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Lalalaland34503 Posts
![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/images/3/30/Ogre_Magi_Large.png) Ogre Magi
The ordinary ogre is the creature for whom the phrase 'As dumb as a bag of rock hammers' was coined. In his natural state, an ogre is supremely incapable of doing or deciding anything. Clothed in dirt, he sometimes finds himself accidentally draped in animal skins after eating lanekill. Not an especially social creature, he is most often found affectionately consorting with the boulders or tree-stumps he has mistaken for kin (a factor that may explain the ogre's low rate of reproduction). However, once every generation or so, the ogre race is blessed with the birth of a two-headed Ogre Magi, who is immediately given the traditional name of Aggron Stonebreak, the name of the first and perhaps only wise ogre in their line's history. With two heads, Ogre Magi finds it possible to function at a level most other creatures manage with one. And while the Ogre Magi will win no debates (even with itself), it is graced with a divine quality known as Dumb Luck—a propensity for serendipitous strokes of fortune which have allowed the ogre race to flourish in spite of enemies, harsh weather, and an inability to feed itself. It's as if the Goddess of Luck, filled with pity for the sadly inept species, has taken Ogre Magi under her wing. And who could blame her? Poor things.
For abilities, stats, and other information, visit this hero's Liquipedia page here: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Ogre_Magi
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Fnatic inspired me to pick up my beloved ogre again. I played him a couple of times today without aghs septer. I had a blast! If ogre gets involved in some early action as a support, he is allready pretty leveled and can almost spellcrit the whole freaking enemyteam without many manaproblems. In my itembuilds i mostly go/went for : manaboot + wand + euls + constantly consumables. It basically feels like we win or loose before i finish the euls (really early, mostly wins ofcourse ).
I thought the aghs-septer change for ogre in 6.80 was for the better, but after my experiences today i think i was wrong. its alot of gold and in the early game after 1 usage of unrefined fireblast, you should probably go to the fountain very soon. This wastes alot of time in general and doesnt make you more efficient (less game-impact). In the late game, the mana usage for unrefined fireblast increases exponentionally because your ogre gets a bigger manapool.
I tend to think the old aghs was better then the new aghs, because i only wanted a 2/3r/4th nukespell without 60% of my manapool drained instantly in the lategame. What do you guys think about aghs septer on ogre and hanni;s choice for an early aghs septer as his first big item?
http://www.datdota.com/match.php?q=628435334
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Why do you go to fountain when mana is low? You can cast unrefined blast with 3 mana.
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Not a fan of the new scepter and not a fan of scepter as 1st item. I guess it might work if you expect fights to be over by 10sec and you wont really get a 2nd round of spells off, but an early scepter hinders your normal Q/W/E usage so much. I really think you need some kind of mana item before scepter. Bloodstone is of course ideal for that purpose but Hex or Euls have some utility rather than just be a massive regen item. Bottle also helps since the active regen helps you keep your mana in that sweet spot where unrefined doesnt empty your mana but you still manage to get off the rest of your spells.
I think for mid going bottle - Euls - scepter is a strong build if you wanna go the scepter route. Then hex/shiva/ghost/force or even dagon as needed. For support you probably have to give up the thought of going scepter unless game drags on very late.
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Russian Federation40190 Posts
On April 27 2014 10:38 Kreb wrote:
Not a fan of the new scepter and not a fan of scepter as 1st item. I guess it might work if you expect fights to be over by 10sec and you wont really get a 2nd round of spells off, but an early scepter hinders your normal Q/W/E usage so much. I really think you need some kind of mana item before scepter. Bloodstone is of course ideal for that purpose but Hex or Euls have some utility rather than just be a massive regen item. Bottle also helps since the active regen helps you keep your mana in that sweet spot where unrefined doesnt empty your mana but you still manage to get off the rest of your spells.
I think for mid going bottle - Euls - scepter is a strong build if you wanna go the scepter route. Then hex/shiva/ghost/force or even dagon as needed. For support you probably have to give up the thought of going scepter unless game drags on very late.
Idea is that scepter 1st item allows you to contribute to teamfights even without mana for qwe usage. Now, casting unrefined fireblast when you have more than 300 mana left is a mistake, serious one.
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On April 27 2014 17:39 lolfail9001 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2014 10:38 Kreb wrote:
Not a fan of the new scepter and not a fan of scepter as 1st item. I guess it might work if you expect fights to be over by 10sec and you wont really get a 2nd round of spells off, but an early scepter hinders your normal Q/W/E usage so much. I really think you need some kind of mana item before scepter. Bloodstone is of course ideal for that purpose but Hex or Euls have some utility rather than just be a massive regen item. Bottle also helps since the active regen helps you keep your mana in that sweet spot where unrefined doesnt empty your mana but you still manage to get off the rest of your spells.
I think for mid going bottle - Euls - scepter is a strong build if you wanna go the scepter route. Then hex/shiva/ghost/force or even dagon as needed. For support you probably have to give up the thought of going scepter unless game drags on very late. Idea is that scepter 1st item allows you to contribute to teamfights even without mana for qwe usage. Now, casting unrefined fireblast when you have more than 300 mana left is a mistake, serious one.
Agreed if your manapool is low, the aghs helps out for you to contrubute with 1 extra casinostun in a teamfight.
But in any other situation its debatable and if you play ogre efficiently i think. I dont have many manaproblems most of the time 20+ minutes in. The question is if that 1 last unrefined fireblast in that teamfight, is even needed or if you could achieve the same or maybe even more with others items.
The whole timing around aghs on ogre feels wasted i think. BKB carries will allways have that bkb sooner then i will farm up that aghs septer. When bkb's arrive my ogre without utility items will fall off pretty hard i think. Thats why i like to win pre 20 minutes and i find sheep/shiva/euls/forcestaff/linkens more usefull on an ogre with lategame in mind. I might be wrong ofcourse so please convince me otherwise.
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On April 27 2014 21:55 govie wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2014 17:39 lolfail9001 wrote:On April 27 2014 10:38 Kreb wrote:
Not a fan of the new scepter and not a fan of scepter as 1st item. I guess it might work if you expect fights to be over by 10sec and you wont really get a 2nd round of spells off, but an early scepter hinders your normal Q/W/E usage so much. I really think you need some kind of mana item before scepter. Bloodstone is of course ideal for that purpose but Hex or Euls have some utility rather than just be a massive regen item. Bottle also helps since the active regen helps you keep your mana in that sweet spot where unrefined doesnt empty your mana but you still manage to get off the rest of your spells.
I think for mid going bottle - Euls - scepter is a strong build if you wanna go the scepter route. Then hex/shiva/ghost/force or even dagon as needed. For support you probably have to give up the thought of going scepter unless game drags on very late. Idea is that scepter 1st item allows you to contribute to teamfights even without mana for qwe usage. Now, casting unrefined fireblast when you have more than 300 mana left is a mistake, serious one. Agreed if your manapool is low, the aghs helps out for you to contrubute with 1 extra casinostun in a teamfight. But in any other situation its debatable and if you play ogre efficiently i think. I dont have many manaproblems most of the time 20+ minutes in. The question is if that 1 last unrefined fireblast in that teamfight, is even needed or if you could achieve the same or maybe even more with others items. The whole timing around aghs on ogre feels wasted i think. BKB carries will allways have that bkb sooner then i will farm up that aghs septer. When bkb's arrive my ogre without utility items will fall off pretty hard i think. Thats why i like to win pre 20 minutes and i find sheep/shiva/euls/forcestaff/linkens more usefull on an ogre with lategame in mind. I might be wrong ofcourse so please convince me otherwise.
I'm not sure where I stand on the aghs Ogre. I think I like it. Anyway, I'd like to point out that comparing your aghs timing to a bkb timing on a bkb carry is certainly usefull information and it DOES devalue the aghs Ogre, but being able to instantly drop 2 both spells on a key support should not be underrated. And the timing for this being effective is fairly late game.
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On April 27 2014 23:25 PinkEmu wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2014 21:55 govie wrote:On April 27 2014 17:39 lolfail9001 wrote:On April 27 2014 10:38 Kreb wrote:
Not a fan of the new scepter and not a fan of scepter as 1st item. I guess it might work if you expect fights to be over by 10sec and you wont really get a 2nd round of spells off, but an early scepter hinders your normal Q/W/E usage so much. I really think you need some kind of mana item before scepter. Bloodstone is of course ideal for that purpose but Hex or Euls have some utility rather than just be a massive regen item. Bottle also helps since the active regen helps you keep your mana in that sweet spot where unrefined doesnt empty your mana but you still manage to get off the rest of your spells.
I think for mid going bottle - Euls - scepter is a strong build if you wanna go the scepter route. Then hex/shiva/ghost/force or even dagon as needed. For support you probably have to give up the thought of going scepter unless game drags on very late. Idea is that scepter 1st item allows you to contribute to teamfights even without mana for qwe usage. Now, casting unrefined fireblast when you have more than 300 mana left is a mistake, serious one. Agreed if your manapool is low, the aghs helps out for you to contrubute with 1 extra casinostun in a teamfight. But in any other situation its debatable and if you play ogre efficiently i think. I dont have many manaproblems most of the time 20+ minutes in. The question is if that 1 last unrefined fireblast in that teamfight, is even needed or if you could achieve the same or maybe even more with others items. The whole timing around aghs on ogre feels wasted i think. BKB carries will allways have that bkb sooner then i will farm up that aghs septer. When bkb's arrive my ogre without utility items will fall off pretty hard i think. Thats why i like to win pre 20 minutes and i find sheep/shiva/euls/forcestaff/linkens more usefull on an ogre with lategame in mind. I might be wrong ofcourse so please convince me otherwise. I'm not sure where I stand on the aghs Ogre. I think I like it. Anyway, I'd like to point out that comparing your aghs timing to a bkb timing on a bkb carry is certainly usefull information and it DOES devalue the aghs Ogre, but being able to instantly drop 2 both spells on a key support should not be underrated. And the timing for this being effective is fairly late game.
Well, the aghs septer does give you solokill potential no matter who it is. Although you can question if a ogre should roam solo in that stage of the game, i think not.
E: i think the aghs septer should buff E-skill somehow and not give an extra fireblast for high manacost. It would give ogre so much more lategame potential and pick/ban ability.
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i really like ogre and wish more teams would use him right now. he's an excellent roamer if paired with someone. he's really tanky at lv 1 and can actually go pretty deep to get kills.
bloodlust is amazing late game, potentially game-winning.
aghs or not i think he is very useful and maybe just underused.
if you draft a tri core and run the roaming supports, ogre/lina or something similar, you can do a lot of work.
i always think of him similar to support lich. pretty comfy in the 5 position with a buff that scales very well to late game.
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this lore is fucking amazing
also aghs ogre is the best because you should only be casting unrefined when you dont have mana for anything else or its for a really important kill, having both of those options is really nice (esp since 4x is like almost 1k magic damage and you can get 2 chances on an important target)
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My advice would be, always build soul ring of ogre first. Has has high default health regeneration, very high str gain.
If you have mana boot and soul ring you can sustain q-w-d combo for a long time.
But my personal build is soul - green boot- mex - aghs.
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On May 04 2014 20:26 Mutineer wrote:
My advice would be, always build soul ring of ogre first. Has has high default health regeneration, very high str gain.
If you have mana boot and soul ring you can sustain q-w-d combo for a long time.
But my personal build is soul - green boot- mex - aghs.
What's your starting itembuild? Do you buy a Ring of Protection in the start and then go Basi -> disassemble into Soul Ring, -> Tranquil Boots?
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no i start with tangos, recipie of Soul ring and may be clarity.
That takin in account buying currier and wards.
I am finishing ring BEFOR boots
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Remember to land your skillshots and you'll do fine.
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On May 05 2014 10:06 aeroblaster wrote:
Remember to land your skillshots and you'll do fine.
Yea. That's the key to this hero. To give context, it is many times more important than landing hooks/arrow/sunstrikes/shackleshots
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I don't even know which thread that comment is intended for...
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On May 05 2014 14:34 GtC wrote:
I don't even know which thread that comment is intended for...
Ogre obviously. Hexor should make a 'luck is no excuse' featuring all ogre scenes.
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i like boots+coerier first for a lanekill at lvl2. Ignite slow+naked boots at level 2 grant you that possibility, those few rightclicks matter alot.
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OoV level 1 is incredibly fun... inspired by SingSing. Just run at people and club them. It really hurts.
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On May 06 2014 03:32 ZerONine09 wrote:
OoV level 1 is incredibly fun... inspired by SingSing. Just run at people and club them. It really hurts.
Also a very ogre thing to do.
Edit: It's also completely logical because boots require you to run which is not one bit of fun while OoV makes them stand still for more hitting which is fun.
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EPT
