SPOILER WARNING If you only watch the show, this thread will spoil you of future events in HBO's Game of Thrones. Thread contains discussion of all books of the series A Song of Ice and Fire Click Here for the spoiler-free thread.
regarding the 16 episode season thing, I'd like to add that for non readers, this world is big enough that adding more will def result in the viewers totally losing the plot as someone else mentioned. There's just so much going on that without the familiarity we have with the characters, it's just so hard to remember whose who given the minimal screen time non-core (even Ramsay..) characters get.
this kind of goes hand in hand with my comments about not being too invested as a viewer with cersei's incoming doom. I feel like, even without ANY more exhibition, just more screen time with cersei would make this so much more impactful. she just needed to be on screen more so that I'm more invested with her. but we can't really afford it given how big the realm is. it's a super hard dance between getting everything in that you can and not adding in so much that you don't even remember who Ramsay or shireen are.
On May 28 2015 11:32 Plexa wrote: So, what's the probability of Stannis returning to the wall? The show seems to be suggesting that Stannis needs to choose between (a) marching and losing (the "Stannis" approach), (b) sacrificing Shireen and winning (the "Melissandre" appraoch) and (c) returning to the wall and trying again after winter (the "Davos" approach).
At the same time, the preview material seen seems to suggest either (a) or (b) is going to be the outcome. In particular, (a) with Stannis losing again and retreating to the wall putting Mel in the right place to save Jon and leaving Shireen alive to make that happen. It could also serve as the point where Mel gives up on Stannis as Azor Ahai and coverts to team Jon.
At the end of ADWD Hosteen Frey enters the great hall of Winterfell with the body of little Walder. A fight breaks out between the Freys and House Manderly because Big Walder accuses the men from White Harbor (Manderlys men). Boltons and Freys have the alliance with the Lannisters after the Red Wedding and are named wardens of the north. But they can't rule the north without a Stark - which is why "Arya Stark" is married to Ramsey. However, "Arya" and Theon escape with the help of the washerwomen and Mance + Show Spoiler [TWOW spoilers] +
and are brought to Stannis where Theon is reunited with Asha Greyjoy and "Arya" is sent with a woman to the wall to be reunited with Jon Snow (maybe to persuade him to become lord of winterfell, however he's a Direwolf now)
so now Roose is without a Stark. Add to this that Walda Frey is pregnant and the child will likely inherit the Dreadfort instead of Ramsey (which is probably why Ramsey murdered Little Walder. Bolton/Frey relations aren't the best either)
After the fight between Freys/Manderlys Roose Bolton orders everyone out into the waist-high snow to make the 3 day long ride to Stannis camp. Boltons are left in Winterfell with no Stark, Frey's will be massacred by Stannis + Manderly + Other northren families (North remembers the red wedding). Boltons will camp Winterfell with no alliances and will be sieged without hurry to secure it for Jon Stark / Goth Sansa / Skagos Rickon Stark or let in via secret entrances (same one used by the Hooded Man that recognized Theon) and take it that way. Theon growing up in Winterfell should know the ins and outs of the castle and can maybe bargain his knowledge for his life
Holy crap is that really going to happen or are you speculating? I hope you're right.
Everything through the first sentence of the second paragraph isn't speculation. (Well, maybe saying Ramsay killed Little Walder is.) That is where things are at the end of Dance + an Asha preview snip from Winds.
Things are not necessarily so sure for Stannis though. Both sides have a betrayal coming. Manderly is of course actually working for Stannis, but that might be counterbalanced by the Karstarks. Alys is the rightful Lady of Karhold, but was chased out and now isn't in control. Instead her uncle is, and he has a deal with the Boltons.
...and none of this is capable of relating to show events at all because it is so very different. Two thirds of the relevant actors do not even exist, and even fewer of the plot threads do. The locale is the same I suppose? Martin's chessboard was translated into a game of checkers by DnD.
On May 28 2015 11:32 Plexa wrote: So, what's the probability of Stannis returning to the wall? The show seems to be suggesting that Stannis needs to choose between (a) marching and losing (the "Stannis" approach), (b) sacrificing Shireen and winning (the "Melissandre" appraoch) and (c) returning to the wall and trying again after winter (the "Davos" approach).
At the same time, the preview material seen seems to suggest either (a) or (b) is going to be the outcome. In particular, (a) with Stannis losing again and retreating to the wall putting Mel in the right place to save Jon and leaving Shireen alive to make that happen. It could also serve as the point where Mel gives up on Stannis as Azor Ahai and coverts to team Jon.
At the end of ADWD Hosteen Frey enters the great hall of Winterfell with the body of little Walder. A fight breaks out between the Freys and House Manderly because Big Walder accuses the men from White Harbor (Manderlys men). Boltons and Freys have the alliance with the Lannisters after the Red Wedding and are named wardens of the north. But they can't rule the north without a Stark - which is why "Arya Stark" is married to Ramsey. However, "Arya" and Theon escape with the help of the washerwomen and Mance + Show Spoiler [TWOW spoilers] +
and are brought to Stannis where Theon is reunited with Asha Greyjoy and "Arya" is sent with a woman to the wall to be reunited with Jon Snow (maybe to persuade him to become lord of winterfell, however he's a Direwolf now)
so now Roose is without a Stark. Add to this that Walda Frey is pregnant and the child will likely inherit the Dreadfort instead of Ramsey (which is probably why Ramsey murdered Little Walder. Bolton/Frey relations aren't the best either)
After the fight between Freys/Manderlys Roose Bolton orders everyone out into the waist-high snow to make the 3 day long ride to Stannis camp. Boltons are left in Winterfell with no Stark, Frey's will be massacred by Stannis + Manderly + Other northren families (North remembers the red wedding). Boltons will camp Winterfell with no alliances and will be sieged without hurry to secure it for Jon Stark / Goth Sansa / Skagos Rickon Stark or let in via secret entrances (same one used by the Hooded Man that recognized Theon) and take it that way. Theon growing up in Winterfell should know the ins and outs of the castle and can maybe bargain his knowledge for his life
Holy crap is that really going to happen or are you speculating? I hope you're right.
Things are not necessarily so sure for Stannis though. Both sides have a betrayal coming. Manderly is of course actually working for Stannis, but that might be counterbalanced by the Karstarks. Alys is the rightful Lady of Karhold, but was chased out and now isn't in control. Instead her uncle is, and he has a deal with the Boltons.
On May 28 2015 11:32 Plexa wrote: So, what's the probability of Stannis returning to the wall? The show seems to be suggesting that Stannis needs to choose between (a) marching and losing (the "Stannis" approach), (b) sacrificing Shireen and winning (the "Melissandre" appraoch) and (c) returning to the wall and trying again after winter (the "Davos" approach).
At the same time, the preview material seen seems to suggest either (a) or (b) is going to be the outcome. In particular, (a) with Stannis losing again and retreating to the wall putting Mel in the right place to save Jon and leaving Shireen alive to make that happen. It could also serve as the point where Mel gives up on Stannis as Azor Ahai and coverts to team Jon.
At the end of ADWD Hosteen Frey enters the great hall of Winterfell with the body of little Walder. A fight breaks out between the Freys and House Manderly because Big Walder accuses the men from White Harbor (Manderlys men). Boltons and Freys have the alliance with the Lannisters after the Red Wedding and are named wardens of the north. But they can't rule the north without a Stark - which is why "Arya Stark" is married to Ramsey. However, "Arya" and Theon escape with the help of the washerwomen and Mance + Show Spoiler [TWOW spoilers] +
and are brought to Stannis where Theon is reunited with Asha Greyjoy and "Arya" is sent with a woman to the wall to be reunited with Jon Snow (maybe to persuade him to become lord of winterfell, however he's a Direwolf now)
so now Roose is without a Stark. Add to this that Walda Frey is pregnant and the child will likely inherit the Dreadfort instead of Ramsey (which is probably why Ramsey murdered Little Walder. Bolton/Frey relations aren't the best either)
After the fight between Freys/Manderlys Roose Bolton orders everyone out into the waist-high snow to make the 3 day long ride to Stannis camp. Boltons are left in Winterfell with no Stark, Frey's will be massacred by Stannis + Manderly + Other northren families (North remembers the red wedding). Boltons will camp Winterfell with no alliances and will be sieged without hurry to secure it for Jon Stark / Goth Sansa / Skagos Rickon Stark or let in via secret entrances (same one used by the Hooded Man that recognized Theon) and take it that way. Theon growing up in Winterfell should know the ins and outs of the castle and can maybe bargain his knowledge for his life
Holy crap is that really going to happen or are you speculating? I hope you're right.
Things are not necessarily so sure for Stannis though. Both sides have a betrayal coming. Manderly is of course actually working for Stannis, but that might be counterbalanced by the Karstarks. Alys is the rightful Lady of Karhold, but was chased out and now isn't in control. Instead her uncle is, and he has a deal with the Boltons.
Karstarks had set a trap for Stannis that Jon Snow warned about. Bolton sent half his forces (3000 men) to ambush Stannis at this trap. Now that Stannis knows about it... 3000 more to deal with at Winterfell[/spoilers]
On May 28 2015 11:32 Plexa wrote: So, what's the probability of Stannis returning to the wall? The show seems to be suggesting that Stannis needs to choose between (a) marching and losing (the "Stannis" approach), (b) sacrificing Shireen and winning (the "Melissandre" appraoch) and (c) returning to the wall and trying again after winter (the "Davos" approach).
At the same time, the preview material seen seems to suggest either (a) or (b) is going to be the outcome. In particular, (a) with Stannis losing again and retreating to the wall putting Mel in the right place to save Jon and leaving Shireen alive to make that happen. It could also serve as the point where Mel gives up on Stannis as Azor Ahai and coverts to team Jon.
At the end of ADWD Hosteen Frey enters the great hall of Winterfell with the body of little Walder. A fight breaks out between the Freys and House Manderly because Big Walder accuses the men from White Harbor (Manderlys men). Boltons and Freys have the alliance with the Lannisters after the Red Wedding and are named wardens of the north. But they can't rule the north without a Stark - which is why "Arya Stark" is married to Ramsey. However, "Arya" and Theon escape with the help of the washerwomen and Mance + Show Spoiler [TWOW spoilers] +
and are brought to Stannis where Theon is reunited with Asha Greyjoy and "Arya" is sent with a woman to the wall to be reunited with Jon Snow (maybe to persuade him to become lord of winterfell, however he's a Direwolf now)
so now Roose is without a Stark. Add to this that Walda Frey is pregnant and the child will likely inherit the Dreadfort instead of Ramsey (which is probably why Ramsey murdered Little Walder. Bolton/Frey relations aren't the best either)
After the fight between Freys/Manderlys Roose Bolton orders everyone out into the waist-high snow to make the 3 day long ride to Stannis camp. Boltons are left in Winterfell with no Stark, Frey's will be massacred by Stannis + Manderly + Other northren families (North remembers the red wedding). Boltons will camp Winterfell with no alliances and will be sieged without hurry to secure it for Jon Stark / Goth Sansa / Skagos Rickon Stark or let in via secret entrances (same one used by the Hooded Man that recognized Theon) and take it that way. Theon growing up in Winterfell should know the ins and outs of the castle and can maybe bargain his knowledge for his life
Holy crap is that really going to happen or are you speculating? I hope you're right.
Everything through the first sentence of the second paragraph isn't speculation. (Well, maybe saying Ramsay killed Little Walder is.)
I was pretty convinced Littled Walder was killed by Big Walder, or at least he s an accomplice.
On May 28 2015 11:32 Plexa wrote: So, what's the probability of Stannis returning to the wall? The show seems to be suggesting that Stannis needs to choose between (a) marching and losing (the "Stannis" approach), (b) sacrificing Shireen and winning (the "Melissandre" appraoch) and (c) returning to the wall and trying again after winter (the "Davos" approach).
At the same time, the preview material seen seems to suggest either (a) or (b) is going to be the outcome. In particular, (a) with Stannis losing again and retreating to the wall putting Mel in the right place to save Jon and leaving Shireen alive to make that happen. It could also serve as the point where Mel gives up on Stannis as Azor Ahai and coverts to team Jon.
At the end of ADWD Hosteen Frey enters the great hall of Winterfell with the body of little Walder. A fight breaks out between the Freys and House Manderly because Big Walder accuses the men from White Harbor (Manderlys men). Boltons and Freys have the alliance with the Lannisters after the Red Wedding and are named wardens of the north. But they can't rule the north without a Stark - which is why "Arya Stark" is married to Ramsey. However, "Arya" and Theon escape with the help of the washerwomen and Mance + Show Spoiler [TWOW spoilers] +
and are brought to Stannis where Theon is reunited with Asha Greyjoy and "Arya" is sent with a woman to the wall to be reunited with Jon Snow (maybe to persuade him to become lord of winterfell, however he's a Direwolf now)
so now Roose is without a Stark. Add to this that Walda Frey is pregnant and the child will likely inherit the Dreadfort instead of Ramsey (which is probably why Ramsey murdered Little Walder. Bolton/Frey relations aren't the best either)
After the fight between Freys/Manderlys Roose Bolton orders everyone out into the waist-high snow to make the 3 day long ride to Stannis camp. Boltons are left in Winterfell with no Stark, Frey's will be massacred by Stannis + Manderly + Other northren families (North remembers the red wedding). Boltons will camp Winterfell with no alliances and will be sieged without hurry to secure it for Jon Stark / Goth Sansa / Skagos Rickon Stark or let in via secret entrances (same one used by the Hooded Man that recognized Theon) and take it that way. Theon growing up in Winterfell should know the ins and outs of the castle and can maybe bargain his knowledge for his life
Holy crap is that really going to happen or are you speculating? I hope you're right.
Everything through the first sentence of the second paragraph isn't speculation. (Well, maybe saying Ramsay killed Little Walder is.)
I was pretty convinced Littled Walder was killed by Big Walder, or at least he s an accomplice.
Both Little and Big Walder are 9 years old. LW was "butchered like a hog". A 9 year old doing that to his cousin?... he has blood on his clothes when LW is brought to the great hall. But I don't see him as a kinslayer
That, and the producers said that the very last scene this season will be straight from the books. I have always been a believer in Uncat appearing in the show, sooner or later. This looks to be it, finally. It sure as hell would be one kick-ass cliffhanger for the unsullied.
I actually don't remember how the last book ended. I thought it ended with Jon getting stabbed and figured that would be the ending cliffhanger scene for this season.
That, and the producers said that the very last scene this season will be straight from the books. I have always been a believer in Uncat appearing in the show, sooner or later. This looks to be it, finally. It sure as hell would be one kick-ass cliffhanger for the unsullied.
I have been secretly hoping she will still appear eventually, ever since it was announced that she will be cut from the show. To be honest, I never understood why they would ditch this storyline. It may not be very impactful in the end (who knows), but it certainly has a huge WTF-factor. And GoT is known for having these, so it would fit perfectly. Also, this title would be very fitting, and also there would be a certain punch to it in the finale. Of course the title is "literally" referring to the Mother's mercy already mentioned in the last episode (or at least I'm fairly certain), but, as already pointed out in the article, these titles do tend to have other interpretations, and this would be an especially cool one.
On May 30 2015 05:14 Canucklehead wrote: I actually don't remember how the last book ended. I thought it ended with Jon getting stabbed and figured that would be the ending cliffhanger scene for this season.
Maybe we are getting a Dany-Jon-UnCat triple cliffhanger. That would be epic.
On May 30 2015 05:14 Canucklehead wrote: I actually don't remember how the last book ended. I thought it ended with Jon getting stabbed and figured that would be the ending cliffhanger scene for this season.
Well, they haven't said which book the last scene will be from
That, and the producers said that the very last scene this season will be straight from the books. I have always been a believer in Uncat appearing in the show, sooner or later. This looks to be it, finally. It sure as hell would be one kick-ass cliffhanger for the unsullied.
I have been secretly hoping she will still appear eventually, ever since it was announced that she will be cut from the show. To be honest, I never understood why they would ditch this storyline. It may not be very impactful in the end (who knows), but it certainly has a huge WTF-factor. And GoT is known for having these, so it would fit perfectly. Also, this title would be very fitting, and also there would be a certain punch to it in the finale. Of course the title is "literally" referring to the Mother's mercy already mentioned in the last episode (or at least I'm fairly certain), but, as already pointed out in the article, these titles do tend to have other interpretations, and this would be an especially cool one.
Exactly. The producers love those big wtf momets, and this one would work just perfectly in the show. There's really no reason not to do it, other than Uncat being entirely and utterly irrelevant to the actual plot. And even then they could've just changed that to make it work.
On May 30 2015 05:14 Canucklehead wrote: I actually don't remember how the last book ended. I thought it ended with Jon getting stabbed and figured that would be the ending cliffhanger scene for this season.
Maybe we are getting a Dany-Jon-UnCat triple cliffhanger. That would be epic.
Dany riding off on her dragon to ???
Jon getting stabbed and left for dead.
Cersei awaiting her Trial by Combat.
Very last seconds are a close up of Cat's corpse as she opens her eyes.
The internet would explode. They couldn't handle all of the cliffhangers.
On May 30 2015 06:15 Geo.Rion wrote: Really? Cutting uncat was one of the very few cuts i agreed with, it would be a shame... especially cuz her storylines moved on in the meantime
Now that they have announced that they are casting for the likes of Euron, Meribald, and Randyll for season 6 I think it is safe to say timeline bets are off. They are doing things in a new order.
Last season ended with Arya sailing to Braavos which wasn't exactly a cliffhanger so I wouldn't bet on this season ending with things like Jon getting stabbed or Lady Stoneheart. I think Jon will get stabbed earlier and I don't expect to see Catelyn in this season at all.
I just noticed they're casting a
Priestess. Mid-20’s to early 30’s. Any ethnicity- she’s beautiful, intense, and magnetic.
Could it mean it's the priestess (septa Lemore) that helped Connington and Aegon? I was pretty sure Connigton is cut after Mormont caught Greyscale
On May 30 2015 06:15 Geo.Rion wrote: Really? Cutting uncat was one of the very few cuts i agreed with, it would be a shame... especially cuz her storylines moved on in the meantime
I think UnCat would be/would have been a nice shocking moment, one of those for which people like GoT. Even if her storyline is not that important ultimately, I would have still preferred to have that instead of some made-up Dorne stuff.
On May 30 2015 05:14 Canucklehead wrote: I actually don't remember how the last book ended. I thought it ended with Jon getting stabbed and figured that would be the ending cliffhanger scene for this season.
The epilogue of the last book is the Kevan Lannister POV in which Varys talks to him about (f)Aegon, then kills him after it is revealed he killed Pycelle.
About that title... It's interesting. I do hope we see UnCat. I'm bummed they removed Coldhands, so I think UnCat would be cool. I agree it doesn't bring a whole lot to the story (yet), but it is very shocking, and it's also satisfying. Lady Stoneheart is the Stark revenge incarnate, she hangs Freys left and right. The Unsullied would love it.
On May 30 2015 06:15 Geo.Rion wrote: Really? Cutting uncat was one of the very few cuts i agreed with, it would be a shame... especially cuz her storylines moved on in the meantime
Now that they have announced that they are casting for the likes of Euron, Meribald, and Randyll for season 6 I think it is safe to say timeline bets are off. They are doing things in a new order.
The way they've casted indicates that they only cast people when they become useful during that season. For instance, timeline wise the Reeds should have shown up in season 2 but they didn't show until season 3 when their function in the plot was actually significant. That said, Uncat is Mother Mercy, not Mother's Mercy so it seems unlikely still.
EPT
