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Please keep the QQ to a minimum if you do not like this update. We are happy to hear your reasoning for not liking a ranked system, but no "OMG VOLVO WHY" posts. | ||
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ChunderBoy
3242 Posts
On December 24 2013 21:50 cecek wrote: Is there anyone with his party rating lower than solo? Every rating I've seen/heard about has the party rating at least 100 points higher. 6k solo 5.3k party | ||
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Laserist
Turkey4269 Posts
On December 25 2013 02:09 konadora wrote: as in, does it only factor if you lose or win? the issue is because there are two kinds of games where my team is just really shit but i played very well, and another being that we were just outplayed, but both games i lose the same amount of points. is this intentional? if so, it really is unfair. Nobody knows the exact system but, a vast majority of the time, you lose points when you lose. But there is a slight chance that you play really well, above your game level, and win some points even though you lose the game. My prediction is, if your MMR is lower than the match average, you manage to perform a sick KDA and lost at the end due to some stupid decisions from your teammates. Maybe you need to outperform all 9 players in the game idk. But I know it is not easy to acquire points when you lose the game. | ||
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Penecks
United States600 Posts
On December 25 2013 02:09 konadora wrote: as in, does it only factor if you lose or win? the issue is because there are two kinds of games where my team is just really shit but i played very well, and another being that we were just outplayed, but both games i lose the same amount of points. is this intentional? if so, it really is unfair. If you think about it, this is actually irrelevant, as over some large number of games, there will be about equal amounts of games where you performed very well, and lost, or performed very poorly, and still won by being carried. And if you're truly one of those guys who "never feeds, honest" you are playing against worse opponents and your mmr should be going up. edit: I think the whole mmr going up if you lose thing is probably reserved for very special cases like smurfing, or someone else playing your account or something. If a 2000 rated guy gives his account to Dendi, who goes like 30-0 on a Pudge in the next game, they need to ensure that he is moved up quickly to prevent lower level games from being ruined. | ||
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umade
Sweden172 Posts
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Excalibur_Z
United States12280 Posts
On December 25 2013 02:09 konadora wrote: as in, does it only factor if you lose or win? the issue is because there are two kinds of games where my team is just really shit but i played very well, and another being that we were just outplayed, but both games i lose the same amount of points. is this intentional? if so, it really is unfair. I think individual performance only matters for the calibration matches (basically the same as smurf detection). | ||
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konadora
Singapore66366 Posts
On December 25 2013 02:56 Excalibur_Z wrote: I think individual performance only matters for the calibration matches (basically the same as smurf detection). well then mmr is just bs once you are past the calibration matches (yet in another game, random drow doesnt know how to play drow) non-ranked gives me better games, wtf. i'm out of ranked until volvo fixes this i'm not the only one experiencing this one-sided fails of a ranked mm am i? http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?t=118083&page=5 | ||
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Kupon3ss
時の回廊10066 Posts
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SkelA
Macedonia13092 Posts
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synapse
China13814 Posts
On December 25 2013 01:47 Laserist wrote: It does give some shit. I remember I read in this forum, you may lose points when you win or vice versa. But it should be like you play godly, far far better than you mates and still lose. I thought that was only in your first like 50? matches where it doesn't know where your mmr uncertainty is high? | ||
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JeeJee
Canada5652 Posts
On December 25 2013 03:06 konadora wrote: well then mmr is just bs once you are past the calibration matches (yet in another game, random drow doesnt know how to play drow) non-ranked gives me better games, wtf. i'm out of ranked until volvo fixes this i'm not the only one experiencing this one-sided fails of a ranked mm am i? http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?t=118083&page=5 There is unfortunately very little reason in assigning performance-based points on anything other than early calibration. The metrics used are going to be subjective and abuseable. I'm sure you've heard this a lot, but if you always play well, you'll tend to win. It's not in matchmaking's best interest to match you with 4 idiots to make you lose. Win/Loss really is the only valuable metric. Yes sometimes you'll lose because your team is having a bad day. Sometimes you'll be the one where nothing is going right, and you get carried. You can only control your own ability in the end. | ||
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babysimba
10466 Posts
You can rape the early game as solo offlaner with OP Spirit and still constantly lose games. I always feel 'dirty' trying to pick that hero, but at this rate i'm getting desensitised rofl. Then, another good portion of games, you get free wins and wonder what the enemy is doing. I'm pretty confident i could play games at least 300mmr higher, but now i'm trying so hard just to keep my mmr somewhat constant, and so afraid of falling into a vicious cycle when you constantly get retarded teammates. First day after calibration, my mmr dropped by 250. Forced to go mid every game next 2 days to increase my mmr by another 350. And what's worse is my mid laning is actually terrible, but at least you could control the game somewhat in the mid-late game. You fucking feel terrible when your team can still manage to lose you the game when you go like 7-1 as a roaming cm in the first 15 mins. Solo matching making was once good when the option for "solo queue matchmaking only" first came out at around march(?), and some people were queuing for it. You could feel they were the good players who got so fed up with the system lol. Then, they change the location of the option to the preference box in a later patch, and nobody queued for it anymore. | ||
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konadora
Singapore66366 Posts
On December 25 2013 03:23 Kupon3ss wrote: would you be in favor of the game also deducting points when the team wins while you're doing poorly? yes because it shows YOUR own skill level (and more accurately may i add) | ||
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Andre
Slovenia3523 Posts
Would you accept the system punishing you for those times? | ||
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Kupon3ss
時の回廊10066 Posts
On December 25 2013 03:56 konadora wrote: yes because it shows YOUR own skill level (and more accurately may i add) so if you play furion, afk farm all game, never participate in a single fight and KS with ult. Your mmr should always go up due to high KDR and high CS despite losing games? | ||
dfs
Russian Federation4050 Posts
On December 25 2013 03:56 konadora wrote: yes because it shows YOUR own skill level (and more accurately may i add) Welcome to the world where KDACS doesn't mean shit and there is no other way to evaluate "skill" through stats. Rating != Skill. | ||
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konadora
Singapore66366 Posts
On December 25 2013 04:07 Andre wrote: What about the times when your KDR doesn't reflect accurately of how good you play? It does happen rarely, but there will be games where you're playing well and have bad kda. Would you accept the system punishing you for those times? that barely happens, and i'm sure the 0.001% chance of that happening will be heavily outweighed by the benefits having a MMR system where u get points for playing well regardless of loss or win. and i'm sure there can be other factors that can come into play, such as game time, KDA as compared to overall score, wards bought and placed, etc so as not to punish those that, as you say, have poor KDA ratio yet actually did well. | ||
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konadora
Singapore66366 Posts
On December 25 2013 04:31 Kupon3ss wrote: so if you play furion, afk farm all game, never participate in a single fight and KS with ult. Your mmr should always go up due to high KDR and high CS despite losing games? if you can pull that off and still win then yes you deserve to be in a higher bracket, not because you are better but because the rest are worse and have failed to put enough pressure to let you free farm and be able to escape every gank. such a scenario like what you mention is highly unlikely, but i do understand where you are coming from. this may be a very subjective point from me but i believe at least that will result in a more accurate ranking than the current one that is in place | ||
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dfs
Russian Federation4050 Posts
On December 25 2013 04:41 konadora wrote: that barely happens, and i'm sure the 0.001% chance of that happening will be heavily outweighed by the benefits having a MMR system where u get points for playing well regardless of loss or win. and i'm sure there can be other factors that can come into play, such as game time, KDA as compared to overall score, wards bought and placed, etc so as not to punish those that, as you say, have poor KDA ratio yet actually did well. You described a perfect bubble where no one KS, fountain farms, creep farms or buys wards at the last seconds of the game to increase their points. Perfect Dota where no one abuses the Ranked system to increase their ePenis. Also, KDA is never accurate when evaluating skill. I am not even sure if you talk about the same game as I do. | ||
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konadora
Singapore66366 Posts
On December 25 2013 04:47 dfs wrote: You described a perfect bubble where no one KS, fountain farms, creep farms or buys wards at the last seconds of the game to increase their points. Perfect Dota where no one abuses the Ranked system to increase their ePenis. Also, KDA is never accurate. I am not even sure if you talk about the same game as I do. i'm not saying my suggestion is the perfect way to account for a player's skill, and neither did i mention that KDA is the most accurate source of telling how skilled a player is. isn't KDA already used for placement matches anyway? What I'm asking is why isn't this method used instead of the current "one loss = minus points, one win = plus points"? | ||
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SKC
Brazil18828 Posts
MMR isnt there to give you a reward for playing well, the best way to ensure better matchmaking is probally to avoid ingame stats most of the time. | ||
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