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Discussing the show and past episodes is fine. Do not put things that have happened in the TV series in spoilers. However, don't spoil things from the books that may happen in future episodes. Put book spoilers in spoiler tags with a CLEAR WARNING that it is from the book. |
On November 07 2012 02:31 Cloud9157 wrote:
How in the hell did that black dude survive...
You see, when a man of african decent is dispelled from a show, a chosen successor is always picked by the gods to take the passed torch. These men are called Tokens.
After T-Dogs glorious sacrifice, the position as Token became vacant. One man had to be selected to fill the necessary role. Now it seemed like there was an obvious choice; Oscar. However, it turned out Andrew was still alive and just as able to take the role.
Keep in mind that when the gods decide who will be the next Token, it is a fight to the death; a fight for survival.
So when Oscar had the choice to either kill Rick or kill Andrew, he picked Andrew. This is because he knew that if Andrew was left alive, the Token position would remain vacant still, and it could be a coin toss as to who would get the position, since the gods would surly kill one of them to force the position on the other. So Oscar eliminated the only other black guy there, rising to become the Token. He will do his duty, and survive until he must pass on the torch to another black guy who may randomly come along.
... And so the cycle continues.
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On November 07 2012 03:00 mythandier wrote:Show nested quote +On November 07 2012 02:48 ThomasjServo wrote:On November 07 2012 02:25 tehemperorer wrote:On November 07 2012 02:14 ThomasjServo wrote:On November 07 2012 01:11 FeUerFlieGe wrote:
I didn't have a problem with the acting. I rarely ever have. I found Rick's hysterical fit of crying to be very powerful. I think this is going to be a big turning point for him, where he goes bat-shit insane. I think if you were watching in a group setting, you may find it a bit more ridiculous. I agree though, I thought it was rather moving in a very Southern Gothic style. Also T Dogg, something had to happen, something did. @__@ Depends on the group. If one person doesn't buy in, then the others that feel safer following suit will do so, even if they would have done otherwise if watching it by themselves; that's just human nature and it isn't really indicative of the quality of acting. That was all I really meant by it, my girlfriend ruined the moment for me on that one last night. My wife broke down last night when we watched it and that caused me to tear up as well.
I was the teary one, she was the voice of callous disbelief. Generally doesn't go that way, my main complaint about the Rick Laurie story arc, was that they killed her off with out her having turned. I would have loved for Carl, not to have been able to pull the trigger then we see her stammer in some way out of the prison.
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On November 07 2012 03:01 Kazeyonoma wrote:
People who haven't lost someone close to them, TRULY close to them, I don't think fully understand the emotion that Rick was going through. When I lost someone truly close to me, i literally collapse on the floor like he did...Call it bad acting, but it's a real emotion and true reaction to losing someone who you've loved most of your life, the mother of your children, no matter how mad you are at her.
Agree. I recently went through the same thing and reacted the same way -- and I've been through over 30 years of my fair share of !@#$ -- so while I'm certainly no expert, I think I can say it was a fairly accurate portrayal.
On November 07 2012 03:03 FeUerFlieGe wrote:Show nested quote +On November 07 2012 02:31 Cloud9157 wrote:
How in the hell did that black dude survive... You see, when a man of african decent is dispelled from a show, a chosen successor is always picked by the gods to take the passed torch. These men are called Tokens. After T-Dogs glorious sacrifice, the position as Token became vacant. One man had to be selected to fill the necessary role. Now it seemed like there was an obvious choice; Oscar. However, it turned out Andrew was still alive and just as able to take the role. Keep in mind that when the gods decide who will be the next Token, it is a fight to the death; a fight for survival. So when Oscar had the choice to either kill Rick or kill Andrew, he picked Andrew. This is because he knew that if Andrew was left alive, the Token position would remain vacant still, and it could be a coin toss as to who would get the position, since the gods would surly kill one of them to force the position on the other. So Oscar eliminated the only other black guy there, rising to become the Token. He will do his duty, and survive until he must pass on the torch to another black guy who may randomly come along. ... And so the cycle continues.
Haha. +1 Very good stuff XD
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On November 07 2012 03:03 FeUerFlieGe wrote:Show nested quote +On November 07 2012 02:31 Cloud9157 wrote:
How in the hell did that black dude survive... You see, when a man of african decent is dispelled from a show, a chosen successor is always picked by the gods to take the passed torch. These men are called Tokens. After T-Dogs glorious sacrifice, the position as Token became vacant. One man had to be selected to fill the necessary role. Now it seemed like there was an obvious choice; Oscar. However, it turned out Andrew was still alive and just as able to take the role. Keep in mind that when the gods decide who will be the next Token, it is a fight to the death; a fight for survival. So when Oscar had the choice to either kill Rick or kill Andrew, he picked Andrew. This is because he knew that if Andrew was left alive, the Token position would remain vacant still, and it could be a coin toss as to who would get the position, since the gods would surly kill one of them to force the position on the other. So Oscar eliminated the only other black guy there, rising to become the Token. He will do his duty, and survive until he must pass on the torch to another black guy who may randomly come along. ... And so the cycle continues.
I think you actually just won life right here.
This was a pretty awesome episode honestly. But poor Tdog... He tried.
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On November 07 2012 03:01 Kazeyonoma wrote:+ Show Spoiler +hey, i fucking shed a tear when both characters died, and i looked over at my fiancee and she was doing the same. Tdog going down was just sad, i know he wasn't the most developed character, but he went down for a purpose and was always a useful person in the group, seeing him get ripped apart trying to save Carol is something remnant of a 'good world', something that is forgotten in this apocalyptic world where it's every man for himself. Sure you see people risk themselves all the time, but rarely do you ever see someone outright throw themselves to save another. You could argue that he was dead already because of the previous bite which gave him more courage, but in this show, we've seen sad whiny people beg for life rather than do what's necessary. I dunno, something about just how he pulled through to save Carol (unconfirmed I suppose) gives me respect to Tdog.
When Lori died, I was equally hurt because she was doing something selfless for her child. People just like to rag on how much they hated her acting etc, but I dunno, since I never hated her acting so much as her character at times, I knew she was going to die, but wanted to see how, and the way they did it was just tragic. To have her own son there, to have him ultimately be the one to put her down. To basically give her life to create another. There's so much going on from a deeper level than you normally see in a zombie movie that it's heart wrenching to see people have to make these decisions. People who haven't lost someone close to them, TRULY close to them, I don't think fully understand the emotion that Rick was going through. When I lost someone truly close to me, i literally collapse on the floor like he did and screamed at the top of my lungs, god why (i'm atheist) and let out a long Nooooooooo. Call it bad acting, but it's a real emotion and true reaction to losing someone who you've loved most of your life, the mother of your children, no matter how mad you are at her.
Sometimes I just feel like the people who post in this thread are here to post hate and vitriol because they have nothing better to do, but incite the shared hatred of others, while those of us who genuinely like the show have no way to fight back because ultimately it's everyone's own opinion of the acting/writing/casting/etc. That or the general population really are more heartless and coldblooded than I'd like to believe. Jeez people.
To me, it has little to do with the acting and much more to do with writing. The pace is always so weird. They have 45 minutes but nothing really happens during 35 of those. So it's all quiet and stuff and then BAM two people die, some zombies are killed and stuff happens.
It's consistently like this as well. Not just a one-off. The shockers aren't that shocking either. Only shocking part about Lori dying was that they really didn't try to keep her alive at all. They, including Lori herself, just gave up on her.
T-Dog gets a few lines and then 30 minutes later gets bit and does something useful with the last few minutes of his life. Not shocking, not interesting. Nothing.
The show has potential but I feel more and more that I am only watching for those 10 minutes where stuff actually happens. The rest is complete shit.
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On November 07 2012 03:01 Kazeyonoma wrote:
When Lori died, I was equally hurt because she was doing something selfless for her child. People just like to rag on how much they hated her acting etc, but I dunno, since I never hated her acting so much as her character at times, I knew she was going to die, but wanted to see how, and the way they did it was just tragic. To have her own son there, to have him ultimately be the one to put her down. To basically give her life to create another. There's so much going on from a deeper level than you normally see in a zombie movie that it's heart wrenching to see people have to make these decisions. People who haven't lost someone close to them, TRULY close to them, I don't think fully understand the emotion that Rick was going through. When I lost someone truly close to me, i literally collapse on the floor like he did and screamed at the top of my lungs, god why (i'm atheist) and let out a long Nooooooooo. Call it bad acting, but it's a real emotion and true reaction to losing someone who you've loved most of your life, the mother of your children, no matter how mad you are at her.
Selfless? I thought Lori's decision was rather selfish and really just a way to escape the hole which she dug so deep for herself.
She escaped Rick without ever having to repair that broken relationship
She forced her son to watch her die and then kill her
She forced a child, which Rick knows is not his, upon Rick
She forced a child, which the group has no means to feed, upon the group
She brought a child that no one wants, into a world that no one wants to live in
She chose easy death over hard life while bringing a hopeless life into the picture. The ultimate reverse-sacrifice.
"No, don't try to save me! I get the easy escape, now you gotta suffer sucka!"
I might be a cynic, so please explain to me what part of any of that is selfless?
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On November 06 2012 17:23 TigerKarl wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2012 10:26 VirtuallyJesse wrote:
Nobody in this world has any idea how loud I was cheering when bitch wife was dying. I was home alone but I must have been hollering for 10 minute straight. As usually i suggest to print that out and to read it once you've become mature, because you wouldn't believe me how much work you've still got ahead of you.
You never watched Prison Break, have you? I've had time to reflect and it still makes me laugh. 100% Justified. 
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Two things gave it away that T-Dog was going to die:
1) The amount of lines he had at the beginning of the episode, and his opposition to Rick's decision. That whole scene was just like Dale's final scene.
2) The actor who plays Oscar is a better actor than T-Dog.
I'm personally pissed it was the guy we thought got eaten who caused all the trouble in the last episode. His screams implied he was being eaten, and he didn't strike me as clever enough to survive and then cause so much trouble. Also, how did he get any of the doors in the prison unlocked when Rick has all the keys?
With the pacing of this season, I don't think Rick and The Governor are going to meet until the mid-season finale, with the second half of the season being the Rick vs Governor story arc.
I agree with previous posts, it did seem like Lori wanted to die. Her greatest fear was having the baby turn and then tear her apart from the inside. I just don't know why they had to do the C-section right away. The show doesn't make clear how much time passes, but it doesn't seem long from the time she started having contractions to when Maggie cuts her open. Surely they could have waited out the contractions for an hour or so until they were back to safety and the proper antibiotics, equipment, etc. Did her water even break?
Any ideas on what's going on with Carol? I can't see them killing three characters off, but they have to make room for The Governor, Merle, Michonne, and Andrea. I think she'll be missing for a while, and then they'll find her as a walker, much like they did with Sophia. Daryl will be the one to put her down.
If Daryl or Glenn die this season I'm going to be CHOKED.
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On November 07 2012 03:34 FREEloss_ca wrote:
Two things gave it away that T-Dog was going to die:
1) The amount of lines he had at the beginning of the episode, and his opposition to Rick's decision. That whole scene was just like Dale's final scene.
2) The actor who plays Oscar is a better actor than T-Dog.
I'm personally pissed it was the guy we thought got eaten who caused all the trouble in the last episode. His screams implied he was being eaten, and he didn't strike me as clever enough to survive and then cause so much trouble. Also, how did he get any of the doors in the prison unlocked when Rick has all the keys?
With the pacing of this season, I don't think Rick and The Governor are going to meet until the mid-season finale, with the second half of the season being the Rick vs Governor story arc.
I agree with previous posts, it did seem like Lori wanted to die. Her greatest fear was having the baby turn and then tear her apart from the inside. I just don't know why they had to do the C-section right away. The show doesn't make clear how much time passes, but it doesn't seem long from the time she started having contractions to when Maggie cuts her open. Surely they could have waited out the contractions for an hour or so until they were back to safety and the proper antibiotics, equipment, etc. Did her water even break?
If Daryl or Glenn die this season I'm going to be CHOKED.
I think they mentioned that the door (one we saw at the beginning of the episode) had its chains cut, allowing walkers to roam around.
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I mean more specifically the doors leading into the 'safe' parts of the prison, and the door to the generator room. I was under the impression that the fence with the cut chains led to the courtyard where the initial zombie fight took place.
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On November 07 2012 03:28 Dosey wrote:Show nested quote +On November 07 2012 03:01 Kazeyonoma wrote:
When Lori died, I was equally hurt because she was doing something selfless for her child. People just like to rag on how much they hated her acting etc, but I dunno, since I never hated her acting so much as her character at times, I knew she was going to die, but wanted to see how, and the way they did it was just tragic. To have her own son there, to have him ultimately be the one to put her down. To basically give her life to create another. There's so much going on from a deeper level than you normally see in a zombie movie that it's heart wrenching to see people have to make these decisions. People who haven't lost someone close to them, TRULY close to them, I don't think fully understand the emotion that Rick was going through. When I lost someone truly close to me, i literally collapse on the floor like he did and screamed at the top of my lungs, god why (i'm atheist) and let out a long Nooooooooo. Call it bad acting, but it's a real emotion and true reaction to losing someone who you've loved most of your life, the mother of your children, no matter how mad you are at her. Selfless? I thought Lori's decision was rather selfish and really just a way to escape the hole which she dug so deep for herself. She escaped Rick without ever having to repair that broken relationship She forced her son to watch her die and then kill her She forced a child, which Rick knows is not his, upon Rick She forced a child, which the group has no means to feed, upon the group She brought a child that no one wants, into a world that no one wants to live in She chose easy death over hard life while bringing a hopeless life into the picture. The ultimate reverse-sacrifice. "No, don't try to save me! I get the easy escape, now you gotta suffer sucka!" I might be a cynic, so please explain to me what part of any of that is selfless?
Fair assessment, I hadn't look at it that way as being the cop out. still a weird cycle of life/death there tied into it, but you're probably right, it's a dumb move no doubt (i was saying that after the episode too, who the fuck is gonna feed this kid), but I think she truly thought she was doing the right thing, even if deep down inside she was relieved.
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On November 07 2012 03:48 FREEloss_ca wrote:
I mean more specifically the doors leading into the 'safe' parts of the prison, and the door to the generator room. I was under the impression that the fence with the cut chains led to the courtyard where the initial zombie fight took place.
Ehh, the kid was resourceful enough to make it out of that mini-courtyard, so I'd imagine he found a way to get the rest of the doors open.
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On November 07 2012 03:01 Kazeyonoma wrote:
Sometimes I just feel like the people who post in this thread are here to post hate and vitriol because they have nothing better to do, but incite the shared hatred of others, while those of us who genuinely like the show have no way to fight back because ultimately it's everyone's own opinion of the acting/writing/casting/etc. That or the general population really are more heartless and coldblooded than I'd like to believe. Jeez people.
This is a thread where you're supposed talk about the show, not a fanclub. I came and spoke my opinion, which basically is, that it's totally overrated. I got flamed and called retarded for that, so i answered and explained my way of thinking a bit more, giving some examples as did other people.
If you enjoy the show and feel emotionally attached to it that's good. It's a tv show and enjoyment of its audience is its goal after all.I became more and more critic towards the show in general over its course and because of that i don't feel emotionally attached to any character any more.
So can you and others please accept, that there's people out there with a different opinion, who don't enjoy the show that much? And first first of all may not be cold hearted emotionless haters, just because they don't shed a tear over a, in their opinion, mediocore tv show? Thanks.
Let me assure you, i didn't come here just to hate on it and look for trouble.
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well i clearly stated that ultimately it's everyone's own opinion, and that the people who post here with their more hate filled comments are just doing it to see if others agree, while the rest of us who enjoy the show just remain silent because it's your opinion and you have a right to that opinion, just as my opinion that i love the show and the acting, is mine and no one elses. My latter statement is that if it's NOT the case that people come here to share their hate and there is a silent majority who agree with me, that the world is more heartless and cold blooded than I'd like to believe. And that's more in regards to the death scenes than the show overall.
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On November 07 2012 04:30 Kazeyonoma wrote:
well i clearly stated that ultimately it's everyone's own opinion, and that the people who post here with their more hate filled comments are just doing it to see if others agree, while the rest of us who enjoy the show just remain silent because it's your opinion and you have a right to that opinion, just as my opinion that i love the show and the acting, is mine and no one elses. My latter statement is that if it's NOT the case that people come here to share their hate and there is a silent majority who agree with me, that the world is more heartless and cold blooded than I'd like to believe. And that's more in regards to the death scenes than the show overall.
Well then I guess it all depends on what you define as a "hateful comment" in your mind, no?
I may not like the direction the show is going or the writing, but I believe that I have left all "hateful" remarks out of those opinion posts to critique the show on what I believe it lacks (barring a few jokes). If I wanted to put in my hateful opinions, I would say that Darabont is a talentless hack, Shawshank is the most overrated turd in the history of film, and it was the worst creative decision ever for Kirkman to partner up with a man that hasn't touched anything worth looking at in over a decade.
THAT would be a hateful comment that's just looking to get a response out of people.
Disclaimer:
+ Show Spoiler +I am not going to argue those "hateful comments" or why I may have those opinions, I was simply making a point on what I think the difference is between posting an opinion and posting hate.
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United States13896 Posts
On November 07 2012 00:51 Destro wrote:Show nested quote +On November 07 2012 00:46 r00ty wrote:
Yeah of course it's just a TV show. But saying "The Walking Dead" is like the best TV show ever is just unfair. "The Wire" and "GoT" set the bar very high, maybe too high. "GoT" is also not perfect, but the acting omg. Anyone saying the acting and directing on "The Walking Dead" is on par with the likes of "Breaking Bad", "The Wire", "GoT" is just delusional.
Peter Dinklage, Lena Heady, Walter White, etc. compared to them, "The Walking Dead" cast is (with minor exceptions) on soap opera level. Most of the time it's the directors fault though imho.
I'm also a huge Zombie flick fan btw. And can just fully aggree with Dosey: A good Zombie film is not about goring through zombie hordes. "The Walking Dead" had a lot more potential and it's not as good as people make it seem to be. I'll keep watching, but i don't think it will improve. For what its trying to achieve, its the best by far. Rivals nearly all zombie movies as well. You keep comparing it to completely different shows. For a zombie flick, it actually has the best acting. Trying really hard to think of a zombie flick with better acting,.. and failing miserably. Your points are valid. but irrelevant. Breaking bad has better acting then sesamestreet, thus, breaking bad is the better children's tv show.
People are only comparing this show to dramas like The Wire, Breaking Bad, etc. because another poster in this thread came forward saying TWD is some of the best television he's ever seen in his life and he can't understand why other people don't hold the same opinion. Its perfectly reasonable to draw these comparisons when that is the standpoint which is in question. The points aren't irrelevent, you're just arguing in favor of something completely different than said previous poster was.
On your point though, I'm not a zombie film expert but I've seen a number of them and I agree with you, I struggle to think of another work within the genre that has attempted to be more than a hack and slash horror/action flick in the same way and has done it better. Just don't conflate what you are arguing about with what people are saying in response to another poster's assertion that this is the best show on TV in the last 21 years.
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Not to derail the conversation further, but the biggest problem here is the way opinions are voiced. If I like the color blue and say I like the color blue, it doesn't offend the people that hate the color blue, it can be easily seen as opinion. If you hate the color blue and say you hate it, if offends the people that like it. It's seen more as an attack than an opinion. It's just how people are, they feel hurt if you attack things they like. Basically, if you're going to criticize something in the company of people that like it, you need to be careful with your words. Further, if I come to the blue thread and say blue is my favorite color ever, it's not the same as going to the red thread and saying how I like blue more.
Getting back on track,
Overall, I think this season has been pretty interesting so far. There have been some questionable moments but I don't think they take away from the show too much. It's certainly better than the start of season 2. Honestly though, I hope the baby isn't around for much longer, because it seems like an unnecessary handi-cap for the group, and might be a sink like finding Sophia.
Glad Lori's gone, and the scene made my opinion of Carl shoot way up.
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Aye I think a lot of people here are taking it all a bit too seriously. I mean come on it's just a cable television show. Lifes too short to care what that other person on the internet said about you or the thing you like. :D As much as I don't want it, I don't think there's anyway to get rid of the baby, I think it's going to be a major focus of the show for the rest of the season.
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On November 07 2012 03:34 FREEloss_ca wrote:
Two things gave it away that T-Dog was going to die:
I'm personally pissed it was the guy we thought got eaten who caused all the trouble in the last episode. His screams implied he was being eaten, and he didn't strike me as clever enough to survive and then cause so much trouble. Also, how did he get any of the doors in the prison unlocked when Rick has all the keys?
Well, I think it's obvious why he screamed if he did survive. He knew Rick couldn't see and was trying to kill him. So if he screamed, Rick would of thought he was dead, and would not come to kill him. If he didn't scream, there was chance Rick would still think he was alive, so he would of hunt him down.
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On November 07 2012 03:28 Dosey wrote:Show nested quote +On November 07 2012 03:01 Kazeyonoma wrote:
When Lori died, I was equally hurt because she was doing something selfless for her child. People just like to rag on how much they hated her acting etc, but I dunno, since I never hated her acting so much as her character at times, I knew she was going to die, but wanted to see how, and the way they did it was just tragic. To have her own son there, to have him ultimately be the one to put her down. To basically give her life to create another. There's so much going on from a deeper level than you normally see in a zombie movie that it's heart wrenching to see people have to make these decisions. People who haven't lost someone close to them, TRULY close to them, I don't think fully understand the emotion that Rick was going through. When I lost someone truly close to me, i literally collapse on the floor like he did and screamed at the top of my lungs, god why (i'm atheist) and let out a long Nooooooooo. Call it bad acting, but it's a real emotion and true reaction to losing someone who you've loved most of your life, the mother of your children, no matter how mad you are at her. Selfless? I thought Lori's decision was rather selfish and really just a way to escape the hole which she dug so deep for herself. She escaped Rick without ever having to repair that broken relationship She forced her son to watch her die and then kill her She forced a child, which Rick knows is not his, upon Rick She forced a child, which the group has no means to feed, upon the group She brought a child that no one wants, into a world that no one wants to live in She chose easy death over hard life while bringing a hopeless life into the picture. The ultimate reverse-sacrifice. "No, don't try to save me! I get the easy escape, now you gotta suffer sucka!" I might be a cynic, so please explain to me what part of any of that is selfless?
How did she force carl to kill her? I can only imagine: "Hey carl and maggie, carry my pregnant ass out of here and outrun the zombies. That way I can have the same surgery that kills me -- except this time carl won't have to watch."
Also, didn't Rick choose to keep the baby when Lori wanted to kill it?
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