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Discussing the show and past episodes is fine. Do not put things that have happened in the TV series in spoilers. However, don't spoil things from the books that may happen in future episodes. Put book spoilers in spoiler tags with a CLEAR WARNING that it is from the book. |
On February 25 2013 17:00 Xinder wrote:
One where they killed off Dale? I dunno.
am I the only one who kind of liked dale? sure, he was a nag and played the same killjoy foil that lori did and andrea now does, but he at least approximated an semi-educated, philosophical approach to humanism and the post-apocalypse application of such. his death legitimately made me feel feels, even though the setup to his death was done in total primadonna TWD fashion.
I would kill for dale in season 3; a little more hardened, a little less sympathetic to the welfare of outgroup assholes but still willing to argue in a dispassionate and logical fashion to balance out glenn and rick. the best we get on that front is herschel and daryl, and let's be real here, I don't see herschel living out the season or the eventual prison departure.
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On February 25 2013 17:13 TheExile19 wrote:
am I the only one who kind of liked dale? sure, he was a nag and played the same killjoy foil that lori did and andrea now does, but he at least approximated an semi-educated, philosophical approach to humanism and the post-apocalypse application of such. his death legitimately made me feel feels, even though the setup to his death was done in total primadonna TWD fashion.
I would kill for dale in season 3; a little more hardened, a little less sympathetic to the welfare of outgroup assholes but still willing to argue in a dispassionate and logical fashion to balance out glenn and rick. the best we get on that front is herschel and daryl, and let's be real here, I don't see herschel living out the season or the eventual prison departure.
I loved Dale, but I loved him for who he was in the comic's (what you described). He was a passionate 'old wise man' who wasn't always right but never pushed things too far (being old he couldn't really), I liked him a lot as he was key in Rick and Andreas development.
This is part of the reason I really dislike what they're doing. I get they want to tell their own story, but couldn't they have gone for a different angle like TWD video game did instead of butchering loved characters. I think I only watch it to get a good rage going, probably the same reason people read The Daily Mail. *shakes fists*
Only read if you want a comparison of comic / tv dale and some comic spoilers of Dale.
+ Show Spoiler +
In the comics Dale and Andrea hook up and end up being adoptive parents. Dale struggles with the idea that Andrea is wasting her life with him as he's too old, he also helps out and provides an occasionally needed moral look on things.
He survives getting bitten by having his leg amputated (lol Hershel), but finally Cpt Oates his way out of this world when he gets bit again. Which ends in one of the most fucked up situations Rick & Co have got themselves into.
In the TV series he's a classic example of why they ruined it, they could've expanded on him with the extra time, flesh out his character more. Instead they shit all over it, he barely talks to Andrea, the kids don't even exist and then they just kill him because he's a crap character who provides nothing useful.
This is the main thing the writers do not seem to understand, a lot of the 'minor' characters in the comics, whilst not necessarily being fleshed out themselves, were used to develop the main characters, whether its Sophia showing that Carl is still a young boy, Dale bring out the tender side of Andrea (who is a serious badass not a whiney killjoy in the comics). They gutted key elements of characters development and replaced them with nothing making the characters un-likeable and boring.
Just hope Tyresse comes back so Michonne doesn't suffer the same fate, although he can't have the same impact as he did in the comics with his infidelity.
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I don't get it, is Andrea not welcome or is she going back to Woodbury just to fuck and kill the Governor?
Either way, it makes no sense at all. Everyone in the world knew there is no way she is not gonna kill him in his sleep, but she chooses to go back there and fuck a murderous lunatic that she knows without any doubt has nothing but killing the other group on his mind. She knows he sent merle to kill machone, she knows he has fucking heads in his room, she knows he lied about the group and is training an army to kill them and she still goes and sleeps with a psychopath that could snap and kill her at any time, and they even give her a car to go, amazing.
I could understand if there was some discussion, like a few minutes of Andrea are you sure you want to do this, Andrea are you aware in how much danger you will be in, etc. But all we get is 4 minutes of a teenager singing Tom Waits song, a few words between Rick and Hershel and 2 minute sequence of her driving to get her from prison to the town and 3 minutes of fake tension at the respective gates.
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On February 25 2013 19:54 adwodon wrote:Show nested quote +On February 25 2013 17:13 TheExile19 wrote:
am I the only one who kind of liked dale? sure, he was a nag and played the same killjoy foil that lori did and andrea now does, but he at least approximated an semi-educated, philosophical approach to humanism and the post-apocalypse application of such. his death legitimately made me feel feels, even though the setup to his death was done in total primadonna TWD fashion.
I would kill for dale in season 3; a little more hardened, a little less sympathetic to the welfare of outgroup assholes but still willing to argue in a dispassionate and logical fashion to balance out glenn and rick. the best we get on that front is herschel and daryl, and let's be real here, I don't see herschel living out the season or the eventual prison departure. This is part of the reason I really dislike what they're doing. I get they want to tell their own story, but couldn't they have gone for a different angle like TWD video game did instead of butchering loved characters. I think I only watch it to get a good rage going, probably the same reason people read The Daily Mail. *shakes fists*
the reason they killed off dale is because the actor playing him wanted off the show. what should they have done, hired a new actor mid-season to play dale?
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This season went from awesome to shit pretty quick, don't know what to think.
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I really don't understand what we are supposed to think of Andrea. Is she portrayed as this dumb and gullible on purpose, or are we supposed to feel for her and understand how conflicted she is between the group she stayed with for month, and the crazy psychopath who tries to murder said group?
I mean, she knows that he lied to her face, many, many times, and that he attacked the prison. And is planning on killing them all just because. And then she makes out with him. Huh.
Since that was the primary focus of the episode.. meh.
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The series started going downhill once they killed the only likable character: Dale.
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Can someone explain to me why is Governor so hostile to strangers? Firstly I thought that he just wants to keep the location of Woodbury secret but that wouldn't explain collecting heads and the whole situation with Glenn and Maggie.
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On February 25 2013 23:45 Sent. wrote:
Can someone explain to me why is Governor so hostile to strangers? Firstly I thought that he just wants to keep the location of Woodbury secret but that wouldn't explain collecting heads and the whole situation with Glenn and Maggie.
He's insane. Simple as that. He sees threats to his safety in everything.
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Honestly, I don't understand why people hate on this episode. It seems like people just want blood and gore 24/7. And the fact that Andrea didn't kill the governer was legit, stop whining about it, she obviously still had feelings for him and it's not that easy to kill someone that she still cares about. This doesn't mean that she betrayed Rick's group as I bet she's doing everything she can to find another solution to the conflict. I didn't really like the beginning of this season that much with somewhat pointless zombie slaughtering, poorly set up fire fights and ridiculous fights/details (for instance when Michonne took out 2 out of 3 armed men by a sword in an open forest), but it's getting better now again. I find it funny that people enjoyed the parts that I didn't and the other way around xD
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On February 25 2013 12:16 Patpoose wrote:Show nested quote +On February 25 2013 12:13 Mercy13 wrote:
I actually really enjoyed this episode. Having Meryl back with Rick's group creates an interesting dynamic, and Andrea's face when Michonne told her that the Governor sent Meryl to kill her was priceless.
Also I loved the song at the end. I really think Merle is gonna be great with him back with the group.
Nothing personal about trying to hunt you down and kill you. Lets just let shit be. I'm cool now right? Love Merle. I think he's going to bring a great dynamic to the group sadly I think he'll die fighting the woodbury people.
I think andrea and michonne will be invaluable in helping Tyrese and his people figure out they should be cool with the prison people and not the govenors people. Right now it seems like Tyrese and his people are going to be used and killed after the fight.
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On February 25 2013 23:54 Conti wrote:Show nested quote +On February 25 2013 23:45 Sent. wrote:
Can someone explain to me why is Governor so hostile to strangers? Firstly I thought that he just wants to keep the location of Woodbury secret but that wouldn't explain collecting heads and the whole situation with Glenn and Maggie. He's insane. Simple as that. He sees threats to his safety in everything.
That is something I have somewhat of a problem with. I can't see a scenario where a person like that could have risen to that kind of uncontested leadership in the life-or-death reality they exist in. I can't see the survivors that make out the population of Woodbury being that naive and gullible, and be fine with not having a word about how they allocate their resources and what the general direction of their small society should be. They are not that many, you really would have to go out of your way not to be involved.
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I love how even in death Lori continues to be annoying (by haunting Rick). I know you can't really blame her for it, but if Rick didn't have those visions, Tyrese might be part of their group in the prison now instead of on the Gov.'s side.
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Hyrule19213 Posts
On February 25 2013 19:54 adwodon wrote:
snip
Actually Dale was killed off when his actor quit the show when they axed Darabont.
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On February 25 2013 23:54 Zaic wrote:
Honestly, I don't understand why people hate on this episode. It seems like people just want blood and gore 24/7. And the fact that Andrea didn't kill the governer was legit, stop whining about it, she obviously still had feelings for him and it's not that easy to kill someone that she still cares about. This doesn't mean that she betrayed Rick's group as I bet she's doing everything she can to find another solution to the conflict. I didn't really like the beginning of this season that much with somewhat pointless zombie slaughtering, poorly set up fire fights and ridiculous fights/details (for instance when Michonne took out 2 out of 3 armed men by a sword in an open forest), but it's getting better now again. I find it funny that people enjoyed the parts that I didn't and the other way around xD
if it's blood and gore vs. an entire episode of andrea and her utterly broken characterization, I know which one I'm opting for. it's not hard to use internal logic to justify character motivation, that doesn't mean that anyone wants to see the most obviously false-tension sequence of andrea out of bed pretending she's going to stab the one guy that drives the plot the hardest.
there were some okay bits outside all the andrea, but overall this episode had me bored and angry in fits and starts. it's really a new low, I think, that fortunately doesn't look like it'll be repeated next episode because there's no way it can get worse with what we saw in the preview.
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I just want to say that Andrea hasn't been a good character since her sister died and I really really hope she dies soon... The only good thing she's done is bring in the one character smart enough to have a sword.
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Not TWD related but, Scorcher, you really think having a sword is better than a mace-like weapon (dunno the word, but something that hits hard and doesn't get stuck in people) ?
I mean, sure, katana is +100 for cool factor, but for that kind of use, I don't know...
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All you need is a spear and a mirror taped to a baseball cap or something, and you can kill infinity zombies. Especially the ezmode zombies on this show. And ya, I'm pretty sure realistically a sword would get stuck in the first vertebra it hits and stay there forever.
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On February 26 2013 04:20 politik wrote:
All you need is a spear and a mirror taped to a baseball cap or something, and you can kill infinity zombies. Especially the ezmode zombies on this show. And ya, I'm pretty sure realistically a sword would get stuck in the first vertebra it hits and stay there forever.
Realistically a sword like that can easily chop up concrete so I have a hard time believing it wouldn't easily cut through zombies.
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EPT
