EPTyour obscure posts are so aggravating rek! be nice and type more D:
KeSPA-Gretech cease negotiations - Page 11
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alffla
Hong Kong20321 Posts
your obscure posts are so aggravating rek! be nice and type more D: | ||
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StarStruck
25339 Posts
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Fyodor
Canada971 Posts
On October 14 2010 09:21 FishForThought wrote: Quick summary of the 3 companies' plan: Kespa: If we just start pro-league, there will be too many people watching that they can't shut us down without bad publicity and that bad publicity will take them out too! YAY!! Gretech: We have supporting documents that gives us exclusive broadcasting rights! We can't lose in court! Blizzard: Why are people still bringing us to this discussion? I thought we settled our IP right issue by giving exclusive rights to Gretech who are willing to 'respect' our IP and follow our direction. Looks about right. There's multiple players trying to protect their interests. Trying to find who is "teh evilz" is pretty immature IMO. KeSPA knows full well what announcing proleague entailed, they're mocking Gretech's license rights. Gretech can't keep this out of court when KeSPA keeps showing that they have no intention of respecting those rights. On the other hand, if KeSPA keeps being bullied by Gretech and their rights, they're fully dependent on Gretech's good will. Mocking the rights and announcing proleague puts Gretech back in a tough spot in terms of public opinion. From what I understand, KeSPA just got some negotiation leverage with this but Gretech will have none of it. | ||
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Rikstah
Australia126 Posts
On October 14 2010 11:19 keylow wrote: Why are Shinhan continuing to sponsor a competition for which intellectual property rights have not been acquired. Shinhan are an international investment bank and this is not a good look for them in my opinion. Because no one has yet proven blizzard, the makers of starcraft, own the rights to VIDEOS of kespa's teams playing matches of starcraft in a pro league that they created. Rights to the ip of the game doesn't automatically = rights to videos of pro gamers in a pro league playing. This is where the court case will come in. Theres plenty of room for argument here in the way of derivative goods. Alot of the pro blizzard posters here are under the assumption its already a proven fact. The guy who created basketball certainly didn't have a right to tell the NBA what to do if he had no hand in creating the NBA. He could've asked for money I guess but as we know Kespa already offered money which was refused. Gretech refuses to let Kespa broadcast at times that would get in the way of the GSL | ||
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zimz
United States510 Posts
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zimz
United States510 Posts
im sure each copy of scbw was bought legit whos to say blizzard gets so much control? they BOUGHT the game created the tournaments, and put up the prize money and the players created the content. GO KESPA. companies are taken IP to extremes. | ||
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Adila
United States874 Posts
On October 14 2010 11:56 Rikstah wrote: Because no one has yet proven blizzard, the makers of starcraft, own the rights to VIDEOS of kespa's teams playing matches of starcraft in a pro league that they created. Rights to the ip of the game doesn't automatically = rights to videos of pro gamers in a pro league playing. This is where the court case will come in. Theres plenty of room for argument here in the way of derivative goods. Alot of the pro blizzard posters here are under the assumption its already a proven fact. The guy who created basketball certainly didn't have a right to tell the NBA what to do if he had no hand in creating the NBA. He could've asked for money I guess but as we know Kespa already offered money which was refused. Gretech refuses to let Kespa broadcast at times that would get in the way of the GSL Difference is Starcraft is much more complicated than the game of Basketball, which basically boils down to putting a spherical object through a circular one. When you also think about it, that basic concept has been around for ages. You can find many variations of Basketball. Just compare international to NBA as an example. On the other hand, there is only 1 thing in the entire world that can be called SC:BW and Blizzard controls all the code, art, and sound that makes it SC:BW. If KeSPA wants to hack that code and make changes of their own, that's a whole separate legal issue that they have 0 chance of ever winning. | ||
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SoMuchBetter
Australia10606 Posts
On October 14 2010 11:36 alffla wrote: your obscure posts are so aggravating rek! be nice and type more D: lol you don't have to be rekrul to know that esports still never really evolved past the ramen eating, apartment cramming prize hunting days. the only players with stable living and salaries are the ones that are successful in the prize hunting | ||
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G3nXsiS
United States656 Posts
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Xenocide_Knight
Korea (South)2625 Posts
On October 14 2010 12:10 G3nXsiS wrote: As much as I love BW, it really should be killed and we should all move on to Sc2. In any case KESPA is being bullshit here! Send you a final notice? They negotiated with you for months and months and you alyways rejected their proposal and say "we can negotiate later" what sort of logic is that? Heretic Seriously, wtf Also, it's the sort of logic you use when the proposal and negotiations aren't going your way. Kinda like if my proposal was that you give me your life savings, you probably wouldn't agree no matter how many months I negotiated.. | ||
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FetusFondler
United States246 Posts
Gretech gets their way and take legal action against KeSPA and no more BW Courts side with KeSPA and BW runs for a bit before being completely overrun by SC2. Therefore, no more BW. Right now I think Immanuel Kant is rolling over in his grave :\ | ||
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Fyodor
Canada971 Posts
On October 14 2010 12:42 FetusFondler wrote: I don't see the logic in this... two outcomes are apparent to me: Gretech gets their way and take legal action against KeSPA and no more BW Courts side with KeSPA and BW runs for a bit before being completely overrun by SC2. Therefore, no more BW. Right now I think Immanuel Kant is rolling over in his grave :\ What do you know about Immanuel Kant? :| | ||
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Biochemist
United States1008 Posts
On October 14 2010 10:14 zenMaster wrote: At least they're taking E-sports in a good direction with stable living and salary for every player. Blizzard wants everyone to revert back to the ramen eating, apartment cramming, prize hunting days. Progamer sweatshops what? | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On October 14 2010 08:16 Garaman wrote: i hope you are wrong rekrul, i really hope so. if the gladiator i want loses, i hope blizzard soon loses due to blood loss from the aftermath of the battle =) Because having 2 dead pro-scenes is better than having 1 alive and 1 dead? If BW has to die, I'd much rather have somewhere for people to go rather than have every progamer, commentator, and coach left without a job. | ||
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Go0g3n
Russian Federation410 Posts
Why would anybody in their right mind attempt to destroy an absolutely perfect, established gaming scene featuring a perfectly balanced beloved game, multiple tournaments and leagues, a 100 top class players and millions of fans. All of that can be exchanged at this very moment for an almost non-existent scene featuring a few popular players (Boxer, Nada, July) who are yet to show themselves on a big screen, a lot of StarCraft:BW B-teamers and those who failed to qualify as B-teamers, wrapped around a 'raw' game that requires balance patches and general improvements. Not to forget that the whole scene is basically a monthly 64-player tournament at this point. | ||
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Fyodor
Canada971 Posts
On October 14 2010 12:01 zimz wrote: also as long as each copy of scbw was bought legit, the people who bought it can play the game run tournaments on it create content on it however they want? That's not true. You never really buy a game but a license to an intellectual property that can be used in x way, defined by the IP holder. That's why Blizzard has the right to ban you for cheating, hacking, etc. I have very big doubts that Blizzard/gretech could lose this trial. Korea would basically have to rule that Blizzard is no longer the IP holder to Starcraft and is therefore not allowed to sell licenses. If you don't protect your IP you CAN lose it but blizzard has shown to protect their IP in many other ways before so I doubt the court will be convinced to think that way by KeSPA. On October 14 2010 11:56 Rikstah wrote: Because no one has yet proven blizzard, the makers of starcraft, own the rights to VIDEOS There is ample precedent to believe this. You generally can't broadcast someone else's intellectual property without their permission. That goes for Square-Enix protecting their CGI from being distributed to the Nobel Foundation detaining the broadcasting right to events relating to their IP, the Nobel Prize. I really don't know if the fact that starcraft is a multiplayer game and that KeSPA formed a league is enough to change things. | ||
tree.hugger
Philadelphia, PA10406 Posts
On October 14 2010 12:10 SoMuchBetter wrote: lol you don't have to be rekrul to know that esports still never really evolved past the ramen eating, apartment cramming prize hunting days. the only players with stable living and salaries are the ones that are successful in the prize hunting It was definitely a lot closer to a "stable living and salary" situation that it would've been without the proteams though. It clearly wasn't there yet, and perhaps not even near to being there. But that dream isn't going to happen without the current set-up to jump off from. On October 14 2010 09:17 stangstang wrote: Yep, I'm a blizzard fanboy. I admit it. What can I say? I just love the amazing games they make. I'm a sucker for good games. my bad. Go on saying Blizzard is trying to kill the game they created. Kespa is charging OGN and MBC for the rights to broadcast starcraft when they don't even have the rights. Surely the courts will rule in favor of kespa. KeSPA doesn't say they control the game, KeSPA says they control the scene. With nitwit posts like this peppering every page, it's no wonder people are confused. On October 14 2010 09:13 sylverfyre wrote: It seems clear to me that Gretech is more than FINE with BW continuing on, but they don't want it to compete for their own timeslot for the GSL. That's a perfectly reasonable thing to ask - they want the opportunity for BOTH GAMES to have the SAME FANS, rather than splitting the fan base between the two. If the timeslot issue was their primary demand, they're not "evil bad guys" they're just a corporation using their own rights to act on their own interests. Welcome to capitalism, this is how it works. Edit: Any confirmation on the timeslot issue being in the negotiations? It makes sense, but don't have a source. Honestly, stop trying to paint either side as a saint or demon, and let's bring a lot more FACTS to the table please? If you haven't noticed, before this all began, BW had all the players, pedigree, and infrastructure that Sc2 needed. And you're telling me that Gretech is fine with BW continuing as is. Good one. | ||
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VManOfMana
United States764 Posts
On October 14 2010 13:39 Fyodor wrote: There is ample precedent to believe this. You generally can't broadcast someone else's intellectual property without their permission. That goes for Square-Enix protecting their CGI from being distributed to the Nobel Foundation detaining the broadcasting right to events relating to their IP, the Nobel Prize. I really don't know if the fact that starcraft is a multiplayer game and that KeSPA formed a league is enough to change things. So under your logic, Day[9], HDH and Husky should pay royalties to Blizzard? You could make the case that Day[9]'s cast is protected under fair use since he is not for-profit, but HDH and Husky create tournaments and events with money involved, most likely for profit. | ||
Milkis
5003 Posts
On October 14 2010 12:10 SoMuchBetter wrote: lol you don't have to be rekrul to know that esports still never really evolved past the ramen eating, apartment cramming prize hunting days. the only players with stable living and salaries are the ones that are successful in the prize hunting do you really want to compare early progamer conditions with current conditions and say it hasn't changed? like, really? what are you basing that on lol | ||
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JayDee_
548 Posts
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