EPTOG Discussion - Page 43
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DucK-
Singapore11446 Posts
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nothingmuch
448 Posts
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zdarr
France375 Posts
On September 24 2017 18:05 nothingmuch wrote: Agreed, they're rusty and just like everyone else realize that they need to figure out new stuff. Liquid had a very similar phase when Miracle joined. Speaking of Liquid if TI7 has proven anything it's that you can't be #1 with just one strat/playstyle anymore. TI3 and 4 were classic examples of this but today teams are too good at countering predictable strategies. Imo OG need to learn how to play fast and be more versatile in their core picks (they already did switch Notail/Reso for a game or two so that's a start). More aggressive supports for Fly, more greedy cores/playstyle for Notail just to have those options available would be my hope. Funny, i post that 3 weeks ago, i'm a troll and now every one in this thread is saying how notail is playing subpar and reso is some hot shit, you even take liquid as an example of what og needs to do, even using my parallel with miracle integration into liquid... | ||
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PandaRed
France58 Posts
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LemOn
United Kingdom8629 Posts
The Nerves got to him during TI though yet again, and he hasn't recovered yet clearly. I tune in and Jerax owns with his plays, N0tal 2-6 on terror T.T | ||
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LemOn
United Kingdom8629 Posts
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Minishield
Italy145 Posts
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Pontual
Brazil3038 Posts
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zdarr
France375 Posts
On September 27 2017 02:15 LemOn wrote: Plus you were obviously trolling, when everyone calls you a troll and stops replying to you you might want to tune down your AW presentation No. It's just that n0tail is charismatic and is loved within the community and most people blinds themselves when they like someone. Dont misunderstand me, i love the guy too, and he is good at dota but i don't understand (beside the bias) why people think of him as the best carry through the season. Especially when you have people like resolution who are clear beast at carry | ||
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LemOn
United Kingdom8629 Posts
But in their Majors runs he was a beast Especially when illusion heroes reigned supreme And is one of the best greedy mid enablers out there and really has been for a couple years Just check his track record it has nothing to do with his personality really It feels like all games you watched him play was TI where he did get overzealous, just like the year before and was making a lot of mistakes you wouldn't see him do usually. And now he seems in a slump frankly still after TI and needs practice | ||
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zdarr
France375 Posts
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nothingmuch
448 Posts
Last but not least there's the claim that the level of play at TI is actually lower than at other big tournaments because the pressure/mental game is so much more powerful (7mad interview/ other pros). When you look at this years grand final that certainly seems plausible. | ||
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hunter_x
Germany2762 Posts
On September 28 2017 04:25 nothingmuch wrote: No. You tend to have no idea what you're talking about. It has been said before that you're either a troll or a fool and since you're denying being a troll that leaves not many options. The fact alone that you come into the OG thread and call them Losers should suffice as proof for either theory especially after a year with 2 major wins and a top8 TI finish. But let's keep going: 1) 3 weeks ago OG didn't have Reso, so there was no way that they could even remotely be in the same position as Liquid after Miracle had joined. 2) You claimed OG were emulating TL with their 1/2 swaps when they had been doing that for 2 years, particularly in the Miracle era. The idea that success not who "invented" something dictates who emulates who is so ridiculous that it puts the troll option back on the table. Nobody is that stupid. 3) OG are playing bad (for their standards) now after they have taken a break after TI (see 7mad interview). Last but not least there's the claim that the level of play at TI is actually lower than at other big tournaments because the pressure/mental game is so much more powerful (7mad interview/ other pros). When you look at this years grand final that certainly seems plausible. The claim is made by the OG coach, what a coincidence;) 7mad always was a salty guy he is just trying to sugarcoat it. Og was great at the two majors for sure, no way they were losers this year. But you also have to admit, they played pretty bad for the last 3-4 month. Until now Reso didnt change much. But Fly is still a Top 3 Captain, so if someone is gonna figure this out, its him. Still notail really needs to Stop playing so bad, that has nothing to do with the team. | ||
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PandaRed
France58 Posts
On September 28 2017 07:37 hunter_x wrote: The claim is made by the OG coach, what a coincidence;) 7mad always was a salty guy he is just trying to sugarcoat it. Og was great at the two majors for sure, no way they were losers this year. But you also have to admit, they played pretty bad for the last 3-4 month. Until now Reso didnt change much. But Fly is still a Top 3 Captain, so if someone is gonna figure this out, its him. Still notail really needs to Stop playing so bad, that has nothing to do with the team. A lot of other pro-player already stated that level at TI is worst than other tournaments because of pressure, but that doesn't mean that top team at TI were lucky or didn't deserve their win. I mean look at the last True Sight, Newbee was so on tilt at the end of the game 1's draft, they lose the final because of their mental while Kuroky find the right words for his team ... and Miracle "Upper bracket is for B****es" | ||
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VvvV1251
Algeria142 Posts
The one who emerge victorious isn't always the more skilled/the better, it's the one who can deal with the pressure. PS: A TI winner is a TI winner, and will forever be in the history of Dota and E-sport in general, all thanks to the prize pool (even if TI 1,2 and 3 had lower prize pool compared the 4,5,6 and 7, it's doesn't change anything, back at TI1 the Chinese team didn't believe Valve will give the money.) edit: typo | ||
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nothingmuch
448 Posts
On September 28 2017 07:37 hunter_x wrote: The claim is made by the OG coach, what a coincidence;) 7mad always was a salty guy he is just trying to sugarcoat it. Og was great at the two majors for sure, no way they were losers this year. But you also have to admit, they played pretty bad for the last 3-4 month. Until now Reso didnt change much. But Fly is still a Top 3 Captain, so if someone is gonna figure this out, its him. Still notail really needs to Stop playing so bad, that has nothing to do with the team. I agree, they were nowhere near as dominant in the last quarter of the year. But we don't need 7mad to tell us they've not been practicing after TI, do we? Everyone is saying they're rusty. | ||
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nothingmuch
448 Posts
On September 28 2017 17:51 VvvV1251 wrote: Dealing with pressure is a form of skill, in fact it's one of the most important skill for high level, be it sports or e-sport, or work...etc. The one who emerge victorious isn't always the more skilled/the better, it's the one who can deal will pressure. PS: A TI winner is a TI winner, and will forever be in the history of Dota and E-sport in general, all thanks to the prize pool (even if TI 1,2 and 3 had lower prize pool compared the 4,5,6 and 7, it's doesn't change anything, back at TI1 the Chinese team didn't believe Valve will give the money.) Absolutely. They call it the "mental game" for a reason. The different mental state is so glaringly obvious if you watch True Sight. Liquid deserved their win and no one is taking anything from them. I was just referring to the troll that claimed majors mean nothing because the level of play at TI is so much higher. | ||
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NInoff
Bulgaria1105 Posts
On September 28 2017 07:37 hunter_x wrote: The claim is made by the OG coach, what a coincidence;) 7mad always was a salty guy he is just trying to sugarcoat it. Og was great at the two majors for sure, no way they were losers this year. But you also have to admit, they played pretty bad for the last 3-4 month. Until now Reso didnt change much. But Fly is still a Top 3 Captain, so if someone is gonna figure this out, its him. Still notail really needs to Stop playing so bad, that has nothing to do with the team. Apart from N0tail making a lot of mistakes there is also a Fly problem IMO. The very experienced captains that've won a lot of shit tend to underestimate opponents. For example Puppey rarely makes respect bans or if he does its just phase 1. Then if the opponents game makes a draft that becomes perfect if a Drow Ranger is added to it - he prefers to try and pick against it than to just ban it. I understand the idea behind that but why risk it? I mean with perfect drow lineup 1 mistake loses you the game. Even way weaker team than you can A click your base and remove it in 10 seconds. Fly on the other hand prefers to pick way too greedy, counting on the fact that most teams will make mistakes during midgame to allow OG to comeback. Well yes there were a lot of new teams and players that used struggle in the midgame, and we saw a lot of comebacks from OG during all their major runs. But things change - people learn. Now even T2 teams rarely lose their advantage if you give it to them. There is a lot more replay base for people to study, there are coaches that help them clear their mistakes. People get experience. I mean there really are not too many new players on the top level overall - a star or two every couple of months and thats it. But this greedy draft requires perfect play from your team and mistakes from the opponent - you can't count on both to happen every time. Chinese old school captains used to draft pretty much 2-3 heroes for their carries, and thats not enough for todays meta - people figure you out and then you are fucked. Hell even GH KoTL got countered in the end. All i'm saying is that OG shoyld not be affraid to try new stuff all the time - cheesy strats for a 15 min GG etc. N0tail will stop making mistakes eventually, and the team will shine once they figure their new playstyle. Old greedy OG style will not cut it. Ill give an example with Liquid from last year -After TI6 they spent like 3 months to figure things out - there were a lot of useless drafts - that lost many games during drafting phase ( like picking necro into PL Doom + Skywrath). But in the end they found their playstyle, drafted their own strats, just adapted some hero picks not to be useless against the enemy draft. Not picking a hero that suits your plan that is already countered hard by enemy draft is a good thing to do. | ||
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nothingmuch
448 Posts
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Damned627
Indonesia264 Posts
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