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On October 21 2014 16:35 govie wrote:
I tried papers build, itemsequence felt pretty good and doable for anyone.
Just wondering if it would be viable to rush a butterfly on troll instead of the S&Y if you allready went for the drums.
u already have miss chance, why wud u get such an early butterfly... it doesnt even give hp
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I've played around with Mjollnir on this hero - its really strong, but timing it seems a bit odd. Probably better to just grab a daedalus instead. I could see an argument for skadi instead of butterfly if you already have a damage item, but you're probably fine tankwise with S&Y, BKB, and Satanic.
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On October 21 2014 23:46 Comeh wrote:
I've played around with Mjollnir on this hero - its really strong, but timing it seems a bit odd. Probably better to just grab a daedalus instead. I could see an argument for skadi instead of butterfly if you already have a damage item, but you're probably fine tankwise with S&Y, BKB, and Satanic.
You can always keep Mael. for sake of farming/damage/IAS and straight go to bkb.
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On October 21 2014 16:35 govie wrote:
I tried papers build, itemsequence felt pretty good and doable for anyone.
Just wondering if it would be viable to rush a butterfly on troll instead of the S&Y if you allready went for the drums.
I believe that the sny is for the maim as well. That combined with the additional ms should keep your target from going anywhere while you hammer away. If you are in a situation where you are not having problems staying on target, then grab something that will keep you alive longer so you can continue to dish out damage, or something that gives you more damage (which bfly does, but there are more cost effective alternatives like Daedalus, unless you really need that flutter/evasion for some reason).
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No one goes 1-4-4 now? I thought you maxed E for Roshan at 11 (+ HOTD)
I just played a Troll game and I think I underestimated the core need for S&Y but what is Drums for? Is it situational or core?
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1-4-4 was a relic of when ur q didn't actually improve with levels (basically just bash duration or something equally awful). Hasn't been like that for a few patches although technically the build has some merit with respect to solo-roshing etc.
I don't think drums are good that often but if ur fighting a lot early, not much beats drums/aquila for early fight efficiency.
Also drums/travs/SnY is 522ms permanently in lvl4 melee form. Much fun.
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How is Troll meant to be played now? With 1-4-4, you would get Morbid Mask then just jungle until 11, do Rosh and then go ham after getting Phase -> HOTD -> Black King Bar.
Is he more aggressive now or still a massive farmer and you can't do Rosh at 11.
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I'm pretty sure that was never how u played troll lol
u wanna push with ur ult and ur pretty damn strong in fights if you are good at getting in and getting out properly and abusing ur ability to change forms.
Ur slow is really good and nobody can ever manfight u if ur blind hits them. A fast bkb fixes more or less everything if ur team fights/pushes with u. If u afk rice ur very likely to just get outscaled.
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Drums are okay, but its a lot of money that could be going towards your yasha. Hard for me to convince myself to pick them up, I usually like getting aquila and a bracer if I need the extra HP.
Not bad at all though to get drums I suppose.
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On October 22 2014 02:32 Sn0_Man wrote:
I'm pretty sure that was never how u played troll lol
u wanna push with ur ult and ur pretty damn strong in fights if you are good at getting in and getting out properly and abusing ur ability to change forms.
Ur slow is really good and nobody can ever manfight u if ur blind hits them. A fast bkb fixes more or less everything if ur team fights/pushes with u. If u afk rice ur very likely to just get outscaled.
That's pretty much what happens. I've been watching many Troll players play and it usually ends up that they get their core items but it feels too late.
For the top Troll Players, they seem to always get Drums.
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Troll gets kited quite a bunch and fights a lot so I can see why drums would be nice. Early phase/drums/yasha makes you strong and very hard to run from.
My main question is when do you guys pick troll? I'm a large fan of picking the right hero for the right lineup, my personal impression is pick troll when you have another carry that scales very well with attack speed (faceless and slark come to mind the most) but I really don't know
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On October 22 2014 02:52 Torte de Lini wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2014 02:32 Sn0_Man wrote:
I'm pretty sure that was never how u played troll lol
u wanna push with ur ult and ur pretty damn strong in fights if you are good at getting in and getting out properly and abusing ur ability to change forms.
Ur slow is really good and nobody can ever manfight u if ur blind hits them. A fast bkb fixes more or less everything if ur team fights/pushes with u. If u afk rice ur very likely to just get outscaled. That's pretty much what happens. I've been watching many Troll players play and it usually ends up that they get their core items but it feels too late. For the top Troll Players, they seem to always get Drums.
#1 on dotabuff that wud be me
On October 22 2014 02:09 Torte de Lini wrote:
No one goes 1-4-4 now? I thought you maxed E for Roshan at 11 (+ HOTD)
I just played a Troll game and I think I underestimated the core need for S&Y but what is Drums for? Is it situational or core?
i barely see anyone going 1-4-4, i have never done that in 10 years of playing this game and i also have nvr rushed hotd just to rosh. guess its a trench build. drums is not a core item for any hero, its just rly damn nice to have when u get it as 7-8min with phase boots and other small items.
On October 22 2014 02:45 Comeh wrote:
Drums are okay, but its a lot of money that could be going towards your yasha. Hard for me to convince myself to pick them up, I usually like getting aquila and a bracer if I need the extra HP.
Not bad at all though to get drums I suppose.
drums gives hp to survive another nuke, more ms/as than yasha when u use charge, more mana to cast 2 whirling axes and ulti more in fights, slot efficient and cheaper... its not like the 10% ms from yasha is better
On October 22 2014 02:26 Torte de Lini wrote:
How is Troll meant to be played now? With 1-4-4, you would get Morbid Mask then just jungle until 11, do Rosh and then go ham after getting Phase -> HOTD -> Black King Bar.
Is he more aggressive now or still a massive farmer and you can't do Rosh at 11.
i dunno where u are getting this statement from "Is he more aggressive now or still a massive farmer and you can't do Rosh at 11". ever since his blind --> whirling axes rework he has been one of the most aggressive early/mid game heroes, u dont put him in lanes to farm, u put him in lanes against carries to make sure they get nothing coz ure too strong
On October 22 2014 03:12 Varth wrote:
Troll gets kited quite a bunch and fights a lot so I can see why drums would be nice. Early phase/drums/yasha makes you strong and very hard to run from.
My main question is when do you guys pick troll? I'm a large fan of picking the right hero for the right lineup, my personal impression is pick troll when you have another carry that scales very well with attack speed (faceless and slark come to mind the most) but I really don't know
i dont get troll to go with my team, i get troll to destory some hero in enemy lane
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So you punish a weaker enemy safelane that has a melee carry then? I'm guessing you duel offlane with another char?
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SoCal8910 Posts
On October 22 2014 05:04 Varth wrote:
So you punish a weaker enemy safelane that has a melee carry then? I'm guessing you duel offlane with another char?
troll can absolutely wreck any melee hero in lane..i mean absolutely DESTROY them. stick troll in a dual lane with an aggressive support and you'll have a good time. i do think he should dual with another support (as opposed to solo) in order to win the lane as opposed to push even.
in my limited experience (someone with more troll games might say otherwise) but after you have bullied the enemy out of the lane, that support can then rotate mid or safe to help that lan and ofc let troll get solo xp..unless you can repeatedly kill the carry bc he refuses to sit back and soak xp 
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How popular is Troll Mid?
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On October 22 2014 05:30 Torte de Lini wrote:
How popular is Troll Mid?
Popular?
Not very.
Legit?
Yes.
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It looked legit but I'm fearful he gets owned by a bunch of ranged mids.
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On October 22 2014 05:37 Torte de Lini wrote:
It looked legit but I'm fearful he gets owned by a bunch of ranged mids.
like who?
He's as good a ranged mid as any other ranged mid. But he also has melee bullshit.
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United States47024 Posts
I mean obviously, he's not Skywrath/Bane/LD/Brood/whatever, but he's still a very strong 1v1 hero.
If we're talking purely 1v1 mid, he's on the same level as something like QoP/Viper/etc. where he's not blindly good against everything, but he's decently strong against most heroes and pretty much always has room to outplay even in "bad" matchups.
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My guess is that when you play him mid, the ring of protection and ring of basilisius buffs are descent and can be more influencial then on a sidelane.
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EPT
