first episode, but I neither feel that the Steampunk universe will be that great of a development, nor did I feel that the character of Korra was that interesting or terribly well presented. The humor was on the level of the original Avatar but that's about all I can say. I thought it was a rather lackluster introduction.
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YEEESSSSSSS OMG
EVERYONE JUST WATCH THE LAST AIRBENDER.
it may seem kiddy, but trust me, you will like it.
first time watching, i hated Saka's jokes. Second time watching, couldnt stop laughing.
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On March 19 2012 05:15 Shockk wrote:Am I the only one not terribly excited by the first episode? + Show Spoiler +I mean, it was alright-ish and you can't expect too much from the very first episode, but I neither feel that the Steampunk universe will be that great of a development, nor did I feel that the character of Korra was that interesting or terribly well presented. The humor was on the level of the original Avatar but that's about all I can say. I thought it was a rather lackluster introduction.
The Steampunk isn't supposed to be "Ooh, so fancy, it's steampunk". It's just acknowledging that 70 years is actually a long ass time when it comes to technology.
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Just watched the first episode. Pumpeddddddddddd. I don't think the storyline can possibly be better than the last airbender, but I think it be just as good. Can't wait until the next one!
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damn im excited
loved ATLA and im hoping this can be as good.
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On March 19 2012 07:57 WolfintheSheep wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2012 05:15 Shockk wrote:Am I the only one not terribly excited by the first episode? + Show Spoiler +I mean, it was alright-ish and you can't expect too much from the very first episode, but I neither feel that the Steampunk universe will be that great of a development, nor did I feel that the character of Korra was that interesting or terribly well presented. The humor was on the level of the original Avatar but that's about all I can say. I thought it was a rather lackluster introduction. The Steampunk isn't supposed to be "Ooh, so fancy, it's steampunk". It's just acknowledging that 70 years is actually a long ass time when it comes to technology.
Yea, the setting of the show isn't supposed to be in the future like science-fiction. From the trailers it can be noticed that it still is set before our present day time. I'll probably put it in roughly around the 90's before pc's and the internet really started to boom. What I really liked actually why they switched the setting is because it resembles the vast technological advancements that we have undergone in the past 70 years ourselves. In the original series we saw just the beginning of industrialization for the avatar world. What I find interesting is that it parallels our times in how globalized our world has become like Republic city. What also strikes me is the relationship between the present and the past after such changes. + Show Spoiler +Also with the character of Korra I think you should just wait. For me the beauty of the original series was the character development for the main characters. The whole story was not just based on Aang so I'm also hoping for development on other characters besides Korra because with the original there is a multitude of characters who just grow on you and that you get to know. That's one of the things I actually hope the new series still will continue on. I was rewatching some of my favorite episodes and just was surprised at at all the small details I missed when I first saw it and that's what I really enjoy about the show. It just allows you to be immersed in the Avatar world and the characters.
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On March 19 2012 04:44 chenchen wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2012 08:19 Tabbris wrote:On March 18 2012 08:05 reincremate wrote:
The original series was amazing; probably the best kid's show ever made (and substantially better than any shounen anime). The only complaint I have with the new series that I can infer from the trailer is that some of the voice acting seems kind of weak (voice acting in the original was mostly good). Im sorry but your giving avatar way too much credit. The writing mediocre. And the series started off pretty slow and uninteresting. It was a good show. Not great No offense, but you haven't been exposed to much "shounen" anime if you seriously believe that Avatar is "substantially" better than *any of them.
What shounen anime is better? The Big 3 (Naruto, Bleach, One Piece) + Fairy Tale are all pretty lame.
edit: Haruhi is probably an obvious answer, although I don't think it's better than Avatar. My point is that most kid's shows, anime or not, are not that entertaining for adults and Avatar was one of the few that were.
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Ya, Korra's pretty hot I reckon.
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On March 19 2012 14:13 reincremate wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2012 04:44 chenchen wrote:On March 18 2012 08:19 Tabbris wrote:On March 18 2012 08:05 reincremate wrote:
The original series was amazing; probably the best kid's show ever made (and substantially better than any shounen anime). The only complaint I have with the new series that I can infer from the trailer is that some of the voice acting seems kind of weak (voice acting in the original was mostly good). Im sorry but your giving avatar way too much credit. The writing mediocre. And the series started off pretty slow and uninteresting. It was a good show. Not great No offense, but you haven't been exposed to much "shounen" anime if you seriously believe that Avatar is "substantially" better than *any of them. What shounen anime is better? The Big 3 (Naruto, Bleach, One Piece) + Fairy Tale are all pretty lame. edit: Haruhi is probably an obvious answer, although I don't think it's better than Avatar. My point is that most kid's shows, anime or not, are not that entertaining for adults and Avatar was one of the few that were.
I'm not sure what you would consider "shounen", since it's usually applied to manga demography and anime based on manga are typically subpar but: TTGL? FLCL? Fullmetal Alchemist? Steins;Gate? Neon Genesis Evangelion? Legend of the Galactic Heroes? Macross? Cowboy Bebop?
All of these shows, at least from my perspective, have "young males" as the target audience and yet they have wider appeal as good shows overall.
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On March 19 2012 14:13 reincremate wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2012 04:44 chenchen wrote:On March 18 2012 08:19 Tabbris wrote:On March 18 2012 08:05 reincremate wrote:
The original series was amazing; probably the best kid's show ever made (and substantially better than any shounen anime). The only complaint I have with the new series that I can infer from the trailer is that some of the voice acting seems kind of weak (voice acting in the original was mostly good). Im sorry but your giving avatar way too much credit. The writing mediocre. And the series started off pretty slow and uninteresting. It was a good show. Not great No offense, but you haven't been exposed to much "shounen" anime if you seriously believe that Avatar is "substantially" better than *any of them. What shounen anime is better? The Big 3 (Naruto, Bleach, One Piece) + Fairy Tale are all pretty lame. edit: Haruhi is probably an obvious answer, although I don't think it's better than Avatar. My point is that most kid's shows, anime or not, are not that entertaining for adults and Avatar was one of the few that were.
Out of the big three I can say One peice is probably better than avatar in almost every way except Characterization. Naruto is pretty similar to avatar cept ill give a slight edge to naruto since it deals with more mature topics over avatar.
Now ill just make a general list of shounen I feel are just far better.
Baccano!
Death Note
Full Metal Alchemist
Evangelion
Cowboy bebop
ect
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I can't wait  , I loved avatar very much. And this should be great  .
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On March 20 2012 02:16 Tabbris wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2012 14:13 reincremate wrote:On March 19 2012 04:44 chenchen wrote:On March 18 2012 08:19 Tabbris wrote:On March 18 2012 08:05 reincremate wrote:
The original series was amazing; probably the best kid's show ever made (and substantially better than any shounen anime). The only complaint I have with the new series that I can infer from the trailer is that some of the voice acting seems kind of weak (voice acting in the original was mostly good). Im sorry but your giving avatar way too much credit. The writing mediocre. And the series started off pretty slow and uninteresting. It was a good show. Not great No offense, but you haven't been exposed to much "shounen" anime if you seriously believe that Avatar is "substantially" better than *any of them. What shounen anime is better? The Big 3 (Naruto, Bleach, One Piece) + Fairy Tale are all pretty lame. edit: Haruhi is probably an obvious answer, although I don't think it's better than Avatar. My point is that most kid's shows, anime or not, are not that entertaining for adults and Avatar was one of the few that were. Out of the big three I can say One peice is probably better than avatar in almost every way except Characterization. Naruto is pretty similar to avatar cept ill give a slight edge to naruto since it deals with more mature topics over avatar. Now ill just make a general list of shounen I feel are just far better. Baccano! Death Note Full Metal Alchemist Evangelion Cowboy bebop ect
Is death note actually considered a Shounen? Opinions should not be considered fact. I've seen most of those, and I did enjoy Avatar more. You might not think so. I like Avatar, and to be honest it has a different feel from it then most japanese Shounen (the original series). I'd honestly say it's the best children's cartoon to come out in the last 10 years. In terms of western culture it's a fantastic success. I love Clannad and Kanon the most out of any show, but I wouldn't think to compare them to Avatar because they are much different shows with different audiences in mind.
I watched Korra last night, and though it was good. It definitely think it has much more in common with Shounen, and has a more adult feel than the first one. It didn't grab me as much as the first series, but it's still very early. We'll see what the future brings. There is definitely potential there for some interesting story lines.
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Norway1244 Posts
On March 20 2012 02:26 Satire wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2012 02:16 Tabbris wrote:On March 19 2012 14:13 reincremate wrote:On March 19 2012 04:44 chenchen wrote:On March 18 2012 08:19 Tabbris wrote:On March 18 2012 08:05 reincremate wrote:
The original series was amazing; probably the best kid's show ever made (and substantially better than any shounen anime). The only complaint I have with the new series that I can infer from the trailer is that some of the voice acting seems kind of weak (voice acting in the original was mostly good). Im sorry but your giving avatar way too much credit. The writing mediocre. And the series started off pretty slow and uninteresting. It was a good show. Not great No offense, but you haven't been exposed to much "shounen" anime if you seriously believe that Avatar is "substantially" better than *any of them. What shounen anime is better? The Big 3 (Naruto, Bleach, One Piece) + Fairy Tale are all pretty lame. edit: Haruhi is probably an obvious answer, although I don't think it's better than Avatar. My point is that most kid's shows, anime or not, are not that entertaining for adults and Avatar was one of the few that were. Out of the big three I can say One peice is probably better than avatar in almost every way except Characterization. Naruto is pretty similar to avatar cept ill give a slight edge to naruto since it deals with more mature topics over avatar. Now ill just make a general list of shounen I feel are just far better. Baccano! Death Note Full Metal Alchemist Evangelion Cowboy bebop ect Is death note actually considered a Shounen? Opinions should not be considered fact. I've seen most of those, and I did enjoy Avatar more. You might not think so. I like Avatar, and to be honest it has a different feel from it then most japanese Shounen (the original series). I'd honestly say it's the best children's cartoon to come out in the last 10 years. In terms of western culture it's a fantastic success. I love Clannad and Kanon the most out of any show, but I wouldn't think to compare them to Avatar because they are much different shows with different audiences in mind. I watched Korra last night, and though it was good. It definitely think it has much more in common with Shounen, and has a more adult feel than the first one. It didn't grab me as much as the first series, but it's still very early. We'll see what the future brings. There is definitely potential there for some interesting story lines.
A common misconception about shounen is that it's a genre or refers to adventure/battle mangas such as the big 3. Shounen is in fact a demographic, so a shounen manga is aimed towards young boys (same with shoujo or seinen) and yes Death Note is shounen: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_Note.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shōnen_manga
To add to the discussion: I too feel that the japanese comparables to Avatar are better, they deal with mature themes in a more respectable way and they know when to lay off the comic relief (an issue I had with TLA was the overuse of comic relief, especially during/after more serious scenes).
Honestly I believe Avatar suffers from severe overhype because it's been a while since western animation made a notable cartoon series that wasn't comedy.
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On March 20 2012 02:26 Satire wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2012 02:16 Tabbris wrote:On March 19 2012 14:13 reincremate wrote:On March 19 2012 04:44 chenchen wrote:On March 18 2012 08:19 Tabbris wrote:On March 18 2012 08:05 reincremate wrote:
The original series was amazing; probably the best kid's show ever made (and substantially better than any shounen anime). The only complaint I have with the new series that I can infer from the trailer is that some of the voice acting seems kind of weak (voice acting in the original was mostly good). Im sorry but your giving avatar way too much credit. The writing mediocre. And the series started off pretty slow and uninteresting. It was a good show. Not great No offense, but you haven't been exposed to much "shounen" anime if you seriously believe that Avatar is "substantially" better than *any of them. What shounen anime is better? The Big 3 (Naruto, Bleach, One Piece) + Fairy Tale are all pretty lame. edit: Haruhi is probably an obvious answer, although I don't think it's better than Avatar. My point is that most kid's shows, anime or not, are not that entertaining for adults and Avatar was one of the few that were. Out of the big three I can say One peice is probably better than avatar in almost every way except Characterization. Naruto is pretty similar to avatar cept ill give a slight edge to naruto since it deals with more mature topics over avatar. Now ill just make a general list of shounen I feel are just far better. Baccano! Death Note Full Metal Alchemist Evangelion Cowboy bebop ect Is death note actually considered a Shounen? Opinions should not be considered fact. I've seen most of those, and I did enjoy Avatar more. You might not think so. I like Avatar, and to be honest it has a different feel from it then most japanese Shounen (the original series). I'd honestly say it's the best children's cartoon to come out in the last 10 years. In terms of western culture it's a fantastic success. I love Clannad and Kanon the most out of any show, but I wouldn't think to compare them to Avatar because they are much different shows with different audiences in mind. I watched Korra last night, and though it was good. It definitely think it has much more in common with Shounen, and has a more adult feel than the first one. It didn't grab me as much as the first series, but it's still very early. We'll see what the future brings. There is definitely potential there for some interesting story lines.
Yes, Death note is Shounen. It tackles mature themes, but so does the number one shounen example NARUTO (genocide, war zones, cold war, experiments on humans, death in general). The best indicator that DN is Shounen is the fact, that the manga was released in the biggest shounen magazine Weekly Shounen Jump, which features popular shounen like One Piece or the before mentioned Naruto.
AVATAR is in my opinion the best cartoon I ever watched, but it doesn´t reach my all time favourite Shounen Full Metall Alchemist (both the original and Brotherhood), which also has IMO the best written Shounen Manga as source material.
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On March 19 2012 05:15 Shockk wrote:Am I the only one not terribly excited by the first episode? + Show Spoiler +I mean, it was alright-ish and you can't expect too much from the very first episode, but I neither feel that the Steampunk universe will be that great of a development, nor did I feel that the character of Korra was that interesting or terribly well presented. The humor was on the level of the original Avatar but that's about all I can say. I thought it was a rather lackluster introduction.
Go back and watch the first episode of The Last Airbender.
+ Show Spoiler +Aang was not that great at first either, sort of a over-hyper obnoxious kid that didn't look like he'd have much interesting to say or do. Looking back, that was the perfect way to start the series; seemed childish and fun, ended epic as hell. I expect that character development will play a large role here too, can't give too much away in the first episode 
Edit: Avatar>Naruto. Naruto was just dumb.
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On March 20 2012 02:44 Zeroxk wrote:A common misconception about shounen is that it's a genre or refers to adventure/battle mangas such as the big 3. Shounen is in fact a demographic, so a shounen manga is aimed towards young boys (same with shoujo or seinen) and yes Death Note is shounen: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_Note. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shōnen_mangaTo add to the discussion: I too feel that the japanese comparables to Avatar are better, they deal with mature themes in a more respectable way and they know when to lay off the comic relief (an issue I had with TLA was the overuse of comic relief, especially during/after more serious scenes). Honestly I believe Avatar suffers from severe overhype because it's been a while since western animation made a notable cartoon series that wasn't comedy.
Hummm, you are quite right about Shounen. I wasn't 100% sure, hence why I asked - thanks for clarifying! Guess I was wrong. Avatar is a great show, so I'm not sure it's "overhyped". I suppose any show has very load fan boys that kind of ruin. I respect it for what it is. It's a fun adventure with excellent character development, and like you say, Western Culture produces some horrific shows relative to its eastern counter-parts so Avatar stands out like a gem.
Dunno, it's definitely on my top 10. I've seen many of the shows people listed, so it's all subjective of course. Just as it's silly to call a show "stupid" or "dumb" because you didn't like it.
On Topic: Where do you think they will go with Korra?
So far they've introduced Korra, Toph's Daughter (don't know her name), Aang's Son (...), Aang's Son's family, and the villian of the story. They've also introduced some political themes and presented the setting of the story. From here, you can kind of see where it's all going. To be honest though, I haven't really connected with any of the characters yet. I am hoping they present some more interesting characters because at this point, because it's not enough that the characters so far are related to characters that I liked previously. Then again, lots of time for development.
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On March 20 2012 02:26 Satire wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2012 02:16 Tabbris wrote:On March 19 2012 14:13 reincremate wrote:On March 19 2012 04:44 chenchen wrote:On March 18 2012 08:19 Tabbris wrote:On March 18 2012 08:05 reincremate wrote:
The original series was amazing; probably the best kid's show ever made (and substantially better than any shounen anime). The only complaint I have with the new series that I can infer from the trailer is that some of the voice acting seems kind of weak (voice acting in the original was mostly good). Im sorry but your giving avatar way too much credit. The writing mediocre. And the series started off pretty slow and uninteresting. It was a good show. Not great No offense, but you haven't been exposed to much "shounen" anime if you seriously believe that Avatar is "substantially" better than *any of them. What shounen anime is better? The Big 3 (Naruto, Bleach, One Piece) + Fairy Tale are all pretty lame. edit: Haruhi is probably an obvious answer, although I don't think it's better than Avatar. My point is that most kid's shows, anime or not, are not that entertaining for adults and Avatar was one of the few that were. Out of the big three I can say One peice is probably better than avatar in almost every way except Characterization. Naruto is pretty similar to avatar cept ill give a slight edge to naruto since it deals with more mature topics over avatar. Now ill just make a general list of shounen I feel are just far better. Baccano! Death Note Full Metal Alchemist Evangelion Cowboy bebop ect Is death note actually considered a Shounen? Opinions should not be considered fact. I've seen most of those, and I did enjoy Avatar more. You might not think so. I like Avatar, and to be honest it has a different feel from it then most japanese Shounen (the original series). I'd honestly say it's the best children's cartoon to come out in the last 10 years. In terms of western culture it's a fantastic success. I love Clannad and Kanon the most out of any show, but I wouldn't think to compare them to Avatar because they are much different shows with different audiences in mind. I watched Korra last night, and though it was good. It definitely think it has much more in common with Shounen, and has a more adult feel than the first one. It didn't grab me as much as the first series, but it's still very early. We'll see what the future brings. There is definitely potential there for some interesting story lines.
Well first off I never stated that my opinion was fact. "Now ill just make a general list of shounen I feel are just far better"
Second yes I agree It is probably one the best western children s cartoon that came out in along time. Others in my opinion include Batman the animated series and uhhhh..uhhh idk. Anyways I just want to reiterate I love Avatar and its a great show
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On March 20 2012 02:44 Zeroxk wrote:
To add to the discussion: I too feel that the japanese comparables to Avatar are better, they deal with mature themes in a more respectable way and they know when to lay off the comic relief (an issue I had with TLA was the overuse of comic relief, especially during/after more serious scenes).
Honestly I believe Avatar suffers from severe overhype because it's been a while since western animation made a notable cartoon series that wasn't comedy.
I've always felt that very few Japanese animes handle mature themes well. They pretend to tackle them, and then go and obscure the really hard choices and morals behind cheap plot twists that make a villain a unforgivable monster, or introduce some sympathetic ploy that allows a popular character to be "redeemed".
Worse yet, they'll try to be "edgy" by introducing some horrible tragic event out of the blue, just to appear more serious.
Avatar is a complete package series, to be honest. If all you want is a consistent story and cool characters, you can look elsewhere for better stuff. However, Avatar does something special by creating an entire world that is well developed and well planned - the entire world itself is clearly shaped, top to bottom, to accommodate benders. You have completely stylized animations and designs, notably different cultures, and a whole lot of sheer detail to take in.
Consider a world like Naruto, for existence, that outright ignores 1/10 people being able to lift mountains, a single person being able to do an entire factory lines worth of work, etc., and it all aspects of society are basically "real life with ninjas".
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There's the episode leaked and it's actually not bad. Animation is about the same/ more fluid.
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EPT
