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I'll just leave this here
H4nn1: hey we are still discussing the matter aparently gd studio is saying that dignitas forced the def win but dignitas is responding with that they didnt force anything and would have waited
Johan Sundstein @FnaticN0tail 5m
@teamdignitas #growapair #littlegirl
@KaiH4nn1 1m
Getting played by @TheGDStudio or @TeamDignitas ? Apparently none wants to force a defwin yet there is no chance to play the game out.
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On March 24 2013 05:58 cecek wrote:Show nested quote +On March 24 2013 05:47 Unleashing wrote:On March 24 2013 05:45 cecek wrote:
Now, I understand that the proteams will never learn and will keep being awful at showing up to matches and at keeping in time if tournament admins keep giving them leeways without punishments, it's a good message to send and I'm glad you guys manned up.
But surely, there's a compromise that can be made so that we actually get to see some games. (and you get to show people some adds to make money and give exposure to your sponsors) You could for example give Fnatic just a game loss walkover, instead of an entire match.... The same thing you could've done with VP -> reschedule and give Liquid a 1-0 advantage. There's been 5 matches played and 2 walkovers so far, that's pretty lame. Fnatic DID get one loss, but then they were 30 minutes late. One loss is 15 minutes late, def loss is 30 minutes late. Oh... Well, that's unfortunate. I dunno, I feel like in a game like DotA where a bo3 can take anywhere from 40 minutes to four hours, you might consider being a bit more flexible. 15/30 minutes seems pretty tight, especially considering how tight the schedules for pro teams must be with that many online tournaments running around. And I don't mean to be rude, but there are plenty of other tournaments that teams will give priority over DreamHack invitational right now, the prizepool here is on the shorter end, considering the teams attending. If worse comes to worse, such strict admining might even backfire and teams might not want to participate in future tournaments run by The GD studio.
pretty sure most teams would like stricter admin'ing, especially in regards to pauses and downtime
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On March 24 2013 05:48 Adebisi wrote:Show nested quote +On March 24 2013 05:40 the`postman wrote:
I don't understand the extreme lack of flexibility from GDStudio, so if their game finished 3 minutes earlier we get a series out of it, and now we get nothing? Just seems sloppy, especially since we knew fnatic's game was about to end. They called it literally one minute before the GG's went out. We've been really flexible, but when it comes down to a schedule that is set, people need to be accountable. Giving FF sucks badly for us, costs us money, wastes our time, decreases interest in the tournament and all around blows, but when Dignitas requests the FF win, we will enforce the rules.
Is there someone in the studio who has authority and can consider the circumstances and make a judgment call in this scenario? If this was the grand finals would it be cancelled over this as well?
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Czech Republic18921 Posts
On March 24 2013 06:02 AwfuL_ wrote:I'll just leave this here Show nested quote +H4nn1: hey we are still discussing the matter aparently gd studio is saying that dignitas forced the def win but dignitas is responding with that they didnt force anything and would have waited
Heeere come the tweets! #drama #pitchforks
It doesn't matter now. The GD Studio has shown they want to run this professionally, I seriously doubt they will change their decision now, they would look rather silly.
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Bearded Elder29903 Posts
I wouldn't be surprised if it was Dignitas to force the defwin after they got humiliated in TD3 finals :3
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From what I've heard, Dignitas asked for a reschedule today and the WePlay game from Fnatic was delayed by 40 minutes so Fnatic couldn't show up.
I don't really know who's to blame but I just think that the 15-30 minutes rules is just too strict (especially when a team is actually already on a game). You have to know that it's important for the players to be able to do enough tournaments to actually make money etc ...
I'd say that nobody is really to blame because it was more of an unfortunate event caused by this stupid rule.
In the other hand there is no real strict rules about pauses etc to actually enhance the competitive scene. That's a shame.
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Well, Fnatic didn't help their argument by dicking around in their weplay game...
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On March 24 2013 06:05 739 wrote:
I wouldn't be surprised if it was Dignitas to force the defwin after they got humiliated in TD3 finals :3
Not asking for the defwin in such a tough group would be kinda stupid, tbh. fnatic had ways to avoid the situation (drafting differently in weplay, maybe asking for a reschedule before their game started?) so it's kinda silly that they seem to be avoiding responsibility
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United Kingdom24425 Posts
On March 24 2013 06:00 SFC wrote:Show nested quote +On March 24 2013 05:58 cecek wrote:On March 24 2013 05:47 Unleashing wrote:On March 24 2013 05:45 cecek wrote:
Now, I understand that the proteams will never learn and will keep being awful at showing up to matches and at keeping in time if tournament admins keep giving them leeways without punishments, it's a good message to send and I'm glad you guys manned up.
But surely, there's a compromise that can be made so that we actually get to see some games. (and you get to show people some adds to make money and give exposure to your sponsors) You could for example give Fnatic just a game loss walkover, instead of an entire match.... The same thing you could've done with VP -> reschedule and give Liquid a 1-0 advantage. There's been 5 matches played and 2 walkovers so far, that's pretty lame. Fnatic DID get one loss, but then they were 30 minutes late. One loss is 15 minutes late, def loss is 30 minutes late. Oh... Well, that's unfortunate. I dunno, I feel like in a game like DotA where a bo3 can take anywhere from 40 minutes to four hours, you might consider being a bit more flexible. 15/30 minutes seems pretty tight, especially considering how tight the schedules for pro teams must be with that many online tournaments running around. And I don't mean to be rude, but there are plenty of other tournaments that teams will give priority over DreamHack invitational right now, the prizepool here is on the shorter end, considering the teams attending. If worse comes to worse, such strict admining might even backfire and teams might not want to participate in future tournaments run by The GD studio. To be fair, prize pool per game is quite good. Like, Liquid is guaranteed 1k from just winning three matches. They had to win 3 bo3 against 'top' teams.
Weplay you have to win 2 bo1's against lesser teams to get into playoffs. Then 2 bo3's and you're in semi finals. Not all that different.
Not to mention that weplay group stages take place in 1 day per group. So much easier for the teams.Not asking for the defwin in such a tough group would be kinda stupid, tbh. fnatic had ways to avoid the situation (drafting differently in weplay, maybe asking for a reschedule before their game started?) so it's kinda silly that they seem to be avoiding responsibility I don't remember many cases where a team was asked to wait a bit, like 30 minutes, or take a def-win, that they took a def-win. This used to happen a lot more last summer when it was common to have multiple bo3's per night per team. Teams very rarely say they want a def-win.
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At least, I am happy that I didn't get 2 players from Fnatic for my fantasy league team.
Other then that , the studio respecting the rules is good and all but there are 2 things that I really don't like
1) 15/ 30 minute defwin is overdoing it at least do 15 min 1 game lead and 45 minute defwin or something this felt unnecessary.
2) Hanni trying to reach both dignitas and gdstudio , Studio stating that dignitas forced a defwin and team dignitas stating that they could have waited , is too contradictory for my liking.
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"forcing the defwin" is only a minor issue here. the main problem was that one team (fnatic) was not able to show up. Even 30 minutes after the scheduled starttime they were not in the lobby. The GD Studio acted correct.
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Bearded Elder29903 Posts
Not blaming GD Studio, rules are rules, decision was right, unless Dignitas would really like to reschedule and GD agreed on that, seems liek they didn't if there was such a situation.
Sucks, wanted to watch that game.
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Shouldn't a forced loss be equal to at least an average game's length? 15 minutes is too short in my opinion.
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I wonder if there was any communication between Fnatic management/GDStudio beforehand as well, it was pretty clear at least an hour before the broadcast that there was going to be a potential delay.
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I feel like you guys are forgetting that fnatic was playing the weplay tournament which ended at exactly 21.37 and they would be in the lobby by 21.40 at the latest and the game would have started, It isn't like they would have to wait an unknown amount of time to get the match going.
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Czech Republic18921 Posts
Thirty minutes for a defloss is incredibly strict... Realisticly, how do you make a shedule if you're a pro team? You would have to dedicate 90 minutes for a bo1 and 5 hours for a bo3 AND you couldn't participate in any tournament where any delay might happen (i.e. every single one of them apart from DH Invitational) in order to be perfectly on time for every match. That's just not possible at all.
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On March 24 2013 06:10 Chezus wrote:
Shouldn't a forced loss be equal to at least an average game's length? 15 minutes is too short in my opinion.
I think longer than 15min for sure, but I think average game length is to long, you can't expect people to sit in an empty lobby for an hour plus.
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Aui just said on stream that Fogged wanted to drive his GF somewhere so they took the default win. They didn't want to wait extra few minutes for Fnatic. Confirmed not GD studio's fault.
On March 24 2013 05:48 the`postman wrote:Show nested quote +On March 24 2013 05:45 SFC wrote:On March 24 2013 05:44 the`postman wrote:On March 24 2013 05:42 Unleashing wrote:On March 24 2013 05:40 the`postman wrote:
I don't understand the extreme lack of flexibility from GDStudio, so if their game finished 3 minutes earlier we get a series out of it, and now we get nothing? Just seems sloppy, especially since we knew fnatic's game was about to end. They called it literally one minute before the GG's went out. Seems sloppy? It's the opposite of sloppy. They have to make sure rules are enforced, the GD studio seeks professionalism, making exceptions and slacking on rules is not professional. The "blame" is on fnatic entirely. Not on the GD studio not being flexible. Fnatic accepted the rules and said yes to being in both tournaments. Dota needs more organizers like the GD studio, i don't like not seeing this game, but i really like them maintaining the rules and not making exceptions. Who are you running the tournament for? The viewers or the teams? Because this decision does nothing but hurt the viewers. Continuing to delay games because of teams hurts the viewers more in the long run. If admins do nothing to punish teams, this will continue to happen. Someone has to put their foot down. Then put your foot down in a way that doesn't entirely screw over the viewers. There are plenty of ways to punish the team without canceling the entire series due to two minutes of delay.
Not without breaking your own rules.
On March 24 2013 05:58 cecek wrote:Show nested quote +On March 24 2013 05:47 Unleashing wrote:On March 24 2013 05:45 cecek wrote:
Now, I understand that the proteams will never learn and will keep being awful at showing up to matches and at keeping in time if tournament admins keep giving them leeways without punishments, it's a good message to send and I'm glad you guys manned up.
But surely, there's a compromise that can be made so that we actually get to see some games. (and you get to show people some adds to make money and give exposure to your sponsors) You could for example give Fnatic just a game loss walkover, instead of an entire match.... The same thing you could've done with VP -> reschedule and give Liquid a 1-0 advantage. There's been 5 matches played and 2 walkovers so far, that's pretty lame. Fnatic DID get one loss, but then they were 30 minutes late. One loss is 15 minutes late, def loss is 30 minutes late. Oh... Well, that's unfortunate. I dunno, I feel like in a game like DotA where a bo3 can take anywhere from 40 minutes to four hours, you might consider being a bit more flexible. 15/30 minutes seems pretty tight, especially considering how tight the schedules for pro teams must be with that many online tournaments running around. And I don't mean to be rude, but there are plenty of other tournaments that teams will give priority over DreamHack invitational right now, the prizepool here is on the shorter end, considering the teams attending. If worse comes to worse, such strict admining might even backfire and teams might not want to participate in future tournaments run by The GD studio.
Teams not wanting to participate in DH branded or GD studio events? Ha! You're funny.
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United Kingdom24425 Posts
Nvm, clarified in post above.
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Bearded Elder29903 Posts
Told You it would be Dignitas forcing defwin 
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EPT
