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On September 04 2018 06:54 Anlo wrote:
They really skimped on the mission hubs though. They could have fleshed them out SO much more.
To the point that you made earlier it makes no sense that what troop you have matters so much and they are all bunched together in the same recruiting system making it RNG what you get.... like man I hate RNG.
I would prefer if it was ALOT more expensive to get troops but if you wanted ranged troops you could recruit two ranged ones from the Wildhammers. You want mounted troops? Recruit some expensive Elekk Draenei. You want some melee? Recruit some melee then!
Makes more sense to me but guess they want people to fail on missions so RNG is a nice way for them of doing that. Yeah, feels stupid when your sending troops to their death purely so you can recruit other troops to send to their death until you get the type you need.
And that is with the extra troop slots. I dont want to know how bad it feels without that upgrade.
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On September 04 2018 06:54 Anlo wrote:
They really skimped on the mission hubs though. They could have fleshed them out SO much more.
To the point that you made earlier it makes no sense that what troop you have matters so much and they are all bunched together in the same recruiting system making it RNG what you get.... like man I hate RNG.
I would prefer if it was ALOT more expensive to get troops but if you wanted ranged troops you could recruit two ranged ones from the Wildhammers. You want mounted troops? Recruit some expensive Elekk Draenei. You want some melee? Recruit some melee then!
Makes more sense to me but guess they want people to fail on missions so RNG is a nice way for them of doing that.
The missions having a type ( stealth missions, etc ) and troops being more diverse is a nice change, but their fear of WoD made them not willing to put the time to expand the system too much.
They really care about making sure the mission table doesn'"t seem that important.
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On September 04 2018 06:54 Anlo wrote:
They really skimped on the mission hubs though. They could have fleshed them out SO much more.
To the point that you made earlier it makes no sense that what troop you have matters so much and they are all bunched together in the same recruiting system making it RNG what you get.... like man I hate RNG.
I would prefer if it was ALOT more expensive to get troops but if you wanted ranged troops you could recruit two ranged ones from the Wildhammers. You want mounted troops? Recruit some expensive Elekk Draenei. You want some melee? Recruit some melee then!
Makes more sense to me but guess they want people to fail on missions so RNG is a nice way for them of doing that.
They skimped on everything.
This expansion is an incredible disappointment in terms of content and quality of content. I honestly can't say anything positive about it in comparison to WoD. It has the same strengths and the same weaknesses, not to mention the horrific class design and complete failure to give us anything meaningful as a reward for leveling.
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On September 04 2018 06:58 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On September 04 2018 06:54 Anlo wrote:
They really skimped on the mission hubs though. They could have fleshed them out SO much more.
To the point that you made earlier it makes no sense that what troop you have matters so much and they are all bunched together in the same recruiting system making it RNG what you get.... like man I hate RNG.
I would prefer if it was ALOT more expensive to get troops but if you wanted ranged troops you could recruit two ranged ones from the Wildhammers. You want mounted troops? Recruit some expensive Elekk Draenei. You want some melee? Recruit some melee then!
Makes more sense to me but guess they want people to fail on missions so RNG is a nice way for them of doing that. Yeah, feels stupid when your sending troops to their death purely so you can recruit other troops to send to their death until you get the type you need. And that is with the extra troop slots. I dont want to know how bad it feels without that upgrade.
Making them more expensive when they only have 2 life is really dumb imo, hard to farm war resources if you plan on running them 24/7 if the missions for them arent up.
not like order resources where i could go do 3-4 missions and be fine for a week or two anyway
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United Kingdom20341 Posts
They really skimped on the mission hubs though. They could have fleshed them out SO much more.
Or just not added it? lol
Daily quests back in the day were 24 hour expiry at a specific time; 8 and 12 hour expiry quests that can spawn at any time will always be BS. I don't think anything that promotes setting an alarm at 4am daily to check your table deserves to stay, it's the absolute worst of the psychological tricks that try to keep people engaged with the game. It's not just not fun, it actively degrades the game experience just by being there regardless of if you take part in it.
That's before considering the design problems like troop selection and missions that aren't possible because they're stealth but have counters that can only be dealt with via troops
They really care about making sure the mission table doesn'"t seem that important.
I don't think so, i've had about 6 quests for 450+425 CoA reputation. I've heard that the rewards are different for everyone and random without BLP, some people have reported huge rep gaps between guildies that are doing the same content because of mission table luck and some people checking the table 5 times a day while others don't and miss the 8 hour expiry missions that are active at 1am-9am and such.
Being able to send missions via a mobile phone without being at the table was an extra lair of bullshit (i don't think that you should ever be advantaged for pulling out a mobile phone while sat in front of the desktop game client at the very least) but that's gone for now AFAIK
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After monitoring AP gain this week i've slowed to 1/week on AP levels already, i guess most of the game has as well. There are 28 silvermoon DH's on wowprogress at level 21 and only one at level 22. Heard that they buffed the island expedition reward this morning so we might be able to bruteforce a little more.
The wowhead guide makes a good point of holding emissaries to complete three of them on reset day each week, if you don't need the reward earlier than that then it's a good increase, up to 600 effective ap out of nowhere on the 2 chests and then more if you hold onto the world quests that would persist through the reset.
For islands in general, they're not really my thing but a friend made a good point that a lot of cool stuff happens around/after the 10 minute mark but the entire reward structure and design of the island is about rushing to end it as soon as possible, often long before then if you're in a decent group. A longer time means less AP/hour, always.
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On September 04 2018 14:13 Cyro wrote:Show nested quote +They really skimped on the mission hubs though. They could have fleshed them out SO much more. Or just not added it? lol Daily quests back in the day were 24 hour expiry at a specific time; 8 and 12 hour expiry quests that can spawn at any time will always be BS. I don't think anything that promotes setting an alarm at 4am daily to check your table deserves to stay, it's the absolute worst of the psychological tricks that try to keep people engaged with the game. It's not just not fun, it actively degrades the game experience just by being there regardless of if you take part in it. That's before considering the design problems like troop selection and missions that aren't possible because they're stealth but have counters that can only be dealt with via troops Show nested quote +They really care about making sure the mission table doesn'"t seem that important. I don't think so, i've had about 6 quests for 450+425 CoA reputation. I've heard that the rewards are different for everyone and random without BLP, some people have reported huge rep gaps between guildies that are doing the same content because of mission table luck and some people checking the table 5 times a day while others don't and miss the 8 hour expiry missions that are active at 1am-9am and such. Being able to send missions via a mobile phone without being at the table was an extra lair of bullshit (i don't think that you should ever be advantaged for pulling out a mobile phone while sat in front of the desktop game client at the very least) but that's gone for now AFAIK --- After monitoring AP gain this week i've slowed to 1/week on AP levels already, i guess most of the game has as well. There are 28 silvermoon DH's on wowprogress at level 21 and only one at level 22. Heard that they buffed the island expedition reward this morning so we might be able to bruteforce a little more. The wowhead guide makes a good point of holding emissaries to complete three of them on reset day each week, if you don't need the reward earlier than that then it's a good increase, up to 600 effective ap out of nowhere on the 2 chests and then more if you hold onto the world quests that would persist through the reset.
Can do missions from phones im pretty sure, friend was doing them at work the other day.
calling it an advantage is stupid, people who are going to hardcore neckbeard arent going to be moving from the computer anyway, so the average individual who decides he wants to send a follower or two on a mission while having a job is hardly at any sort of advantage.
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United Kingdom20341 Posts
Why should one player have to hearth mid raid to go send a mission from the table or update an auction when somebody else can do it on their phone while standing in the raid? I think that's ridiculous. I have an insane amount of play time on WoW these last weeks and i still have to cancel or cut short social events and sleeping or interrupt other tasks/sessions to make the mission table work properly.
There might be no requirement to do anything else in WoW in the next 16 hours but a set of missions complete in 3.5 hours and another one for 875 rep expires in 5 hours. That means that you must be not just at the computer but stood at the mission table in Boralus in that 90 minute window, fuck everything else.
The only people who get the optimal rewards are the people who don't leave the house and have an alarm go off at certain hourly intervals throughout the whole day and night, i would think that even more objectionable to you.
You could do what the vast majority of players do and ignore a lot of the missions / let them expire but i don't think that's good game design and i think that bypassing part of problematic game design via a mobile phone doing stuff that you can't do within the desktop client is an issue as well. If there was a button you could press in the desktop client to let you send missions, access the mailbox and post auctions while standing in a raid then this part would be much less of a problem.
With the daily quest system you could go clear all of the quests at 8am and leave the game for 46 hours without missing any reward (as long as you came back in less than 2 resets, a 24-48 hour window), that was an enormous amount of freedom compared to the current wq and mission table system that demands that you play more regularly, sometimes in extremely specific time windows or miss rewards. I feel much more a slave to the game's schedule than i did doing a ton of daily quests and raiding on aggressive schedules because i can't do the content when i want to do it, even if there is less of it. I can't plan around it in advance like i can say that i'l be busy at 6-10pm on wednesday two weeks from now. I have to start that mission between 3 and 4 AM, not at 8am. I have to do certain wq spawns in one specific half of the day because they despawn for the other half. It's amazing how draining that sort of thing can add up to be when you're facing it 24/7 for weeks at a time!
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Cyro, the obvious solution is to care less about AP and rep 
Honestly who cares if you are a full Neck level behind on your guildies, it's 2 ilvls...
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United Kingdom20341 Posts
Sure
With the old system you just didn't have to not care. I don't see why elements of that system (like missions remaining available for 24 hours after spawning) couldn't be part of the current system aside from psychological fuckery to try to get people to think about WoW every minute of the day.
We don't really have a need for stuff to expire 3-6x faster than they did in TBC-WOD. Stuff like Magni wq's function fine on the old timers - they spawn once a day and you can do them on spawn, leave for 46 hours and come back without missing any of them. They're not creating a strong pressure on when and how we play the game, they're just there and as long as you play somewhat regularly you'll be able to put in the time when you feel like it without missing them. Nobody was incentivized to cut a social event short, to set an alarm for 3:30am or to hearth out of a raid outside of break time to do their magni world quest, but people accept it when the mission table demands that you either do that or miss the mission.
I don't understand the enthusiasm and/or apathy towards having 8 hour windows instead of 24-48 hour windows to do the content that spawns at the same rate. Don't you agree that it's less fun and less player-friendly for both casual and hardcore players?
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I agree that the current state of the mission table is pretty much just straight up bad design. It is the dumbed down reminant from a system that was proven broken 2 expansions ago, and rather than phase it out as a whole Blizz is intent on keeping it but dumbing it down each expansion.
The 8 hour window thing only applies to Missions right? Can't think of anything else that would follow that time table. Thus far it has felt unnecessary for me to be that diligent with the missions, and honestly it seems like it might not be possible to keep constant missions going with the amount of Resources given as rewards vs cost.
Having said that, I have started to get equipment for my followers to reward extra crafting mats on mission success. That is something that is adding a lot of incentive for me to try and keep missions going, but I still do not feel like I need to be as diligent with the missions as you seem to be Cyro. I do agree that anything happening in a game like WoW with such a short window is probably poor design.
Seems to me that this expansion would have been a great time to do away with the mission system. Or at least overhaul it so that it is not just the same thing as 6 years ago but slimmed down to the state where it is. Maybe something like the Shipyard system from WoD would work better, and also be super on point with themes of this expac. I don't even mind the overall idea behind Missions, but it feels like it is something that has been kept in the game without a clear purpose at this point.
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United Kingdom20341 Posts
Huge bug. If you did a M+ the last week of legion you have a M+ chest waiting for you with up to 380 gear in it today.
Lol, pretty sure that i did? That's.. unfortunate
![[image loading]](https://i.gyazo.com/thumb/1200/a2fec1cd82735e94fabc4a91db96e4d5-png.jpg)
edit: Apparently people also got exorbitant amounts of AP (2-3 weeks worth of farming) and level 25 keystones both out of the box and from doing an m0
Really curious to see the response to this kind of major bug! I wonder if they will actually roll back US a bunch of hours - that seems the cleanest option but they've said that they don't really have the ability to do so. It's hard to rollback tens or hundreds of thousands of characters one-by-one. If they patched it and left the stuff on NA but didn't allow EU to get it, it would screw over one region and mess with raid progression because some people now have ilvl 400 stuff. If they do let the bug stand it's punishing the people that didn't do m+ in the last week of legion - and why would you? This obviously wasn't the intended result.
edit2: They hotfix removed the chest, i guess that indicates that they're going to remove the gear and AP from all of the people that opened it
Azmongold also got season 1 BFA PVP achievements when the raids unlocked.
So he got full transmog set for a season that literally just started.
Small indie company btw.
Looks like a similar bug causing both things - it checked participation, dungeon completion, ratings and such on the last week of Legion instead of nonexistant BFA stats
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The 8 hour window thing only applies to Missions right? Can't think of anything else that would follow that time table. Thus far it has felt unnecessary for me to be that diligent with the missions, and honestly it seems like it might not be possible to keep constant missions going with the amount of Resources given as rewards vs cost.
Some WQ's do 12 hours. The problem is not just an 8 or 12 hour window, but the fact that they can spawn morning, evening or middle of the night with such a time window.
With regards to hitting all missions, i don't take too much issue with that as long as you can choose what you want to do - stuff like 875 rep for CoA randomly popping out of nowhere just for you and being active at 3am-11am or whatever time happens to be inconvenient for you is far more annoying.
I'm not a huge fan of missions or of WQ's but they'd be far better IMO if they didn't expire so quickly. Just bumping everything up to at least 18 hour expiry would be a good start, but the old daily quest system could allow you to take 47 hour breaks if you timed them well.
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I’m a fan of limited WQs and mission table because it’s something different to do with moderate rewards. I get the rage from min/maxers and they should have longer expiry times to assist with WQ availability and followers already on a mission. It’s kind of like the weekly island expeditions bonus: I’m not farming it to really work on my neck, but I’ll eventually get it every week. It’s just little side quest things beyond the M+/raid core of the PvE lat game experience. It’s like professions.
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why are people in my grp getting +14 keys.. why i am getting an 8...
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Oh boy this expansion is a disaster. What an oversight lmao.
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On September 05 2018 02:10 Warri wrote:
Oh boy this expansion is a disaster. What an oversight lmao.
Ive been good with all the other stuff since Im not min maxing or racing for anything, but this one is pretty fucking awful..
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"Guildy has a mythic 22 keystone, challenger/duelist/rival title on his first arena win, and is currently ilevel 360 because he has a 410 weapon.
This is fine."
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Wtf, I don't know whether to be excited or horrified at the prospect of logging in after work lol
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Its a massive oversight and fuckup.
How did no one think to clear the M+ database entry. How can the Glad stuff be screwed up when this is not the first time there has been a pre-season.
Something Something, B Team.
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United Kingdom20341 Posts
I've kinda been waiting for this to happen with how much BFA was rushed so i'm more amused than surprised but i hope that they fix it up well so that progress isn't fucked for everyone. It'd really suck to lose 390 items and 2-3 weeks worth of AP compared to some other people for no reason.
There is precedence for that, people that got lucky with their first legendary in Legion got their drop rate on the second legendary increased by an order of magnitude and then weeks later when the bug was fixed they weren't rolled back and other players didn't get compensation for it. We didn't truly hit level ground for a whole season or two after that with the legendary acquisition debacle.
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Well good thing I play on EU.
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EPT
