EPTGeneral Discussion - Page 190
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zeehar
Korea (South)3804 Posts
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NB
Netherlands12045 Posts
On March 09 2012 12:53 zeehar wrote: speaking of silencer, what are his core items as a carry? i haven't really seen him played on pro streams and i don't know whether his default recommended items are his core. force staff allow you to escape battle and is a must. After that sheep and survival items: BKB/Shiva/linken etc... take advantage of your orb attack to add in maximum dmg... I also have seen the slow staff used on silencer before, gave him a bit HP and a bit of int but i think if you have enough farm just rush straight mystic staff :-/... Also you could see midas on silencer early on if he has solo lane and good last hit 5 mins into the game. | ||
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LAN-f34r
New Zealand2099 Posts
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Xinder
United States2269 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:17 LAN-f34r wrote: Build like you are playing OD. Generally my build is: treads > force > sheep then any item with int or survivability (depending on what is needed). If I'm doing great in lane ill get a midas, if I'm doing terribly I'll get either ghost or atos (ghost if they have auto attacks and not many nukes, atos otherwise). Both OD and Silencer should be getting Mekansm as their first core item, as it gives survivability and health regen (which they are both lacking early), and they have the mana to support using the active. If someone else is getting Mekansm, then get Janggo instead to buffer your stats. Atos is just a shitty item. It costs more than either Eul's or Force Staff, when in the context of a fight, both of their actives counter Atos. If you want a caster survivability item, there are just loads better options. On March 09 2012 13:22 Xinder wrote: My Jungle DS needs some work I think. Everyone seems to know that if you let DS ult + vacuum he wins. So they chain CC me til i die. I'm thinking Shivas after aghs would be good choice. Do DS normally get BKB? No. Vanguard/Pipe before Aghanim's is common though instead of straight Aghanim's rush--DS is a fantastic Pipe carrier. | ||
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Zlasher
United States9129 Posts
On March 09 2012 12:53 zeehar wrote: speaking of silencer, what are his core items as a carry? i haven't really seen him played on pro streams and i don't know whether his default recommended items are his core. Similar to OD I feel. Mekansm, Forcestaff, BKB, Sheep | ||
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zeehar
Korea (South)3804 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:32 TheYango wrote: Both OD and Silencer should be getting Mekansm as their first core item, as it gives survivability and health regen (which they are both lacking early), and they have the mana to support using the active. If someone else is getting Mekansm, then get Janggo instead to buffer your stats. so you recommend treads > mek/drums > force > scythe? edit: noticed that's basically a wr build except for the treads... funny how these things happen also, starting items as a bot dual lane? tango/salve/clarity/branches x3? | ||
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Esoterikk
Canada1256 Posts
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NB
Netherlands12045 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:32 TheYango wrote: No. Vanguard/Pipe before Aghanim's is common though instead of straight Aghanim's rush--DS is a fantastic Pipe carrier. meh, in pub i just scepter rush... it gives decent stat early on and pub isnt reliable on teamfight... rushing scepter also give you ton of extra time to build refresher late game which is a game changer... every 180 seconds (which is very short late game) you got a guarantee win team fight... | ||
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Aui_2000
Canada435 Posts
On March 09 2012 12:53 eqez wrote: - Tinker: Fixed Rearm refreshing level 2 and 3 of Necronomicon. That must make him the strongest pusher ingame with BoT and Necronomicon. Those small demons fucking rapes, i wanna se a pro go that build. Also Necronomicon gives really nice stats That means they fixed (as in stopped) necronomicon from refreshing. Rearmable nec book would be ridiculous | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On March 09 2012 14:47 NB wrote: meh, in pub i just scepter rush... it gives decent stat early on and pub isnt reliable on teamfight... rushing scepter also give you ton of extra time to build refresher late game which is a game changer... every 180 seconds (which is very short late game) you got a guarantee win team fight... I'm not saying straight Scepter is bad. Just pointing out that if he's not feeling tanky enough, it's not at all uncommon for DS to buy Vanguard or Hood/Pipe, and that Pipe is much better for DS than BKB. If you use BKB, you 1) can't Ion Shell yourself, 2) can't Surge yourself, 3) don't have the Pipe shield for all your illusions. And Refresher is pretty much never a practical item for serious games. | ||
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NB
Netherlands12045 Posts
On March 09 2012 14:57 TheYango wrote: I'm not saying straight Scepter is bad. Just pointing out that if he's not feeling tanky enough, it's not at all uncommon for DS to buy Vanguard or Hood/Pipe, and that Pipe is much better for DS than BKB. If you use BKB, you 1) can't Ion Shell yourself, 2) can't Surge yourself, 3) don't have the Pipe shield for all your illusions. And Refresher is pretty much never a practical item for serious games. but to be fair, despite AM, seer scepter refresher could win any tower push/teamfight :-/... its almost imbalance if not yet imba @_@... my only question right now on DS is should i get vacuum at all early game? the surge is just too crucial but the feeling of suck people up cliff is so addictive xD | ||
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lozarian
United Kingdom1043 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:32 TheYango wrote: Both OD and Silencer should be getting Mekansm as their first core item, as it gives survivability and health regen (which they are both lacking early), and they have the mana to support using the active. If someone else is getting Mekansm, then get Janggo instead to buffer your stats. Atos is just a shitty item. It costs more than either Eul's or Force Staff, when in the context of a fight, both of their actives counter Atos. If you want a caster survivability item, there are just loads better options. No. Vanguard/Pipe before Aghanim's is common though instead of straight Aghanim's rush--DS is a fantastic Pipe carrier. Atos isn't the best item to rush - but it's not a bad item by any means. Personally for silencer I tend to go boots -> vitality -> treads -> force staff -> decide to get either atos or heart. The pile of early hp is all silencer really needs to be scary, but he really needs a force before making an atos for sure. If no-one else is making a mek, get a mek, but don't underestimate raw hp. With vita and str treads silencer has a good 1200 hp at least (level 7 stats) which shouldn't be underestimated. | ||
Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
DS is also a relativly fast farmer, and getting that pipe quickly will impact the game by alot aswell as making him fairly tanky. | ||
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Aui_2000
Canada435 Posts
Mek only the other hand gives 345 hp, ~8 armour, some ias, some regen and some damage and imo should be deferred to be built on silencer pretty much every game--not to mention its great buildup. He really needs that armour all game long and definitely has the mana pool to support it (especially if you skip/only get low curse level). For a carry silencer, you should probably be finding a way to skip curse completely, and going (midas if possible/nulls) treads mek forcestaff guinsoo. Please never go vanguard on silencer. edit: poster above meant on ds. My bad. You should probably not rush aghs on ds because your images don't do that much early+it requires you to clump during a team fight. Although some people do like vanguard pipe on sil which is sort of not good | ||
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NB
Netherlands12045 Posts
On March 09 2012 15:58 Validity wrote: I really don't like pipe on silencer. It's really expensive for the direct benefits to silencer it gives, and it makes silencer pretty much only useful for aura/ult, thereby disregarding his potential for high range pure damage. Mek only the other hand gives 345 hp, ~8 armour, some ias, some regen and some damage and imo should be deferred to be built on silencer pretty much every game--not to mention its great buildup. He really needs that armour all game long and definitely has the mana pool to support it (especially if you skip/only get low curse level). For a carry silencer, you should probably be finding a way to skip curse completely, and going (midas if possible/nulls) treads mek forcestaff guinsoo. Please never go vanguard on silencer. edit: poster above meant on ds. My bad. You should probably not rush aghs on ds because your images don't do that much early+it requires you to clump during a team fight. Although some people do like vanguard pipe on sil which is sort of not good there are 2 roles that a silencer could take in a team: Healing bitch or carry. Often in competitive game you see him as healing bitch with mek and pipe simply bc his aura is just too amazing to shut down combo such as SK or rashta. Also his 1st skill is priceless to suck out mana out of a trilane containing heroes such as VS or ES. Carry silencer is mostly seen in pub bc you have more room to wiggle around to farm as well as you dont have to skill Q bc there are no trilane to shut down. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On March 09 2012 15:38 lozarian wrote: Atos isn't the best item to rush - but it's not a bad item by any means. Personally for silencer I tend to go boots -> vitality -> treads -> force staff -> decide to get either atos or heart. The pile of early hp is all silencer really needs to be scary, but he really needs a force before making an atos for sure. If no-one else is making a mek, get a mek, but don't underestimate raw hp. With vita and str treads silencer has a good 1200 hp at least (level 7 stats) which shouldn't be underestimated. Vit Booster is fine, but committing 2k gold in Staffs of Wizardry isn't worth the active or the auto-build stats. I'd rather be 2k gold closer to Sheepstick than have the Atos active. | ||
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hauton
Hong Kong743 Posts
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Zlasher
United States9129 Posts
On March 09 2012 16:39 hauton wrote: Force Staff's utility > Atos' stats Agreed with this | ||
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lozarian
United Kingdom1043 Posts
Like most things, it's a situational item, but it can be completely backbreaking when it's useful. | ||
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